Hydroid: An Exhaustive Review

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

In the following post, I will share an extensive review of my experience of Hydroid, covering everything from appearance, to secondary equipment, to loadouts, and even builds. I hope it helps you.

 

Appearance: Hydroid was the second Frame to come in with a very obvious motif, that of a Pirate, complete with a Parrot skin for the carrier, to better collect booty. With him came the Attica Crossbow, and the Nami Skyla, a Falchion and Dagger combination Melee weapon. His alternate helmet, the Triton, allowed people to further customize for the pirate look, with a head that looks like Davy Jones bastard child. Fortunately, he was still abstract enough, that he had the ability to be more than a Pirate. Then came the Ketos helmet, which was reminescent of a female anglerfish, as well as the Iliac attachments, and with that, Hydroid could now look like a wicked sea monster! I absolutely love the way this looks, but I have to say, a lot of other pieces of equipment look rather silly on him, due to how overly themed he is. On the Record: He still looks absolutely amazeballs.

 

Passives: There are still no passives for Hydroid, and the only ones that have official passives, to my knowledge, is Zephyr and Mesa. I think Hydroid ought to have one as well though, like a slow regen ability when in water. This would be fairly limited, only applying to tile sets in the Void, Earth, Ceres, and Europa, if memory serves.  

 

Base Stats:  

 

Health: Sadly, Hydroid has very little health, beginning at 100, and capping at 300.

 

Shields: This is the first ever Shield frame I've reviewed on here, though I've explained, in depth, why shields in Warframe seriously need more options. At their base, and unmodded, Shields are definitely better than Health, what with their regeneration, but they have too many things that bypass them, like bleed procs, and Toxic damage, for instance. Knowing that there are damage types that ignore this altogether, it makes shields a liability. For health, there are may more options for modding, like Equilibrium, Rage, Quick Thinking, Armor, Life Strike, Winds of Purity, the fact that Shields buffer Health. For Shields, the only options you have are Recharge, Recharge faster, or Recharge slightly faster with a 1 in 5 chance to not be knocked down. There is much more to it, and I explain, thoroughly, why Shields are insufficient in comparision with Health. And for Hydroid, his Shields begin at 115, and peak at 345, and even with a Maxed out Redirection, his shields only peak at 851. This is pretty low considering he is more of a CC frame, and if he didnt have the ability to run and hide well, it would be a liability.

For more on why Shields in Warframe are entirely insufficient, see the following Thread: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/368661-is-it-time-for-more-shield-options/

 

 Armor: It's interesting, how at 300 max health, you can basically just add Hydroids armor rating to health, because the effective health become 365.01. This doesnt make much of a difference though, because he is, most unfortunately, one of the six Shield Frames in a game with 28 different frames.

 

Movement: 

 

Stamina: Hydroid is a power house in this area, though it doesnt matter much. He has a power for mobility to make up the distance between him, and where he needs to go, and seeing as he is a Shield Frame, melee is not much of an option. 

 

Sprint Speed: At 1.05, Hydroid is alright, for his playstyle. If you get behind Tidal Surge will make up the difference, but with Hydroid, you dont want to be the first person there anyway, so falling behind works out for him. 

 

Power: He begins at 100, and caps at 150, but this is usually enough for him. As a general rule, the higher the duration, the less energy you will need, because you will not be spamming as often as you may with another Frame. With Hydroid, duration benefits three out of four of his powers, so you will not need to be casting all that often.

 

Aura Polarity: As an answer to his less-than-great energy pool, is the Naramon polarity, and so he can equip Energy Siphon, which will do well enough to make back what you spend on him.

 

Abilities:

 

Tempest Barrage: Good power, so long as you dont try to make it do something that it is not meant to do. Too many people in the forums throw temper tantrums about Hydroids lack of damage, and honestly, if that's really a problem for them, they may want to try a different frame. Hydroid is a utility frame, that has endgame possibility with his CC. If it doesnt deal enough damage for you, make up the difference with a weapon, and let him excel in the way he was intended. With Tempest Barrage, this power is a very good CC. Some common misunderstandings people have with Tempest Barrage, as well as Tentacle Swarm, are that they think that it has a limited range, when the truth is, you could aim that thing at a different planet, and it would work. They also dont seem to understand that more range makes the power less useful. When you make the AOE on TB seriously expanded, it means that anybody that enters the AOE is less likely to be hit, because the AOE isnt entirely affected, but it just happens to be where numerous effects happen to occur, not all simultaneously, nor are they constant. For the best result, Tempest Barrage should be though of, as one would a shotgun. You want it nice and tight, not spread out. Since Hydroid benefits from Duration, as well as negative Range, Narrow Minded is a must have. Sure, you may not be covering as wide of an area, but it is still wide enough to count, and it will last longer, and for those enemies that do wander in, they are much more likely to be hit, and will likely be hit numerous times, at that. This feature is invaluable in defense missions, especially so with Infestation. You target the pod with this, you will make a mess of enemies. You may not kill them with it, but you will be knocking them down on-the-reg, and you can hit them while they are down with the weapon that you are using to make up for his lack of power damage, like a good/smart gamer would. Even with maxed out power strength, Hydroid can only manage 284 damage per strike, but keep in mind that this power is great for it's utility, and not for its damage. This power is a bit slow to cast, and so Hydroid is one of the few frames where I use Natural Talent. I've soloed high end hordes of infested with this power, due to Natural Talen, and keeping a manageable Duration on it.

 

Tidal Surge: This is a very useful power, IMO. For the duration, you are invincible. You can skip lazers, and you knock down everything in your path. It does alright damage, but it's not much to worry about, given the utility. This is a power that can be used to aim, for a similar effect to Tempest Barrage, providing knockdown, only covering a wider area (even if it's in a line). This is good for finisher damage, people, or just shooting people while they are down, the same as Tempest Barrage. Moreover, this is great for mobility. Mine is modded to take me about 45 Meters, and covers many gaps. You can activate this in the air as well, so emerging from a forward flip, turning into a tidal wave, and then launching yourself forward over even difficult to cross gaps. This is a great power for Capture missions, as it permits you to close the distance between you and the target while invulnerable to their rockets or supras. It does some damage, but not much, doing only 300 to those he passes, and 300 at the end of the duration, yet again I remind you: Hydroid is not a frame that is meant to do damage. He is a frame that is a CC specialist. 

 

Augment mods on Hydroid: Normally, I would not be big on augment mods. I find that their bonuses arent very good, generally speaking, with few exceptions. For Hydroid, however, there are only so many ways that you can mod him for optimal usage. Lets think about this: He doesnt do much in the way of damage, so to make up for that, you should carry high DPS weapons in. Even using max Power Strength, his damage is unimpressive, and the smaller the number being modded, the less the mod will do, so taking up a bunch of drain to make an unimpressive number less unimpressive will not make it impressive. This leaves you with few options. You can go with Transient Fortitude, but Duration is important for Hydroid. You can go with Blind Rage, but the amount of energy it costs for powers that do unimpressive damage is simply not worth it. Intensify is a mere 30% of an unimpressive number, and it will do nothing. Ultimately, what we need to understand, is that putting Power Strength on Hydroid is like putting a Maxed Steel Fiber on Banshee, turning her insignificant 15 armor into an insignificant 31, when you could mod for something else. Then you have Duration. While it is important for him to have a decent duration, you still want to have a manageable duration. Continuity(Not Primed), and Narrow Minded, countered with Fleeting expertise, provide a very reasonable duration, so when the crowd changes, you are more adaptable, and with that, there is no need for Constitution. Then you have Power Range, which actually hurts two of his powers, and he actually benefits from negative Range. At that point, all you have to mod for is Casting speed, and Shields. Seeing as he is a Frame whose powers provide CC in a diverse manner, all four of his powers were worth equiping, before the new system, and so with the new system, there are two slots available on him. That being said, if you are going to throw augment mods on him, go right ahead.

 

Tidal Impunity: This power is alright, and if you have nothing better to do with your mod space, then go for it, but keep a couple things in mind: Duration makes it better, amping it up to a maximum of 18.42 seconds of immunity to Status. This is actually a good way to counter Hydroids problem of being a shield frame, or at least a part of it, considering there are ways to bypass shields. With that in mind, nearly 20 seconds of being immune to bleed procs, Toxic and Gas, and other types of ongoing damage actually make life good to be a shield frame. In fact, this could make Hydroid one of the best Shield based frames in the game, but unfortunately, it has little to do with actual shield modding. 

 

Undertow: Because I know that only a mere 15% of people know the real name, I am referring to the power more popularly refered to as "Puddle". This is the worst of his powers, in terms of damage, and that is saying quite a bit, but at least it's irresistible finisher damage. This power makes you invincible, and your companion too, for the most part, so this benefits him greatly as a Shield Frame. In addition, it is also stealth, but when it comes to stealth, this power fails miserably. You cant just hide, and then reimurge undetected when an enemy strolls by, because as soon as they fall in, the only thing you can do is let them out, at which point you have been discovered. IMO, it would be better for this power to be more focused on Stealth, and less on CC. He already has plenty of that with his other three powers, and the CC function renders him unable to do damage substantial enough to mean something in the long run. With his other three powers, you can make up for their lack of damage by making use of their CC to keep the enemies pinned while gunning them down. With this, all you can do is sit and Recharge your shield.

 

Curative Undertow: This is a fantastic power in theory, but it takes communication to make it worth while. I've run three missions with this, all with randoms, to see if it can be used in a pinch, and every time I got close to using it, the people moved away. Undertow is just not fast enough. When you do manage to land it, it's incredibly useful. This heals up to 85.2% of health per second on allies, if you are modding Hydroid for Power Strength, but honestly, it's worth it to leave it at it's base. After 3 seconds, you will have healed 90% at a cost of about 6.75 energy, with Efficiency. This is a huge bonus. In addition, it heals 10% of your own per second. This is a pretty great mod, IMO. This means that you have the power to, not only Heal allies in four seconds, but also regenerate your own health, along with your shield Recharge, while remaining invincible. Hydroid actually benefits GREATLY from both of his Syndicate mods, but even moreso, he also has room for them both, if you arent trying to make him into something that he is not.

 

Tentacle Swarm: DE too a page right out of a Hentei Snuff film for this one, and gave us the power to murder our enemies with tentacles. This power is similar to Tempest Barrage in MANY ways, including the LOS range, the beneficial negative power range, and the amazing CC. The key differences are the duration is better, the damage is better, and the damage is more diverse. It works on both Shields, because it starts with magnetic, and then it is finisher damage thereafter, which allows it to bypass all armor. With this in mind, note that it's kind of good for all factions, at the very least, in terms of "loosening the lid", so to speak. The rest of the information is mainly the same as Tempest Barrage.

 

Acquiring: Hydroid is one of the most insane Warframes to get your hands on. It is more difficult to get than any Prime to date, and it is all the fault of RNG. First off, you have to farm the beacons. I recall when it was hard getting Delta Beacons. Now, thats about all I can find, and in farming for weeks, I never once found a Kappa beacon. It's terribly infuriating. After that you go through Vay Hek, who is extremely time consuming, even if he isnt all that difficult. Then there is the possibility of the exit being blocked by a glitched out water stream, wasting the efforts, and time you spent hunting Hek. Assuming all of that is done, then your fate is sealed by RNG, yet again, as you wait to see which of the three pieces you get. I'm sorry, but this needs to be a bit simpler, to be worth getting.

 

Optimizing Hydroid: I really cannot stress enough, how unimportant Power Strength is to Hydroid. On the contrary, this is a utility frame. Not necessarily a support frame, though he is quite capable of doing so, but Power Strength is unnecessary to make him great, and amping it up will do nothing to correct the lack of damage he was born with. His main role in this game is CC, and at that he is amazing, but you have to be careful to not overdo it. This means it's good to have a duration to keep a certain area busy, but you need to be able to retarget. Usually it's healthy to lay down a TS on a choke point to tie it up, and then use TB on other points of entry. The most important aspect of this, is to case the location, and locate the greatest choke points available. With a Hydroid, you should have no problem covering three entry ways, even in the late game with minimal effort, so long as the duration is not too long, which would make it impossible to reposition in a pinch. 

 

LOADOUT: This is what I usually run with Hydroid

 

 

Hydroid: Requires 1 Forma

Energy Siphon: Hydroid is no good at tanking. Keep him fueled.

Fleeting Expertise: 1 from the top. This, in tandem with Narrow Minded and Continuity, have a pretty versatile duration. Long enough to hold the line, but short enough to move it around when needed.

Streamline 1 from the top. 

Narrow Minded Max: Remember that negative range helps out both Tentacle Swarm, and Tempest Barrage.

Continuity Max

Natural Talent Max: His animations are slow, and with how shields can be, you want those powers out there asap.

Redirection Max: Sadly, he is a shield frame, but at least he has ways to suppliment his shields in a way that make them more viable.

Fast Deflection Max: This is really only until we get Tidal Impunity on PS4. His other powers are just right in duration and utility, and I want to keep the delicate balance.

Curative Undertow: The utility is too useful to ignore.

 

Primary: I prefer the Attica, but it's not that viable later on without a lot of Forma. I will use it to snipe priority targets as they come, and I use the blast damage for it's knockdown. Really though, any weapon that has a high status, and can also provide knockdowns will greatly help.

 

Secondary: Nobody is perfect, and sometimes people get through event he most solid of barricades. In such an instance, a good hand canon would be useful, but remember how squishy he can be. 

 

Melee: I dont remember the last time I had to melee with Hydroid, using the methods stated above. Whatever you want.

 

Companion: Raksa Kubrow. If you are Hydroid, you already have some serious CC going on, but a little more can always help. Many have asked why I dont balance, attack, utility, and support, and the reason is that every Frame excels in one area, or another, and adding to that  is never redundant. The reason I do not recall the last time I meleed with him, is due to Howl. It is so often, and consistent, I rarely, if ever, have to worry about something being in melee range. In addition, the Raksa power, Protect, is much more useful than Guardian. Protect is ongoing, and will begin the instant you lose any shield, even if negligible. Guardian will occasionally go off, once your Shields are gone, and the enemies have broken into your health. This does not suit Hydroids defenses very well.

 

Until next time,

 

-Fen

Edited January 18, 2015 by (PS4)Fenrushak

[MrNonApplicable]

Hydroid never really glued for me, but I'll take another look after reading this. Thanks for taking the time.

[NoggDog117]

*impressed whistle*

 

This was a very in-depth review. Really, I thought about every bit of information as I was swimming on through this. Great way to discuss Aquaman's CC in a light that is not all damage-focused. Still though, fishing through this, I see that you put a sea of information that was at no point tossed overboard. It really sank in.

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

Hydroid never really glued for me, but I'll take another look after reading this. Thanks for taking the time.

 

I know the feeling. It took me revisiting him twice before I realized that he was one of my favorites. I kept shelving him because I fell for the "He doesnt do enough damage" line that keeps coming back to the Forums. He is definitely worth it, but I've found that a Warframe is better depending on Loadout, not just Mod Build. There are many weapons that simply do not flatter some Frames, and some that synergize very well, like Volt and Laser weapons. 

 

*impressed whistle*

 

This was a very in-depth review. Really, I thought about every bit of information as I was swimming on through this. Great way to discuss Aquaman's CC in a light that is not all damage-focused. Still though, fishing through this, I see that you put a sea of information that was at no point tossed overboard. It really sank in.

 

You edify me greatly, NoggDog. I've done about five now, with a new review every day for a while. Tomorrow will either be Banshee, Volt, or Mag. I've been reading up on them a lot lately. I'm really glad if I was able to help in any way.

[DrBorris]

I can agree with most points on this review (I have had my gripes with some of the past ones), but I can agree with pretty much everything here. The only thing I kind of disagree with is about Tentacle Swarm. This ability drives me crazy for three reasons.

 

A) It does not work very well. In concept, it could be an area denial ability, but the hit detection of the tentacles is terrible. I have watched enemies stroll right through tentacles countless times.

 

B) You said it yourself, it is just like Tempest Barrage. When it comes to the later game, it becomes more effective to spam Tempest Barrage due to being more controllable aiming and CC. I get that it has a much longer duration, but how often are you standing in the same place?

 

C) This one is more subjective. Hydroid is a water frame, right? His first second and third abilities fit that theme very well... then you get to Tentacle Swarm. Yeah, yeah, Hydroid is also the "pirate" frame (physical styling) and something about giant squid and pirates just go together, but... Hydroid is the water frame. I feel like DE could have done something much more water-y that could have fit into Hydroid's role (CC), without overlapping his other abilities (Tempest Barrage).

 

That is it from me, thank you for doing these reviews, they are the most fair reviews of Warframes i have seen on the Forums. (Now if you could just stop them from dying and sinking to the deep, dark, depths of the Forums so that all may see them)

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

That is it from me, thank you for doing these reviews, they are the most fair reviews of Warframes i have seen on the Forums. (Now if you could just stop them from dying and sinking to the deep, dark, depths of the Forums so that all may see them)

 

I appreciate what you have said, friend. I plan to augment all reviews in the future, as the game updates, and once I do so, I will post a new comment explaining that new information has been included. This will revive them. I'm sure that others have much to contribute too, though. Keep looking. There is always someone better.

[ENIAK_Prime]

Y'know? After reading this I'll have to try playing my Hydroid again. I had no idea about how added power range can hurt Tempest Barrage and Tentacle Swarm. That's something to think about!

 

C) This one is more subjective. Hydroid is a water frame, right? His first second and third abilities fit that theme very well... then you get to Tentacle Swarm. Yeah, yeah, Hydroid is also the "pirate" frame (physical styling) and something about giant squid and pirates just go together, but... Hydroid is the water frame.

To be fair, the tentacles are made of water.

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

Y'know? After reading this I'll have to try playing my Hydroid again. I had no idea about how added power range can hurt Tempest Barrage and Tentacle Swarm. That's something to think about!

 

To be fair, the tentacles are made of water.

 

Tempest Barrage and Tentacle Swarm are usually misunderstood. Hydroids powers, as I mentioned, really should be considered like that of a shotgun. The Spread could be tight, or it could be spread.

[Rankii]

I completely agree with this, which is odd. Especially with the bit about curative undertow needing some communication. Personally I'd like it if the mod gave undertow a visual effect, like some sort of glow or mist around it to help give the "fountain of youth" look to it.

 

On a purely cosmetic note, I wish that coloring Hydroid's water wasn't so wonky and washed-out. I tried making a Nikelodeon-themed hydroid (Organge with green slime) but have hit a wall in getting the slime that right shade of green. I want to have a nice black color for squid ink, but It doesn't look like it's happening anytime soon. If someone has Hydroid and the Smoke Palette, could they confirm/deny if that particular palette's darkest black actually does the trick? I'd rather not burn another 75p on a guess.

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

I completely agree with this, which is odd. Especially with the bit about curative undertow needing some communication. Personally I'd like it if the mod gave undertow a visual effect, like some sort of glow or mist around it to help give the "fountain of youth" look to it.

 

Yeah, that would be really helpful, but if the team is moving around, it'll be difficult to see the animation behind them. If they dont notice a Hydroid zooming up behind them, and turning into a puddle beneath their feet, bc they keep moving too fast, they wont have much luck seeing the animation. I think that maybe a "Fountain Of Youth" sound would be useful. 

[Sangiros]

Guide needs a little rewiew, with Pilfering Swarm out. People are farming his parts like crazy now that Vay Hek is ocne again a key-free boss, mostly because Pilfering Hydroid is being a great pair with Despoil Nekros.

Plus there's something that's bothering me about his powers. Is reducing Power Range beneficial to him? I'm asking because hitting Tempest Barrage and Tentacle Swarm in a smaller, more focused area, sounds interesting for damage. Especially now, once again, because of Pilfering Swarm, since it's not really clear if the 100% bonus drop rate applies to enemies killed by the tentacles, or killed while the tentacles have them (gun/melee/power assisted kill). So a smaller area for both for a looter build could be a better tradeoff for CC

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

Guide needs a little rewiew, with Pilfering Swarm out. People are farming his parts like crazy now that Vay Hek is ocne again a key-free boss, mostly because Pilfering Hydroid is being a great pair with Despoil Nekros.

Plus there's something that's bothering me about his powers. Is reducing Power Range beneficial to him? I'm asking because hitting Tempest Barrage and Tentacle Swarm in a smaller, more focused area, sounds interesting for damage. Especially now, once again, because of Pilfering Swarm, since it's not really clear if the 100% bonus drop rate applies to enemies killed by the tentacles, or killed while the tentacles have them (gun/melee/power assisted kill). So a smaller area for both for a looter build could be a better tradeoff for CC

 

Sorry, but if you add range, you lose the (effective) CC for both TB, and TS. Forget about damage altogether. Hydroid is not a damage frame, and as I emphasized in the OP, the damage you gain by doing a damage build is not worth it. I have not use Pilfering Swarm, but there are a few things to keep in mind, which are almost a given.

 

1) If you increase the range, you are not increasing the amount of things being hit. It is the same number of projectiles with TB, and the same number of Tentacles with TS. If they are spread out, that only means that it is less likely that they are going to hit an object, because they are so far apart that enemies can walk in between them. Think along the lines of the spread from a shotgun. If the spread is tight, then things in the effective area, while smaller, will still yield better results. Hydroid can hold down several choke points, and with the very weapon that comes with the Hydroid pack, you can hold down more, and make up for his lack of damage. 

 

2) The damage that Tentacles do is not worth it. The normal reaction to that would be something along the lines of "2419.68" damage is good damage. Keep in mind that this is the amount of damage that results from Maximized Power Strength, so the duration would run about 14 seconds, and the energy cost would be so high that you couldn't use the power without equipping Flow/Primed Flow. A build that would produce this much damage would require 5 of 8 mod slots, just to be able to cast one power, which is a shameful waste on any frame. 1) Intensify 2) Blind Rage 3) Transient Fortitude 4) Flow 5) Pilfering Swarm.  

 

3) Since the kills MUST be done by the Tentacles (Yes, they do have to be killed by the tentacle) to yield loot, this is not even a fraction as viable as a Nekros, and it would be silly to pair Nekros with Hydroid, when you could pair Nekros with Nekros, which is even worse off, considering the low base damage. 

 

In the end, Pilfering Swarm would not benefit you with enough loot to make much of a difference, even after you threw out efficiency and duration to make the damage any level of worth it. Plus, you would be throwing away his main area of expertise: Crowd Control. Modding for this would be a mistake, and a waste of Hydroids overall build.

[Kontrollo]

Props for the guide, well-written and I agree with a lot of things in it.

 

Your assessment of Pilfering Swarm, however, isn't quite right. The mod is viable, the added loot is noticeable. And Tentacle Swarm isn't as bad as you make it out to be, because the DOT deals Finisher damage. It's a nice mod to have equipped in Survivals, I recommend pairing up with a Nekros and go to Elara, Jupiter whenever you need to collect some Neural Sensors. By itself, Nekros' Desecrate is better of course, but Pilfering Swarm has nice synergy with that anyhow.

 

Edit: I forgot btw, try the Quanta as primary weapon, because Tempest Barrage can make the cubes explode. It's ideal to add the damage the barrage lacks, after they've been knocked down.

Edited March 14, 2015 by Kontrollo

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

Props for the guide, well-written and I agree with a lot of things in it.

 

Your assessment of Pilfering Swarm, however, isn't quite right. The mod is viable, the added loot is noticeable. And Tentacle Swarm isn't as bad as you make it out to be, because the DOT deals Finisher damage. It's a nice mod to have equipped in Survivals, I recommend pairing up with a Nekros and go to Elara, Jupiter whenever you need to collect some Neural Sensors. By itself, Nekros' Desecrate is better of course, but Pilfering Swarm has nice synergy with that anyhow.

 

Edit: I forgot btw, try the Quanta as primary weapon, because Tempest Barrage can make the cubes explode. It's ideal to add the damage the barrage lacks, after they've been knocked down.

 

Thank you for the kudos. I always appreciate a pat on the back, friend!

 

I will say that I stand by my word on Tentacle Swarm, but I would like to point out that I dont think that I ever really made it out to be bad. I just made the damage out to be less than adequate. Tentacle Swarm is fantastic in terms of CC, provided you keep the spread tight (Narrow Minded kills two birds with one stone) but considering how lackluster the damage is on all four of his powers, Tentacle Swarms damage is not heavy enough to warrant modding in that direction, when it would hurt his other three powers.

[PsyFungus]

Nice Review, still in my opinion Hydroid needs a buff.Is hard to play solo with him...Not that i enjoy playing solo all the time but realy Hydroid needs to be Buffed.

Edited March 17, 2015 by PsyFungus

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

Nice Review, still in my opinion Hydroid needs a buff.Is hard to play solo with him...Not that i enjoy playing solo all the time but realy Hydroid needs to be Buffed.

 

Can I ask why you feel he needs a buff, and why you feel that you are having difficulties with him? I soloed numerous missions in Breeding Grounds, Mutalist Incursions, and Gate Crash with him, without much of a problem. 

 

My advice would be to focus on Loadout, rather than builds. If you are worried about him not having enough damage, then take a high tier weapon, and let that take care of the damage for you. If you feel that he doesn't handle enough CC, take a Raska to add to it. 

 

There are a lot of ways to make a Frame more viable. The problem we often have, is that Tenno look at everything as an individual, without being able to be complemented by the rest of the loadout. The only example I've seen of such synergy being widely known, is a loadout containing Ember, with the Ignis, and a some form of a heat based weapon. She already does decent damage with her powers, but using these in tandem with Accelerant, you will have constantly staggered enemies, and with the range capabilities of the Ignis, it is really enhanced by her abilities.

[Kontrollo]

Thank you for the kudos. I always appreciate a pat on the back, friend!

 

I will say that I stand by my word on Tentacle Swarm, but I would like to point out that I dont think that I ever really made it out to be bad. I just made the damage out to be less than adequate. Tentacle Swarm is fantastic in terms of CC, provided you keep the spread tight (Narrow Minded kills two birds with one stone) but considering how lackluster the damage is on all four of his powers, Tentacle Swarms damage is not heavy enough to warrant modding in that direction, when it would hurt his other three powers.

 

Sorry for the misunderstanding, I actually agree that Tentacle Swarm's damage isn't great. But it's good enough for Pilfering Swarm to work quite well on weaker enemies. What i wrote there was only meant in context with that augment. Place some tentacles with Pilfering Swarm to close off a doorway and focus on another part of the tile. After they're done, clean up and collect.

 

And yeah, I'm using a 6/10 Narrow Minded as well. That mod is just made for Hydroid. By the way, I don't equip any power strength mods on my preferred build.

 

 

Nice Review, still in my opinion Hydroid needs a buff.Is hard to play solo with him...Not that i enjoy playing solo all the time but realy Hydroid needs to be Buffed.

 

Interesting, I'm having less problems soloing with him. But as soon as someone on my team goes down, I'm usually having trouble reviving without going down myself. However, I agree that he could use a few tweaks, I've said so in several threads on this forum.

[ironman90na]

I discovered this topic because the OP linked this discussion on my post about "reworking" (more of a tweaking) Hydroid.

 

After checking out how in depth this review of the frame is, i'm quite impressed. Sadly not impressed enough to make me change my mind. I agree that Hydroid is a CC orientend frame, and i'm not the one looking for damage in his skill-set, but obvious tweaks are in order.

 

As you mentioned his 1° ability is a very useful CC, but with a continuity build, a very ineffective one if not in defence missions, or in objective oriented ones. In fact in normal missions such as Extermination, capture or survival, it's preferable to spam those cc, rather than having it active in a small area for 10+ seconds. It just doesn't help you.

So a possible solution for this would be to make his 1° ability spammable regardless of activation, and if it may seem op, then deactivable at anytime during is active period.

 

 

 

His 2° ability is a very good CC as well as movement skill, but as you mentioned, it's only useful if built with duration in mind, which is not ideal for the point i'm trying to make.

A possible and simple solution is to make the 2° ability affected by range, rather than continuity, and bump up the damage a little bit.

 

His 3° skill as you mentioned is not that useful, unless you equip its augument, Curative Undertow. But the stationary nature of this skill, makes it very flow-breaking, in a fast game as Warframe is.

A simple and rather a must is to make undertow not stationary, maybe you can move while in undertow at a walk speed, or something like that.

 

His 4° ability as you said it's his 1° ability on steroids. so basically my point is the same as his 1° ability. make it spammable, or deactivable.

 

I like how you took the time to study and learn to appreciate this warframe, but to me seems an unnatural process, as i get the feeling that your first impression with it was not that good, and it shouldn't be like that. 

 

If you dont mind i'd like to link my post to yours so we can share opinions about it.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/495774-hydroid-rework-needed/#entry5544028

 

I apologize if i made any mistake writing this post, english it's not my first language.

Edited July 26, 2015 by ironman90na

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

Thank you for your input! I will be slow in response.

Edited July 26, 2015 by (PS4)Fenrushak

[rudman88]

In my opinion, remove the natural talent.

 

Its casting speed for most skill are fast enough.

 

1st skill not affected natural talent will not affect rain

2nd skill instant

3rd skill instant

4th skill the tentacles 2 secs ( my estimate) for the tentacles start whipping people

 

you dont really need fast deflection too as undertow can let you charge your shield.

 

If you put narrow minded, the duration  is long but the range become very short. I suggest change it to constitution.

 

why short range is bad.

It is a utility frame, you will need some range for cc

 

It is a power horse a.k.a mortar bombard style.

 

Most people put damage for the pilferign swarm augmented  mod.

 

Wjere the tentacles must kill to receive 2 x drop

 

tq

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

As you mentioned his 1° ability is a very useful CC, but with a continuity build, a very ineffective one if not in defence missions, or in objective oriented ones. In fact in normal missions such as Extermination, capture or survival, it's preferable to spam those cc, rather than having it active in a small area for 10+ seconds. It just doesn't help you.

So a possible solution for this would be to make his 1° ability spammable regardless of activation, and if it may seem op, then deactivable at anytime during is active period.

 

-snip to keep it on one topic-

 

His 4° ability as you said it's his 1° ability on steroids. so basically my point is the same as his 1° ability. make it spammable, or deactivable.

 

His 4 and his 1 are both very useful. In fact, you can manage exactly what you want by having a lower duration build. This way you have a long term CC power that you can leave down, and one that is fairly spammable. Hydroids specialty is tying up locations with CC powers to control the inflow of enemies. His 1 excels in tight quarters, and his 4 does even more so. I would argue that it truly does help us greatly, but I think it helps more with a tight spread, so Narrow Minded is a must. 

 

As for it's use in Extermination, I think that his 1 works very well for knocking down Squads. I think it works so well that I dont worry about losing health in missions like that. I just keep the enemies tied up with CC the whole time.

 

I want you to think about it for a minute, how powerful he would be if he could instantaneously dismiss castings and recast. His CC would be impenetrable. I think it would be a bad idea. 

 

 

His 2° ability is a very good CC as well as movement skill, but as you mentioned, it's only useful if built with duration in mind, which is not ideal for the point i'm trying to make.

A possible and simple solution is to make the 2° ability affected by range, rather than continuity, and bump up the damage a little bit.

 

Not true. Duration makes its distance better, but even if you only use it as a short term burst, it will still knock things down and make you invincible for the duration. This would be great for a melee only build on Hydroid. Think about it: You can use it in a quick burst in the same way as Ember uses Accelerants CC effect, and you will be close enough. When powers change drastically according to the mods equipped, try and find a way to repurpose them. Turning this power into a quick knockdown technique would be the obvious answer. That, and it's standard duration is also very good for mobility.

 

 

His 3° skill as you mentioned is not that useful, unless you equip its augument, Curative Undertow. But the stationary nature of this skill, makes it very flow-breaking, in a fast game as Warframe is.

A simple and rather a must is to make undertow not stationary, maybe you can move while in undertow at a walk speed, or something like that.

 

IMO, this power does need some changes. I'd say that it should be mobile, but shouldn't drown people. Full Stealth would be fantastic. The fact that it is a stealth power is almost silly, since people will obviously be aware of you the moment they fall in, and you cant do much of anything afterward to get back to stealth.

 

 

you dont really need fast deflection too as undertow can let you charge your shield.

 

Alright, with this statement alone, I can tell that you didn't do any more than look at the pictures. I can also tell that you haven't studied much. I agree that Fast Deflection isnt a great choice. I explained that it was only equipped until the Augments made it to PS4, and then I replaced it with Curative Undertow. Also, it would reduce the time I need to remain in Undertow for the Recharge.

 

 

In my opinion, remove the natural talent.

 

Its casting speed for most skill are fast enough.

 

1st skill not affected natural talent will not affect rain

2nd skill instant

3rd skill instant

4th skill the tentacles 2 secs ( my estimate) for the tentacles start whipping people

 

If you put narrow minded, the duration  is long but the range become very short. I suggest change it to constitution.

 

 

That's the standard, but his powers function differently than most. I'm not sure you know how range works on his powers. I'm not trying to make the rain fall faster. I'm speeding up the power cast time, which is substantial with both Tempest Barrage, and Tentacle Swarm. You'd be surprised how greatly this benefits the powers. 

 

None of his powers suffer from negative range. In fact, it improves Tentacle Swarm and Tempest Barrage. Think of Range, in the context of this power, in the same way a Shotgun has Spread. When it's far enough apart, you are unlikely to hit them with even one, in some instances. 

 

In the following Video, Calypso explains why you specifically want negative range, and he uses visuals. 

 

 

 

Most people put damage for the pilferign swarm augmented  mod.

 

Wjere the tentacles must kill to receive 2 x drop

 

tq

 

And that's a decent build, but I only do well rounded builds. I am also one of those players that abhors focusing solely on one power. None of his other powers really benefit from Power Strength, and even Pilfering Swarm isn't that great damage. I've been with squads that used Hydroid for farming, and it was painfully slow and boring, if you mod him for anything beyond PS. In fact, if you don't go Max Power with him, it's going to be a long wait. Seriously, just get a Nekros and save time. 

[AlphaHorseman]

To be fair, the tentacles are made of water.

And if you're like me, they're made of pink water ;)

[AkerTheSpjot]

All in all, this is a well-written review. Definitely shows how Hydroid should be played.

And I noticed that you seem to hold Tentacles Swarm in high regard, which is not the same case for me. The AI and spawn logic can be horrid sometimes, also as you and someone else has mentioned, the ability shares similar traits with TB while excels in damage, cc capability and duration that could causes overlap issue.

Wait, the Great Beacons Grindwall hasn't been torn down on PS4 ?

Edited July 26, 2015 by The_Vile_Blade

[(PSN)Fen_Integrum]

No more beacons! :-)

[AlienOvermind]

Tentacle Swarm: DE too a page right out of a Hentei Snuff film for this one, and gave us the power to murder our enemies with tentacles. This power is similar to Tempest Barrage in MANY ways, including the LOS range, the beneficial negative power range, and the amazing CC. The key differences are the duration is better, the damage is better, and the damage is more diverse. It works on both Shields, because it starts with magnetic, and then it is finisher damage thereafter, which allows it to bypass all armor. With this in mind, note that it's kind of good for all factions, at the very least, in terms of "loosening the lid", so to speak. The rest of the information is mainly the same as Tempest Barrage.

I just cannot stay put when I see someone calling Tentacle Swarm an amazing CC. It's good (maybe even amazing) comparing to Tornado, yeah. But, please, look at other frames' CC abilities:

- Bastille and Vortex — unquestionably better at CC;

- Radial Disarm — not even close;

- M.Prime — Tentacle Swarm is a joke compared to this;

- Chaos — yeah, right;

These are truly amazing CC abilities.

 

Ok, let's look at "not amazing, but very good" category then:

- Radial Blind — LoS hurts a bit, but overall much better than Tentacle Swarm;

- Rhino Stomp — cannot be recasted, but much more reliable than Tentacles;

- Prism — more damage, more control over ability and blinded enemy is better than wildly swinging one.

 

Now "kinda bad, but sometimes useful":

- Reckoning — radiation procs and blind is not SO reliable, but works till certain degree;

- Terrify — good to clear comm-tower area in interception or just "oh-S#&$-button";

- Tornado — can stall enemies and that's it.

 

It's obvious, that Tentacle Swarm falls in the last category — it's on par with Reckoning, Terrify and Tornado in terms on CC. And it's nowhere near "amazing".

 

And there goes a big problem: Hydroid have nothing to compensate mediocre CC. He got semi-useless 1st ability, which is not really a problem for a 1st ability. Tidal Surge would be good if it was 1st ability (like Slash Dash or Rhino Charge), but overall it's not the best. Undertow is extremely boring afk-ability.

 

So, Hydroid is bad. Really bad. I'd say he's the worst frame atm. Even Ember is better. Hek even Limbo is better.

Edited July 26, 2015 by AlienOvermind