Why In Lotus' Name Are The Daggers So Slow?

[Lekkur]

I really don't understand no matter how hard I try. I mean, come on, it's basically a stick with a metal blade. How can the Sheev i.e. be slower than the monster blade that is the Galatine. It just does not really make sense. I mean besides the Karyst there is not a single viable dagger in the game. Mainly because their DPS is so low cause of their extremely slow attack speed even though it goes against the very idea of Daggers. They are meant to be easy to transport and have attack quickly. Go in-> stab people as quickly as possible-> go away. And isn't that exactly the fighting style a Ninja (means in wider extend the Tenno) should aim for? 

 

It only gets worse by the fact that Pointed Wing (the stance the most recent Daggers use) slows them down additionally, no matter how cool it looks, it just does not compensate enough for that (huge drawback). I swear I can stab people faster with a dagger so the super-human people that are Tenno should be able to as well.

 

Rant over, had to get that out of my system.

[RavenousPartyLibrarian]

While the stats imply that they are slower than the heavy weapons, they really aren't. 0.7 for a dagger is still quicker than 1.0 for a greatsword. Don't ask me how it works, but that's how it is. If you had used both heavy and light weapons you'd see this very clearly.

[Lekkur]

They are still slower than let's say a sword. Simply from logic a single (and dual dagger) should be one of the fastest weapon types in the game. Denying them that is just stupid in my opinion. Maybe a heavy weapon is slower than a dagger but that does not solve the problem that every other light weapon feels 20x faster than a dagger.

[--Q--JoeTheBanshee]

Quick attack is your answer. Quick attack is love, quick attack is life.

[RavenousPartyLibrarian]

I do agree that they should get some buffs, preferably in speed, I'm just saying that they aren't that slow compared to other weapons.

[aoguro]

i dont get it, i have a few daggers and they are everything else then slow :-)

[Lekkur]

i dont get it, i have a few daggers and they are everything else then slow :-)

And would you go out into high level missions and go with "melee only". Under quotation marks cause those damn drones are annoying. And in comparison to a sword they are pretty slow. Which shouldn't be the case

[Megakruemel]

I still think, that daggers are way to slow and have to agree with OP. Daggers should be fast weapons and the "fast" daggers in this game are not even faster than some swords.

 

What is the point of a small weapon, that does not deal that much damage nd has a small range, if it is not even fast? The only fast attacks are the quick attacks and ...well. Why did we even get melee 2.0 if we just use quick attacks anyway?

[bl4ckhunter]

as far as the sheev is concerned they actually buffed the attack speed but it bugged and only affected slide attacks

reference->(https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/312092-hotfix-1473-14731/#entry3533691)

[BoneBreakerx]

Why did we even get melee 2.0 if we just use quick attacks anyway?

been asking the same ever since melee 2.0

 

the problem is that the stances makes the weapon slower and pretty much unpredictable

 

take the stance for dual ichors (cant remember its name)

it has a "charge" attack that makes you jump forward

i can see it being usefull in some situations

but when useing a berserk build and spamming E you often pull of the combo by mistake and getting "pulled" away from your location and that can get you killed the unpredictability and speed of the combos makes them useless

 

and some combos are too annoying to pull of in the middle of a fight that they never gets use

or are too hard to aim

 

and its too bad becous alot of them looks amazing

[Dekallis]

If I remember correctly, daggers are actually faster than they appear to be. Because of the way DE designed melee, Heavy weapons despite their supposed superior aspd are actually slower because the animations are longer, those pauses at the end of each swing for heavy weapons are part of the animation which is why it needs the higher aspd to get through it, daggers on the other hand have very short to the point animations with little(or no) wasted frames of animation. So their lower aspd actually feels faster. Why DE went about this the most roundabout way possible I don't know but that's what they did.

 

Increasing ASPD basically just shortens animations, but since the heavy weapon animations are longer to begin with even with the same aspd they end up being slower than 'lighter' weapons

[Cyborger1]

Pointed Wind really needs a revamp. There's no reason for it to slow down daggers so much when Homing Fang is sitting there turning daggers into tornadoes of pain.

[GTG3000]

The quick attack on Sheev is rather godly, but the stances (I only own Homing Fang, so my perception is probably skewed) contain waay too many slowly executed animations.

 

And seeing how it's impossible to perform the "pause" and "hold" combos any reliably while in combat, I'm stuck getting in two short hits... And a long, lengthy stab.

[Flyghter]

Still waiting for a fast crit dagger a Soma in dagger version XD 

[[DE]JohnnyBoomstick]

Revamping Pointed Wind

[TennoSimons]

Revamping Pointed Wind

 

 

Really? Cool! Will it get new animations?

[Paul_Pianoff]

Revamping Pointed Wind

No, please, don't. Revamp daggers themselves.

[AM-Bunny]

Revamping Pointed Wind

 

So glad I didn't forma my Karyst's stance polarity now~

[CF_HoneyBadger]

No, please, don't. Revamp daggers themselves.

 

^^^

 

agree 100%.

[--Q--JoeTheBanshee]

No, please, don't. Revamp daggers themselves.

I also agree with this. The attack speed of the daggers with stances should be on par with their quick attack speed.

[mrecentric]

While the stats imply that they are slower than the heavy weapons, they really aren't. 0.7 for a dagger is still quicker than 1.0 for a greatsword. Don't ask me how it works, but that's how it is. If you had used both heavy and light weapons you'd see this very clearly.

 

It's a bit of an inversion from the old ways. Before damage 2.0 a low number meant they were slow. After 2.0 a low number means melee is fast.

[Tails-san]

No, please, don't. Revamp daggers themselves.

 

Why not both? Pointed Wind is too slow for a dagger stance. Quick melee is substantially faster than it, and no amount of dagger revamping will change that fact.

[Tails-san]

While the stats imply that they are slower than the heavy weapons, they really aren't. 0.7 for a dagger is still quicker than 1.0 for a greatsword. Don't ask me how it works, but that's how it is. If you had used both heavy and light weapons you'd see this very clearly.

 

I believe that the attack speeds are now a multiplier of sorts, rather than an actually attacks per second value.

[AlienOvermind]

Revamping Pointed Wind

I'm SO happy about this. Pointed Wind is plainly horrible atm. Unbearably slow and sluggish, no attack bonus, no handy moving-forward combos. Nothing helpful at all. It just lowers your overall DPS and daggers are not so powerful to begin with. If any stance requires a rework — it's Pointed Wind.

 

Edited September 23, 2014 by AlienOvermind

[Naftal]

How do people think you fight with a dagger? Because it's small and light you'd just go stabstabstabstabstabswingswingswing?