Soulie Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 I'm just not gonna play on the rails anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalaiLlama Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Thought this might help as a summary of sorts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peemy Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 In my opinions it was more sad when Clan Ghost Bear died Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatpig84 Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 If u got a problem, get your own 4k men alliance and throw Eclipse out, don't create Eclipse threads all the time because people are genuinely sick of it lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kartumterek Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 The only node that matters is Sechura, and it is free atm so please just... just stop.. only caring about the self and not others... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mastikator2 Posted May 31, 2014 Author Share Posted May 31, 2014 If u got a problem, get your own 4k men alliance and throw Eclipse out, don't create Eclipse threads all the time because people are genuinely sick of it lol. And what does the abundance of these threads tell you? That everybody is fine with extortionary taxes? Hell, you got enough credits, so why should I complain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BabyChooChoo Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 What is this about? The whole Dark Sector/solar rail business? I have yet to even remotely participate in all that jazz, but based on the amount of complaints about...well...everything since they've bee released, I think I'm going to continue to stay as far away as possible from that side of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmokinDevil Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Hey guys, there is a rail up with 100% tax. Leave eclipse alone and go take your low tax charade somewhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Festinger Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 The overlying assumption that the community stands by and does nothing is quite a simplification: while the overall effect is observed to be Eclipse maintaining and controlling solar rails, it should not be interpreted as the community standing by and doing nothing. A analogy would be that, as brought up earlier, the system of democracy. The view that has the highest votes win, but does that mean that there are no opposing parties? How would you group those that do not participate, whether out of ignorance, apathy or, perhaps a specific form of, learned helplessness? All of them require different arguments to persuade them. Ignorance here includes a few facades, some not correctly grouped but nevertheless will be placed under this category. People that need sleep, work, go to school, neighbor stopped paying their internet bills, not knowing what these conflicts are... all fall under this umbrella(for this reply only). While not much can be done on most of the cases mentioned, the last facade mentioned is of particular interest. To the uninitiated, the dark sector conflicts are just like another void mission, with warframes as enemies(anecdote experience with clan recruits). The normal dark sector does not look awfully different from the other missions either. These two factors might constitute to them treating dark sectors as just another node on the solar map, and then treating them as trivial. For the initiated, perhaps a apt noun to use would be apathy. Poise is the question: "How does it affect me?" There are players that do not partake in normal solar rail operations, but only appear when there are conflicts, for the battlepay or other reasons. I will be focusing on the case where they are motivated by the battlepay, or in your terms, greed. The tributes help the clans/alliance secure funds for the battlepay outs, and reducing the tributes ultimately will affect the payouts, and so from a functionalist[sociological] view point, tributes are a go. I take the conflict theorists'[sociological] standpoint that these high tributes can be used to help subjugate more sectors. With an unprecedented credit pool they can continue to subjugate the dark sector missions, like in Monopoly[the game, nothing to do with monopoly]. Those that know about the conflicts and their implications but decide to avoid them also have set of reasons, such as adopting measures to play warframe without the need of accessing dark sectors. Again, specific reasoning against functionalism and getting those that have done away with the need of dark sectors are required to get them to fight for your cause. Learned helplessness[psychology] is where a fraction of player pool have tried, forums and time investment wise, to reverse this tyranny which you brought up, but have fallen to silent ears or seeing their efforts bearing little fruit. You will require a strong force to recruit them back into the fight again. For arguments that suggest that lower tax will invite higher participation rates, ad ultimately more revenue, one has to first consider the price elasticity[economics]. How much (increase) credits per (decrease) in tribute percentage. This is important because different rails have different participation rates due to rewards and resource drops, as well as accessibility. I have no idea if it's viable to come up with an estimate, but nevertheless it is important to keep this in mind. Personally I would like to observe that is the limit of such taxes until DE team decides to further rectify their rules on dark sectors. Would be much nicer (and darker I suppose) if they don't, but I would like to see how it all pans out in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMKing Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 And what does the abundance of these threads tell you? That everybody is fine with extortionary taxes? Hell, you got enough credits, so why should I complain? Calling 'extortionary' is an exaggeration. Eclipse can't extort people for credits when there's a rail with zero taxes and the highest payout of any Dark Sector sitting over in Pluto. It seems like a copout to mention Pluto, but it really does define both our attitude on taxes and their impact. As long as Sechura is a free rail, nobody has to run any other rail for the purpose of gathering credits, meaning that no clan can force anyone to pay taxes if they would rather not. Most people who run Eclipse rails do so for the XP, or for the resources, neither of which are taxes (XP can't be taxed, and Eclipse has no resource tax on any of its rails as of when I checked today). Jupiter's 50% tax are on the two rails that produce Neural Sensors - which is the only conceivable way anyone would do them. Jupiter is also a lower-credit rail, paying out far less than Ceres or Pluto will, so there's no reason to farm them for credits even if there weren't a zero-point rail. On a side-note, Sinai and Cameria are pretty bad arenas, so they're longer and more tedious than, say, Ceres. Something about Jupiter gas-cities don't mesh well with the Infested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_Gohae Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Most people seem to want their money now rather than later. Which is weird because with a 50% tax their money is being taken now to be given to them later if they choose to be part of the defense. So this thing really just doesnt make any sense to me. After the first couple of weeks of excitement over this i have just ignored Dark Sectors. I guess i would use them if i get bored of ranking up something because doing DS gives you a lot of XP. Other than that this is just a feature i dont care about. Maybe when they add more to it later, at this point there is little reason to pop into those things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrashSpider Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Go to Sedna and on Sangeru there you will find a alliance name invictus that tax you 100% with another tax to resource as well.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deidaku Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Shingeki no Eclipse XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audeath Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Hey guys, there is a rail up with 100% tax. Leave eclipse alone and go take your low tax charade somewhere else. Oh, you mean INVICTUS which is part of Eclipse, so we should leave Eclipse alone once they start using clan deployed rails rather than alliance rails eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rekkou Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 (edited) The irony is, thread like this is a reverse psychology in favor for Eclipse. People simply don't like being judged while they did nothing wrong. They're not siding with eclipse, but they're standing for themselves against people who tried to antagonize them. Edited May 31, 2014 by Rekkou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcKentucky Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Dark Sector broke because this game is lobby-based. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mastikator2 Posted May 31, 2014 Author Share Posted May 31, 2014 Go to Sedna and on Sangeru there you will find a alliance name invictus that tax you 100% with another tax to resource as well.. And they put a resource tax on 5%. Eclipse is gonna start doing that too, soon. They'll raise all their taxes to even more ridiculous numbers slowly. The only reason to go to Dark sectors will be because of XP, and people will just accept it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-InV-Skitz0 Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 (edited) And they put a resource tax on 5%. Eclipse is gonna start doing that too, soon. They'll raise all their taxes to even more ridiculous numbers slowly. The only reason to go to Dark sectors will be because of XP, and people will just accept it. uggh, my clan rail has nuthing to do with eclipse. It was not decided on by eclipse, it was payed for out of my own pocket. as well as the measly little 2 million battle pay that won the rail. further more tax was raised to 100% before the battle was even over, and if you go back to #34 on this very topic i explicitly stated that you should go fight against my own rail if you dislike high taxes because i would raise it to 100% if i won. If everyone that replied to this topic after me complaining about the high taxes had in fact went and ran a few missions against my clan rail then we would not own it right now, but no you would all rather complain about something then actually take action against it. btw I've already gained 1.25 million revenue from this node so apparently a substantial group out there don't even give a crap about having all of there money taken. Again Eclipse has no control over the personal decisions of me or my clan. Edited May 31, 2014 by Skitz0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Somedude1000 Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 I honestly dont ind, because dark sectors were meant to be taxed. I am mad however, that they promised zero and now ask for 50% Oh well :D Godspeed :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythblaze Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 I do not play dark sector missions because it is half &#! content. When the PvP over contested sectors is available, I'm sure Eclipse will fall harder than a sack of bricks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mastikator2 Posted May 31, 2014 Author Share Posted May 31, 2014 uggh, my clan rail has nuthing to do with eclipse. It was not decided on by eclipse, it was payed for out of my own pocket. as well as the measly little 2 million battle pay that won the rail. further more tax was raised to 100% before the battle was even over, and if you go back to #34 on this very topic i explicitly stated that you should go fight against my own rail if you dislike high taxes because i would raise it to 100% if i won. If everyone that replied to this topic after me complaining about the high taxes had in fact went and ran a few missions against my clan rail then we would not own it right now, but no you would all rather complain about something then actually take action against it. btw I've already gained 1.25 million revenue from this node so apparently a substantial group out there don't even give a crap about having all of there money taken. Again Eclipse has no control over the personal decisions of me or my clan. Sorry I was busy fighting in Saturn. Saturn has orokin cells, sedna has nothing of import. I prioritise Saturn over Sedna. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DecoyCode Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 (edited) Considering there isn't any inefficiency for holding multiple rails, it was incredibly easy to tell this would happen. People who made 0% tax rails screwed up, because when they got torn down by a bigwig (Eclipse) they had no money to pay for a fight. Once Eclipse claimed and taxed multiple rails, they paid more than anyone else during fights. Money that other clans/alliances didn't have because they had no rails or didn't have the size. This combined with their large clan size, the overall communities low player-base, and the desire for credits made it so Eclipse is guaranteed to win just about any rail they want. The clan formerly known as Warbros had its champions leave for greener pastures. The clan you see now, Warbros Prime, is the post Tethra event clan of zergtrash we had to recruit just because DE switched clan scoring back to the old flawed method of Clan Size > Clan Effort. This was the last straw for our competing members, as there was no way we could win events scored as such. We had about 250-350 active members during events, and we still beat you like drums. Edited May 31, 2014 by DecoyCode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irreverent Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_Gohae Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 Considering there isn't any inefficiency for holding multiple rails, it was incredibly easy to tell this would happen. People who made 0% tax rails screwed up, because when they got torn down by a bigwig (Eclipse) they had no money to pay for a fight. Once Eclipse claimed and taxed multiple rails, they paid more than anyone else during fights. Money that other clans/alliances didn't have because they had no rails or didn't have the size. This combined with their large clan size, the overall communities low player-base, and the desire for credits made it so Eclipse is guaranteed to win just about any rail they want. The clan formerly known as Warbros had its champions leave for greener pastures. The clan you see now, Warbros Prime, is the post Tethra event clan of zergtrash we had to recruit just because DE switched clan scoring back to the old flawed method of Clan Size > Clan Effort. This was the last straw for our competing members, as there was no way we could win events scored as such. We had about 250-350 active members during events, and we still beat you like drums. It was easy to tell that people wouldnt care about being taxed so they could get a chance at getting that money later if they participated in the defense? I thought this was strange. I thought no tax would reign because people dont take their stuff being taken away. Throwing a guess out there i say that the people going to BP are not the people that do DS. These people just see this as some sort of Alarm and pop in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DecoyCode Posted May 31, 2014 Share Posted May 31, 2014 (edited) It was easy to tell that people wouldnt care about being taxed so they could get a chance at getting that money later if they participated in the defense? I thought this was strange. I thought no tax would reign because people dont take their stuff being taken away. Throwing a guess out there i say that the people going to BP are not the people that do DS. These people just see this as some sort of Alarm and pop in. You don't lose a damn thing if you feed their taxes then side with them in conflicts. Edited May 31, 2014 by DecoyCode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts