_Fracture8 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) A quick heads up. Serious background knowledge of the available lore and codex entries required. Read at your own risk. Just a little connection I noticed while browsing through Teshin's wares. Apparently Teshin was present during the fall of the Orokin empire that supposedly occured by Tenno hands. This means he is one of a select few that knows the Tenno's true past; this must mean he has quite a story to tell us right? Well why hasn't he? Well, have you ever looked closely at the sigils that he offers? More specifically the names and order they come in than the actual pattern itself. When placed in order it tells a story of a revolt or liberation of sorts. A timeline of events if you will. 1) Awakening: The very first time that the Tenno's powers were "awoken" at the hands of the Orokin after being cast into the Void. This is the Tenno's creation as weapons for the Orokin and the first part in the timeline. And potentially the time in which Rhino's codex takes place. 2) Perception: The Tenno were told to fight the Sentients because they were "the bad guys" and since the Orokin created us they were our "masters". Tenno perception was skewed in order to become lethal killing machines. The second part in the Tenno chapter. 3) Awareness/Revelation: I believe this awareness title suggests that the Tenno's loyalty with the Orokin began to falter. There was something that the Orokin were doing that made the Tenno aware of their actions. It could've been anything from slavery, genetic testing (development of the highly dangerous infestation or experiments on fellow Tenno) to good ol fashioned galactic domination. The third part of the timeline. 4) Vigilence/Prudence: This is when the Tenno definitely realised something was wrong about the Orokin, wrong enough to warrant mutiny and the extermination of the entire Orokin race? Who knows. The fourth/fith part in the timeline. 5) Discretion: Now I believe from here on, this is when the events of Excaliburs detailed Codex entry takes place. By this point the Tenno could have been plotting vengeful/justice-like genocide behind the backs of the Orokin. The sixth part drawing the full betrayal of the Orokin empire. 6) Ambition: The execution of the Orokin emperors and the remaining forces. The Tenno had serious ambition to exterminate all traces of the Orokin empire. Most likely happened when Excal's Codex goes into grim details of the assassination during the Tenno ceremony; also the event which lead to Stalker's creation and his quest for vengeance of his own. The final part of the Orokin era and seventh chapter. 7) Volition/Freedom: With the Tenno's masters dead, they now had true freedom and the will to live life as they wanted. Why did the Tenno decide to spend the next few thousand years in a freezer? Noone knows. The beggining of the new era. Rise of the Grineer / Corpus. TL;DR (you lazy asses): Tenno's powers were "awoken" by the Orokin to be used as a weapon against the Sentients, Orokin skewed the perception of the Tenno's views to make them fight the Sentients, Tenno became aware of some negative stigma around the Orokin (unsure of what, probably development of the infested imo), Tenno then sought to sneakily betray the Orokin and gain true freedom from their very likely oppressive rule. All this can be seen from Teshin and the sigils he sells by the order and names of said sigils. Since he was present during the Orokin era he bore witness to the Orokin's demise and most likely knows our past. These sigils could be a clue as to what happened between the Tenno and Orokin. This order of names sums up what we already know that occured during the Orokin era and adequately fills in a number of blanks. The source practically makes sense since Teshin was around during the Orokin era, and with DE not wanting to reveal too much lore, this could be a subtle nod to the event thats occured so many years ago. EDIT: Just a quick spotting, The ranks in which the Sigils are seperated (Mistral, Whirlwind, Tempest) could symbolise the hatred/willingness to revolt that the Tenno had for the Orokin. Mistral = Barely nothing, maybe a grudge for turning them into freaks. (quiet storm) Whirlwind = Starting to pick up on some negative things about the Orokin, slight disdain and anger. (large storm) Tempest = full on justice-seeking, genocidal rampage. (storm cell sh*t right there) If theres any plot holes or other details that need explaining please let me know. I'm worried I've forgotten to mention something... Can't put my finger on it... EDIT2: (Thanks for the heads up) Edited March 23, 2015 by KilelrDrone492 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papatou15 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I like that... It's always fun to know more lore about all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HunterHog Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Good find. +1. Guess this is a way to tell a story. Fantastic OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinobi-kun Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 But I thought the Tenno were made and not because the Tenno needed help unlocking it.Good imagination, but things can always be something else unless DE actually gave us lore about what happened instead of what's going to happen or lore about that unrelated guy. Need Tomb of the Sentients nao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikodemos Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 This is an interesting theory indeed, haven't really thought of it that way. However, I don't really think the names of the sigils has much relevance to what us Tenno had done during the Orokin era, but are rather signals for your progress within the Conclave itself. But, the Occam's Razor way of thinking things was always a bit boring, so kudos to you for thinking about this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kantazo Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Good Read OP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Fracture8 Posted March 23, 2015 Author Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) But I thought the Tenno were made and not because the Tenno needed help unlocking it. Good imagination, but things can always be something else unless DE actually gave us lore about what happened instead of what's going to happen or lore about that unrelated guy. Need Tomb of the Sentients nao. There's many different theories as to how they were created, from what I've heard the general consensus is that they were people with the Technocyte virus thrown into the void by the Orokin. (Later to be used as the last hope against the Sentients) I don't expect everything in here to be correct, hell I would be surprised if anything in here that wasn't already confirmed was. Guess we'll just have to wait and see :) Edited March 23, 2015 by KilelrDrone492 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakshal Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Hm, interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vargras Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I love stuff like this, and it isn't the first time DE has snuck in little things to try and foreshadow future lore/gameplay. Remember Mag Prime's codex and Archwing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gale47 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) Just a heads-up, the Tenno were most certainly frozen for a much longer period of time than "a couple of years". We're talking thousands of Earth years here. Edited March 23, 2015 by Gale47 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthan Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Very interesting. Very interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morec0 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 It fits... makes me wonder against if Teshin is a Tenno... I'm still not completely clear on that. On one hand... me hoping, talk about him not going into cryopods with the Tenno... on the other hand, no direct confirmation, things that we seemingly aren't able t do as Tenno, him talking about himself like he's something other than a Tenno... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gale47 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 It fits... makes me wonder against if Teshin is a Tenno... I'm still not completely clear on that. On one hand... me hoping, talk about him not going into cryopods with the Tenno... on the other hand, no direct confirmation, things that we seemingly aren't able t do as Tenno, him talking about himself like he's something other than a Tenno... I'd say he's the same as Lotus... in a way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Fracture8 Posted March 23, 2015 Author Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) It fits... makes me wonder against if Teshin is a Tenno... I'm still not completely clear on that. On one hand... me hoping, talk about him not going into cryopods with the Tenno... on the other hand, no direct confirmation, things that we seemingly aren't able t do as Tenno, him talking about himself like he's something other than a Tenno... I think it's pretty much confirmed he isn't a Tenno. But I do reckon he has had close relations with them in the past. By the way he acts it's almost like he was trained by one, or at least an Orokin Warrior of equivalent status. Also several thousand years can work wonders for training with blades. The real question is how has he lived for so long? Edited March 23, 2015 by KilelrDrone492 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senketsu_ Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 The TL;DR is just as long as the OP :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morec0 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I'd say he's the same as Lotus... in a way. I think it's pretty much confirmed he isn't a Tenno. But I do reckon he has had close relations with them in the past. By the way he acts it's almost like he was trained by one, or at least an Orokin Warrior of equivalent status. Also several thousand years can work wonders for training with blades. The real question is how has he lived for so long? My favored theory (mostly because it was mine) is that he, Lotus, and Stalker were all a part of this earlier "Low Guardians" order (potentially it gained that name when it was replaced by the more-effective Tenno) that was a precursor to the Tenno through their use of the blade and gun, the "Old Ways" ("the Conclave", as Teshin reveals its real name to us), that, as technology became more and more advanced and effective, was eventually outmoded and had its size wither... UNTIL the Sentients came, but we all know what happened from there. POTENTIALLY this order may even have roots linking back to Hayden Tenno, but that idea's a few leaps short of the ledge - if you catch my drift. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senketsu_ Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Also just a quick thing. During one of the newer devstreams one of them sad that " teshin didn't go into cryosleep 'like' the other Tenno." Giving be reason to assume that Teshin was/is a Tenno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4ever4gotin Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 (edited) I think they've mentioned that Teshin was a tenno right? I vaugely remember they said something about him during one of the later PVP devstreams when they introduced semaris and teshin. I got to go check again, but in the mean time that is a pretty good read. Edited March 23, 2015 by 4ever4gotin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morec0 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 I think they've mentioned that Teshin was a tenno right? I vaugely remember they said something about him during one of the later PVP devstreams when they introduced semaris and teshin. I got to go check again, but in the mean time that is a pretty good read. I'm watching DevStream 47 right now looking for that. Not a word about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Achaix Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 It fits... makes me wonder against if Teshin is a Tenno... I'm still not completely clear on that. On one hand... me hoping, talk about him not going into cryopods with the Tenno... on the other hand, no direct confirmation, things that we seemingly aren't able t do as Tenno, him talking about himself like he's something other than a Tenno... Points in favour of Teshin = Tenno: - Clear connection to the Orokin Age - Older/Old as the Lotus - Fancy armour - TEshin, TEnno Points against Teshin = Tenno: - Does not wear any recognizable Warframe - Does not consider himself to be Tenno - Shows his (lower) face, much like the Lotus and many friendly NPCs do Based upon this information, I propose my theory: Teshin was formerly part of the Orokin Empire's military, and joined forces with the Tenno to oppose the Orokin regime. One thing that always called my attention was the fashion of hiding or covering one's eyes. Though it could simply be fashionable in the Warframe-verse, consider this: There are no Grineer or Corpus who follow that trend. Sure, Grineer usually lack an eye, but the other is always visible. Then you have those with helmets, but that hardly counts (as with the Corpus bucket-helms). I believe the act of covering eyes is a symbolic way of showing that you have secrets to keep. Teshin, the Lotus, and even the Syndicate leaders are examples of this... unlike the Grineer/Corpus, who know as much as we do about the Orokin Age (i.e.: Close to nothing). Teshin knows more, but isn't willing to share just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gale47 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Points in favour of Teshin = Tenno: - Clear connection to the Orokin Age - Older/Old as the Lotus - Fancy armour - TEshin, TEnno Points against Teshin = Tenno: - Does not wear any recognizable Warframe - Does not consider himself to be Tenno - Shows his (lower) face, much like the Lotus and many friendly NPCs do Based upon this information, I propose my theory: Teshin was formerly part of the Orokin Empire's military, and joined forces with the Tenno to oppose the Orokin regime. One thing that always called my attention was the fashion of hiding or covering one's eyes. Though it could simply be fashionable in the Warframe-verse, consider this: There are no Grineer or Corpus who follow that trend. Sure, Grineer usually lack an eye, but the other is always visible. Then you have those with helmets, but that hardly counts (as with the Corpus bucket-helms). I believe the act of covering eyes is a symbolic way of showing that you have secrets to keep. Teshin, the Lotus, and even the Syndicate leaders are examples of this... unlike the Grineer/Corpus, who know as much as we do about the Orokin Age (i.e.: Close to nothing). Teshin knows more, but isn't willing to share just yet. I agree with this post, nice one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morec0 Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 Points in favour of Teshin = Tenno: - Clear connection to the Orokin Age - Older/Old as the Lotus - Fancy armour - TEshin, TEnno Points against Teshin = Tenno: - Does not wear any recognizable Warframe - Does not consider himself to be Tenno - Shows his (lower) face, much like the Lotus and many friendly NPCs do Based upon this information, I propose my theory: Teshin was formerly part of the Orokin Empire's military, and joined forces with the Tenno to oppose the Orokin regime. One thing that always called my attention was the fashion of hiding or covering one's eyes. Though it could simply be fashionable in the Warframe-verse, consider this: There are no Grineer or Corpus who follow that trend. Sure, Grineer usually lack an eye, but the other is always visible. Then you have those with helmets, but that hardly counts (as with the Corpus bucket-helms). I believe the act of covering eyes is a symbolic way of showing that you have secrets to keep. Teshin, the Lotus, and even the Syndicate leaders are examples of this... unlike the Grineer/Corpus, who know as much as we do about the Orokin Age (i.e.: Close to nothing). Teshin knows more, but isn't willing to share just yet. Problem with your theory: he seems to regret the loss of the Orokin, but rather than blame us (ala Stalker) he blames the Lotus. Also, the name bit there, is a HORRIBLE point for being with them; and another point against him being Tenno is his talk about having "failed the Orokin" when that "new evil" (clearly Sentients) came, while we Tenno were victorious against them, and the fact he talks in the first place (a contentious point, but honestly it seems to be a fact). I'm with you that covering the eyes does indeed have something to do with the Orokin Era - the Lotus, Teshin, and New Loka lady all do it (note the Orokin items in the New Loka room) - and I think it MAY have something to do with the Low Guardians, but that's just guesswork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeranov Posted March 23, 2015 Share Posted March 23, 2015 This is a really interesting interpretation and I must admit it makes a lot of sense if you read the sigils this way. Heh... sneaky Steve still hiding stuff wherever he can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Climaxstriker Posted March 30, 2015 Share Posted March 30, 2015 I think the Orokin was an empire, not necessarily a race. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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