Retune *all* The Frames! (11/19: Wildfire)

[Alphascrub]

On 3/11/2016 at 1:26 PM, taiiat said:

Rhino having CC immunity negates the point of that Atlas already has that - furthermore, doesn't do good to incentivize not garbage gameplay from Players using Rhino as a crutch(which he's bad at, due to the nature of the game - which no, doesn't mean 'Iron Skin buff' it means if you want a crutch, Rhino isn't the right choice).

Rhino... doesn't run fast? Sprint speed of goldfoil prime is 1.0, Nezha is 1.15?
the only Warframes slower than goldfoil prime is normal Rhino, Frost, and Saryn.
that being a passive makes little sense considering Charge exists. but you recognize that already.

less Kick or higher Stagger with Melee - idunno.

Heavy Impact innate isn't a bad thing to have - but it uh, shouldn't cause a catching animation, should only trigger if it would normally for any Warframe from that height, and both Heavy Impact and that passive need to be more reliable, in the sense of forcing Knockdown.
and then you'd have a useful tool, more CC for your CC Warframe - 'cause why not.

Huh I mistakenly thought Rhino had some stupid base speed on him or something. But your right according to the wiki he is only 1.0 which im happy with. Somewhere I was thinking his base speed is 1.25. Oh well. At any rate I had time to think about and I would honestly be happy if the Heavy Impact just worked properly. I was all up and arms because passive seem to be strange and some seem to be very strong. Then I realized I'm complaining about Rhino's passive some warframe don't even have passives.

I think on some level I was projecting the fact that I've maxed out Rhino and just found his skills on their own to be cool but together no cohesive and kind of meh. A balanced build on him kind of fees lack luster and usually trying to maximize one of his abilities can lead to gutting/gimping the others into not being very useful. That being said I think his ability augments are ok. Just the abilities themselves that feel mixed up. 

Stomp Rhino can be an interesting thing to use but I think other frames do it better (Massive CC, Hello Mirage). Iron skin Rhino is alright but it turns into flaky skin in higher level voids and in the end again other frames do this better (Valkyr/Inaros even though I feel like these to might need some looking into, very strong). The roar is really pretty great and really underrated its just hard to mod it well and maximize something else in his kit. Rhino charge is fun but the damage is anemic and the cc mediocre given its linear nature. I understand he is supposed to be an unstoppable rhino and all but he just doesn't feel that way to me. I mean is he supposed to be a tank? Supposed to CC alot? A mix? 

Overall I guess Rhino is just not for me in his current state.I really would like to see his Iron skin get turned into something active, maybe similar to Mesa's shatter shield or really anything other than a flat damage shield. Hell you could even make it another constant drain effect or something of that sort, whatever just get rid of the flat damage shield. Its boring and hard to balance. Lastly take all this with a grain of salt. Not trying to offend people or get into an internet argument, just voicing my perspective. 

[taiiat]

7 minutes ago, Alphascrub said:

Somewhere I was thinking his base speed is 1.25.

Goldfoil Prime with the Arcane Helmet that everyone uses (because there's no reason not to) brings his base Sprint Speed to 1.25.
but the Warframe isn't just innately like that.

8 minutes ago, Alphascrub said:

trying to maximize one of his abilities can lead to gutting/gimping the others into not being very useful.

i don't know what Players expect. why do they expect Corrupted Mods to be free upgrades? if you overspecialize into one Ability, ofcourse the rest of your Abilities will suffer.
if nothing suffered, then it wouldn't be called a Corrupted Mod, it would be called free upgrade / powercreep.

- - - - - 

• Charge does not exist for Damage, it exists for CC - the CC is very effective since you'll Ragdoll Enemies across the room?
• i wouldn't want Iron Skin to become another Shatter Shield esque Ability - Shatter Shield is a pretty lame Ability that you just run on a Macro because there's no reason not to.
• Roar's Damage Bonus is... okay. if you're really looking for extra Damage though, the Damage sharing Augments blow it out of the water.
• Stomp is plenty effective CC - there are some Warframes that have gamebreaking cheats that Players exploit to completely lock down the game - comparing something that is effective at a job but doesn't turn off the game to something that does is a poorly thought out comparison.

[Archwizard]

1 hour ago, taiiat said:

i don't know what Players expect. why do they expect Corrupted Mods to be free upgrades? if you overspecialize into one Ability, ofcourse the rest of your Abilities will suffer.
if nothing suffered, then it wouldn't be called a Corrupted Mod, it would be called free upgrade / powercreep.

Just to throw my two cents in, there's a difference between "the Range of a couple of my abilities will take a hit but I'll have increased Duration overall" and "If I cripple 3/4 of my kit to near uselessness, I can maximize a stat that benefits only one ability, functionally restricting my use of the frame to said one ability." _{^{CoughNekroscough}}.

It's not always a matter of expecting free upgrades, just fair tradeoffs. Of course, what's "fair" varies by player and what's a "tradeoff" varies by frame.

1 hour ago, taiiat said:

Charge does not exist for Damage, it exists for CC - the CC is very effective since you'll Ragdoll Enemies across the room?

Odd, could've sworn they said they were going to give Charge melee scaling, on top of Landslide's comboing. Guess they got worried it'd be too good.

Of course, having two abilities within the same kit provide CC (when one is both enough and vastly better) is a questionable practice.

Edited March 15, 2016 by Archwizard

[taiiat]

2 hours ago, Archwizard said:

there's a difference

certainly, but "trying to maximize one of his abilities" was what was stated. 'maximize' implies overspecializing.

- - - - - 

and Charge has the uh, repeat cast combo thingy now(which you knew), so Charge is a different way to CC Enemies, that costs less Energy to do so. with normal Duration it won't incapacitate specific Enemies for as long, but you can spend very little Energy to CC pretty much everything.
it also will get 4x Damage from that as well, so on 4x you can get some Damage from it i suppose, but hard values and infinite Enemy Scaling, yadda yadda. but i suppose 2600 Impact Damage without any Power Strength is worth noting, even if it's very situational.

and then more situational stuff, the double Damage on Enemies levitated by Stomp. and you could throw Roar in there too i guess. but whether all of that is practical or not is a different story - and i'd say it is not and not something that should be considered worth relying on. even it all of that together without any Power Strength totals to 7800 Impact Damage. costs 194 Energy(and a lot of time) to do baseline though.
basically i'm not going to consider that viable in terms of practicality.

and there's also the interesting thought of using Ironclad Charge to boost Iron Skin, which while i still haven't bothered to run numbers on or use - it sounds interesting and cool.

anyways, i see use for both. Stomp will pause a large area for a bit, and Charge will disable Enemies that weren't hit by it or w/e. two forms of CC works out because you can use Charge while Stomp is already running, so they can supplement each other. because we all know the rate that we go through Enemies in this game, before Stomp ends there will be more Enemies you want to CC.

 

Edit:

2 hours ago, Archwizard said:

Guess they got worried it'd be too good.

oh, btw - i wouldn't say because of it becoming 'too good' then, but rather that, it would instantly become a Damage Ability then, and a better one than Slash Dash! dealing WAY more Damage, and being able to hit 20 Enemies at the same time rather than cutting Enemies one at a time.
because with a base Damage of 650, just Pressure Point and 5 Elementals(totally plausible normal Mod Loadout for some Melee Weapons) would result in Charge dealing ~41,500 Damage at 4x from Combo. and you still have Power Strength, Stomp bonus, and Roar to add on top.

and if your directional CC Ability easily hits 10,000 Damage, meaning it Kills most Enemies, how are you supposed to Ragdoll them across the map? they're dead already!

okay yeah, there's also some 'would be too good' there, but even just thematically, it would kind've break all of the current functionality of the Ability.

Edited March 16, 2016 by taiiat

[Archwizard]

Alright, the OP has now been updated with both Inaros (relatively light, the ongoing discussion sort of pushed him to the wayside) and the first iteration of these energy changes.

Hilariously, I think it's the first section I've put into the OP that's primarily dedicated to nerfing something. Granting, I'm probably forgetting a few un-worked frames from the first couple iterations. Probably Rhino. (Which reminds me, less than a week till the second anniversary of the thread.)

Quote

3 hours ago, taiiat said:

but rather that, it would instantly become a Damage Ability then

That point... sort of falls flat, to be honest. There are provisions within Rhino's own kit to make Charge deal more damage, with his Stomp contextually saying "you should use this to deal damage". The main flaw with that approach is that it doesn't scale at all.

But yeah, as you were saying, it would be pretty overpowered. Rhino Charge is easier to compare to Landslide, except that Charge has a higher base damage and a larger effective radius since it affects everything in a radius around the charge (which is multiplied for each cast)... before you get to the multiplier from Stomp.

Edited March 16, 2016 by Archwizard

[Alphascrub]

12 hours ago, taiiat said:

 

Goldfoil Prime with the Arcane Helmet that everyone uses (because there's no reason not to) brings his base Sprint Speed to 1.25.
but the Warframe isn't just innately like that.

i don't know what Players expect. why do they expect Corrupted Mods to be free upgrades? if you overspecialize into one Ability, of course the rest of your Abilities will suffer.
if nothing suffered, then it wouldn't be called a Corrupted Mod, it would be called free upgrade / powercreep.

- - - - - 

• Charge does not exist for Damage, it exists for CC - the CC is very effective since you'll Ragdoll Enemies across the room?
• i wouldn't want Iron Skin to become another Shatter Shield esque Ability - Shatter Shield is a pretty lame Ability that you just run on a Macro because there's no reason not to.
• Roar's Damage Bonus is... okay. if you're really looking for extra Damage though, the Damage sharing Augments blow it out of the water.
• Stomp is plenty effective CC - there are some Warframes that have gamebreaking cheats that Players exploit to completely lock down the game - comparing something that is effective at a job but doesn't turn off the game to something that does is a poorly thought out comparison. 

Lol. Been wearing the Arcane for so long I kind of forgot there was another choice besides it. Kind of explains where I was getting the base 1.25 from, I just never took the helmet off. 

This bit seems harsh to me. Never once did I state I don't expect weakness I do. When employing corrupted mods I expect there to be weakness and strengths both. Here is one of the recent mod setups it toyed with on Rhino to attempted Irons Skin maximization while not completely gutting multiple other abilities. It kind of worked but it still felt a bit lack luster to me. As you can see I focused primarily on power strength and armor. The empty slot is for flex, things like Iron Shrapnel, Fleeting Expertise, Rush, Armored agility, vitality sometimes to name a few. Maybe you have some pointers or maybe some criticisms. Regardless maybe this will give you a better insight into how I'm modding. 

- If this ability is meant for cc then it is truly all over the place in its purpose and maybe should be trimmed down to just do its cc and not bother having all these ways for it to buff its damage. 

- That fair. I've got a friend that macros a few things with some of his warframes. I haven't quite gotten into it myself but to each their own I guess. 

- Agree. 

- While stomp is efficient cc I disagree with the next part of you point. If players are actually cheating and using abilities somehow outside of how they were designed then by all means this should be addressed. However if players are using their abilities as they were designed then this just seems like people using everything to their advantage. Exactly like using a shatter shield macro, and even then they are staying inside the premise of the game where macroing is not. I compared Rhino's stomp to Mirage's Prism because Mirage's prism exist so therefore it is a factor when gauging how powerful/effective Rhino's stomp is the grand scheme of the game. The fact is regardless of what we think of it Mirage's Prism is part of the game and therefore given the min max philosophy that is is used in online gaming it will be looked at. 

 

Overall I feel like my original post was misleading. What I should have said is that I feel like Rhino is a victim of powercreep. I just think he should looked at and maybe given a firmer identity. Yea he supposed to be a raging Rhino that destroys everything in his path, he just doesn't seem to feel like it to me. When I play Loki  he feel like playing a squishy stealth trickster, when play Valkyr she feels like an invincible berserker (probably feel this to much), but when I play rhino I feel like a guy with rebuff-able body armor who just happens like screaming, running into people and throwing hissy fits. 

Edited March 16, 2016 by Alphascrub

[--Q--uaint]

On 3/15/2016 at 2:57 AM, tnccs215 said:

While you did satisfy me, the problems archwizard mentioned still exist.

to be honest, I think that if you want to use a per kill energy system, you might as well simply replenish % of the energy bar every time an enemy dies in a 50 meter radius, a la affinity sharing (or even remove the range limitation altogether), and make that percentage variable according to people in squad, to prevent the current problem of full squads having an energy advantage vs the solo player.

Eh. I think ability kills shouldn't count for the person making the kill, since that would feed the lootcave setup even more than now.

I think some variation of this would be better than what we have now, but I dunno that it'd be actually enough better to be worth implementation (or in our case, begging for implementation).

 

Now for some more cherrypicking in the OP:

On 3/21/2014 at 6:53 PM, Archwizard said:

Radial Disarm disables the abilities and flight of Mutalist Infested, Grineer Regulators and Hellions

At least for a while, it disabled the Tar Moa and Fart Osprey. Swarm Moa stops shooting, but it still produces swarms when it kicks. I think Regulators pretty much die to RD's damage, almost regardless of level.

It already works that way on Hellions.

On 3/21/2014 at 6:53 PM, Archwizard said:

Valkyr
- Rip Line casts against the environment cause Valkyr to knock down enemies she passes through (ie dive kick).
- Paralysis stun duration doubled.
- Prolonged Paralysis no longer affects stun duration; augment renamed.
- Hysteria no longer makes Valkyr invulnerable or deals damage to the player when it ends, but instead prevents Valkyr from falling below 1 health (by any means) while active. While active, damage dealt to the user's health increases the user's damage dealt until the effect ends (exchange rate affected by rank and Power Strength).

I like your Rip Line change.

I feel like Paralysis and Prolonged Paralysis are fine, but this is your thread not mine.

I had an idea for Hysteria recently:

Keep the full invulnerability, low drain, and lifesteal. Give her more fluid, usable combos. Make it so the invulnerability procs as soon as you hit #4 I am so done being down in Hysteria with no way to do anything.

Make the base damage on the claws <Venka base damage or something similarly underwhelming>*<maximum health>/<current health>

Since this clearly would make her damage die quickly from the lifesteal, another change is in order: give her an effect that maintains the damage level of her strikes so long as she continues to hit things. This effect would easily be trackable for the player by putting the duration on top of the Hysteria icon while it's active.
The effect would get incremented by one second for each strike and would have a cap of 4-5 seconds. Neither of these values would be moddable. This is done so that Hysteria's damage-maintenance is more forgiving than the default melee combo, but isn't affected by Body Count.
The one-second increments are to make maintaining extremely high damage VS low level enemies harder, so there's less trivialization.
Making it a separate effect makes it quite reasonable to add nice QoL like freezing the timer while you rez allies (especially since helping your friends that just got rekt shouldn't make you less angry).

The result of this change would be that Hysteria is able to put out low-end fully-modded melee damage all the time, and the full utility of being invulnerable for long periods is maintained.
To maximize the ability's potential, one would have to take as much damage as possible without dying, then wreck face constantly to maintain the damage output after the first swing.
I feel like that would keep most of what people are attached to in this ability while mitigating the utter braindeadness and total trivialization.

[Elydir]

Watched the devstream stuff.

Mag rework looks like fun, although I wish they did more with her ultimate.

Nice to see you got some questions in, Arch, though it sucks they kinda brushed off your loot question.

[PsychoticMarik]

30 minutes ago, Annon5150 said:

Nice to see you got some questions in, Arch, though it sucks they kinda brushed off your loot question.

They didn't just brush it off...they flat out mocked it, and in fact seemed to take offense to the very notion.

I already posted my thoughts on this on the warframe reddit, and to no surprise its not a popular one, but it is genuine, and I make no apologies for it.

"The attitude and condescension displayed towards those pointing out the massive and obvious design flaws of desecrate and other loot based powers really gets on my nerves, and Rebecca's obvious attempts to not push the issue because she didn't want to irritate him further is honestly pathetic and doesn't inspire any confidence whatsoever in these devs for me.

Its obvious they care more about fluff than actual content(hell this stream was 90% fluff yet again)and have no intention of changing loot based powers. Idk if they are just that clueless, or if they just cant admit when their wrong, but I'm glad I saw what I did. I'm now certain giving them anymore of my money is a waste. The game hasnt been able to get my attention for a long time now, and I've been playing other games instead. This only serves to discourage me further from the game.

Few devs have done me the kindness of outright showing me why they dont deserve my money like DE have."

All I can honestly say at this point is that I have officially given up on this dev team, and any hopes I had that they might learn what is, and what isnt good design. The player base is largely a lost cause in this regard as well ihmo. Thank you Archwizard for pushing the issue enough to at least get their attention. If nothing else you've helped me become a more informed player about what DE intend/dont intend to do with this game.

Maybe somewhere far down the line they will start understanding, but I wont hold my breath. At least I can count on the game being much prettier in 6 months.

Edited March 18, 2016 by PsychoticMarik

[Hammahness808]

46 minutes ago, PsychoticMarik said:

They didn't just brush it off...they flat out mocked it, and in fact seemed to take offense to the very notion.

I already posted my thoughts on this on the warframe reddit, and to no surprise its not a popular one, but it is genuine, and I make no apologies for it.

"The attitude and condescension displayed towards those pointing out the massive and obvious design flaws of desecrate and other loot based powers really gets on my nerves, and Rebecca's obvious attempts to not push the issue because she didn't want to irritate him further is honestly pathetic and doesn't inspire any confidence whatsoever in these devs for me.

Its obvious they care more about fluff than actual content(hell this stream was 90% fluff yet again)and have no intention of changing loot based powers. Idk if they are just that clueless, or if they just cant admit when their wrong, but I'm glad I saw what I did. I'm now certain giving them anymore of my money is a waste. The game hasnt been able to get my attention for a long time now, and I've been playing other games instead. This only serves to discourage me further from the game.

Few devs have done me the kindness of outright showing me why they dont deserve my money like DE have."

All I can honestly say at this point is that I have officially given up on this dev team, and any hopes I had that they might learn what is, and what isnt good design. The player base is largely a lost cause in this regard as well ihmo. Thank you Archwizard for pushing the issue enough to at least get their attention. If nothing else you've helped me become a more informed player about what DE intend/dont intend to do with this game.

Maybe somewhere far down the line they will start understanding, but I wont hold my breath. At least I can count on the game being much prettier in 6 months.

Thank you for this post. Only been playing for about 10 months but I have about 850+ hours invested (and some money) and I quite feel the same.

[Archwizard]

3 hours ago, Annon5150 said:

Mag rework looks like fun, although I wish they did more with her ultimate.

All I can say here is "agreed".

3 hours ago, PsychoticMarik said:

I already posted my thoughts on this on the warframe reddit, and to no surprise its not a popular one, but it is genuine, and I make no apologies for it.

Honestly, I think the reason it's unpopular is because it's a bit... caustic.

Rebecca did a fine job. She hit the nail on the head with several of the points. That she didn't necessarily agree didn't seem to matter (at least until she mentioned it), she made the effort anyway and didn't try to undermine it in the delivery, which is more than I would have done. The only thing I will say could have been improved was to bring more attention to people making groups to pickpocket Misery and the G3.

If anything, I will say that Scott's response - "Could this question be any longer?" - was immature. I will admit that after several devstream threads (around... 30 by now) of not having variations on that question answered, I got frustrated with condensing a TL;DR on an issue that only gets worse.
^{To answer his question though, yes, it absolutely could be and next time I might just do that.}

I agree with the point you're trying to make though. I didn't expect that I would see flat agreement (at the very least, some discussion could begin), but it's disappointing to see the issue laughed off, and a number of players are already throwing together every argument they can think of to justify it. "Well it's all they're useful for!" doesn't seem to matter in the case of, say, Ivara, or the number of people who will pounce to say Shadow builds work excellently on Nekros (strangely, they only seem to jump up when I try to present that strawman argument as a reason to improve the frames).

I presented an alternative that could have left the effect on farming the same while freeing Nekros and farmer frames from the task, and nobody seems to have noticed that. To some degree, people don't want to look at that possibility. If we want to counter, highlight that instead of devbashing.

Edited March 18, 2016 by Archwizard

[Azamagon]

Positives from the devstream in regards to Warframes - I'm quite happy about the Mag rework, mainly 'cuz they took A LOT of my ideas into account! :D
(Mainly the Crush (and Pull too, which is their idea) affecting BA (now Magnetized) targets, no matter where they are +  the BA/Magnetize bubble's explosion scaling from damage done to the target (although I'm not the only one that has suggested that) + BA/Magnetize pulling in enemies towards the main target)

Negatives from the devstream in regards to Warframes - I'm sad about the immaturity from the devs (Scott mainly) and their dismissal of the loot power problem :/ Actually, it makes me REALLY sad. Not only is it unprofessional and immature, it is also VERY bad for themselves to outright mock their players like this, i mean, as the saying goes "Don't bite the hand that feeds you"... Archwizard, keep up the good fight in this antiloot power discussion. Hopefully, the devs will one day understand... hopefully :/

[Gurpgork]

1 minute ago, Azamagon said:

Hopefully, the devs will one day understand... hopefully :/

Well, the thing Scott said that made me a little more optimistic is that they've incorporated many ideas (syandanas, kavats, ect.) that earlier they would have flat-out rejected, so I guess it's not entirely impossible that they'll change their minds about loot abilities.

[PsychoticMarik]

2 hours ago, Archwizard said:

Honestly, I think the reason it's unpopular is because it's a bit... caustic.

Fair enough.

I'm just not the type to hold back when something really gets under my skin, and I appreciate others who treat me in this manner. It feels real, and more like respect to be told something bluntly than to have someone pussy foot around like I'm made of fragile glass.

I find that those who can be receptive to it tend to have an appreciation for it. A no nonsense tell it like I see it kinda approach.

Perhaps its not as helpful as I'd like it to be, but as I've come to learn "Listen to what people are saying, and less to how they are saying it".

In any case you're a stronger man than I. My patience has expired. There are simply too many other games competing for my free time, and I cant keep trying to convince a dev team that just wont listen.

[--Q--uaint]

1 hour ago, PsychoticMarik said:

I'm just not the type to hold back when something really gets under my skin, and I appreciate others who treat me in this manner. It feels real, and more like respect to be told something bluntly than to have someone pussy foot around like I'm made of fragile glass.

So much this.

1 hour ago, PsychoticMarik said:

There are simply too many other games competing for my free time

Do any of them have an equivalent/comparable feature to Coptering or at least Parkour 2.0?

4 hours ago, Archwizard said:

it’s disappointing to see the issue laughed off

If more people posted such questions in the devstream threads, do you think they'd pay more attention?

[Hammahness808]

5 minutes ago, ChronoEclipse said:

Do any of them have an equivalent/comparable feature to Coptering or at least Parkour 2.0?

I'm playing Skyrim again instead. The story may get old but new mods and the fact that I can make my own mods makes the game 10x more enjoyable. It may not have coptering but I have 100x the amount of spells/abilities to access and can make more :)

[Archwizard]

2 minutes ago, ChronoEclipse said:

If more people posted such questions in the devstream threads, do you think they'd pay more attention?

They do, and I'm sure they have.

_{^{Still doesn't change how Scott reacted.}}

[--Q--uaint]

5 hours ago, Archwizard said:

I presented an alternative that could have left the effect on farming the same while freeing Nekros and farmer frames from the task, and nobody seems to have noticed that.

Was that here, or in your question, or?

Also, I just went back and watched that response. I felt like the whole group was taking a collective dump on Rebecca for bringing it up. It only let up when she said she likes the loot powers herself.

I don’t understand why someone would enjoy using a meta-power, but ok.

[Archwizard]

Just now, ChronoEclipse said:

Was that here, or in your question, or?

It was in the original question.

Just now, ChronoEclipse said:

I don’t understand why someone would enjoy using a meta-power, but ok.

I think it's more the idea of it. As they said, they think the powers have "a place" within the game.

In some cases, like Ivara or Hydroid, being able to steal from enemies is thematic and adds some flavor to the class. The problem comes when it jumps from just "flavor" to legitimately affecting gameplay to any notable extent.

[--Q--uaint]

7 minutes ago, Archwizard said:

legitimately affecting gameplay to any notable extent.

That’s what 'frame powers are supposed to do. The fact that it indirectly affects the gameplay by changing people’s behaviors is the problem. But I'm sure you knew that. I just like splitting hairs :V

I think DE doesn’t like the idea of just reducing the grind and giving us more interesting mechanics lol.

[taiiat]

20 minutes ago, Archwizard said:

In some cases, like Ivara or Hydroid, being able to steal from enemies is thematic and adds some flavor to the class. The problem comes when it jumps from just "flavor" to legitimately affecting gameplay to any notable extent.

i think those two Abilities in particular represent both sides. Prowl is very limited, making it only really useful on Enemies that you rarely see. it is effectively useless at l00t grind vs the group of 20 Enemies - and that's both thematically and game balance wise good.

on the other hand, Tentacle Swarm able to make more l00t, with how it's handled... actually makes an impact worth noting in the grand scheme just like Desecrate does, and then it starts getting into the problematic territory.
for Tentacle Swarm, i guess if only the Enemies the Tentacles have grabbed can make extra l00t, it might be able to be thematic. it'd be very impractical to actually use for l00t specifically in the grand scheme, but still holding the theme.

Et Cetera.

[--Q--uaint]

8 minutes ago, taiiat said:

~snip~

I think it’s fair to say Arch’s suggestion that looting powers only give in-mission benefits is reasonable. Picking a Grineer’s pocket is liable to give you some extra ammo or maybe medical gear. Picking his pocket doesn’t seem like it should matter to whether he had a Mod on him or not.

[taiiat]

Just now, ChronoEclipse said:

I think it’s fair to say Arch’s suggestion that looting powers only give in-mission benefits is reasonable.

i know. that would be the ideal.

[--Q--uaint]

@Archwizard The forum says you edited the OP an hour ago, but you haven’t updated the changelog :c

[Archwizard]

2 hours ago, ChronoEclipse said:

The forum says you edited the OP an hour ago, but you haven’t updated the changelog :c

Minor phrasing changes, I do that sometimes when I don't like what I'm reading.

If it's worth noting, I note it.

Edited March 19, 2016 by Archwizard