[Devstream 25] Old Helmets Losing Stats : De, There Are Better Ways To Do This

[Zerrien]

The real bad move DE made was to listen to the whine squad in the first place. Things get retired in online games, deal. Only in the warframe forums is it this much of a problem.

 

Is there another game out there that retires... Gameplay exlcusives? It's one thing to retire a cosmetic... mount, or limited edition cosmetic, but, I'd love to see a retired high-level item.

[GrosslyIncandescent1709]

Here's a suggest instead:

 

Put stat changes on every cosmetic item.  Scarves, helmets, emblems; hell, you could even make sheaths for swords, pommels, etc.  Open a whole new market, and new things to put in the alert system to take up the space of those wasted alerts for tiny amounts of credits or nanospores or any other the other alerts no one runs because the reward has no value.  Even the sentinel cosmetics.

 

Then make the stat changes a toggle.  

 

Give me something to use my plat on that I'd actually want to buy to play with.  Once you've got all the weapons and the frames and the sentinels, there comes a time when you just don't have a reason to play anymore except to tinker.  Give me more options to tinker than mod cards.  Even little tweaks.  A different style pommel and a sheath for my Galatine (one of the things I really like for my Dual Zorens is the dagger axe skin, but I WISH it had some sort of stat change that let me tinker with them).

 

And yet DE doesn't consider it because whiners without vision don't see the value in tinkering with their builds; they just want someone to tell them "Do x for best frame" or "do Y for best grineer damage" and be done with it.

 

Go back to Call of Duty please.

those players you call whiners simply believe there should be a balance between frames that is currently nonexistent, the vanguard helmets huge boost compared to vaubans crappy helmets is a good example. i don't think they want to see everything nerfed but rather made equal, so that ember can use that 15% efficiency boost for 5% armor that only nyx gets for example... cause ember is one of those examples for a frame with a serious need for every buff it can get right now.

 

The real bad move DE made was to listen to the whine squad in the first place. Things get retired in online games, deal. Only in the warframe forums is it this much of a problem.

there are people who aren't selfish and greedy, people who care about the fun of everyone and not just themselves, yes, even the players who aren't even playing yet. balance is vital for every game to stay alive

Edited March 21, 2014 by MortalSin

[CWJLee]

What about an option to enable/disable state changes? That way you don't need to get rid of stat and piss off the people who actually want the stats; People who only want the helmet as an esthetic and not affecting anything would be happy; And there won't be any "Exclusive" argument. 

 

Sound about right?

[WARLOCKE]

We're talking about the fact that soon, there's going to be a set of exclusive helmets for players who already own them, with stats, that newer players WILL NOT have access to.

 

There are much more unfun things out there that need to be covered before the speed of Saryn.

 

I know what this thread is about, but thanks for stating the obvious in some lackluster attempt to devalue my talking points.

 

The Bacon helm is the current hot whine. All tho I have to admit its refreshing its not about Nova, The speed of Poisongirl and Frost is mentioned in relation to the bacon helm. The reason why the bacon helm is linked to this topic is because some intrepid soul brought it up as a reason for this action by DE.

[ArsVampyre]

those players you call whiners simply believe there should be a balance between frames that is currently nonexistent, the vanguard helmets huge boost compared to vaubans crappy helmets is a good example. i don't think they want to see everything nerfed but rather made equal, so that ember can use that 15% efficiency boost for 5% armor that only nyx gets for example... cause ember is one of those examples for a frame with a serious need for every buff it can get right now.

 

there are people who aren't selfish and greedy, people who care about the fun of everyone and not just themselves, yes, even the players who aren't even playing yet. balance is vital for every game to stay alive

How doe staking things people want away from them make it balanced?  You say you want better stats for the Vauban helms, yet you want to take away the stats for the rhino helms because people use them?

 

That doesn't make sense.  If your problem is with the specific stats on the cosmetic item, you talk to DE about the item, not about destroying all the other items like it so the item you don't like doesn't seem to be quite as bad anymore.  That's just pants-on-head stupid.

 

And yet that's the consistent cry from nerfers under the guise of this non-existent 'balance' concept.  You don't balance Rhino against Vauban because 1) this is a coop game and 2) Vauban has different uses.  The only 'balance' needed is to make undesirable frames MORE desirable, not desirable frames/power/weapons LESS desirable.

[.Talia.]

Its simple. If you don't want stats on your helmet, you will receive a blueprint of a statless version of the retired helmets you have.

[WARLOCKE]

Its simple. If you don't want stats on your helmet, you will receive a blueprint of a statless version of the retired helmets you have.

 

But what will the socialists have to complain about then?

[SexyTRex]

I love it! Might actually where the beret then.

[ArsVampyre]

Its simple. If you don't want stats on your helmet, you will receive a blueprint of a statless version of the retired helmets you have.

And what about new players that DO want the stats?  After this is 'retired' they get the finger?  Sounds fair...

 

How about DE just ignore the nerfers and invest their time in doing things like making the game more fun?  

[CWJLee]

Its simple. If you don't want stats on your helmet, you will receive a blueprint of a statless version of the retired helmets you have.

That's fine for player who don't want stats, but for people who DO want them but don't have the helmet yet would have a problem, which creates another exclusivity argument 

[Monolake]

So they are cool with OP vanguard speed bonus and leaving it as is for now.

[ZephyrPhantom]

Its simple. If you don't want stats on your helmet, you will receive a blueprint of a statless version of the retired helmets you have.

DE already said they were giving stat-removal blueprints, so I don't think that's necessary. It doesn't solve the exclusivity issue either.

Edited March 21, 2014 by ZephyrPhantom

[marbatico]

Its simple. If you don't want stats on your helmet, you will receive a blueprint of a statless version of the retired helmets you have.

and what about people who join the game after these helmets have been retired? it would be unfair for them to not have acces to these stat changes

[WARLOCKE]

So they are cool with OP vanguard speed bonus and leaving it as is for now.

 

Yup. As I have said all along.

[Deidaku]

Well goodbye weird Vanguard and Hello Manly Thrak helmet.

 

Even the name is better.....THRAK

[GrosslyIncandescent1709]

How doe staking things people want away from them make it balanced?  You say you want better stats for the Vauban helms, yet you want to take away the stats for the rhino helms because people use them?

 

That doesn't make sense.

i'll put it simple. why can't vauban use the 25% speed boost just like rhino? i don't want the stats to be taken away in general, i merely stated that they're either removed or made available for every frame. that's it.

[.Talia.]

Watch the livestream guys, watch the part DE Scott talks about helmets being retired.

[Gekker]

The by DE suggested change is not helping us unfortunately. I am highly against keeping the stats for any player.

 

 

Many, many players have these stat helmets already and THEY are mostly the ones who want to get rid of them because they want to choose their looks without having to worry about its effect on their stats. If we get to keep these helmets we still wont have any choice but to keep on using these helmets that may look really ugly for us or are just not the way we want to look.

E.g. I would love to equip the Meridian Helmet on my Trinity because it makes her look freaking awesome but due to the existance of the Aura Helmet I am unable to choose because it turned into an calculation. That is one reason why I want for the stats to go personally.

 

Additionally the fact that Rhino Prime is abel to equip the Vanguard helmet and gets as fast as the fastest frame, Loki is a serious balance matter DE has to take serious if you ask me.

 

And there is the fact that new players are already complaining about exclusive content they will never be able to get (Excalibur, Skana, Lato Prime /Vandal, Snipetron etc). Keeping helmets with stats in the game is just gasoline spilled into the matter.

 

The decision DE can make is simple removing stats from helmets, maybe refunding people that have bought the helmet and removing the helmet from their inventory leaving them with the decision to re-buy it. Or maybe even sending a gift of like 20 platin to anyone who had at least one of these helmets to say "sorry but we had to do it".

 

 

But there are other thing we can do as well. We could Introduce these stats with the new Focus Endgame implementation. Focus is suppose to give our frames and weapons minor buffs and the stats we have on helmest now could work in some way or another in the new Focus system. And if not there was a really nice idea somewhere here on the forums that are about introducing mods for helmets that give these stats independently.

 

There are so many ways to do this right, DE. Keeping the helmets for those who have it is not the right way.

Start a dialoge with us here. We love talking to you guys, there is a lot we can all learn and there are many great ideas to solve it in the right way :)

[ArsVampyre]

The by DE suggested change is not helping us unfortunately. I am highly against keeping the stats for any player.

 

 

Many, many players have these stat helmets already and THEY are mostly the ones who want to get rid of them because they want to choose their looks without having to worry about its effect on their stats. If we get to keep these helmets we still wont have any choice but to keep on using these helmets that may look really ugly for us or are just not the way we want to look.

E.g. I would love to equip the Meridian Helmet on my Trinity because it makes her look freaking awesome but due to the existance of the Aura Helmet I am unable to choose because it turned into an calculation. That is one reason why I want for the stats to go personally.

 

Additionally the fact that Rhino Prime is abel to equip the Vanguard helmet and gets as fast as the fastest frame, Loki is a serious balance matter DE has to take serious if you ask me.

 

And there is the fact that new players are already complaining about exclusive content they will never be able to get (Excalibur, Skana, Lato Prime /Vandal, Snipetron etc). Keeping helmets with stats in the game is just gasoline spilled into the matter.

 

The decision DE can make is simple removing stats from helmets, maybe refunding people that have bought the helmet and removing the helmet from their inventory leaving them with the decision to re-buy it. Or maybe even sending a gift of like 20 platin to anyone who had at least one of these helmets to say "sorry but we had to do it".

 

 

But there are other thing we can do as well. We could Introduce these stats with the new Focus Endgame implementation. Focus is suppose to give our frames and weapons minor buffs and the stats we have on helmest now could work in some way or another in the new Focus system. And if not there was a really nice idea somewhere here on the forums that are about introducing mods for helmets that give these stats independently.

 

There are so many ways to do this right, DE. Keeping the helmets for those who have it is not the right way.

Start a dialoge with us here. We love talking to you guys, there is a lot we can all learn and there are many great ideas to solve it in the right way :)

How about you just don't play with the helmets and stop trying to ruin it for others who want them?  Ever considered that option?

 

Balance == bullS#&$.

[ZephyrPhantom]

Watch the livestream guys, watch the part DE Scott talks about helmets being retired.

Just rewatched the stream, and now I'm confused - at 54:35 they say they're going to be reissuing statless versions of the retired helmets, but 10 seconds later they mentions a blueprint to "turn helmets into statless".

 

...DE, do you even have an idea of where you're going with this?

[Zerrien]

How about you just don't play with the helmets and stop trying to ruin it for others who want them?  Ever considered that option?

 

Balance == bullS#&$.

 

Seriously? We're about to get an indirect PvP mode, and you want to give Veterans even more of an advantage over new players?

 

When a new player asks why their clan can't compete in Badlands, and everyone says, "oh, you don't have stat helmets? lol."

[GrosslyIncandescent1709]

Balance == bullS#&$.

yeah, let the game die, screw diversity... like ember or frost? well it's your problem, better grab rhino cause the frames you like unfortunately are boring and underpowered

[(PSN)Pengu_Imperialus]

The by DE suggested change is not helping us unfortunately. I am highly against keeping the stats for any player.

 

 

Many, many players have these stat helmets already and THEY are mostly the ones who want to get rid of them because they want to choose their looks without having to worry about its effect on their stats. If we get to keep these helmets we still wont have any choice but to keep on using these helmets that may look really ugly for us or are just not the way we want to look.

E.g. I would love to equip the Meridian Helmet on my Trinity because it makes her look freaking awesome but due to the existance of the Aura Helmet I am unable to choose because it turned into an calculation. That is one reason why I want for the stats to go personally.

 

Additionally the fact that Rhino Prime is abel to equip the Vanguard helmet and gets as fast as the fastest frame, Loki is a serious balance matter DE has to take serious if you ask me.

 

And there is the fact that new players are already complaining about exclusive content they will never be able to get (Excalibur, Skana, Lato Prime /Vandal, Snipetron etc). Keeping helmets with stats in the game is just gasoline spilled into the matter.

 

The decision DE can make is simple removing stats from helmets, maybe refunding people that have bought the helmet and removing the helmet from their inventory leaving them with the decision to re-buy it. Or maybe even sending a gift of like 20 platin to anyone who had at least one of these helmets to say "sorry but we had to do it".

 

 

But there are other thing we can do as well. We could Introduce these stats with the new Focus Endgame implementation. Focus is suppose to give our frames and weapons minor buffs and the stats we have on helmest now could work in some way or another in the new Focus system. And if not there was a really nice idea somewhere here on the forums that are about introducing mods for helmets that give these stats independently.

 

There are so many ways to do this right, DE. Keeping the helmets for those who have it is not the right way.

Start a dialoge with us here. We love talking to you guys, there is a lot we can all learn and there are many great ideas to solve it in the right way :)

I am advocating helmet solidarity.  I will go statless, unless it costs me lots resources.  I have tracked down all the Stated helmets and I would be ok with them disappearing all together.  It honestly shouldn't effect your build too much either, unless you are so dependent on the helmet that without your legs fall off...

[(PSN)Pengu_Imperialus]

Just rewatched the stream, and now I'm confused - at 54:35 they say they're going to be reissuing statless versions of the retired helmets, but 10 seconds later they mentions a blueprint to "turn helmets into statless".

 

...DE, do you even have an idea of where you're going with this?

The statless blueprint will use up the stated helm.

[ZephyrPhantom]

The statless blueprint will use up the stated helm.

Except the way it was stated, it could also be interpreted the way RexSol stated, with a complete wipe of helmet stats and everyone just getting statless one as reimbursement.