New Warframe Doesn't Feel Tenno Anymore.

[Phobose]

Didnt they mention that they meeded to finalize the animations for his abilities? That the ability names werent the final decisions?

The 4th skill's name is too long and it was missing its usual pizazz.

Edited April 7, 2014 by Phobose

[nekrojiji]

How can Loki and Ash Teleport? Do you know how difficult something like that would be to pull off, let alone have on the fly?

How does Ash and Loki being invisible make their swords/etc hurt more?

How isn't Nova causing the ship structural damage and destroying near everything because she is using anti-matter?

Where do Ash's shurikens come from? How do Loki and the boss who throws decoys have touchable holograms?

How does  Rhino hit the ground so hard that he puts enemies in stasis? How does him roaring make bullets hurt more?

How do ANY of Vauban's moves function?

 

Warframes enjoy a casual relationship with ALL laws of physics and some laws of common sense. Just because you think it is incredibly improbable that Aenon (water spring, refuse to call him by THAT name) can turn into water doesn't make any of the above more probable.

 

Teleporting is not that dificult in principle.... the part where the atoms are rearanged the same way as at the start ... that's the hard part.

 

My point was that all the other frames manifest special abilities in a very similar way. Their "skin" releases particles ....and than the ability manifests. 

The water part can be improved with effects to make it similar to the other frames, but the 1st skill is totaly different. All the frames manifest skills without any help from outside. That bararge ..."must" come from the warframe, not from outside. 

 

and ....  none of the frames break the laws of physics.

Edited April 7, 2014 by nekrojiji

[Basilisk1991]

He turns into a liquid that resembles water, all matter is capable of entering a liquid state, he can just freely switch between the two. I would be fine with a warframe that could take on a gaseous form as well, since the same principle applies. If they decide to give him limited access to the void for his 1, 3, & 4 I'm willing to suspend my disbleieve on those as well. Rhino isn't really Ninja themed either. He's big, bulky, loud, and slow which aren't really traits I associate with Ninjas. Valkyr runs around screaming her head off and ripping guys apart with her bare hands which isn't really what I would call the "subtle" approach typically favored by ninjas.

[LukeAura]

Have you ever seen a Pirate attempt stealth before?

A pirate that was also a stealthy assassin?

It's not like an AAA game was literally just made about that. 

I don't see the purpose of defining every ability having to spawn directly from the frame. That's just limiting the creative potential of abilities, or just shoehorning a reason why it does what it does from a location other than the frame itself. 

I'm fairly sure the whole his ship/barrage thing was just a joke. He's probably just encasing pure void magicwhoozits in highly pressurized water drops that form and launch at an angle to imitate cannon fire.

[Sharrack]

Necros is the best example that warframe abilities never should be taken literally and that tenno can be quite excentric. So any info given for the stranger abilities is usually what you see not what it is.

 

So in case of Hydroid:

1st could be anything from a ship shooting teleporting rounds, to the bullets being created in place out of air moisture intented to look like being teleporting rounds shot by a ship.

2nd could be him transforming into liquid or just an illusion

3rd implies heavily that he creates a pocketdimension as enemies can fall into it.

 

So in the end he is probably just one of the more excentric Tenno.

Edited April 7, 2014 by Sharrack

[nekrojiji]

Necros is the best example that warframe abilities never should be taken literally and that tenno can be quite excentric. So any info given for the stranger abilities is usually what you see not what it is.

 

So in case of Hydroid:

1st could be anything from a ship shooting teleporting rounds, to the bullets being created in place out of air moisture intented to look like being teleporting rounds shot by a ship.

2nd could be him transforming into liquid or just an illusion

3rd implies heavily that he creates a pocketdimension as enemies can fall into it.

 

So in the end he is probably just one of the more excentric Tenno.

 

The part that 1st skill doesn't originate from the warframe is what's wrong with it.

[The_Markness]

Yep I agree.
For me, actually changing the physical structure of a warframe, in this case turning into a liquid state, is a bit far fetched.

Manipulating fluids or generating fluid like you said is alright, but turning into a puddle? Nah, seems silly.

[Sharrack]

The part that 1st skill doesn't originate from the warframe is what's wrong with it.

You not seeing it originate from the warframe doesn't mean it isn't. As said there doesn't need to be a ship and it might be an ability of the frame meant to look like there being a ship.

[Basilisk1991]

Yep I agree.

For me, actually changing the physical structure of a warframe, in this case turning into a liquid state, is a bit far fetched.

Manipulating fluids or generating fluid like you said is alright, but turning into a puddle? Nah, seems silly.

It's just a matter of loosening your molecular structure enough that you shift states, the "puddle" may very well just be a pocket dimension since he actually traps people/corpses in it, which if he was just shifting into a liquid wouldn't happen.

 

We have teleportation abilities in this setting which based on Star Trek and other sci-fi franchises may neccesitate molecular deconstruction/reconstruction, but with this franchse I think we could safely assume most teleporation is done via the void (much like the warp in Warhammer 40K). Most of this sort of boils down to how far you're willing to suspend your disbelief.

[BloodArmoredApostle]

thinking to hard here...........let's see where it goes first.

 

Plus, if in terms of ninja everyone seems to have their own definition. On top of that, comparing traditional old time ninjas to warframe wouldn't mix well either. You can have few relative factors, but it does need to be out of the ordinary.So far, I see trying to rationalize this game with science or something and thought process that seems to be obvious on the thread so far. Didn't think this was the discovery channel or science class. 

Edited April 7, 2014 by BloodArmoredApostle

[(PSN)Bloodedge85]

I disapprove of DE giving Hydroid a pirate theme. They are suppose to have a ninja theme. Period. Also, powers 1, 3, and 4 need a little work.

1.Tempest Barrage- When you activate the power, the water would come from the warframe and run across the ground knocking down enemies in it's path until it reaches it's target then it explodes. Upgrading it will increase the range of the explosion. 

3.Undertow or Submerged- When you turn into a puddle, you should be able to move. When you get close to an enemy, a tentacle grabs and muffles the enemy dragging them into the puddle. Upgrading it would increase the amount of enemies you can hold in the puddle.

4.Deep Dark Sea or Dark Abyss- When the water tentacles come out, they should pound the ground. Creating water shockwaves wherever they smash. Upgrading it increases the size of the shockwaves.

[VergilDT]

there is a slight point here, i mean zephyr doesn't turn in to a lovely summer breeze with tail wind but like all the other posters(didn't read every one) the technology present in the universe and the effects of the void on the tenno can reasonably account for his powers. btw i love the "he's really a liquid" theory.

[Wolfstorm18]

Its ok, he's a droid, not a ninja. He's not human, but a machine, made of n4n0sph0rs. 

[VergilDT]

How can Loki and Ash Teleport? Do you know how difficult something like that would be to pull off, let alone have on the fly?

How does Ash and Loki being invisible make their swords/etc hurt more?

How isn't Nova causing the ship structural damage and destroying near everything because she is using anti-matter?

Where do Ash's shurikens come from? How do Loki and the boss who throws decoys have touchable holograms?

How does  Rhino hit the ground so hard that he puts enemies in stasis? How does him roaring make bullets hurt more?

How do ANY of Vauban's moves function?

 

Warframes enjoy a casual relationship with ALL laws of physics and some laws of common sense. Just because you think it is incredibly improbable that Aenon (water spring, refuse to call him by THAT name) can turn into water doesn't make any of the above more probable.

just an aside here: you would deal more damage to an enemy that's not actively trying in someway to defend or avoid your attack than if they don't see it coming(armor not withstanding). if i threw a brick at you and you dodged only getting hit by some of it as it went by you'd receive less damage than a full force hit to the face you never saw coming.

[TheCometCE]

For all we know, Hydroid's suit may effectively turn him into a non-Newtonian fluid (or permanently), allowing for them to switch between a semi-solid and liquid state on command.

[kaboomonme]

I actually like where this frame is heading, including his name.

 

I would agree about the stealth pirate part, but alot of famous pirates have something better: Cunning.

Leave it to the pirate frame to come up with the sinister puddle trap. Quite genius actually.

 

As for his first ability...I want to see this ship of his. Maybe involve it in some great lore opportunities. Also, in certain tilesets, maybe see it out windows, or on the horizon?

 

-Jin

I don't know though... I mean I love the skill itself, but the look of the Frame itself just looks like a Captain leading his crew along and wiping out enemies with raging tides... as opposed to sitting in a puddle. 

His skills seem a bit too slow-paced for my liking. I thought of him to be a "go out with a bang" kind of frame, but... meh. Maybe in the future, with the Focus system, you can specialize him to fit certain niches, but for now, he's just hanging around the "weird" section on my list, along with Oberon, the wannabe-nuker with a false title (Paladin).

[LGear]

I disapprove of DE giving Hydroid a pirate theme. They are suppose to have a ninja theme.

 

Frost, Vauban, Nekros and Oberon don't have a ninja theme, yet I don't see anybody complaining about them. Hell, what kind of ninja manipulates magnetic powers (Mag), antimatter (Nova), manipulates electricity (Volt) or is a walking tank (Rhino)? The only two Warframes that can be described as "true" ninjas are Loki and Ash, two out of the currently 19 Warframes available including Hydroid (24 if we include Prime versions).

 

Tenno are "ninja" only in the fact that they're assassins with an culturally Eastern bent. However, they do not stick to the Japanese Shinobi archetype most of the time. Sticking to just the aesthetics and abilities that stereotypical ninjas have would just be limiting creativity in Warframe.

[Seanjuju]

1 But with Water

2. On a smaller scale ofcourse.

 

3.

RIGHT? :D

My Day has been made

[fatpig84]

using Naruto to referring something "ninja" its not a good idea

 

Naruto is as Ninja as batman or superman.

[LukeAura]

Ninja is as Naruto as Manbat or Man supper.

Not sure why I saw this when I read it. 

Hydroad seems very attuned to strange void magicks. More so than other Tenno. I highly doubt his abilities are actually what they appear to be, but simply take a water themed effect to cover for their truth.

[Archistopheles]

Weighing in.

 

I agree with jiji.

 

Until now, Warframes have wielded powers. It's weird to have one transform.

 

However, if he has a sister, she would need the ability to turn into animals... if anyone catches my drift...

[Cpl_Facehugger]

Hydroid's 1st, 2nd and 3rd skills don't fit the game..... How can he turn into watter!? and who the hell shoots the cannons!?

If you're going to complain about this, you better also complain about how Rhino can stomp the ground to break time, Excalibur can pull javelins out of nowhere, viral damage and procs affect robots, Valkyr can issue a warcry that actually makes Tenno armor stronger, frost can cast his powers even in a vacuum... As far as science goes, Tenno have been wizards from the word go.

[nekrojiji]

If you're going to complain about this, you better also complain about how Rhino can stomp the ground to break time, Excalibur can pull javelins out of nowhere, viral damage and procs affect robots, Valkyr can issue a warcry that actually makes Tenno armor stronger, frost can cast his powers even in a vacuum... As far as science goes, Tenno have been wizards from the word go.

 

1. Rhino...doesn't stop time with a stomp..... the stomp is the way in wich he manifests his power. If you pay attention you will notice all those particles that come out of him and into the enemies. They (the particles) are responsible for an illusion of stopped time, not the act of stomping the grownd.

 

2. Excalibur manifests swords from all those particles that come out of him when the ability is activated, wich, I believe, are technocyte nano bots. They (again, the particles) take the form of swords that impale enemies. You know.... he's called Excalibur like the legendary "sword" for a reason!?

 

3. Although there aren't cases of the techocyte virus affecting robotics, in the lore, that doesn't mean that "viral" means the same in the time of the tenno as it does in our time. A virus is not only the ARN based parasite. We define a "virus" as something that behaves as the one in the previous sentence.

 

4. This is my favorite piece of Warframe lore.

 Valkyr's lore sais that after being experimented on, her tolerance to pain is huge. How can you implement that piece of lore in the game other than giving her lots of armor?

About Warcry: It is the implementation of "team courage (morale)". When Valkyr cryes out, allies' morale is boosted driving them forward in battle disregarding pain and enemies' morale is lowered. All of this is amplified by the technocyte virus.

 

4. Frost: The illusion of fire, ice and even water can also be created with nano bots.

 

All the descriptions "must" have fantastic even magical expressions. That's the ninja theme. The ninja were believed to possess magical powers, when they were actualy using little or not al all understood technology by the masses.

Edited April 8, 2014 by nekrojiji

[Kyphe]

If you're going to complain about this, you better also complain about how Rhino can stomp the ground to break time, Excalibur can pull javelins out of nowhere, viral damage and procs affect robots, Valkyr can issue a warcry that actually makes Tenno armor stronger, frost can cast his powers even in a vacuum... As far as science goes, Tenno have been wizards from the word go.

 

Ok rhino stomp, not the best description they could have come up with, yet time and space are not separate, time is relative to acceleration and speed and your relationship with quantum space, so if set of some kind of energy pulse that disrupts the fabric of space-time you could theoretically slow time down in a local area. targeting just one group of people though is a different matter and would require the typical deus ex thingy with a button that just works cos they said so

 

hmm the javelins could be energy constructs no different to a replicator on startreck or they could emerge from a portal, or they could be simply rods of energy with holographic images for style lol

 

Viral is the tenocytie virus though (I probably spelt that wrong) but it is a nano virus so effective against robots, I would think gas is more unlikely a weapon for machines unless it has innate corrosion or energy component.

 

Valkyrs war cry has a psychic element and we already know that frames have psychic power like nyx which has always been thought of as mystical but still science lol

 

Frost has no problem with ice in a vacuum as most asteroids are made of ice, it only matters that he has permanent access to some kind of water source via some kind of technology , lets face it he is a water frame.

 

I think the problem with Hydie is that even if you think of the techno ninjas as semi mystics he is just a different brand of magic that feels a bit ridiculous tbh. though this is mostly due to the descriptions of what the powers are and how they are said to work rather than the powers themselves.

 

I mean why water? why focus on an element that has no part in the game other than via Ice which is already taken care of? why not choose the more general liquid? thus avoiding having to explain why getting hit with a water cannon is going to be anything but an act of making your enemies nice and clean.

 

but the ability to actually liquify things, now that is a power, whether it is liquefaction of solid objects or actually liquifying the quantum bonds of reality Itself to make holes in dimensional space, that is some fare more palatable fiction right there lol

 

power 1 broadside, fires a shotgun spray of liquifying globs which do a bit of damage over time but more important make patches on enemy armor which weakens them by half and reduces shields by 30%  it is liquifying the armor and interfering with the shields

 

power 2 surge which is like wave only cast not a transformation, the material of the floor is liquified and then solidifies which leaves caught enemy encumbered or even stuck for a time, the wave might even go out and then come back dragging enemy to you.

 

power 3 abyss like puddle a liquified hole in the floor, perhaps into another dimension which you can jump in yourself of leave as a trap, but i would make it that if you were in enemy would walk over you and if an enemy fell in you would walk over.

 

power 4, hehe you actually liquify or partially liquify a number of enemy units around you tentacles of blood and liquified matter then attack any enemy that gets in range. the power does a set amount of damage to the enemy that are effected, if this kills them or they are killed in any way while under the power then they become large tentacles attached to the floor, if it does not kill them they run around in a panic with one or more smaller attacking tentacles waving about hitting anything that gets close.

 

and I would change his name to Horatio or Ahab or Hook or almost anything that is not hydroid

[Rakosta_Kai]

Weighing in.

 

I agree with jiji.

 

Until now, Warframes have wielded powers. It's weird to have one transform.

 

However, if he has a sister, she would need the ability to turn into animals... if anyone catches my drift...

Wonder Tenno Powers... ACTVATE!