Community Hot Topics Relevance

[Llyssa]

We've had the CHT around for a while now.

After many months of reading them, I've found they almost never address anything meaningful to the game, but rather include a lot of wild and weird detritus from the forums, things that are hotly discussed because one side finds the other side particularly out of touch with the game, and the other side thinks the idea in the OP is REALLY COOL. That is, in effect, the best way to get a hot topic--post something that's cool as long as you don't think about it, yet entirely irrelevant, and watch it ignite.

 

I'm not sure if anyone else sees this trend, but other than a few gems(vivergate, for example), that seems to be the standard.

 

Do you think CHT is actually doing the community a service? Do you think it's really getting our voices out to DE? Or is it just an echo chamber for pointless arguments?

 

http://strawpoll.me/3424504

[Genoscythe]

It kinda does not always cover things that are actually important to a game, like who hell is interested in grabbing enemies? And why did the thread about the ninja-nerf of droptables not make it? I think DE act a bit in their own favor by collecting the "hot" threads.

[BenzinNinJa]

I've always thought that they did what was in the name. Community Hot Topics = What was popular topics on the forums since last we had a talk about what was popular on the forums.

 

I honestly have no idea if they actually do any good though. When release notes come, I've usually completely forgotten what the last CHT was about.

[VKhaun]

 

Last month I got twice as many likes as the dev post itself just for asking for them to add shotguns to the topic.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/369840-december-19th-community-hot-topics/

 

In November they did a poll just to ask how shotguns compare. -.-

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/341525-november-7th-community-hot-topics/

 

 

I don't feel like I'm just putting "my pet issue" ahead here. This is a whole classification of weapons that, first and foremost, is under powered and seems to be underused by all accounts and secondly we have no idea what the devs are doing with it! You look around at shotgun threads and it's all people assuming shotguns are this, or shotguns should be that and then having messy arguments because they can't see eye to eye. What the hek was Kohm about? It's like an LMG they decided to make a shotgun type weapon at the last second because they hadn't put in a shotgun in a while.

 

That is something we need a dev to come and make a post about so that we can then have informed discussions around.

[Rakshal]

It is hardly ever relevant. I mean a few good topics will make it there sometimes but that is extremely rare.

[TheErebus.]

Kinda find it odd how you posted this in off-topic...

 

 

Anyways, the CHT is just there for DE to see what some other users think of the topic that may or may not have seen or ideas that DE have in mind to put in the game, but want to run it through the community first.

And they have done several things related to the outcome of the CHT.

 

Kubrow removal?
The majority picked for a simple button to remove it.

And they did exactly that.

 

Less costs for DNA Stabilizers?
Boom

100K cost down to 75K cost 

 

SO yes, to some extent, it does get out our voices to DE. But I also agree that some of the topics discussed are...plain to say the least.

Edited January 17, 2015 by TheErebus

[Kalenath]

CHT DOES seem odd at times.

 

But people who say DE staff members don't listen haven't been paying attention.

[Archistopheles]

Do you think CHT is actually doing the community a service? Do you think it's really getting our voices out to DE?

Yes. Just because DE doesn't run with every idea we spew out doesn't mean they aren't actively reading and discussing the ideas. Drew, Rebecca, and Megan have been doing a fantastic job representing us when talking to the designer devs. Steve has also always been a champion of the people, and even Scott has linked changes he has made to the game to community feedback.

Take it from someone who also feels "ignored". You're not. DE has many children, and must love us all equally, but the health of the game, and the employees who make it come first.

Edited January 17, 2015 by Archistopheles

[TheErebus.]

 DE has many children, and must love us all equally,

Oh my~

[Archistopheles]

Oh my~

Not that kind of love -_-

[TheErebus.]

Not that kind of love -_-

But yeah, I agree with you said Arch.

[VKhaun]

CHT has gone downhill.

 

I appreciate Drew, Megan and Rebecca very much and so do my Minotaurs but that means I want them to stay awesome not slip into mediocrity because we pat them on the back regardless of what they do.

 

Go back and read some of the old CHT's. They're two-way communication with devs where each one is a mix of issues they're giving answers or clarification on, and issues they're taking notes on. It's like polls have made that all entirely one-way. They used to tell us what was what, now it just feels like pandering.

 

Example from Megan, March 2014:

Boosters as Consumables

Players have pointed out Boosters shouldn’t activate right when you obtain them, but rather when you’re online. So why not change this you ask? Ultimately, as a self-published free-to-play game, our lifeblood is our players, and boosters are an incentive to stick around. The idea of Boosters as consumables that you can activate at your discretion or Boosters that only take effect when you’re online have potential, but active players play a huge role in Warframe’s success.

 

This is REAL TALK. This is explaining something to people. Reasoning. Game development direction.

 

Give me an example like that from Q4.

 

You can't.

 

They're nothing but straight poles repeating our own questions back at us, sucking in information and not giving anything back. All the shotgun talk is just about effectiveness, not dev direction that we need. All the talk about D polarity is about mod selection, not the position in the first slot that we've been giving negative feedback about since Boltor, and not Boltor Prime I mean since BOLTOR.

 

They're not getting this wrong. They play the game just like we do and they know what's what. At some point they just developed some kind of new process for these CHT threads and it's not getting the same good results of providing clarity and quotablilityness. We need to keep poking them to re-evaluate that process.

 

 

EDIT--

Here's where it happened:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/253878-june-27th-community-hot-topics/

Edited January 17, 2015 by VKhaun

[Katakuna]

There are times when the CHT is spot on, but not as often as it used to be, I feel.

 

I don't know if an "echo chamber" is an accurate description at the moment, but it's slipping there.

[Mokkania]

uh, is it in relation to the last one? because it seems all okay to me...?

[Llyssa]

Yes. Just because DE doesn't run with every idea we spew out doesn't mean they aren't actively reading and discussing the ideas. Drew, Rebecca, and Megan have been doing a fantastic job representing us when talking to the designer devs. Steve has also always been a champion of the people, and even Scott has linked changes he has made to the game to community feedback.

Take it from someone who also feels "ignored". You're not. DE has many children, and must love us all equally, but the health of the game, and the employees who make it come first.

I don't feel ignored. <.<

 

I merely don't see the "hot topics" they present as reflecting anything anyone in the community at large wants, and the subjects are generally presented with poor understanding of the game by people who don't seem to have any idea of what their ultimate goal is with their suggestion. It feels strange/wrong/weird that these are the things the devs think we need to most discuss, when I've never played with anyone who ever talked about the "hot" topics in-game before they hit the CHT.

 

 

 

CHT has gone downhill.

 

I appreciate Drew, Megan and Rebecca very much and so do my Minotaurs but that means I want them to stay awesome not slip into mediocrity because we pat them on the back regardless of what they do.

 

Go back and read some of the old CHT's. They're two-way communication with devs where each one is a mix of issues they're giving answers or clarification on, and issues they're taking notes on. It's like polls have made that all entirely one-way. They used to tell us what was what, now it just feels like pandering.

 

Example from Megan, March 2014:

 

This is REAL TALK. This is explaining something to people. Reasoning. Game development direction.

 

Give me an example like that from Q4.

 

You can't.

 

They're nothing but straight poles repeating our own questions back at us, sucking in information and not giving anything back. All the shotgun talk is just about effectiveness, not dev direction that we need. All the talk about D polarity is about mod selection, not the position in the first slot that we've been giving negative feedback about since Boltor, and not Boltor Prime I mean since BOLTOR.

 

They're not getting this wrong. They play the game just like we do and they know what's what. At some point they just developed some kind of new process for these CHT threads and it's not getting the same good results of providing clarity and quotablilityness. We need to keep poking them to re-evaluate that process.

 

 

EDIT--

Here's where it happened:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/253878-june-27th-community-hot-topics/

 

That's exactly my thinking--the "new and improved" version seems less on-the-ball than promised, by a wide margin. I think the DE staff does a good job, I just don't find anything from the CHT to be anything anyone at all seems to care about, and I find that baffling--I expect to see the things we discuss in game here, the things that I've watched lots of productive back-and-forth being presented. Things most players care about. It's usually not even close. It also never includes any of the "WOW, THIS IS A GREAT THREAD!" things I find, despite them having pages of replies.

 

I read the CHT, and I never see a reflection of myself or anyone I've played with, no matter where I found them, be it recruiting, trade, public games, or friends/allies/clannies I know. It's unpleasant to conceptualize it as what the devs think they should focus on most, when it's things being discussed in-game the least(that is, never at all).

 

Kinda find it odd how you posted this in off-topic...

 

 

Anyways, the CHT is just there for DE to see what some other users think of the topic that may or may not have seen or ideas that DE have in mind to put in the game, but want to run it through the community first.

And they have done several things related to the outcome of the CHT.

 

Kubrow removal?

The majority picked for a simple button to remove it.

And they did exactly that.

 

Less costs for DNA Stabilizers?

Boom

100K cost down to 75K cost 

 

SO yes, to some extent, it does get out our voices to DE. But I also agree that some of the topics discussed are...plain to say the least.

Sometimes they have relevant after effects.

 

Most times, I'm very afraid that they'll be paid any heed at all. Like this week, one that hit is "remove serration to improve diversity!" Ask them what they mean by "diversity" and they re-assert their buzz word, "diversity!" There's no actual logic to it, just a nebulous buzzword. Synergize Ergonomically! If you actually discuss with them the ramifications of what they've suggested, they're horrified by all possible options, and claim they only wanted "diversity", despite the fact their suggestion apparently doesn't achieve their imaginary goal.

 

So far as being in off-topic, I think that's the right place for it, as it's discussing discussions discussing the game, rather than the game itself. If there's a better place for this, by all means, suggest it, but given it's 3 levels of removal from the game, it seems to make sense to me.

[(PSN)Pharen]

Alot of times I find it irrelevant, but there have been a few topics show up in the community hot topics that have interested me.

[(PSN)IMainTheMains]

It kinda does not always cover things that are actually important to a game, like who hell is interested in grabbing enemies? And why did the thread about the ninja-nerf of droptables not make it? I think DE act a bit in their own favor by collecting the "hot" threads.

That just gave me the brilliant idea that... The COMMUNITY gets to pick the COMMUNITY hot topics, not 100% sure how though.

 

Edit: Still more than other developers do though.

Edited January 17, 2015 by (PS4)RyanRFC12345

[Llyssa]

That just gave me the brilliant idea that... The COMMUNITY gets to pick the COMMUNITY hot topics, not 100% sure how though.

 

Edit: Still more than other developers do though.

Well, the easy/obvious way would be to have the commods collate a list of everything that hit "hot" status in the 2 weeks since the last one was posted, and then have other things that people actually want discussed popped up there as suggestions.