traybong111 Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Every critics say, warframe have potential but the grinding is to bad. DE knows that,they will not change it, so people get frustraded, they stopp to spending money and then they stopp playing... its so sad This is a very cynical view and I'll gladly accept criticism or warning points for saying it...but wait I'm on an online forum. That's how it works anyway. Every review or comment I hear from anyone who's tried Warframe is that "it's full of potential." I'm starting to think this "potential" is just our delusion. Well, not really delusion, more like out own projection of what it ideally would be. The game's so unfinished and unguided that it allows for pretty much any imagination of how it'd look like when it's "done," and that hope, that beacon of torturous hope players hold onto is actually their own imagination and the Platonic idea of Warframe, rather than a concrete vision set by the developers. To stay on topic, I think the nav coordinates should have been obtainable from the previous quest locations of Alad's ship. I mean, that's how we triangulated him...? Or as a rare drop from any Infested mission or Mutalist incursion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sethrea Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I agree with the general consensus here. While I suspect the "walls" in place are there so people are more inclined to spend platinum in the store, I think it has a completely opposite effect, for multiple reasons. 1. Funneling like that is something a lot of people pick up on and consider not-so-fair-play, which leaves bad taste and instead of promoting "I want to support the Developer", makes people assume the "you don't deserve my money" stance. 2. Trying to make players buy everything decreases player retention as the gameplay itself becomes less rewarding. Players need goals, but those goals need to be obtainable (so, nothing like first iteration of Syndicate farm) and have a reasonable profit for effort margin. From my personal point of view: I do not want to buy all the Warframes, I'd like to actually earn some of them. Warframe gameplay is cool but without a goal - an obtainable goal - I'd probably would no do more than one mission a weak and in such scenario chances of me buying Platinum are NULL. 3. Quest for Warframe is atm not compatible with buying them. To explain what I mean: I bought Mirage because I simply wanted to play her after I came back to game. I knew there was quest for her, which I wanted to complete as well because: Lore, but the pack description mentioned it including the quest (key?) so that I can immediately play it to discover Mirage's origins. Only that it makes no sense for me to do so because I still have to farm the warframe parts thus be subject to now completly unnecessary grind and craft the parts wasting resources just so I can experience that content. Thus, if one wants to do the quests, one is strongly discouraged from buying in the store. Again, my personal feeling on this matter (the matter of RNG grind walls in general) is that if they don't go, I probably will because game is simply not fun with them in play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weissseher Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Make it so EVERY outbreak mission gives coordiantes. People would actually do the credit outbreaks and it would be more possible to make keys. Or as I've read by some(didn't go through the whole thread) make it so every new enemy has a chance to drop coordiantes. The way it is no one will be happy. Hydroid is horrible to farm and that's why I don't have him. THIS is worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kubbi Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I'd say they just need to lower the mutalist nav requirement from 3 to 1. Because really why would you need to do 9 runs just for one boss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sethrea Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I'd say they just need to lower the mutalist nav requirement from 3 to 1. Because really why would you need to do 9 runs just for one boss? Vay Hek is not much better in this regard. Maybe worse even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sethrea Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Make it so EVERY outbreak mission gives coordiantes. People would actually do the credit outbreaks and it would be more possible to make keys. Or as I've read by some(didn't go through the whole thread) make it so every new enemy has a chance to drop coordiantes. The way it is no one will be happy. Hydroid is horrible to farm and that's why I don't have him. THIS is worse. A coordinate reward - like blueprints - at the end of every outbreak mission, that would be nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kubbi Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Vay Hek is not much better in this regard. Maybe worse even. Nah Vay hek used to be worse yeah because the delta beacons used to be a rare drop. Its better now that they made delta beacons drop guarenteed at a defence mission. I can build about 2 keys in one run. Its still annoying and tedious yeah but not as bad as mutalist Alad V right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyv001 Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I'm not sure what I'm upset about more, the fact that the new frame is locked behind such a messy grind wall or that the new boss of all things is locked behind a grind wall. Heck, people who cave and just buy Mesa may never even fight Mutalist Alad V. And that saddens me greatly, considering he'll probably be a really fun and new boss - like Hek, who is also behind a grind wall. I wish we could obtain frames like how we used to, but from fresh new bosses like Hek and Mutalist Alad V without the ridiculous grind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H3dsh0t Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 The thing that people are forgetting here is that at least the Prosecutors are farmable, even if the RNG when they first hapenned was terrible. Whereas Mesa has no way of farming to get her. Its complete luck as to whether you are online in time to run the invasion. And for those that say "well its been that way forever for vauban" I agree it has, doesn't mean that it should be though. For someone like me who can invest a tonne of time into warframe, the grind MIGHT not be too bad, but for someone that can maybe play a couple of hours a day, they realisticly have no chance of getting Mesa any time soon... I was seriously hyped for this update, Mesa was a frame I was looking forward to plus new archwing weapons. But that enthusiasm quickly disappeared when I saw that I had no real control over getting Mesa myself, and then when I saw the archwing weapons are on nodes already with other archwing weapons on them (and after like 25 runs and getting not a single new part) I went to bed dissapointed. Think this is the first time I've been genuinely dissapointed with an update. Also those of you blaming PWE seriously need to lay off that, PWE have no decision making powers at DE, they have no influence over decisions. DE are in control of their own game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Fade Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I totally agree with you , the farming of the new alad v is just way too hard , the farming and grinding is so horrible , DE need to change how mesa component is dropped. For example , make it the Eris boss! Eris has no boss and its one of the last few planet to unlock , so players still need to get to Eris in the late game and yup it would so much easier since that it will be always at the same place or you can make invasion mission drop the new alad v cords randomly , if not the grinding and farming is just too horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sedu13 Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 This here is what happens when you pay to be a beta tester and not the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashnal Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Yup, its disgusting. I still dont have hydroid because of the beacons farming, and it doesnt even come close. Except the grind for Mesa isn't as bad as Hydroid for one simple fact, you're guaranteed a chance at the boss once those invasions pop up. With Hydroid, you could farm all day and never get enough of one type of beacon. Personally, this doesn't bother me as much as Hydroid, I just have to keep an eye out for invasions, and I'll get her eventually. No need to constantly grind anything for it, aside from the mission nodes that reward coords once they're there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invalid_Infinity Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Lovely topic and a lovely argument. You have my support and the devs have my disappointment. (About the sword gun blade thing, Dual skanas, and a vasto? You serious right now? If you are making things this expensive then you had better make the weapon worth all that time and effort.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssfsx17 Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I'm a high roller - bought every single Prime Access - and I still do NOT support the Grindwall for Hydroid & Mesa. It is ridiculous. I know that at least one guy at DE is all like, "Kids these days are so entitled etc. etc." but you know what? Games are not meant to be like work. I already grind enough at my day job. My day job which then partly pays for the existence of Warframe. I don't need more of that in a video game. And neither do my friends who play Warframe, who I subsidize. If the grindwall gets too bad, then they leave, and I have less people to play with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABAL Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 (edited) DE. This is serious. I am losing faith in you. We are losing faith in you. This is something that's been bothering me for quite some time: If you continue treating us like that, you'll be just like EA. Honestly, I don't see much difference right now: Everything, no matter how tiny and insignificant it is, can be bought for real money. Your statement that "everything that changes gameplay significally will be obtainable without investment" (Am I correct?) is still technically true, but soon we will be getting "platinum only" weapons and warframes again, not only cosmetics. Edited November 28, 2014 by LABAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xana_Skullsunder Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Yeah, I'm basically not touching Mesa because of the steep requirements just to reach the boss that drops the parts (that and she reportedly isn't very good. I'd bet good money ANOTHER frame gets released before she gets any major changes.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSpite Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 He's giving feedback in a constructive way, even if it's negative. That's what this forum is for. We can reread your post as many times as you request, doesn't make it any less wrong. Yes, because the monthly fees you pay to play this game gives you the right to question decisions made by the company whose free game you are playing. Oh wait ... When you are getting handed free stuff, and you don't like it? Negative constructive criticism only goes so far, then someone should tell you "go play something else". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitelace Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Why can't I upvote OP more? Please this needs to change I'm not droping more money into this game because of S#&$ RNG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liminal Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 (edited) Yes, because the monthly fees you pay to play this game gives you the right to question decisions made by the company whose free game you are playing. Oh wait ... When you are getting handed free stuff, and you don't like it? Negative constructive criticism only goes so far, then someone should tell you "go play something else". The game is not "free", it's "free 2 play". F2P is a business choice. It's not charity. We don't need to be thankful. In fact, you can take this thread as a "thank you, we really like your game, and since we like it we will give you some advice ". Edited November 28, 2014 by The_Doc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunfaiz Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I am with you on this, if you werent that guy, it wouldve been me. And im glad, because i wouldnt have put it that clear and detailed as you. My exact thoughts. +1 for both of you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDoctah Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 The game is not "free", it's "free 2 play". F2P is a business choice. It's not charity. We don't need to be thankful. In fact, you can take this thread as a "thank you, we really like your game, and since we like it we will give you some advice ". This is a great response! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomyGordo Posted November 28, 2014 Author Share Posted November 28, 2014 just to further ingrain my point into stone, yesterday i was able to get on in time to see the only nav point reward node be at 0.5%. maybe its diffrent if you sit in the game all day but i only ever see infested invasions maybe once every 2-3 days. Unless DE has them set to appear extreamly frequently during this event (would make alot of sense lore wise since salad is crashing infested ships into population centers) then i dont see how i will get this frame aside from either not trying for it and getting it after a few months or buying it (i refuse to spend another cent on this game with these current decisions) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hochstepanzerjager Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I hear a lot of people in this thread complaining there's no bosses for Eris or Earth. Well, there's a simple solution to that. Put the Grustrag 3 as the boss of Earth, and the Zanuka Hunter as Boss of Eris. It would allow people to be able to farm them a bit for Brakk and Detron, and it would be nice to be able to take the fight to them for once. You could still use them as Mark Hunters, it would just add to the ability to see them on a more regular basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENIAK_Prime Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 I completely agree, all these walls are clearly designed to make it so annoying that you give up and buy the thing... I still say, at least to some degree, that DE is doing this primarily to make the event seem bigger than it really is. Adding more "wait" time so you "feel" like it was more "difficult", although a lot of us know that isn't true... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landwalrus Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 Well almost everyone complains about how fast and easy events are so I guess they listened but this is a little too much and I don't think 5 days is enough. People complain about them being easy. They still are easy. Only, guess what? It got more grind and RNG based. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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