Have The Tenno Lost Their Way?

[vaugahn]

We're our own force to be reckoned with at this point (imo), the only reason we don't seem to be treated as much of a major faction is that we operate from the fringes of the system and sectors (if the positioning of the dojo on the original starchart is any indication), content to keep to ourselves unless something requires our immediate attention and we stick to the tradition (and smarter style of war) of black ops-style warfare (smaller groups, smaller goals, still massive impact).

 

Don't forget that even if there's thousands of tenno we're not major at all compared to the Grineer and the Corpus. The Grineer alone have millions of lancers and other soldiers and can clone more constantly, and the Corpus control massive facilities on several planets. 

[MeduSalem]

maybe i am just overreacting, but to me the tenno seem more like savages than "noble warrior" .

 

You are not... because the Dark Sector stuff raises some serious questions about the Tenno faction description. The ongoing conflicts could easily be interpreted as a Tenno Civil War.

 

But thinking about that we might actually have a Civil War much longer than the Dark Sectors exist... because every time some ideas get thrown into the pit on the Forum there are at least 4 categories of Tennos:

 

- Yaysayer

- Naysayer

- Tennos that could go either way

- Tennos that don't care at all

 

All of which need to express their opinion and have a bloody fight to the death or something because that's their only way to debate reasonably. So I guess we don't stand united since a long time ago.

Edited August 11, 2014 by MeduSalem

[Snydrex]

-snip-

 

Yeah, see. This is where gameplay and story begin to bash heads. Compared to us, there are almost an indefinite number of each faction. Grineer aren't going to pull out due to population loss, and neither are the Corpus. So numerically, despite having thousands of Tenno awake and running about, we are still the smallest faction, in danger of going extinct compared to the others.

 

Granted, you make some good points. One of us is enough to kill hundreds of grineer. At this point, however, the sheer difference in numbers is like slowly chipping away at the great wall of china with a lato. (lol)

 

And clans have absolutely no canon lore surrounding each one, so it's a bit of a stretch to give any reason at all why the Tenno remain seperate, let alone different ideals. (Unless doge is now god)

 

Also, our smarter strategy seems to have little to no effect on any faction. It is wise to divide and conquer, but when the enemy has almost infinite resources and surplus infantry compared to us, we have very little effect. In fact, we barely moved from where we were since beta.

 

Also, it's another stretch to say Tenno are humans at our core. I don't know what Tenno are. Nobody has a defined definition besides "magic space ninjas" It's clear we're capable of rational thought and decision-making, but we don't know just how far that rabbit hole goes. We can't talk, and we know very little about ourselves.

 

EDIT: Btw I'm calling bull on infinite Grinnies and Corpses. As well as Tenno populace rising with the amount of players joining. Mixing game and story mechanics like that just causes more questions than it answers.

Edited August 11, 2014 by Snydrex

[Morec0]

Don't forget that even if there's thousands of tenno we're not major at all compared to the Grineer and the Corpus. The Grineer alone have millions of lancers and other soldiers and can clone more constantly, and the Corpus control massive facilities on several planets. 

 

Hence the black ops. We're not a threat like "if we lined up ALL our soldiers and took pop shots, we could possible beat you" we're the "we WILL find you, and we WILL kill you, and there is LITTLE you can do another" type - heck, the Hidden Messages quest seems to suggest that (while we CAN be outmatched eventually) we ARE some kind of one-man army:

 

I see the Sentients crashing down on her, dying in overwhelming numbers. Now she's out of energy, I'm telling her to go but she's laughing, tearing their heads off as they swarm.

 

This, of course, is assuming that the Sentients were at least on-par with the Grineer and Corpus - which, while unlikely in my opinion (as the technology of the Orokin was all that could manage to keep them at bay, and slowly lose, and the Grineer/Corpus barely manage to scratch the surface of that power) may be a possibility if there's a good arguement for it - otherwise we're even MORE powerful.

 

 

Yeah, see. This is where gameplay and story begin to bash heads. Compared to us, there are almost an indefinite number of each faction. Grineer aren't going to pull out due to population loss, and neither are the Corpus. So numerically, despite having thousands of Tenno awake and running about, we are still the smallest faction, in danger of going extinct compared to the others.

 

Granted, you make some good points. One of us is enough to kill hundreds of grineer. At this point, however, the sheer difference in numbers is like slowly chipping away at the great wall of china with a lato. (lol)

 

And clans have absolutely no canon lore surrounding each one, so it's a bit of a stretch to give any reason at all why the Tenno remain seperate, let alone different ideals. (Unless doge is now god)

 

Also, our smarter strategy seems to have little to no effect on any faction. It is wise to divide and conquer, but when the enemy has almost infinite resources and surplus infantry compared to us, we have very little effect. In fact, we barely moved from where we were since beta.

 

Also, it's another stretch to say Tenno are humans at our core. I don't know what Tenno are. Nobody has a defined definition besides "magic space ninjas" It's clear we're capable of rational thought and decision-making, but we don't know just how far that rabbit hole goes. We can't talk, and we know very little about ourselves.

 

I'm gonna address that first point last: the faction description mentions the Tenno originate from Earth (imo, a point for human) Kaleen (nor the Old Woman) is/are not described as anything out of the ordinary (whereas for Sentient ships and eyes alone - Mag codex, Hidden Messages - we're given details that suggest a different from the speaker) and recognizes the Tenno found on the ship AS children and stresses that point (imo, a point for human).

 

As for the rest, you do have good points about game mechanics - I still see a slight nod towards a growing community in the actions the Tenno take, as I just don't see how or why this "we're barely surviving" group could or would have the resources to construct these massive transportation systems in otherwise hostile space, and then war to own that territory ('cause, love it or hate it, it's there and NEEDS to be factored into the thought) - and as for the clans I will ALSO withhold using that as a major argument as there is nothing in-game about it yet - only a passing comment by DE that the Polarity symbols have an attachment to ancient Tenno organizations during a Devstream, and if there are different organizations there are different methods of doing things (on need look no further than political parties to confirm that) and differences, as I repeat myself, lead to conflict.

 

"barely moved since beta" is a bit of a stretch, though, as I personally feel, again because of the solar rails and whathaveyou, that we have a much stronger presence in-system than we are being allowed to see by game mechanics. After all, our actions have allowed ressistance groups to ACTUALLY take root (Red Veil) and even our enemies fear us (as Frohd Bek stated: "The Tenno are TOO dangerous" to make enemies of, or whathaveyou for the actual quote). The mechanics (or general "we don't have time for this fluff" attitude, not that such is a bad thing) of the game hold us back from seeing, like, WoW-style phasing in which all of mercury is replaced with Tenno holdings, or Grineer corpses are plastered to ships with the words "Fear the Lotus," but the progression of what has been added to the game does hint at, imo, a stronger galactic presence for our player characters and related faction.

[Snydrex]

-snip-

 

I'll just spoiler respond to your paragraphs to avoid textwalls.

 

1st P: All of that is true. However, what I'm saying is that what exactly the Tenno are, in fact, is not yet set in stone. Otherwise, you wouldn't see so many "energy Tenno" topics. Every theory about what they are ALWAYS, and I mean ALWAYS seems to have a counter-argument. I'm just blaming DE's poor writing on that :S

 

2nd P: You're right again. It's undeniable that huge solar rails have been made via clans. However, we do not know how. It could be digital construction. It could be Red Veil helpers. It could be sheer Tenno manpower. We don't know if time in Warframe is literally perpendicular to real life. We don't know if resources really make that big of a difference in construction anymore.-

 

It could take a few hours to build a room, or a few years in in-game time. Much less a solar rail. But I doubt all of that. Point is, we do not yet know if manpower in this game regarding construction is realistic or not.

(Or lotus could just be a huge slave driver. XD)

 

3rd P: By "barely moved since beta" I was talking about our progress regarding our "war" with the other factions. If missions are anything to rely upon,  We haven't left a dent in Corpus or Grineer forces. No numerical loss. No morality loss. No one runs away from us. Unless you're Nekros scaring poeple.

Behold, TERRIFY!!!

 

As a matter of fact, they seem to be getting stronger. But as I was saying before, none of this speculation is a solid fact just yet. (Well, to be fair, we did kick Salad, but Sargas took that credit.)

 

However, you are undeniably right in the fact that wheels are turning. Things are changing. Like Alad V. He's been booted from the council, and now controls a bunch of infested cauliflowers instead of Zakuna. A new faction may be added soon, if rumours are to be believed, and the Tenno are going to be caught in the center. I personally can't wait to see where they take this game.

[SunBlade_ger]

I personally can't wait to see where they take this game.

me too. its just sad seeing tenno bickering over resources like corpus and grineer.

[S.T.M.P.D]

DE_Steve did say in a reply to Mogamu that Dark Sectors are just getting started: one of their long-term plans is to integrate lore about why the Tenno are fighting in clans and such.

 

So worry not, children. DE has plans, and they intend to act upon them.

[Snydrex]

DE_Steve did say in a reply to Mogamu that Dark Sectors are just getting started: one of their long-term plans is to integrate lore about why the Tenno are fighting in clans and such.

 

So worry not, children. DE has plans, and they intend to act upon them.

 

You are my ray of hope, friend. Finally this debating will see an end....

 

...Maybe.

[notlamprey]

You are my ray of hope, friend. Finally this debating will see an end....

 

 

Playing devil's advocate, let's say it probably won't.

 

It's more profitable to keep the game running on as little "hard" lore as possible, because it enables you chase money in future development without "breaking canon" - there's nothing to break.

[Snydrex]

Playing devil's advocate, let's say it probably won't.

 

It's more profitable to keep the game running on as little "hard" lore as possible, because it enables you chase money in future development without "breaking canon" - there's nothing to break.

 

I know that it'll likely never end. My statement before was light hyperbole.

 

Aaaannnnnd that actually makes sense.

[jennibear]

lol.. 1) clans don't really have to have a story line to it. Most games I play have no story line connected to guilds, they don't make much sense but it's just a social perk.

 

2) again... it's just a perk to have fun with the game, kind of like a mini game. Think about Mario for example, in Mario party games you beat the living hell out of each other sometimes, but the characters help each other in other games.

 

3) They are putting in a new system to delete kubrow you'll just have to wait until then.

Edited August 11, 2014 by jennibear

[ElHefe]

I know that it'll likely never end. My statement before was light hyperbole.

 

Aaaannnnnd that actually makes sense.

 

Clearly DE likes leaving mystery in place ... it generates interest

BUT, DE_Steve is an admitted big fan of Frank Hubert's Dune series and that speaks volumes in terms of how detailed he would really like to flesh out the Warframe story (see thread "Dune and Warframe")

 

 

 

[SunBlade_ger]

2) again... it's just a perk to have fun with the game, kind of like a mini game. Think about Mario for example, in Mario party games you beat the living hell out of each other sometimes, but the characters help each other in other games.

yes, if it were a fight for fun. but this is a fight for resources.

the conclave is a place where you fight just for fun. we bash in each others head. and in the infirmary we again laugh with each other.

in DS you fight for supremacy over the sector. we fight each other because our money is at stake. even after the fight, the looser will glare at the winner with murderous intent, because he lost this precious sector.

[vaugahn]

yes, if it were a fight for fun. but this is a fight for resources.

the conclave is a place where you fight just for fun. we bash in each others head. and in the infirmary we again laugh with each other.

in DS you fight for supremacy over the sector. we fight each other because our money is at stake. even after the fight, the looser will glare at the winner with murderous intent, because he lost this precious sector.

 

And? It's just a gameplay reason to PvP

[jennibear]

yes, if it were a fight for fun. but this is a fight for resources.

the conclave is a place where you fight just for fun. we bash in each others head. and in the infirmary we again laugh with each other.

in DS you fight for supremacy over the sector. we fight each other because our money is at stake. even after the fight, the looser will glare at the winner with murderous intent, because he lost this precious sector.

doesn't seem any different to me. Some of these things are put into the game to give it variety and competition. These 2 things make people stay and play the game more, they don't have to make sense. They are like minigames on the side of the actual game to give it some spice.

 

it's not like you're actually a tenno IRL fighting for resources, you're taking it too seriously.

Edited August 11, 2014 by jennibear

[-Vondred-]

Just gonna leave this here:

It says agent OR merc. OR being the key word. I'm not a merc. I'm I'm a noble ninja agent of badassitude fighting to keep the peace and balance in the galaxy. Huzzah!

[themovement]

The pure fact that the Tenno lost all there memory's and even need to remaster there weapons and warframes easily open the door for tenno to ignore the old ways.

 

PvP in the form of conclaves dark sectors and the existence of clans is completely reasonable since no Tenno has the same allegiances it did during the orokin era.

 

If you lost all of your memory's you wouldn't be the same person as you where before you lost your memory's. 

[SunBlade_ger]

it's not like you're actually a tenno IRL fighting for resources, you're taking it too seriously.

IRL i want to have fun while playing xD .

so what do i do to have fun:

i enter the conclave because i just want to fight other tenno. if i win i am happy, if not i don't care. since i don't want to ruin the PvP experience for others, i rarely enter the conclave.

i enter DS because i want more money (less taxes). because i am bad at PvP i join the side i want to lose.

i take the worst equipment i can find into the fight and behave like a brain dead idiot. even if i would fight seriously, i would do only slightly better than a NPC. so i'm just accelerating the inevitable.

(i know this is just a statement of selfpity, you don't have to comment on that.)

DE gave us an all out war between tenno. and since DE also gave us a choice on how to play, i intent to participate as a traitor and intentionally ruin the PvP experience for everyone else. i am happy when the war is over and i can make tons of creds again.

how do you have fun in this war, like a "noble warrior"? or are you like me and take the path of the profit oriented mercenary?

i never said i picture myself as a noble warrior.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

So being a Ronin means I have no Lord to serve but I do follow a simple Code: Let them live so they may attempt to strike you down, only then will they be struck down.

[ElHefe]

@ Zero.No.Hikari ... I cannot place that aphorism - is that one of your making or is it a quote?

[Hieulelam]

We already know there is at least one new faction coming... there is always someone to fight. It just makes sense to reduce not increase the number of available opponents.

If we make Corpus leave the system and then cleanse the remainder from the Grineer/Infested conflict we would still have plenty to do before the new enemy of the week shows up.

however, this is a game, imagine fighting one faction only after we already clean up the 3 major factions. the game gonna get boring really quick. also, i disagree, if we clean up all 3 factions, we wont have anything left to do before the next faction arrive. warframe is about run and gun not doing some clean up job, i imagine if we clean up the 3 factions there wont be any more epic battle to fight.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

@ Zero.No.Hikari ... I cannot place that aphorism - is that one of your making or is it a quote?

 

I dabble a bit in quote making yes, Like it? I kinda made it on the spot to sum up how I do what I do.

[SunBlade_ger]

So being a Ronin means I have no Lord to serve but I do follow a simple Code: Let them live so they may attempt to strike you down, only then will they be struck down.

nice quote, i have to remember that one.

[ElHefe]

I dabble a bit in quote making yes, Like it? I kinda made it on the spot to sum up how I do what I do.

 

Indeed I do like it ... rather like a logical Mobius strip as most Zen tautologies are

Well done!  1+

 

You should consider starting a separate thread of your aphorisms - maybe they might show up in game :)

 

[Zero.No.Hikari]

nice quote, i have to remember that one.

Could make one for you if you'd like just give me a message and I'll cook one up just for yous or anyone interested helps flex them creative muscles a writer needs to have but not now for now I slumber like the stone giants do in the forests resting till needed.