Proposed Starchart Changes [Megathread]

[SquirmyBurrito]

I only tolerate 2 game modes, interception and defense. From there, I only tolerate 2 of the four factions, Grineer and Infested. On top of that, I only play those on the highest (available on the current star chart) level ranges. And to make matters worse (for me), I only play with randoms. I do not mess around with pre-made groups as it usually comes with some degree of expectation regarding my performance and how social I am (if I decide I want to **** around with a Skana, that is my choice/if I decide I don't want to chat no one complains). I can't sit around waiting for Grineer Interceptions and Infested Defense missions to pop up just so I can play. This is without me even getting started on my preference regarding tilesets...

 

TL;DR- I haven't heard much regarding the coming changes, but I like none of what little I have heard.

[--.B.--HARDCOREDAVE-]

I hope you're not, but "You won't be able to pick what mission you want, whenever you want" sounds an awful lot like random missions. As does "elimination of freedom of choice" that Rebecca said in the post-devstream thread.

Warfarm will become WaRNG.

[(PSN)jwernecke]

How bout we wait and see what actually happens with the star chart before we start b*tching about it, okay?

This....a thousand times this...

[(XBOX)George Dooby]

After actually watching the video of them talking about it my mind has been changed and i think it could actually turn out good. The seemed to indicate rewards would be buffed a bit and some boss fight would be made more entertaining which i think a lot of people missed when they just went straight to complaining. Not to mention key crafting which was already brought up i think

Edited May 10, 2015 by (XB1)George Dooby

[Wurdyburd]

See DE? This, right here. You said "The R Word" and now some players think that they will only see mission type once they're already in game. And you've said nothing to disprove such. While his reaction is sort of stretching the plausibility of your change, it's this sort of fear you can squash easily via transparency.

 

While my argument is a little exaggerated, it's not exactly wrong. You say yourself that the use of the R word panics players, and with good reason. Any time that random number generation has been applied to this game, bad things have happened. 

Fighting Vay Hek when he came out, in an attempt to get a randomly dropping Hydroid, demanded hours of grinding for randomly dropping triangulator parts that came off randomly appearing enemies that were immune to randomly chosen element types.

Fighting Infested Alad in an attempt to get a randomly dropping Mesa still demands waiting for alerts dropping them to appear, randomly.

Farming for primes became progressively more of a nightmare the more items were added to a mission type that could only be accessed through grinding mission types for randomly dropping keys. 

 

And once the void goes boom, and prime parts are distributed across certain game modes, means that we'll now have to, likely:

>Grind to get the mission type we want so that we can

>Grind that mission to get resources we need, to

>Build keys to access certain mission types to

>Grind THOSE specific missions for prime parts that will

>Randomly drop

 

Currently it's a might bit similar to our current system, but it's adding another layer of rng on top of an already rng-laden system, that nobody is really, truly happy about. More rng won't fix that.

[Dragongodcarnage]

The concept of not being able to pick the mission type you're going into is frankly horrific. I cannot stand Interception unless I'm specifically looking for syndicate standing. I do not want to play Excavation at random, I need to bring Frost or another defensive frame to hold out for a reasonable amount of time. I don't want to go into a mission not knowing what's about to happen.

w

The whole point of having multiple frames with varying powersets is that we can alter our loadout according to what we're likely to face. If my hapless Loki finds himself in the middle of an Excavation, he's going to violently explode. Similarly, if my Ember gets dropped into a Survival on anything past Phobos, I'm probably going to have a bad time.

 

I've never played a game where you didn't have any opportunity at all to prepare for a mission's specific challenges. I'm not entirely sure I've even encountered one. There might be a reason for that.

this here is my thought too. given each frame has a different use and different power set why would you change the star map so that ends up being worthless in the end as a result of changing the star map

[Rodee7]

 

We do not know exactly what this proposal entails. I think I will enjoy the game more if I am encouraged to play on other maps. My hope if that resources and enemies are juggled as well as what missions are available to play. This would make it so if I am farming for a specific resource I won't be doing the same mission over and over.

I think it will be a positive step if resources and mods were not locked on a specific planet or tower level. Instead of farming being repetitive and monotonous it could have a little bit more variety. My worse fear is like everyone else's, I do not want more grind especially with the recent gold core nerf.

I am just going to keep an open mind and enjoy this game for as long as I can. I encourage everyone to try and do the same.

 

1+ OP im for this as well

I'm fine with randomizing the missions planets to keep the gameplay spontaneous.Heck I don't see many players on some of the Outer planets (with a few exceptions like Semini and Draco) like Pluto, Eris and Ceres.

 

But I think the resources on each particular planet can stay as it is. It just seems playing the same mission types repeatedly for parts,resources, etc. would be repetitive in my opinon.

 

Im more curious on how DE is going to implement the mission creator. Its its going to be something like  payday2?

 

 

• will you be able to adjust the levels for the enemies like (easy lvl 3-5 to hard lvl 38-40)
• Is there going to be a nightmare mode optional ?
• Based on the difficulty how are the  rewards going to be like?

Edited May 10, 2015 by Rodee7

[Ruby_Rose_]

FTFY

No, you're very mistaken.

 

I'm really not going to waste my time trying to explain it. Because you've already shown that you're incapable of understanding what I'm trying to say.

[Vargras]

*Sigh* If anyone else than Rebbeca played the game and understood why this make most players annoyed.

People need to stop saying this when it's 100% false.

 

The devs do play their own game. Please stop acting like they don't. It's stupid and short-sighted.

[Sziklamester]

I think that about this now better to wait what will happen but I hope they doesn't delete the old system permanently if their new not work well. The more rng makes the game more interesting because nobody can calcul what will happening and what stuff you get finaly in the end but the other point whit this if nobody can get what really wanted then dozens will left this ship because of the frustration.

 

I am sure DE won't fix things with the new star chart enough to just look around on the mod system or look at the warframe/weapon slots. They doesn't like variation and they always use bandaid on bad systems and they called their fault as a powercreep then they again recreate that power creep with other ways then the work begin again.

 

I played their latest games also and Clearly they doesn't learn their faults and recreate always the same problems so maybe they need to freshing up their team with new faces.

 

I don't want complain and blaming I just said an opinion and a fact which is true from a 2-3 years ago. There is a lot to do and now they touching a system which not the best but not the worst in this game instead of make those missions more interesting they remove again a variation. With that sentence : "The random will do it better than me"

 

Yes the random will do better than them but at least they can say they aren't control the events and they will sit and watch the show.

[Lordofgore]

Weekly rotation of 20 missions hopefully each one slightly different but I feel they are undoing a lot that they spent so much time on I'd hate to be the ui team who worked tirelessly on the newer star chart just to have it smashed I feel like this will also be a detriment to the new player experience. I personally think that condensing the player base this much will put a pressure on the player base. I hope the "20" will exclude dark sectors and PvP nodes .

To put to short what the ops point is : We deserve details of this new system and the exact metrics and algorithms it works by.

Members of the player base don't like X mission type but maybe that's the only place to get orkin cells that week besides crafted missions. And what of nightmares and syndicate missions I truly hope they give us clearer answers next stream or Dev workshop post.

[(PSN)alonenova1]

the reason why were are here too many nodes not played and overkill on some planets is a consequence of the missions not giving player appropriate rewards.  there is absolutely no reason to play them once your past being new or you got the  warframe in the region.     even when your new its better to stay on lares and apollodorus than do anything else.  

 

endless mission which are far Superior "except for void missions of non endless"  because we get rare resources or lots or a resource more  xp for leveling and forma ing stuff , void keys and cores lastly enjoyment of taking down lv 150 + heavy gunners in a well coordinated teams is fun,  

 

I think we should get a  reworking of the rewards similar to spy 2.0 and having only 1 of every type in each region maybe omit a few mission types  in starter planets.

20 is really low.

[Psychus]

How about we don't stay passive when a system could ruin our freaking experience is right at our door? I don't know about you but prevention is always better than damage control.

How about we not overreact like we seem to do every time something different comes to warframe? What you fail to realize is that literally everything that's been a cancer to the game (such as e-gate, viver, and now draco) have been defended to the grave by at least half of the forum goers. This is one of many ways this could have been done. And what you also fail to ask yourself is this. Why do it this way? Do they hate their players? The obvious answer to this question is no. So then what? They're doing this for a reason. Once you figure that reason out, you'll then realize that this change definitely isn't going to "ruin your experience" Unless your experience was sitting at your computer pressing one button until  reward screen popped up. Then yeah, that might be ruined a bit.

[reedknoll]

I don't think people really understand the gravity of this.

Your mission type will be randomized. That means that you can hop into a mission, and be RANDOMLY given one of 14 or so game types, ranging from Defense, to Spy, to Interception.

Here's an example: you're a Loki, prepped out for stealth gameplay, silenced weapons, long-duration invisibility, solo-running.

Surprise! You're playing Interception. Quick, roll the dice, on a scale of 1-10 how screwed are you?

If you're not a min-maxer or an experienced player? Answer is probably very.

Inversely, let's say you have a squad outfitted for a long-haul Defense, when you're given a Spy instead. None of you have silenced weapons, but that doesn't matter because you can all roflstomp your way through the delicate layout that is a spy map and cipher it to oblivion and back.

[inb4 void destruction]?

If this happens i will only use 1 jack of all trades frame/weapon. No more diversity or specialization. No more fun

Edit spelling

Edited May 10, 2015 by reedknoll

[Dawn11715]

But what if it will be like Syndicat missions?

RanDom Missions but with mostly guarantied rewards.

in the Moment we have no idea how fair this thing will be.

If all Missions pop up random, but we get to KNOW the rewards (spsomething they mentioned would happen) then the game would actually feel more rewarding because you wouldnt play ten survicels to minute 15 to get the key you want.

You play one when it pops up, and dont feel like your wasting time anymore.

ALso we would be encouraged to play all the mission types instead of tje two that match our compfort zone.

[Yastin]

How about we not overreact like we seem to do every time something different comes to warframe? What you fail to realize is that literally everything that's been a cancer to the game (such as e-gate, viver, and now draco) have been defended to the grave by at least half of the forum goers. This is one of many ways this could have been done. And what you also fail to ask yourself is this. Why do it this way? Do they hate their players? The obvious answer to this question is no. So then what? They're doing this for a reason. Once you figure that reason out, you'll then realize that this change definitely isn't going to "ruin your experience" Unless your experience was sitting at your computer pressing one button until  reward screen popped up. Then yeah, that might be ruined a bit.

 

They've said themselves that they expect vets to hate the new system to start with, and people to go crazy on the forums.

 

In other words... Due to what they have openly stated, they have given reason to be worried. They have given -only- reason to be worried. I am not going to doom-say. If it's bad, it's bad. If it's good, it's good. That's when we break out the "I'm leaving" shtick, if necessary.

 

I would appreciate an official and transparent post explaining the system. Perhaps some ideas. A poll in the Founders area. Anything to give us reasons -not- to be worried.

 

The best way to fight fear is head on. And they will spare many goats, if they are a merciful pantheon.

[Evanescent]

We need more detail and information besides a list. I need to see concepts and discussions from the developers on this. I'm not sure whether we are getting the entire scope of it, or if we're just scorning and condemning with the possibility that it might be positive change before it even ships out.

^THIS.

THIS.

 

READ THIS PEOPLE, READ.

 

[Ashnal]

I don't think people really understand the gravity of this.

Your mission type will be randomized. That means that you can hop into a mission, and be RANDOMLY given one of 14 or so game types, ranging from Defense, to Spy, to Interception.

 

Here's an example: you're a Loki, prepped out for stealth gameplay, silenced weapons, long-duration invisibility, solo-running.

Surprise! You're playing Interception. Quick, roll the dice, on a scale of 1-10 how screwed are you?

If you're not a min-maxer or an experienced player? Answer is probably very.

Inversely, let's say you have a squad outfitted for a long-haul Defense, when you're given a Spy instead. None of you have silenced weapons, but that doesn't matter because you can all roflstomp your way through the delicate layout that is a spy map and cipher it to oblivion and back.

 

What about players who haven't plat'd out their inventory slots, and are limited in their options? What about certain builds for specific map types? What'll happen to grinding for certain resources, or void keys [inb4 void destruction]?

I don't think that's what is going to happen.

 

I don't think they're that clueless to give us the inability to prepare for missions.

 

My take on what they've said is that they're going to shuffle rewards around, attaching different mission types to rewards on some kind of cycle. Kind of like how Syndicate missions work. You would still be able to prepare for the mission and see the type, but the rewards you get may vary every so often. This way you see variety in what you play, even though you're always looking for that one part, mod or resource.

 

I think what they're trying to accomplish is to give players who are always farming the same nodes and missions over and over more variety of play to prevent burnout. As well as bring the community together for better matchmaking. So for instance, one day you might kill Raptor for Neural Sensors, but the next it might be the Hyena pack awarding them.

Edited May 10, 2015 by Ashnal

[Psychus]

They've said themselves that they expect vets to hate the new system to start with, and people to go crazy on the forums.

 

In other words... Due to what they have openly stated, they have given reason to be worried. They have given -only- reason to be worried. I am not going to doom-say. If it's bad, it's bad. If it's good, it's good. That's when we break out the "I'm leaving" shtick, if necessary.

 

I would appreciate an official and transparent post explaining the system. Perhaps some ideas. A poll in the Founders area. Anything to give us reasons -not- to be worried.

 

The best way to fight fear is head on. And they will spare many goats, if they are a merciful pantheon.

Well, of course we're going to hate it. We sit our dumb asses on draco pretty much every day and do nothing but press a combination of buttons 1-4.  If that's our normalcy in warframe, yeah lots of people are gonna be pissed. Does that make this a bad thing? Hell no. I agree, things need to be explained through and through, but you have to remember. They're probably not even done with it themselves, and still working on ways to make this feasable. Asking players what they want out of a game is fine, but there is a line that has to be drawn, Just look at nova. They regret that, yes, but it was the community's fault. We asked for an OP piece of S#&$, and we got it. 

All I'm saying is that we as players are stupid. Very, very stupid. We want easy. We want efficiency. And if we focus on those two things we have the current system of press 4 to win on map that gives us the most bang for our buck. 

[Yastin]

Well, of course we're going to hate it. We sit our dumb asses on draco pretty much every day and do nothing but press a combination of buttons 1-4.  If that's our normalcy in warframe, yeah lots of people are gonna be &!$$ed. Does that make this a bad thing? Hell no. I agree, things need to be explained through and through, but you have to remember. They're probably not even done with it themselves, and still working on ways to make this feasable. Asking players what they want out of a game is fine, but there is a line that has to be drawn, Just look at nova. They regret that, yes, but it was the community's fault. We asked for an OP piece of S#&$, and we got it. 

All I'm saying is that we as players are stupid. Very, very stupid. We want easy. We want efficiency. And if we focus on those two things we have the current system of press 4 to win on map that gives us the most bang for our buck. 

 

This is true. I assume... I have never farmed Draco but I know the grind of ages all too well. As a massive glob of hate, players cannot be trusted to come up with a good system. But we don't need to. The worst part of all this starchart nonsense, for me, is that we simply -don't- know.

 

Will there be immediate ways to farm important things?

 

Will resources dropped be based on node? Tileset? Enemies?

 

Will nodes be all one for each gametype, and only tilesets randomized?

 

There are many unknowns. But DE has said scary words at us. And the scary words are the only knowns, understand?

 

I would rather a flood of well-informed objections than a storm of misinformed blasphemy. So would the good RNGesus. Probably... You can't ever tell, for sure.

[Psychus]

This is true. I assume... I have never farmed Draco but I know the grind of ages all too well. As a massive glob of hate, players cannot be trusted to come up with a good system. But we don't need to. The worst part of all this starchart nonsense, for me, is that we simply -don't- know.

 

Will there be immediate ways to farm important things?

 

Will resources dropped be based on node? Tileset? Enemies?

 

Will nodes be all one for each gametype, and only tilesets randomized?

 

There are many unknowns. But DE has said scary words at us. And the scary words are the only knowns, understand?

 

I would rather a flood of well-informed objections than a storm of misinformed blasphemy. So would the good RNGesus. Probably... You can't ever tell, for sure.Yeah 

Yeah well, such is the way of warframe. The livestreams are just as much theory as they are fact half the time. I've just been here for a while so I trust them to do what needs to be done so that warframe can continue improving. As of now there aren't a lot of facts beside what they talked about on stream, and the summary thereafter. I completely understand, F***, I'm scared too. I don't want my choice taken away. But unlike most other people, frothing at the mouth and overreacting, I'm simply saying wait. Update 17 is quite a ways away.

[Vargras]

They've said themselves that they expect vets to hate the new system to start with, and people to go crazy on the forums.

 

In other words... Due to what they have openly stated, they have given reason to be worried. They have given -only- reason to be worried. I am not going to doom-say. If it's bad, it's bad. If it's good, it's good. That's when we break out the "I'm leaving" shtick, if necessary.

You know what happens after every single patch and whenever there's a major change?

 

Vets hate it and people go crazy on the forums. Happened with the new UI. Happened with Melee 2.0. Happened with the new star chart. Happened with Dark Sectors.

 

Them saying that isn't really a reason to be worried. If anything, it's the norm. People hate change, period.

[Yastin]

Yeah well, such is the way of warframe. The livestreams are just as much theory as they are fact half the time. I've just been here for a while so I trust them to do what needs to be done so that warframe can continue improving. As of now there aren't a lot of facts beside what they talked about on stream, and the summary thereafter. I completely understand, F***, I'm scared too. I don't want my choice taken away. But unlike most other people, frothing at the mouth and overreacting, I'm simply saying wait. Update 17 is quite a ways away.

 

All the more reason to request transparency now, I say. If this is the calm before the storm, imagine how an uninformed community will respond if we're given little/nothing more as the update rolls out. I can imagine it... Like unhype threads... Doomsayers and folks saying they'll quit if red-text takes their speckle-map. DE, I'm sure, will try their best... But sometimes you need to cave a little. Compromise, even. Give the community some info here. They'll *@##$ and moan and be horrible, but then at least it will be for good reason. Scared investors lead to depressions. Scared customers lead to lost profits. Scared goats... Well, they're lead to fires. And lead to a pleased RNGesus.

[Vargras]

All the more reason to request transparency now, I say. If this is the calm before the storm, imagine how an uninformed community will respond if we're given little/nothing more as the update rolls out. I can imagine it... Like unhype threads... Doomsayers and folks saying they'll quit if red-text takes their speckle-map. DE, I'm sure, will try their best... But sometimes you need to cave a little. Compromise, even. Give the community some info here. They'll $#*(@ and moan and be horrible, but then at least it will be for good reason. Scared investors lead to depressions. Scared customers lead to lost profits. Scared goats... Well, they're lead to fires. And lead to a pleased RNGesus.

They'll give more info when they're ready. Much of it is still in the planning phase, and it's really obvious that such is the case based upon their phrasing when asked about it.

 

Everyone needs to just chill and wait. Seriously. It's pointless getting worked up over things when we know nothing about it.

[(PSN)witex25]

I didn't see nothing on this to not be worry about. They planning a big changes, huge easly can be said as the biggest after damage 2.0. At the same time they said the worst word possible, the "R" word. We all don't want to hear that but we did...unfortunately! We all know they also making last times a lot of horrible decizions witch in long terms can be easily concerned as good for them not us.

They making this game for us, we spend ouer time on it and ouer money. Because of us they still prospering and doing better and better. They doing devsstreams, making new posts here and always trying to show us that they care about ouers opinion. But unfortunately last times at least in my eyes they don't care at all what we have to say. They should explain at least a little bit mors about this "20 randoms" because now it sound mord like THE END OF OLD GOOD WARFRAME than the year of quality ( wich for me is the yaer of disasters more like)