Is Hammershot Really Useless?

[Autongnosis]

Iirc on 100% crit chance and 2.0x crit multiplier weapons, considering vital sense already slotted, Hammer Shot gives a better damage increase than the third 90% elemental mod even considering the damage bonus.

[Dragon_AV]

I use it on my Braton Prime, together with event mods and the critical change increasing one (forgot the name)

[TotallyLagging]

Most of the time you could replace them with dual status mods or elemental mod. I like it on the Tonkor tho.

 

I don't find Hammershot useless, but then again I find the Mutalist Quanta to be a decent crit weapon...

2.5% Base crit chance

wtf

 

how

[Elfalpha]

The issue in terms of DPS is that for an optimal critical build you need Serration, Heavy Cal, Split Chamber, Point Strike, Vital Sense and Two elemental mods.This only leaves one slot open that is adjustable. You can put hammer shot here but you lose out on hush/ammo mutation/speed quality of life mods.

[inflatable_fish]

The issue in terms of DPS is that for an optimal critical build you need Serration, Heavy Cal, Split Chamber, Point Strike, Vital Sense and Two elemental mods.This only leaves one slot open that is adjustable. You can put hammer shot here but you lose out on hush/ammo mutation/speed quality of life mods.

 

just imagine... if Vectis prime was absolutely identical to the base version in terms of stats and damage, but was made silent baseline...

 

*teary eyes*

[Autongnosis]

The issue in terms of DPS is that for an optimal critical build you need Serration, Heavy Cal, Split Chamber, Point Strike, Vital Sense and Two elemental mods.This only leaves one slot open that is adjustable. You can put hammer shot here but you lose out on hush/ammo mutation/speed quality of life mods.

Heavy Caliber is anything but mandatory.

[[DE]Momaw]

Build 1, no Hammershot, use one 60% dual stat elemental mod instead

21224.657SUSTAINED DPS

 

Build 2, Hammershot

22016.988SUSTAINED DPS

 

There's only a handful of guns that would really want Hammershot at all, and in this best-case scenario you're looking at a 3% DPS advantage. Not exactly compelling.

 

 

The issue in terms of DPS is that for an optimal critical build you need Serration, Heavy Cal, Split Chamber, Point Strike, Vital Sense and Two elemental mods.This only leaves one slot open that is adjustable. You can put hammer shot here but you lose out on hush/ammo mutation/speed quality of life mods.

 

Punchthrough. :-/

 

 

Heavy Caliber is anything but mandatory.

 

Depends on the gun really. If you have a weapon that doesn't really care about the accuracy, then Heavy Cal is vastly more powerful than anything else you could add after the first element.

Edited June 3, 2015 by Momaw

[Autongnosis]

Depends on the gun really. If you have a weapon that doesn't really care about the accuracy, then Heavy Cal is vastly more powerful than anything else you could add after the first combined element.

That said, what you wrote works only for minimum damage guns.

If you have the aiming skill to hit heads consistently with a crit weapon the loss of accuracy from Heavy Caliber will hurt your potential damage output. 4x crit headshots on a regular basis>>+38% to damage (yeah, that's the effect of HC once you slot Serration)

 

That said, i'm a skrewb@aiming and i fit HCal on EVERYTHING so i can be less skrewbby. But you get the gist xD

[[DE]Momaw]

If you have the aiming skill to hit heads consistently with a crit weapon the loss of accuracy from Heavy Caliber will hurt your potential damage output.

 

I specifically said weapons that didn't suffer significant loss from using Heavy Cal. Boltor Prime would be an example of a weapon that can use this mod "for free". The difference in practical accuracy before and after is so minor as to be irrelevant. If you lose accuracy, then the issue gets more complicated, which is why I didn't say something like "all weapons".

 

I also said, and meant, "first element".

 

Serration + Split Chamber = 500% of base.

First element (90%) =  956% of base

Second element (90%) = 1408% of base

One element plus heavy caliber = 1552% of base

[Autongnosis]

Two notes:

- this topic is originally about Hammer Shot, which to be honest has no place in a minimum damage gun's build

- not slotting a second element to get at leas a single combined is a pretty bad idea. Maths under here.

So:

- base damage of 100%

- serration brings it up to 265%

- split chamber brings it up to 503.5%

- first element is 956.65%

- second element to 1409.8%

- HC plus first element is 1552.3%

Against a beneficial resistance assuming neutral base damage the max bonus you can get is +50%, so a total of 1919.95%.

With the combined element you get a +75% so a 2089.525%

A damage increase of 8.8% without the -55% accuracy penalty.

Assuming a beneficial base damage the two numbers get pretty close, but HC gives you a -55% accuracy penalty.

[Nagisawa]

A clanmate of mine states that Hammershot is worth nothing, even for those weapons the damage output of which relies on critical hits. I'm not sure if he's right. I mean, I have been using it on weapons like Dread and Amprex and found the extra crit damage AND status chance a nifty addition.

 

Do you believe that Hammershot is useless? Why? Why not?

Given that it gives my Dread bow a total of 125% Crit chance, I'd argue I love my Hammer Shot.

[S0V3REiGN]

Most of the time you could replace them with dual status mods or elemental mod. I like it on the Tonkor tho.

 

wtf

 

how

Dat 2.5% crit chance.

[Autongnosis]

Given that it gives my Dread bow a total of 125% Crit chance, I'd argue I love my Hammer Shot.

Agreed.

 

Basically in my opinion there are two main ways to build bows.

 

A skirmish-styled build which is the one i like the most, with

- serration

- heavy caliber

- split chamber

- point strike

- vital sense

- vile acceleration

- 2 90% elemental mods

 

And a more sniper-like build, which is

- serration

- split chamber

- point strike

- vital sense

- hammer shot

- speed trigger

- 2 90% elemental mods

[Gr3vi3R]

Ok, if you wanna make a REAL comparison, that's how you mod a Soma Prime:

 

Raw Crit Damage:

http://warframe-builder.com/Primary_Weapons/Builder/Soma_prime/t_30_22000000_131-5-5-132-1-5-133-6-5-137-0-10-138-7-5-140-3-5-150-2-10-159-4-5_137-7-132-8-150-16-140-9-159-9-131-11-133-11-138-11/en/2-0-65/

 

Hammer Shot:

http://warframe-builder.com/Primary_Weapons/Builder/Soma_prime/t_30_22000000_131-5-5-132-1-5-133-6-5-137-0-10-140-3-5-150-2-10-153-7-3-159-4-5_137-7-132-8-150-16-140-9-159-9-131-11-133-11-153-9/en/2-0-65/

 

 

Against low armored enemies (Or Corrosive Projections) you lose like no damage for more status proc, and Viral is the best.

Yes, Hammer Shot is worth it.

 

(PS: Ppl should l2mod)

Edited June 4, 2015 by Gr3vi3R

[(PSN)JiggaJazz]

Not even volt can utilize it with electric shield to get more dmg than you would with a basic element so yes it is completely useless

[Autongnosis]

Not even volt can utilize it with electric shield to get more dmg than you would with a basic element so yes it is completely useless

Hm, well, tbh an ES volt is a pretty poor example since it devolves the importance of crit damage mods to favour raw damage mods. Diminishing returns basically.

 

That said, on a 125% crit chance weapon Hammer Shot gives more net increase in damage than the third 90% elemental mod. So you basically either choose to have flexibility (the allmighty Corrosive+Cold combo for example) or better raw damage with Hammer Shot.

 

EDIT: spoilered out because of wrongness .-.

Edited June 4, 2015 by Autongnosis

[(PSN)JiggaJazz]

Hm, well, tbh an ES volt is a pretty bad situation since it devolves the importance of crit damage mods to favour raw damage mods. Diminishing returns basically.

That said, on a 125% crit chance weapon Hammer Shot gives more net increase in damage than the third 90% elemental mod. So you basically either choose to have flexibility (the allmighty Corrosive+Cold combo for example) or better raw damage with Hammer Shot.

Electric shield doubles critical dmg, the only way to deal more dmg with hammershot than an element with volt is to use synapse, amprex or dread and get a red critical head shot

Until I did the math I thought hammer shot would be better than an element if you're head shotting but I was only half correct as you need to red critical the head which won't happen enough to increase overall dmg

Even without volt, amprex, synapse and dread still deal more dmg even if you red critical without hammer shot than with it

[Autongnosis]

I got a bit confused on ES mechanics, my mistake. Don't know why i was convinced it was a 200% additive bonus instead of a 2.0 multiplier. My bad.