Limbo Overall

[Monolake]

Banish: It is fine as is.

 

 

 

Being able to grief/troll locking out other players from combat is fine?

[Criogen]

Limbo in his current state sucks. He uses way too energy and skills to accomplish something where other warframes can do it half the time, half the energy. Please tweak him a little. 

[FoxFX]

Being able to grief/troll locking out other players from combat is fine?

The same thing is said about Loki's Switch Teleport on allies. It dependent on the player's playstyle.

 

For what I see in Limbo is some Warframe that slips past enemy lines and picks of stronger enemies.

[Vashramire]

Maybe if we wish real hard, Limbo will get fixed before everyone that didn't already buy him with plat gets him and they murder small animals.

Edited October 26, 2014 by Vashramire

[GreyEnneract]

After playing with Limbo to rank 30, I feel the idea is good, but the execution needs some serious work. The fact that you can't pick up items and objective items in missions can be a HUGE drawback and a nuisance for your team. Here are my suggestions on what Limbo's ability should do so far:

 

Rift World (General Idea): I think the idea of items not being able to be picked up in the Rift World doesn't make much sense since you are bringing with you the item that you carry into the Rift World as well. Items that are in the Rift Zone by Cataclysm should be considered part of the Rift Zone as well as any items that a Warframe is carrying (like datamasses) which is sent to the Rift Zone by Banish or that enters it by entering in Cataclysm.

 

Banish: It is fine as is.

 

Rift Walk: Just fix the AOE glitch since enemy AOEs in the Real World are still part of the Real World as well as Eximus Auras.

 

Rift Surge: The idea that you do more damage in the Rift Zone is fine, but there should be another unique add-on to this ability. Activating this skill should allow Limbo to do damage to enemies in the Real World while in the Rift World as well as being able to damage enemies in the Rift World while in the Real World. If Limbo is able to cross both worlds, he should have some way to do this as well.

 

Cataclysm: Idea is good, but some more utility should be added. The explosion @ the end of Cataclysm should deal a bit more damage and have a bit more range as well as being able to knockdown enemies affected by the blast.

 

That or...Change Cataclysm to like some moveable Globe that surrounds Limbo (similar to how Ice Eximus has with their version of Snow Globe) that damages and temporarily stuns enemies that enter and leave the Rift World. Make it into some It shouldn't have a duration and it should be cancellable. Once the skill is cancelled, then the explosion happens.

 

Strategy to Utilize so far with Limbo:

 

Right now, the one effective strategy to be fighting as Limbo is to stay in the Rift World with Rift Walk when in combat and pick-off the stronger enemies using Banish/Cataclysm to bring them into the Rift World to finish them off.

 

And that I guess is my initial take on Limbo the Rift Warframe.

His 1 would be fine if the allies had some way to leave on their own, and would at least be a bit better if Limbo could Un-Banish targets.

I agree about the Rift World.

I still like the previously stated idea of Rift Walk opening up a Wormhole that allows allies and yourself to pass through back and forth at will.

If the Rift world itself won't have more innate buffs, then Rift Surge needs to add more buffs while active. A mediocre 1.5x damage increase is not even noticeable, and even if it was, there is no CC to keep enemies inside of Cataclysm, or a benefit to fighting in the Rift World. If you just wanted a damage increase it'd be a lot easier to bring a Rhino, Nova, or Banshee.

[FoxFX]

His 1 would be fine if the allies had some way to leave on their own, and would at least be a bit better if Limbo could Un-Banish targets.

I agree about the Rift World.

I still like the previously stated idea of Rift Walk opening up a Wormhole that allows allies and yourself to pass through back and forth at will.

If the Rift world itself won't have more innate buffs, then Rift Surge needs to add more buffs while active. A mediocre 1.5x damage increase is not even noticeable, and even if it was, there is no CC to keep enemies inside of Cataclysm, or a benefit to fighting in the Rift World. If you just wanted a damage increase it'd be a lot easier to bring a Rhino, Nova, or Banshee.

 

I have made a thread with the ideas you quoted and I added one additional change that should be made for Banish:

 

Banish: The idea behind moving units to the Rift World is ok, but it should also include the ability to move units out of the Rift World into the Real World.

 

There is also my suggestion for adding the perk for Rift Surge to allow Limbo to damage units in the opposite World.

Edited October 26, 2014 by FoxFX

[GreyEnneract]

I have made a thread with the ideas you quoted and I added one additional change that should be made for Banish:

 

Banish: The idea behind moving units to the Rift World is ok, but it should also include the ability to move units out of the Rift World into the Real World.

 

There is also my suggestion for adding the perk for Rift Surge to allow Limbo to damage units in the opposite World.

I have also personally offered those 2 suggestions.

It's nice to know others have the same train of thought as me : )

[Jik605]

With his last ability. What if the bubble does a little damage to the enemies, but any player inside is like half way between limbo and the real world. Enemies cant hurt you but you can hurt them. Ranged players aren't affected as they shoot like it was regular, but any player inside the bubble is invulnerable but can attack enemies inside

[GreyEnneract]

With his last ability. What if the bubble does a little damage to the enemies, but any player inside is like half way between limbo and the real world. Enemies cant hurt you but you can hurt them. Ranged players aren't affected as they shoot like it was regular, but any player inside the bubble is invulnerable but can attack enemies inside

That sounds nice, but I feel that Rift Surge allowing players to attack enemies outside the rift while they're in the rift and vice versa would work better.

Though it would be very powerful, so maybe it would only affect Limbo.

I feel the problem lies with the Rift world not offering enough benefits, and I think Rift Surge could fix that problem.

Other than the trolling problems obviously.

[Cephalon_Madrona]

LImbo just needs a lot of fixing. I enjoy him, and I find uses for him and ways to use his abilities...but I just find myself hating all of the fiddling about required to get something out of him. My problems with him are a bit common: his third ability is borderline useless, his banish needs to work like rift walk, in that you can bring things in and out of the void with another cast, and have something to make sure that allies can get out of the rift on their own; I don't know how, but there has to be a way. I want to love this frame so badly, but I just find so many problems that keep me from adoring him like I did Mirage or Nyx Prime...you know, keeps him from being the frame that you fall back on, no matter what. 

[GreyEnneract]

LImbo just needs a lot of fixing. I enjoy him, and I find uses for him and ways to use his abilities...but I just find myself hating all of the fiddling about required to get something out of him. My problems with him are a bit common: his third ability is borderline useless, his banish needs to work like rift walk, in that you can bring things in and out of the void with another cast, and have something to make sure that allies can get out of the rift on their own; I don't know how, but there has to be a way. I want to love this frame so badly, but I just find so many problems that keep me from adoring him like I did Mirage or Nyx Prime...you know, keeps him from being the frame that you fall back on, no matter what. 

My thoughts exactly. I love his concept, but his viability is....

[Monolake]

The same thing is said about Loki's Switch Teleport on allies. It dependent on the player's playstyle.

 

For what I see in Limbo is some Warframe that slips past enemy lines and picks of stronger enemies.

Switch tele is only a momentary annoyance if you are trolled, Banish has quite a duration and frustrating even if used with good intentions. Something has to be done about it (like let affected players cancel  it)

[GreyEnneract]

Switch tele is only a momentary annoyance if you are trolled, Banish has quite a duration and frustrating even if used with good intentions. Something has to be done about it (like let affected players cancel  it)

You're right. My banish lasts a little over 40 seconds, and if I use it on an ally by accident there's nothing even I can do about it.

[tseng_]

I really wish they do something about Banish, today in Sechura i passed the last 5 waves (i leave at 10) in the rift because a dumbass Limbo spammed the ability on me because "i was killing too much...", and later on another Sechura, other Limbo spammed Banish since wave 1 till 5.

Edited October 27, 2014 by tseng_

[GreyEnneract]

Mogamu offers a very nice examination into Limbo!

 

[Rustning]

Banish: Remove the ability for it to be casted on teammates.

 

Rift Walk: Here's the big mechanic change:

- Leave a dimensional portal where Limbo casted it, allowing allies to interact with it and enter/exit at will.

- Remove Limbo's ability to cancel Rift Walk early, recasting it will now move the portal to his current location and refresh the duration (Like Decoy)

- Change the ability augment for Banish (That heals allies) to this one. Oh look, now he has a healing fountain.

 

Rift Surge: Oh my god this ability is so expensive and useless it hurts. If they really want it to cost that much energy, increase the damage multiplier to 3.0x at base, stun every enemy for 2-3 seconds, and nullify their armor for the duration. There, now it's an ability you'll use when you want to annihilate everything in a breeze with some set-up. Still could do with a power cost reduction to 50.

 

Cataclysm: Entering and exiting the rift staggers enemies and inflicts a radiation proc.

 

Now you can start Banishing difficult enemies to the rift, spawn a portal that allows your allies to deal with them and exit as they please, and you can make their life easier by making every enemy in the rift shred like paper. Or you can cast Cataclysm and Rift Surge, CCing everything in that bubble and make them die instantly if you so much as breathe on them.

 

My question is if the Rift Surge is a continuous effect. Let's say you begin with casting Rift Surge, then start banishing enemies to the rift. Will they have the damage multiplier on them for being there while Rift Surge is in place, or is it Accelerant in nature?

Really liking the idea for Rift Surge, because the damage multiplier makes it almost useless.

Also, worth noting that rift walking doesn't negate auras, or toxin cloud damage, etc. (at least I think so).

[Aspari]

Rustning, on 26 Oct 2014 - 11:49 PM, said:

Really liking the idea for Rift Surge, because the damage multiplier makes it almost useless.

Also, worth noting that rift walking doesn't negate auras, or toxin cloud damage, etc. (at least I think so).

The only thing it doesn't seem to negate is Grineer Napalm attacks.

[StonedMakak]

Banish: Remove the ability for it to be casted on teammates.

 

Rift Walk: Here's the big mechanic change:

- Leave a dimensional portal where Limbo casted it, allowing allies to interact with it and enter/exit at will.

- Remove Limbo's ability to cancel Rift Walk early, recasting it will now move the portal to his current location and refresh the duration (Like Decoy)

- Change the ability augment for Banish (That heals allies) to this one. Oh look, now he has a healing fountain.

 

Rift Surge: Oh my god this ability is so expensive and useless it hurts. If they really want it to cost that much energy, increase the damage multiplier to 3.0x at base, stun every enemy for 2-3 seconds, and nullify their armor for the duration. There, now it's an ability you'll use when you want to annihilate everything in a breeze with some set-up. Still could do with a power cost reduction to 50.

 

Cataclysm: Entering and exiting the rift staggers enemies and inflicts a radiation proc.

 

Now you can start Banishing difficult enemies to the rift, spawn a portal that allows your allies to deal with them and exit as they please, and you can make their life easier by making every enemy in the rift shred like paper. Or you can cast Cataclysm and Rift Surge, CCing everything in that bubble and make them die instantly if you so much as breathe on them.

 

My question is if the Rift Surge is a continuous effect. Let's say you begin with casting Rift Surge, then start banishing enemies to the rift. Will they have the damage multiplier on them for being there while Rift Surge is in place, or is it Accelerant in nature?

 

What about adding the option to banish multiple enemies with Rift Surge on top of the changes you suggested? Like for example, if there is an active portal from Rift Walk, upon the activation of Rift Surge all enemies around the said portal are transferred into the rift (simply teleported). This is to maximize the benefits of the damage buff as well as to conserve energy (no need to spam banish), especially if your allies are also inside the rift with you.

[Riyoshi]

Have you guys even tested the third skill or limbo enough to judge him? Seems like you played him for 10 mins and you didn't "get" it.

 

All the "roles" I have discovered so far

 

Battery:

 

Just a hint: When low on energy just go into the rift and use Rift Surge (pretty awesome how fast you regain energy eh?). An now double it, with your proposed 3x multiplier, this would be insane. By the way, allies also regain energy when they enter the rift (you dont cast 1 on your allies you just throw your 4 somewhere where no enemies are and you are basically a battery for the team.

 

Defense:

 

The 4th skill is extremely useful in every defense except against infested, since the pods/drills/whatever can't be damaged by ANYTHING that isn't in there, so what's your job as limbo? Stay outside the bubble but inside the rift and kill every melee that runs to the pod, THAT's your job, you don't do anything else when defending something, since you are invulnerable and the only person able to kill the melees, your team will kill everything else and doesn't have to worry about the pod.

 

Survival:

That's where he really shines, you are basically able to be invulnerable forever with your second and 3rd skill, picking key targets with your 1 to kill, giving your team energy sustain with 4, rezing them with no risk whatsoever (putting your 1 on them before rezing gives you a minute to regroup/activate oxygens/hug each other/whatever).

 

General Mission/Solo play:

Wanna rush a boss? Press 2 run there, don't care about traps or enemies, cast 4 under boss and kill him, walk out there like a boss, pretty much the same with every mission except spying, since it forces you to go out of the rift.

 

---

 

So overall you never run out of energy, you can give you team energy, you are invincible forever, so you can take out key targets or take key objectives like oxygen, you can protect pods with no downside except for the last 3 seconds where the bubble is too small if you didn't place it correctly. The only thing I would change is the Syndicate mod, to actually give YOU health when you enter the rift, you can already fully heal allies by letting them die and rezing them with no ease

 

He is not a damage powerhouse but he IS a game changer, your whole team can be reckless as hell and spam crap around, they just have to know what you are capable of - you are there to support them, FAILSAFE, which is important as hell. Not every Frame has to be a "press 4 lel ded"-hallway hero, you actually have to use all your skills with this frame and have to think a bit and all of a sudden the community is going whack because he deals no damage, which isn't his job in the first place. He's extremely versatile you just have to think outside the box.

 

Is he a pug Frame? Hell no, if you see him using the 1 on a teammate except in a revive attempt where the downed player is surrounded by mobs just leave, he doesn't have the damage to go far on his own in defense or survival, do that and the trolling will stop after a while.

 

But as I said he actually completely changes the game in organized survival, excavtion and defense since you have SO MUCH utility to bring to the table that he even outclasses trinity in every field except healing, which isn't needed in the first place when you have a 100% rez chance, and his 3 is actually insanely powerful if you use it as a battery skill, all I use is Flow and streamlined, I don't even go for maxed efficiency and I didn't run out of energy even once, you get your energy cost back after 5 seconds with a ~45 second duration. And dont go for extension mods, you want a controlled safespot for your 4 and not a huge arena with shiny colors.

Just remember to stay in the rift and that you are objective oriented and not there to kill stuff.

 

 

Also the issue with the napalms: it seems you are still affected by environmental hazards and auras, so the trick with napalms is to just... take a step back and walk out of the fire (which spawns on the ground)

 

So yeah, overall I don't really get everyone saying he is too weak since he is actually one of the most op frames right now in terms of teamplay, you just have to get around the fact that he is in it to win it, and not to stomp face

[SergeiTheBeast]

#BasedMogamu

 

But seriously guys, Limbo has too much control over his allies and just doesn't do all that much to help a team as he stands now. A lot of the reworks Mogamu suggested sounded good to me and some i've read here seem good too. I wish I had suggestions to add but I don't as I don't have Limbo yet.

[StonedMakak]

-snip-

 

Rift Surge does not boost energy regeneration, I don't know where did you get that idea. Maybe what you've noticed was simply the rift plane bonus stacking with energy siphon?

 

Concerning your other points you are quite correct, Limbo has his uses. The point is that other frames can do the same more easily and often better than him. Team battery? Nekros's desecrate or Trinity's Energy Vampire (not to mention that you can built a frame for efficiency). Protect the pod from both ranged and melee attacks? Forst's Snowglobe, Loki's Disarm + Decoy combo. Revive mid combat? Ash says hi. The point others are trying to make is not "ZOMG DIS FRAME SUCKZZZZZ", but that he is rather underwhelming for such an awesome theme as void sorcerer/magician. That being said I still enjoy him, I just see the potential for some really unique/fun mechanics. No need to get your panties in a twist mate. 

[Ijaa-Aden]

Banish SHOULD be a toggle skill : Limbo should be able to toggle enemies AND allies in and out of the Rift. Plus, duration of Banish on allies should be reduced at least by half (limiting trolling).

 

Rift Walk is good as is.

 

Rift Surge needs a little more effectiveness. Too much energy for too few damage bonus. Or it should be converted to a blast for rifted ennemies.

 

Cataclysm is not bad, but NOT SHRINKING would be better.

 

Overall, the Rift plane should not allow to use consoles or open lockers, making almost everything WAY too easy) but allow to pick up drops ! Banished allies and Cataclysmed location stuck the loot on ground way too long (or way too troll, for banished allies).

Edited October 27, 2014 by Talmac

[Riyoshi]

Rift Surge does not boost energy regeneration, I don't know where did you get that idea. Maybe what you've noticed was simply the rift plane bonus stacking with energy siphon?

 

Concerning your other points you are quite correct, Limbo has his uses. The point is that other frames can do the same more easily and often better than him. Team battery? Nekros's desecrate or Trinity's Energy Vampire (not to mention that you can built a frame for efficiency). Protect the pod from both ranged and melee attacks? Forst's Snowglobe, Loki's Disarm + Decoy combo. Revive mid combat? Ash says hi. The point others are trying to make is not "ZOMG DIS FRAME SUCKZZZZZ", but that he is rather underwhelming for such an awesome theme as void sorcerer/magician. That being said I still enjoy him, I just see the potential for some really unique/fun mechanics. No need to get your panties in a twist mate. 

I have actually tested it a couple times and Rift Surge does boost the energy reg quite a bit, when I get home I'll try some power mods to see if it gets further improved. Could just be a bug that it does but if you use it you will definately see an improvement in energyreg (other teammates in ts also said that they saw an improved energyreg when standing in my cataclysm after I used rift surge)

 

Energy Battery: while Trinity does give you more energy your teammates don't become invincible and she also lacks his other utility skills, and nekros is just straight rng so not really an argument there. So kinda even with trinity but easily outmatches nekros in that regard

 

Defending: You said more easily and better? Frost is literally crippled on high waves since he has to spam his globe constanlty, for the 4 secs of globe invuln, so hes just dead weight, while limbo can still do other stuff and just has to manage the melees. And Loki's decoy isn't foolproof, enemies could still attack the pod, especially if you didn't get everyone with disarm. So Limbo easily takes first place here

 

Reviving: AoE will still destroy Ash or loki while theyre invisible and if the teammate is ganged there is no way to ensure the survival of the rezed teammate. And again Limbo is doing a better job at it than both frames (though i don't know how ashes syndicate mod will affect that)

 

 

 

I'm not twisting my pants, it just hurts my brain to see people running around with a huge cataclysm and obviously no clue why they actually do it, and after watching the forum everyone wants him to be another standard damageframe, or even a sub-nova instead of experimenting and using his kit the way it is. It seems everyone pressed a button, and thought "hmm cool, but I want it to be like THIS, let's make a post about it"

 

The way he is now he is versatile and can easily compete with any other frame in his fields and even outshine them in most cases, and most importantly, all of his skills synergize well with each other.

 

I can agree with putting someone out of the rift by targeting him with 1 again but turning 1 into an aoe? whats the point of cataclysm then?

 

Making cataclysm just a damage boost instead of sending them into the rift (youtube vid where everyone immediately agreed), why not take a nova to cover the whole map while slowing them?

 

Making 2 spawn portals while you have to stay in the rift and can't cancel it? hello? effectively removing your ability to pick up mods or items for the mission and crippling yourself

 

Where exactly are these examples improvements? (by they way, these are thing most people agreed on, unfortunately).

 

The way he is now is is permanently invincible (how ANYONE can think that this is bad is beyond me, seriously), he never runs out of energy, he has ways to make nearly all of the current missions a guaranteed success (again, I don't get it why anyone would change that, except for some quality of life improvement like canceling the 1 and 4), he can scratch mistakes that can usually end up in complete failure, like the death of a teammate in a dozen of enemies, from the table and continue as if nothing happened.

 

Seems like a pretty insane warframe.

 

If you want insane dmg multipliers take Mirage, if you want it for the whole team take nova, he's straight up a huge utility boost to every team, nothing more nothing less. I hope he won't get changed except his syndicate mod and a few qol improvements but overall his kit is perfectly fine.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: Oh another thing: When I read Rift surges  description I thought it would make insane damage to every enemy inside the rift (you know, press 4 then 3 and make it go boom), which would be pretty awesome but I just adapted and take it as what it is, I dont' get it why it's so hard to just use the tools you have and try to use them to their full potential instead of just wanting to rework the whole thing when something doesn't please you.

Edited October 27, 2014 by Riyoshi

[LukeAura]

Edit: Oh another thing: When I read Rift surges  description I thought it would make insane damage to every enemy inside the rift (you know, press 4 then 3 and make it go boom), which would be pretty awesome but I just adapted and take it as what it is, I dont' get it why it's so hard to just use the tools you have and try to use them to their full potential instead of just wanting to rework the whole thing when something doesn't please you.

It seems people have answered that question at least twice here.

The full potential of Limbo's skills is over all lower than most other frames, his best potential is still worse than the best of other frames.

You're excusing away imbalance. 

[GreyEnneract]

Being in the Rift Plane is what increases energy regen, not Rift Surge.

Rift Surge is just a mediocre damage amp at 1.5x that costs an insane amount of energy (75) that can only be used on Rifted enemies.

Also, Trinity can give me max energy instantly, while Limbo makes me useless for 40 seconds but hey, I get 2 energy per 3s...

Mogamu explains it all.