Nerf/remove Greedy Pull Please (With Ideas)

[SickoSike]

the root of camping is actually the mission type, survival or defense, of course you will be force to camp unless DE put up a new defense mission that would move from one place to another... plus Mag gpull is a utility mod that helps the team overall performance, unless you hate mag because you are one of those people who move around a lot, away from your team and mag is stealing your loot and you have to walk back to her to get your share :))

Not necessarily, you can set up camp spots easily in excavation missions given you find the right tiles to exploit spawn rates and camp there as well.

E gate is not the only map that's exploitable.

Edit: Also Draco the infamous spot for all farming atm and it's an interception mission, what we all must notice here is that the game mechanic is broken, not the mission types.

Edited June 10, 2015 by mikecliffs

[Onisa]

Not necessarily, you can set up camp spots easily in excavation missions given you find the right tiles to exploit spawn rates and camp there as well.

E gate is not the only map that's exploitable.

Edit: Also Draco the infamous spot for all farming atm and it's an interception mission, what we all must notice here is that the game mechanic is broken, not the mission types.

I'd like to point out that Draco is a defense map that's been reused. As was Viver. That's above and beyond both Excavation and Interception including enough elements of Defense and Survival to promote the same behaviors though.

[SickoSike]

Lot's of maps has been re-used for specific mission types, I'm not seeing your point exactly...many of the maps that are made available by a specific game mode promotes a tile set that's shown to be exploitable is not always behind a characteristic design of survival and defense missions. Are you going to tell me that E gate and other dark sector maps along with other excavation maps and or interception maps were both EXACT copies of survival and defense missions? Had it been the case with the new content they released, with the old maps they reused..everything would be rather the same, but it's not. The spawns are quite different on how it works for a Survival base mode, an Interception base mode and a Defense base mode and largely unique with Excavations, we're not talking about maps that has been re-used or not for a specific mission. The interaction between the AI and the Players themselves trigger the spawn based on a specific behavior on how we interact with the game. Those modes do not promote the same behavior, if they did there wouldn't be strategic ways for farming a specific mission exactly if we're able to exactly manipulate the same mission nodes, but different type of game modes map.

Edit: Just to give you a clear point of example with how spawning in this game works.

The more people you have on your team, the more the system will spawn and increase difficulty based on the number of players in your squad.

1. Survival based maps- Trigger spawn by solving cipher, Trigger spawn away from you at a specific distance as you kill a wave of mobs and or looting an area where enemies can detect you.
2. Defense based maps- Trigger spawn by touching way point to protecting Cryopods or Ancient orokin artifacts. Trigger spawns by a preset amount of enemies that are mean't to spawn and adds more as each wave gets cleaned up by solo, or team.
3. Capture based mission- Trigger spawns right when you appear on map, trigger spawn when you take down targets, trigger the spawns when you head towards extraction, (spawns also triggered when enemies alert others that tenno is in their location.)
4. Mobile Defense base mission- Triggers spawn when you are spawned, spawns are also triggered when you add the data mass base for lotus or old dark sector mission battles, spawns are triggered when you head for extraction.
5.Deception base mission- Spawns enemies when you arrive, enemies spawn time to time in minimal amounts as you travel along the map, as soon as you put in data mass enemies spawn in hordes as you make your way to extraction. (enemies also spawn by alarms)
6.Sabotage-Enemies appear right when you do, as soon as you sabotage grineer or corpus, more enemie spawn along the way when you make to extraction.(enemies spawn more by alarms)
7.Spy base missions- Spawns enemies when you arrive, spawns enemies right when an enemy is alerted, if you trigger the alarms system while trying to steal and get received data enemies spawn, they also spawn when you head to extraction.
8.Extermination- Enemies spawn a preset amount, depending on which enemy type spawns, some can release extra spawns and add numbers towards that preset amount of kills you need to do to finish the game.
9. Interception- Triggers spawn when you capture Alpha, Bravo, Charlie or Delta, enemies don't stop spawning till the 100% mark of the message gets distributed to lotus, or the enemy,
10.Rescue- Trigger spawn right when you appear, wardens spawn- enemies are spawned when you interact with the game by saving the VIP target and spawns until extraction.
11.Excavations- Triggers spawn right when you start game mode, Enemies are spawned when you collect or pick up power cells/until Extraction.

anyways all these missions have a way of being triggered by a specific interactions with the game, there are a total of 18 specific mission types that I won't go over, specifically because I'm trying to let you know that these maps are almost all the same yet unique on different set of tiles with the way how the game works, based on Survival and Defense maps.

TLDR Version: Many types of maps show a large similarities with  how survival maps and defense missions function, but they work entirely in a different matter with how we communicate with the game itself.

Edited June 10, 2015 by mikecliffs

[Onisa]

Lot's of maps has been re-used for specific mission types, I'm not seeing your point exactly...many of the maps that are made available by a specific game mode promotes a tile set that's shown to be exploitable is not always behind a characteristic design of survival and defense missions. Are you going to tell me that E gate and other dark sector maps along with other excavation maps and or interception maps were both EXACT copies of survival and defense missions? Had it been the case with the new content they released, with the old maps they reused..everything would be rather the same, but it's not. The spawns are quite different on how it works for a Survival base mode, an Interception base mode and a Defense base mode and largely unique with Excavations, we're not talking about maps that has been re-used or not for a specific mission. The interaction between the AI and the Players themselves trigger the spawn based on a specific behavior on how we interact with the game. Those modes do not promote the same behavior, if they did there wouldn't be strategic ways for farming a specific mission exactly if we're able to exactly manipulate the same mission nodes, but different type of game modes map.

Small to medium small play area with lots of nooks out of LOS and no real need to travel. That was my point.

Last time I checked that was what was required for things to spawn, the player not observing the spawn point. So if there's lots of places to spawn unobserved and and the game says there should be X mobs running about at any given time it's going to spawn them to replace what has been removed.

 

As far as overlapping elements, I was referring to what you do in said missions.

You protect a position for as long as you are able.

You collect a resource that extends the mission for as long as you are able.

You protect 3-4 positions for as long as you are able.

You protect a point, while gathering a resource- I'm willing to bet you know where I'm going with this.

 

All of them except survival have some stationary behavior printed on the tin. With the proper tile and setup survival can be just as stationary as a defense mission.

[SickoSike]

Small to medium small play area with lots of nooks out of LOS and no real need to travel. That was my point.

Last time I checked that was what was required for things to spawn, the player not observing the spawn point. So if there's lots of places to spawn unobserved and and the game says there should be X mobs running about at any given time it's going to spawn them to replace what has been removed.

 

As far as overlapping elements, I was referring to what you do in said missions.

You protect a position for as long as you are able.

You collect a resource that extends the mission for as long as you are able.

You protect 3-4 positions for as long as you are able.

You protect a point, while gathering a resource- I'm willing to bet you know where I'm going with this.

 

All of them except survival have some stationary behavior printed on the tin. With the proper tile and setup survival can be just as stationary as a defense mission.

Yea, I get what you mean and I totally agree with you're saying right now, because that's how the game is basically structured at the moment, but with different set of interactions that all cycles down to one point, about the game mechanics being broken, I really hope DE can read this, and keep this into their heart and be able to somehow fix this game for us, because right now I'm feeling this game isn't heading towards the right direction with a faulty mechanic like this that's been going on for too long now.

[climatiseur]

-.- I've said many times. If you want to nerf it in loot camp, just make it not pulling loots, but NOT the health and energy orbs.

 

You are suggesting it reversely.

 

Health and Energy orbs enhance Mag's survivability, while loots are only bonus, give no real benefit to Mag in the battlefield.

 

The loots are also the main point people taking her into loot camping groups, NOT the orbs.

 

Thus, If you ever wanna do anything on it (Which I fundamentally disagree as it is not the true issue anyway,), you should suggest it NOT PULLING THE LOOTS, but NOT the orbs.

[SickoSike]

Okay, so supposedly let's go with your idea, we now have a team for Draco and lets put it into play Mesa/Frost/Gmag/Nekros with a Nerfed greedy pull mod that only pulls in health/energy orbs.

Mesa distributes clear time and clear's one wave of interception, now Mesa doesn't clear the last unit, instead leaves the grineer alive, Everyone runs around picking up loot in a maximum of supposedly 20 seconds, and btw while Mesa clears Frost will spam globes everywhere on map so people can actively collect loot in a safe matter while mesa clears. After looting everything, kill the last unit, head back to the same Camping spot.

What does that change exactly? If I replace Gmag withTrinity it would be the same exact thing... It makes no difference to nerf what you're suggesting and in the end the element of the pure gameplay that is right now being exploited is by taking advantage of the game mechanics, not how warframe works.

[ThePresident777]

A long time ago, the Survival spawner was nerfed to make survival into just another camping mission.  The enemy spawn as long as the team are in the same room.  That's the reason why people experience problems when the team separates in Survival.  Nerfing Greedy pull will not change that.  So, running out of ammo because of Greedy Pull is besides the point when being in a different rooms means running out of enemies.

[fatpig84]

Or make G pull affected by LOS like... Mag's Pull ?

You can still get orbs but you might have to run around a bit more.

And of course loot in the draco basement won't be pickable hurr.

 

So yeah, no need to smash a hammer on something.

 

 

Also with really well made trinity builds, they can fill up the 425 energy pool on Prime Flow fitted Mesa really quickly.

So no issues at all other than mesa needed a refill every min or so (which involves pressing 4, wait for 10 seconds and she is done....)

Edited June 11, 2015 by fatpig84

[bubbabenali]

I came to the point to realise to not waste any affort of playing the game if there is a sh***y pull Mag in a public defense mission; just move a bit arround to not trigger the afk detector and browse the net on the 2. Monitor.

 

Cut the reach by half or nullify the damage of Pull with this mod active but do something.

 

It's just a f'n boring waste of time whatching one guy using autohotkey with his precious Mag Prime.

Or how about not counting the quitrate when a Mag was on the team.

[HandsomeSorcerer]

I came to the point to realise to not waste any affort of playing the game if there is a sh***y pull Mag in a public defense mission; just move a bit arround to not trigger the afk detector and browse the net on the 2. Monitor.

 

Cut the reach by half or nullify the damage of Pull with this mod active but do something.

 

It's just a f'n boring waste of time whatching one guy using autohotkey with his precious Mag Prime.

Or how about not counting the quitrate when a Mag was on the team.

Its a bigger boring waste fkn time running around like a headless chicken every wave in defense or interception. Without gmag, I most of the time dont bother collecting all of the loot.

[(PSN)Bob_Dole478]

Greedy pull is fine as-is. 

[Ironlixivium]

Greedy pull is fine as-is. 

 

git wit' da times, man.

 

By this I mean check my more recent posts in this thread.

[-SLX-J3tAc3]

 

 

 

That video is from closed beta, U6, posted 02/16/2013. 

is from 02/08/2013, and nukes had already been in the game before that.  Components  of 4 Tenno Devastate Massive Army had already been in the game long before, featured in even earlier Warframe promotional videos on youtube, as well as disinterest in typical gaming conventions.  In open beta, DE started to make good on 4 Tenno Devastate Massive Army.  It's not unusual for development to take time.

 

There absolutely are nerfers and buffers.  There are tons of new threads on a daily basis to show this.  None of them giving a damn about other people's fun.  All of them wanting the game to suit their narrow interests in their entirety.  It's very rare for someone to request a scenario to suit a particular preference, virtually unheard of.  Instead, narrow views are prevalent.

 

This thread is yet another example of such.  The fact is that camping has existed in Warframe since Defense in March 2013, maybe earlier.  Getting rid of Greedy Pull isn't going to get rid of camping.  The only thing that will get rid of camping is missions with goals that move, and room to move in, and spawners that do not shut down when the team occupies more than one room (like it does in Survival now), and rewards as good as what one finds in camping.  As long as missions like Defense exist, especially in tiny maps like the one at Varro and Draco, there will be campers camping.  But, how does their camping ruin the game for people who do not want to camp?  It doesn't.  What ruins the game for people who do not want to camp is the best rewards being available only in camping missions.

 

Artillery doesn't destroy a Massive Army with one shell.  And, in warframe, it is not the case that 4 Tenno Devastate Massive Army with one press of the number 4, even if it had a 50 meter radius because Massive Armies take up space, and time, obviously.

 

There is more than one balance point.  Each one makes the game play faster or slower than the next balance point.  Nerfers are constantly attacking the "OP" stuff, the stuff that makes the game play fast, the stuff that other people enjoy.  Nerfing for balance is facitious.  It's propaganda.

And I wish they'd shut the [sneeze] up. What part of Space Ninja do you guys not understand? You want Dark Souls or some other weaksauce? Go there, this is not the game for you - the designers are not aiming for unnatural slow and weak crap and your opinions are not the end-all, be-all.

[Ironlixivium]

 

 

 

 

And I wish they'd shut the [sneeze] up. What part of Space Ninja do you guys not understand? You want Dark Souls or some other weaksauce? Go there, this is not the game for you - the designers are not aiming for unnatural slow and weak crap and your opinions are not the end-all, be-all.

 

 

     Eh, I sorta abandoned this thread, but I just wanted to point out the faulty logic here; greedy pull has absolutely nothing to do with the pace of the gameplay, in fact in most cases it slows it down for everyone ho doesn't want to camp. I'm sorry that '777 sees me as a "nerfer" but I have no idea how to break it to him that they don't exist. The only kinds of people on these forums are trolls, people who voice their opinions, and people who reply to others' opinions. 

 

     I assure you that I'm not a troll, Nor am I trying to slow down the gameplay, I just thought it would be better without that farming crap, but it occurred to me that this is a much bigger problem than greedy pull. We need to remove farming from this game entirely, I'll give you the same reason you gave me: "What part of Space Ninja don't you guys understand?". I'm not trying to mock you or anything but think about it; when you play a game about space ninjas, you want to be assassinating VIPs, raiding facilities, cutting down armies at a time like it's nothing. I don't know about you, but when I play a game about space ninjas, farming is the LAST thing I want to do. Yet it's a big part of warframe. If you disagree, and think warframe should keep its farms............

 

   I'm disappointing in you, if that's the case. Go play WoW or something. 

 

     I play warframe to be a space ninja, if I wanted to farm, I'd play farming simulator.

[Onisa]

     Eh, I sorta abandoned this thread, but I just wanted to point out the faulty logic here; greedy pull has absolutely nothing to do with the pace of the gameplay, in fact in most cases it slows it down for everyone ho doesn't want to camp. I'm sorry that '777 sees me as a "nerfer" but I have no idea how to break it to him that they don't exist. The only kinds of people on these forums are trolls, people who voice their opinions, and people who reply to others' opinions. 

 

     I assure you that I'm not a troll, Nor am I trying to slow down the gameplay, I just thought it would be better without that farming crap, but it occurred to me that this is a much bigger problem than greedy pull. We need to remove farming from this game entirely, I'll give you the same reason you gave me: "What part of Space Ninja don't you guys understand?". I'm not trying to mock you or anything but think about it; when you play a game about space ninjas, you want to be assassinating VIPs, raiding facilities, cutting down armies at a time like it's nothing. I don't know about you, but when I play a game about space ninjas, farming is the LAST thing I want to do. Yet it's a big part of warframe. If you disagree, and think warframe should keep its farms............

 

   I'm disappointing in you, if that's the case. Go play WoW or something. 

 

     I play warframe to be a space ninja, if I wanted to farm, I'd play farming simulator.

You know, I could turn around and say there are only three types of people as well: those that want to tear down the overpowered stuff, those that want to build up the underpowered stuff, and those who want both ends to meet in the middle. Your thread title and opening arguments defiantly fell into one of those categories, and that's why you earned a label.

 

The only difference between farming and what you're describing as appropriate ninja activities is repetition though. People tend to play something until they get what they want, it's only when the fun is leached out of the activity that the label farming is applied.

 

It's a real pity most people don't have that kind of self control though, and things get mixed up and muddied until nothing is recognizable as what it is/was.

[ThePresident777]

I hate camping too.  But getting rid of camping is not going to make a difference to non-campers because camps do not take up physical space.  What makes a difference to non-campers is non-camping rewards being at least as good as the camping rewards.

[vaugahn]

You know, I could turn around and say there are only three types of people as well: those that want to tear down the overpowered stuff, those that want to build up the underpowered stuff, and those who want both ends to meet in the middle. Your thread title and opening arguments defiantly fell into one of those categories, and that's why you earned a label.

 

People who want things to meet in the middle also fall into those other two categories on a case by case basis, so that starts to get a little confusing. 

 

We should all know by now that trying to categorize people gets us nowhere, especially when those categories are pretty much always used as a personal attack. 

Edited June 20, 2015 by vaugahn

[Onisa]

People who want things to meet in the middle also fall into those other two categories on a case by case basis, so that starts to get a little confusing. 

 

We should all know by now that trying to categorize people gets us nowhere, especially when those categories are pretty much always used as a personal attack. 

Eh, it's as accurate as Ironlixivium's generalization and served as an explanation as to why someone would refer to them as a nerfer. If OP still doesn't believe 'nerfers' are a thing or even how someone could be labeled as such then I don't know how to phrase it to get the point across.

[TheBrsrkr]

It's the thread that just won't die!

[Ironlixivium]

You know, I could turn around and say there are only three types of people as well: those that want to tear down the overpowered stuff, those that want to build up the underpowered stuff, and those who want both ends to meet in the middle. Your thread title and opening arguments defiantly fell into one of those categories, and that's why you earned a label.

 

The only difference between farming and what you're describing as appropriate ninja activities is repetition though. People tend to play something until they get what they want, it's only when the fun is leached out of the activity that the label farming is applied.

 

It's a real pity most people don't have that kind of self control though, and things get mixed up and muddied until nothing is recognizable as what it is/was.

 

      The problem with that though is I don't fall into any of those catagories. I want things buffed, and other things nerfed, and I don't always want stuff to meet in the middle either. My categories fit everyone. The only kind of person left out are the ones that don't voice their opinion...but they don't show up in these forums for that exact reason. XD

 

Then remove the repetition o.0 add some twists, idc. Seems to me that the new star chart will fix most of our grind issues though.

 

I hate camping too.  But getting rid of camping is not going to make a difference to non-campers because camps do not take up physical space.  What makes a difference to non-campers is non-camping rewards being at least as good as the camping rewards.

 

     I agree. I just think that farming shouldn't be the best solution. It's a huge shame that it is.

 

People who want things to meet in the middle also fall into those other two categories on a case by case basis, so that starts to get a little confusing. 

 

We should all know by now that trying to categorize people gets us nowhere, especially when those categories are pretty much always used as a personal attack. 

 

     My catagories couldn't possibly be used as an attack without making yourself look dumb though :/ I was just pointing out that People voice their opinions, just as there are no real life villains dedicated to evil, there are no "nerfers". One nerf post makes me a nerfer? So if I do one thing that someone sees as evil, I'm a villain? People do what they think is right, or are too lazy to. Nazis weren't evil, they did what they thought was right, the rest of the world strongly disagrees, but that doesn't make them evil. don't read too far into that analogy please, just trying to make a point.

 

Eh, it's as accurate as Ironlixivium's generalization and served as an explanation as to why someone would refer to them as a nerfer. If OP still doesn't believe 'nerfers' are a thing or even how someone could be labeled as such then I don't know how to phrase it to get the point across.

 

     Except not :/ I don't fit into any of those categories as squarely as you fit into the category of voicing your opinion. Something you're doing right now. That or you're trolling, but only you know that, lol.

 

     Sure, you could label me as a nerfer, but did you take the time to notice I have multiple "buff limbo" posts? How accurate could the label be if it's 90% wrong?

 

 

It's the thread that just won't die!

 

lol, ikr

[(PSN)zero1872001]

     It's causing massive spam-camping problems, allowing people to using channeling abilities longer than the afk timer. It's kinda breaking the game. :/

 

     If you don't want to remove it, then please make location-locked channeling abilities disable energy pickups, or better yet make greedy pull client side only after all it IS called "greedy pull" not "team energy restore pull"

 

Clarification:

Just to clarify, I have no real issue with camping, it's spam-camping that's the problem.

Camping is where you fortify yourselves at the pod.

Spam camping is where you press one or two buttons while you pretend you're playing the game :/

 

Other Clarification:

     The reason gmag should be nerfed, and not every support ever, like you sarcastic commentators tend to suggest, is that gmag allows for insane amounts of mindless spamming. Nekros, Trin, Hydroid, and all the other support frames do not. Extra loot? you still have to go pick it up, so it's not comparable. Trinity doesn't work on channeling abilities, so she's not a gmag replacement either.

 

     Please, I'm not attacking a random spam-camp enabler, I'm attempting to fix the biggest spam-camp enabler.

 

Others' Ideas:

 

• Make GP not pull energy orbs

 

 

Edit: clarified stuff....again....

 

 

 

Sounds like someone not getting into farming parties.

 

But as many have said here, dont like playing with a gp mag, dont.

I hate having to run stupid bosses for a 3% chance to get a piece of gallium. love my hydroid farming now.

 

It doesnt effect your gameplay. dont like playing with em, dont. aww. it effects a 60 to 90 minute survival? Well call me a wambulance. its called survival >.>

 

I could go on. but deciding to be nice

[Filas312]

     I play warframe to be a space ninja, if I wanted to farm, I'd play farming simulator.

Stop. Calling. It. Farming.

It's pure gambling. In farming you're working towards a set goal like killing 500 mobs of type X or doing 1000 hours of Y or killing 1000000 of Z... In gambling you're literally doing nothing than throwing dices after every kill and hoping that something's gonna drop. 

 

The problem is that farming may cause certain people to quit and let the rest grind their teeth trying to do what they have to do, but there's a goal in a set place. Gambling on the other hand doesn't quite reward the effort - the reward is either given to you at the first occasion, somewhere in between or at the bitter end, where you might even die trying and not ever see the reward. It's kind of a lose-lose situation: either you reward people who didn't quite 'work' for the reward or don't reward those who have. This is bad design at it's worst (best?!).

 

Stop bashing the wrong things for christ sake! Greedy Pull isn't killing your ability to be a space ninja, how is it doing so?!

 

What I can think of is that the drop system could work as "one of two, the earlier one" as in "either you get it from RNG drops or it drops at a set amount of tries, whichever comes first", and then it switches to completely RNG-based system. I believe one piece of something should be almost 'guaranteed', for the reasons which aren't that obvious, but they're logical - people should be at least a bit rewarded for their effort, else they're going to quit! You could tell people to do it or die trying, but hey, you don't want your playerbase to die trying, actually.

Edited June 21, 2015 by Filas312

[AgentScarlet]

I've mained Mag since I joined, and tbh I've become a little bit resentful of Greedy Pull. It's overrated IMO - unless you're using extremely specialized spam-camping strategies (which is not how I want to play the game), it's completely unnecessary. It's not hard to bring a carrier and do a quick dash around the area every so often. Yet, I'm more or less obligated to waste a mod slot on it, because everyone expects Mag to have Greedy Pull. I won't miss it if it gets nerfed or removed.

[Ironlixivium]

Sounds like someone not getting into farming parties.

 

But as many have said here, dont like playing with a gp mag, dont.

I hate having to run stupid bosses for a 3% chance to get a piece of gallium. love my hydroid farming now.

 

It doesnt effect your gameplay. dont like playing with em, dont. aww. it effects a 60 to 90 minute survival? Well call me a wambulance. its called survival >.>

 

I could go on. but deciding to be nice

 

     You aren't the first person to say this kind of thing. The matter of greedy pull was settled, it took over 10 pages, I don't want to go through that again :/ 

 

Stop. Calling. It. Farming.

It's pure gambling. In farming you're working towards a set goal like killing 500 mobs of type X or doing 1000 hours of Y or killing 1000000 of Z... In gambling you're literally doing nothing than throwing dices after every kill and hoping that something's gonna drop. 

 

The problem is that farming may cause certain people to quit and let the rest grind their teeth trying to do what they have to do, but there's a goal in a set place. Gambling on the other hand doesn't quite reward the effort - the reward is either given to you at the first occasion, somewhere in between or at the bitter end, where you might even die trying and not ever see the reward. It's kind of a lose-lose situation: either you reward people who didn't quite 'work' for the reward or don't reward those who have. This is bad design at it's worst (best?!).

 

Stop bashing the wrong things for christ sake! Greedy Pull isn't killing your ability to be a space ninja, how is it doing so?!

 

What I can think of is that the drop system could work as "one of two, the earlier one" as in "either you get it from RNG drops or it drops at a set amount of tries, whichever comes first", and then it switches to completely RNG-based system. I believe one piece of something should be almost 'guaranteed', for the reasons which aren't that obvious, but they're logical - people should be at least a bit rewarded for their effort, else they're going to quit! You could tell people to do it or die trying, but hey, you don't want your playerbase to die trying, actually.

 

     The matter of greedy pull was settled. I wasn't bashing the wrong thing, it's called "cred farm", "core farm", etc. :/ if you want, replace "farm" with "gamble", but it's very commonly referred to as "farm for a loki sys", not "gamble for a loki sys". I'm bashing farming because farming is stupid. I'm playing a space ninja game, why is space ninjaing not the best way to play? It's stupid that it isn't :/ this rng system should be scrapped.

 

I've mained Mag since I joined, and tbh I've become a little bit resentful of Greedy Pull. It's overrated IMO - unless you're using extremely specialized spam-camping strategies (which is not how I want to play the game), it's completely unnecessary. It's not hard to bring a carrier and do a quick dash around the area every so often. Yet, I'm more or less obligated to waste a mod slot on it, because everyone expects Mag to have Greedy Pull. I won't miss it if it gets nerfed or removed.

 

     This is how I feel about it. :/ we have people who I'll try to refrain from insulting who need to wake the heck up. That think Greedy pull is the only reason mag is acceptable in late game. They're wrong, and tbh it's kind of annoying :/ It gives me the same feeling I get when I see some guy assumes a girl in a hospital is a nurse and not a doctor just because they're a girl (or similar situations).

     Mag is GREAT in endgame just because of how well shield polarize scales. (it drains a percentage, so if you have enough power strength, you'll be able to drain any shield with it no matter what, AND deal damage based on how much shield you drained, not in percentage drained, but amount drained.) Yeah, grineer have no shields but if you try to say the same about corrupted all you'll get is a bunch of hardcore mag users laughing in your face because they'll think you're an idiot. Corrupted shield drones. End of discussion.

 

     Sorry for the rant, I REALLY hate it when people say BS like "we wanted her to be endgame, now she finally is and you want it changed back."