Exclusivity Should Be Visual Only And Anything Else Is Either Pay2Win Or Just A Limitation To New Players.

[Evan-0-matic]

Hashtag BuyRhinoPrimeToDealWithIt

I was sick of farming and decided to put some money aside for when Rhino Prime showed up. Not to mention I love this game and decided DE earned my cash by developing something fun.

Do you have an issue with me beig an adult?

[Monolake]

Depends on how you consider trading really, to trade these someone must already have farmed them so someone worked to get these.

I feel like trading is a good way for someone who doesnt want to pay to get platinum without DE losing potential customers.

 

Exclusive weapons are problem tbh, theres no better machine pistol than dex furis or vipers wraith, if someone decides that its a weapon type that they like, sorry but they wont get best one.

Same with semi auto shotguns, there are only 3, strun, hek and strun wraith, rest is full auto, double barreled or flak cannon which tries to imitate real shotgun. Again these ppl wont get best of the class weapon.

 

You forget that not everyone wants to use brakk or soma and these ppl wont be able to get best weapon out of their favorite category for a pretty long time.

Ofc thats more of a balance problem than exclusives but still my point stands.

A variety of choice disadvantage - you just have less alternatives,  is not as bad as technical power disadvantage, when there is no choice at all, you are forever behind.

[DuWryght]

People fail to realize that you don't need the event mods/weapons to be relevant in this game.

 

It's not like life is impossible w/o the Cicero mods... Prior to, I'm sure we were all doing just fine.

 

Gorgon Wraith and Dex Furis? They will be a forgotten thing of the most recent past come next update.

[Onisa]

I was sick of farming and decided to put some money aside for when Rhino Prime showed up. Not to mention I love this game and decided DE earned my cash by developing something fun.

Do you have an issue with me beig an adult?

Not particularly, but the tone of your previous post along with your avatar make you seem like the kind of person who throws money at their problems to make them go away.

 

As far as your 'shoulda started earlier' argument, that's not always an option.

I have short stubby fingers that make this game this game uncomfortable to play with a keyboard. So while I started the first week of January I had to delay serious play while I tracked down a usb controller. Needless to say I missed out on Cisero.

Do I want to be given those prizes as freebies? No, I'd rather earn them in a rehashed event or through something interesting. Don't really care how, as long as I get a chance at them.

[Akaya754]

DE was saying in a past livestream that they will somehow revive past events and integrate them into the game in some permanent fashion. My guess is that you can get the exclusive mods and weapons some way or the other later in the game. 

 

As for pay4power/pay2win, I really think it's more like pay2save-time; you spend say 1000 plat on a full compliment of mods, a frame and a bunch of boosters. This still won't put you at the same level as the veteran player who has grinded enough for all the mods to go on the weapon and has the mastery rank to reach the more powerful weapons. You still have to do some leveling (or a lot, depending on how you want your gear) only now you have it much easier than the guy beside you. It comes down to a choice to how you want to enjoy the game ie. not everyone likes to start off an RPG at level 70 and one shot everything until you run through 80% of the game and cry boring all the way. 

[TempestFoxNZ]

Play for fun, not for the rewards. If the events and the gameplay in Warframe in general is boring in your opinion, why are you still here?

 

You cannot separate the the reward system from general gameplay, its an essential part.

[TempestFoxNZ]

Not particularly, but the tone of your previous post along with your avatar make you seem like the kind of person who throws money at their problems to make them go away.

 

As far as your 'shoulda started earlier' argument, that's not always an option.

I have short stubby fingers that make this game this game uncomfortable to play with a keyboard. So while I started the first week of January I had to delay serious play while I tracked down a usb controller. Needless to say I missed out on Cisero.

Do I want to be given those prizes as freebies? No, I'd rather earn them in a rehashed event or through something interesting. Don't really care how, as long as I get a chance at them.

 

Are you serious, that's what money is for - to deal with problems. Hence the USB controller to fix yours. 

 

You also had your chance to get them, you just missed it (for whatever reason)

[PunisherX]

u do know that u can make these mods va transmute right there rare but in there its not like prime chamber where the only way to get it is to pay $200 worth of plat  that mod sell from 2k plat to 10k plat and yes i have seen people pay the 10k be for and o well its not pay to win when the mods where a reward for doing events pay to win means that the cash shop has stuff u cant get in game unless u pay $$ for it and its OP like making a gun in the cash shop only and its so OP that it kills people in 1 hit  or making a skin that adds armor and u can only get it throw the cash shop this games in no way pay to win alerts have mods all the time and frame parts only 1 mod i wish was in game and thats prime chamber 

[Archistopheles]

I was sick of farming and decided to put some money aside for when Rhino Prime showed up. Not to mention I love this game and decided DE earned my cash by developing something fun.

Do you have an issue with me beig an adult?

 

That's a silly question. My comment had nothing to do with your age.

 

When you instantly buy the (arguably) best solo frame and gun whilst simultaneously telling newbs to "deal with it," you come across as a Delta Satchel.

 

(D-bag if you didn't catch that)

[Scryed]

Well this is my opinion. I don't care about skana lato and excalibur prime being exclusive, its ok. Excalibur proto skin is also ok. Wraith & Vandal weapons and exclusive mods however, are just a nightmare for new players to come. Theres no.doubt that if you wanna make reliable proc builds, you need tethra and cicero mods. I personally have cicero mods and can just buy tethra for cheaper than I sold them anytime, for platinum howeverm I can agree that they need to be rare, but any exclusive mod or weapon that is stronger than original will limit the joy new players will have.

Sure, old players need some exclusives, but that exclusivity should be exclusive to visuals and not something that changes the way you play for once and for all.

Think what would happen if melee 2.0 was exclusive to founders only...

Well I made my point. I dont see any possible reasonable argument to oppose how I think. This is bad for de, bad for our community, bad for new players. There shouldnt be exclusive mods or weapons that are basicly needed. Primed chamber is a game breaker: Either you cant buff snipers without making them too OP, so sniper is not reliable for normal player, or you buff it to make it reliable to normal player and you make it too OP for that 1000 person who won that mode.

Timed exclusive can be ok but not with disney vault; you can just release them several months ago for some, but you need to express that openly. A mod released for some players should be availible to others within a month or two at max.

[Onisa]

Are you serious, that's what money is for - to deal with problems. Hence the USB controller to fix yours. 

 

You also had your chance to get them, you just missed it (for whatever reason)

Has that turn of phrase really fallen that far out of use? Or are you being dense?

I can never tell anymore. If you're not being dense, it's not a positive trait beyond having to be rich to do it.

Buying groceries for the week isn't throwing money at your problems, but buying a position on the board of a fortune 500 company because you absolutely have to have the bragging right of being there is.

[Nagisawa]

Vandals and Wraiths are usually pretty balanced. You don't see that many players with Strun Wraiths, Gorgon Wraiths, Twin Wraith Vipers or Snipetron Vandals anymore.

 

Tethra and Cicero mods, indeed, are a problem.

That's because those without whined and whined and whined and got them nerfed to the point that they aren't worth carrying around.

 

And if no one wants nice buffed up toys for putting up with the crappy gameplay and bugs, fine.  Stop giving them to us.  Just make them skins for existing weapons.  There done.

[Seanjuju]

1.The mods aren't limited edition, they will be released to everyone at some point. The exclusive mod atm is primed chamber.

2.The weapons are swag for what players have accomplished and milestones they've been here for. I have no interest in making these weapons meaningless.

 

Is there anything else? 

[BizarreFetalChimpanzee]

I'm quite concerned with DE's decision with regards to how to handle stats on helmets. I agree the issue needed to be dealt with, but the way they've proposed to do it is outright pathetic. All it'll do is cause an insane rift in the playerbase (not like we have those already). I can see it now...

 

Player 1: Why is that Rhino going faster than mine?

Player 2: Vanguard helmet.

Player 1: How can I get it?

Player 3: You can't get it with the stats anymore and those stats shouldn't be re-released because I was there and you weren't, HAHAHA!

 

Get the picture?

 

As for the cicero and more recent tethra mods, those should most definitely be rereleased. The cicero mods especially have been out long enough they should have been put into the nightmare drop tables as soon as february, considering how much of a difference they make in a status chance build, and that's not including the extra damage they bring to the table.

 

With regards to wraith/vandal weapons, I'm fine with these as being "disney vault" weapons, exclusive for the time they are distributed and for a fwe months afterwards, and then re-released as part of a new event and then put back into the vault. Keeps them at least semi-exclusive while still giving newer players a chance at earning those weapons (not the lato or braton vandal though, since it was either one or both of those that were made as closed-beta gifts). 

 

Founders of course is a no, but that's because of the promise DE made to not re-release it, and not my own real opinion on it. 

[derclaw]

I'm quite concerned with DE's decision with regards to how to handle stats on helmets. I agree the issue needed to be dealt with, but the way they've proposed to do it is outright pathetic. All it'll do is cause an insane rift in the playerbase (not like we have those already). I can see it now...

 

Player 1: Why is that Rhino going faster than mine?

Player 2: Vanguard helmet.

Player 1: How can I get it?

Player 3: You can't get it with the stats anymore and those stats shouldn't be re-released because I was there and you weren't, HAHAHA!

 

Get the picture?

 

As for the cicero and more recent tethra mods, those should most definitely be rereleased. The cicero mods especially have been out long enough they should have been put into the nightmare drop tables as soon as february, considering how much of a difference they make in a status chance build, and that's not including the extra damage they bring to the table.

 

With regards to wraith/vandal weapons, I'm fine with these as being "disney vault" weapons, exclusive for the time they are distributed and for a fwe months afterwards, and then re-released as part of a new event and then put back into the vault. Keeps them at least semi-exclusive while still giving newer players a chance at earning those weapons (not the lato or braton vandal though, since it was either one or both of those that were made as closed-beta gifts). 

 

Founders of course is a no, but that's because of the promise DE made to not re-release it, and not my own real opinion on it. 

Sacrifices must be made to keep stuff balanced. DE make things they treat as mistakes but they dont want to bend over those who like their "mistakes". No more stats on helmets - thats their word, but those who dont want to lose stats can keep them. Fair enough for me. Speedy-racer Rhino will be the preciouse artifact of old times.

 

Also - notice how nobody complains about any other helmet except Vanguard - thats cause the advantage of that helmet can be seen with naked eye. No new player will cry for not having dmg buff of Pendragon since he just wont notice it.

 

Stop focusing on bad stuff. Look at good side - helms that give S#&$ty stats will be used again for their cool look.

Edited March 30, 2014 by derclaw

[Mateus_ex_Machina]

I am a newer player, and I will say I love this game and wish I had been along for more of the journey.  When I heard about the exclusive items, I started a thread on exclusives, which was merged into a megathread later.  Here is the link.  The name is not my doing, the mod changed it.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/185428-the-exclusives-megathread-the-eternal-struggle-of-giving-a-damn-and-not-giving-a-damn-about-event-items/

 

My suggestion of how to deal with the issue of Founder exclusive items, without DE breaking their sacred oath to their founders: make weapons or skins that are definitively better.  By that, I mean all stats equal or greater, with the same basic functionality.  That would satisfy newer players, while hopefully not ticking off the Founders too much.  Second opinions on this idea?  If someone could tell DE about this suggestion, or point me too a "submit idea" form, that'd be great.

I agree with you except in one thing, i don't think that veteran players need exclusives, and exclusives, whether or not they are common in other games do create controversia amongst players, specially if they give advantages. 

Well, on the one hand, having something to show you are a veteran, other than heavily ground gear, is a neat feature, and having some exclusive cosmetics is definitely cool with me.

 

Play for fun, not for the rewards. If the events and the gameplay in Warframe in general is boring in your opinion, why are you still here?

Definitely.  I'm new, but I got in on Tethra's Doom and got max tier rewards.  Did I enjoy the event: YES!  That is another good argument for bringing back event weapons: bring back the events as well, because events are fun.  They'd still technically be exclusive, but new players would have a shot.  This seems to be what DE was going for.

 

De has re-released most event items and mods before, really don't see any reason they'd stop now. For those worried about putting too much time into events ("why should I play the events if I can just do something easier, later?"), the fact remains that these events are for FUN. Sheesh, feels like everyone just up and forgot what a game was.

 

The point of the event is experimentation of game mods and level layouts, tactics, weapons, the whole thing. It also gives us as players a chance to experience something outside of the norm in Warframe, something we might enjoy. Try to keep that in mind while you scrabble for the light loot at the end of the tunnel event.

 

back on topic: OP, I read your post as, "veteran players have exclusives that are way stronger than newer players will ever get."

As it stands right now, I agree. There are some weapons and mods in the exclusives pool that give some pretty insane levels of power (strun wraith, snipetron vandal, cicero, tethra, looking at you guys...). 

 

As it stands right now.

 

DE is already aware of this issue, and has stated that ALL exclusive weapons (and, hopefully, mods too) are slated to make returns, most likely in permanent fashions. (check the livestreams for that, I think it was either #21 or #22, where they mentioned all event weapons going into a "vault" to be released at a later date, like they did with brakk and detron.)

 

The only things they aren't letting go of is the founder's gear, and those really aren't anything to get too worked up about.

 

Actually, now that I think about it, it's not like there aren't commercially available weapons that couldn't match the power of the exclusives. Dread, Synapse, Soma, and various other examples, all available through one form or another, right there in the game. I guess what I'm saying here is that your whole "pay2win" statement was just alarmist and outta line. The only things that you can currently get through payment only is the founder gear, and again, nothing to get worked up over.

 

Just chill out and be patient. Newer players will get their chance, and those weapons and mods will emerge again.

Well, the Lato Prime seems like a fairly good semi-auto pistol, all things considered.  See my above suggestion for how to deal with it being fairly good whilst unavailable to new players.  Should help things out, assuming anyone listens.

 

Sacrifices must be made to keep stuff balanced. DE make things they treat as mistakes but they dont want to bend over those who like their "mistakes". No more stats on helmets - thats their word, but those who dont want to lose stats can keep them. Fair enough for me. Speedy-racer Rhino will be the preciouse artifact of old times.

 

Also - notice how nobody complains about any other helmet except Vanguard - thats cause the advantage of that helmet can be seen with naked eye. No new player will cry for not having dmg buff of Pendragon since he just wont notice it.

 

Stop focusing on bad stuff. Look at good side - helms that give S#&$ty stats will be used again for their cool look.

No, sacrifices do not have to be made.  I saw another forum topic on Helmets where it was suggested that helmet stats could be toggled, or that everyone who purchased a helmet for platinum be given a full refund in case they bought it for stats, and many other suggestions besides, that would avoid alienating new players.  Having "speedy-racer Rhino" as a relic will just be unfair to new players.

 

I'm quite concerned with DE's decision with regards to how to handle stats on helmets. I agree the issue needed to be dealt with, but the way they've proposed to do it is outright pathetic. All it'll do is cause an insane rift in the playerbase (not like we have those already). I can see it now...

Yup, I think DE has really done it this time.  See this forum topic for suggestions on how the situation could be managed and hope that DE actually listens: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/199163-devstream-25-old-helmets-losing-stats-de-there-are-better-ways-to-do-this/

Edited March 31, 2014 by Mateus_ex_Machina

[Davoodoo]

Sacrifices must be made to keep stuff balanced. DE make things they treat as mistakes but they dont want to bend over those who like their "mistakes". No more stats on helmets - thats their word, but those who dont want to lose stats can keep them. Fair enough for me. Speedy-racer Rhino will be the preciouse artifact of old times.

 

Also - notice how nobody complains about any other helmet except Vanguard - thats cause the advantage of that helmet can be seen with naked eye. No new player will cry for not having dmg buff of Pendragon since he just wont notice it.

 

Stop focusing on bad stuff. Look at good side - helms that give S#&$ty stats will be used again for their cool look.

Their mistake was not putting stats on helmets but forcing you to use specific helmet to get specific bonus, if you split these 2(any helmet with any stats) its okay. Their mistake atm is imo removing stats completely for new players while still letting veterans use that poor mechanic.

 

Also giving best in slot stuff in one time events is never a good idea, even if they will be eventually replaced. Gorgon wraith is good example of well made event reward, better than regular but still worse than best lmg. 

Edited March 31, 2014 by Davoodoo

[(PSN)PD_33]

That's a silly question. My comment had nothing to do with your age.

 

When you instantly buy the (arguably) best solo frame and gun whilst simultaneously telling newbs to "deal with it," you come across as a Delta Satchel.

 

(D-bag if you didn't catch that)

 

 

Lol dude, its his choice if he wants to buy something in a game that sells it. If you don't like it, play another game. You can buy things in the game, it is an option for anyone.

[Zarbain]

I don't know if you guys understand that most games with a beta have a special thing that is for the most part OP for a long time till something new comes out that only beta testers get like there was the braton vandal and nobody complains about that even though it can be one of the best weapons. 

[HansJurgen]

event items exist in every other game. they are exclusive to those who participate on those events.

I dont see people making dozens of threads in WOW/GW2/AION/ etc where its completely normal to have

exclusive gear.

 

Name one exclusive item that is ridiculously op in WOW/GW2. Also, who cares about Aion?

 

You named 2 games which have exclusive items. I can name a hundred that do not. How is it even remotely relevant how other games handle it?

Edited April 1, 2014 by HansJurgen

[Ratiasu]

I think it's great and a great intensive for me to keep in touch with what's happening in the game event-wise, even when I'm having a period where I play less.

[The__Q]

(Recap)

So essentially, because people paid money they shouldn't get anything but cosmetics. And event items are bad because you can't get them.

(End recap)

This is obviously just a rage post because you need an event mod/wep.

Also, Event items are tests of SKILL AND RANK, So noobs don't get ridiculous stuff and ruin the fun.

Take the strun wraith event.

It was survival, and you needed to survive 20 min.

That's fair if you have ANY SKILL WHATSOEVER and even mag can do that.

It was old survival so it was camp in one place and kill everything.

That was fair. It shouldn't be re released because it was an EVENT meaning IT WON'T HAPPEN AGAIN and IT'S TO TEST A GAMEMODE.

[Cemges]

(Recap)

So essentially, because people paid money they shouldn't get anything but cosmetics. And event items are bad because you can't get them.

(End recap)

This is obviously just a rage post because you need an event mod/wep.

Also, Event items are tests of SKILL AND RANK, So noobs don't get ridiculous stuff and ruin the fun.

Take the strun wraith event.

It was survival, and you needed to survive 20 min.

That's fair if you have ANY SKILL WHATSOEVER and even mag can do that.

It was old survival so it was camp in one place and kill everything.

That was fair. It shouldn't be re released because it was an EVENT meaning IT WON'T HAPPEN AGAIN and IT'S TO TEST A GAMEMODE.

Yeah yeah you didnt read the post and its just a rage post yeah. I am a rank 1 noob, i havent had any exclusives or i havent been to any events. Thats my first post ever on forums and just to complain. I never bought plat and incapable of earning it and getting any item I want. I dont vare at all for anyone but myself. Give me free plats and free exclusives, I need them for myself.

[GuardWarg]

Talking back like (regardless whether the target deserved it or not) isn't exactly helping your case.

 

My honest oppinion on the thread though... meh, that's life. I'm a free player for the most part and I'm still somewhat new to this game, but I can honestly say the amount of exclusives don't effect me at all.

[Lorche]

People are doing events for those Wraith/Vandal weapon. And DE put quite a long time for the events to be done.

Did they deserved the weapon? Definitely. They participated in the events, after all.

 

But, as stated, the only exclusives in this game are the Founders stuff. Re-releasing the weapon again may hurt some people who did their share of event, but it bound to happen. And mods will be released. Just sit there and be patient.

 

Besides, there will be some people who don't care about the reward and just having fun in events.

 

These two already said what's left to be said.

I do not see a problem with exclusive gear, the only reason I have ever seen anyone complain is because they thought the gear was more powerful because of its exclusivity but that is not the case.

 

Play for fun, not for the rewards.

Edited April 1, 2014 by Lorche