Shouldn't Pre-Corpus Valkyr Be "healed" Valkyr?

[Morec0]

Indeed, Just because a Tenno-in-a-Valkyr-Warframe suffered trauma at the hands of Alad V, and sustained damage to the Warframe that resulted in our Tenno being unable to determine what the Valkyr Warframe was like before the damage doesn't mean that the abilities exhibited by the damaged Warframe need to significantly differ from the pre-damage Warframe. Same with the name, there is no reason that Alad V would assign a new name to a vivisection target (Nor that the Tenno would honour any such "renaming") Hence the default assumption is that the pre-Alad V vivisection Valkyr Warframe was also called "Valkyr"

 

There is no need to change the name, powers, or change the designation of the skin. It is simply Valkyr, before the Corpus damage.

 

I wouldn't say no to a "Martial Frenzy" hysteria augment that lets you use your melee weapon instead of the claws though.

 

As I've said before, I'm more of the mind the Warframe ITSELF was affected by the trauma, but the end result's basically the same, I suppose: it just had the same/similar abilities before, its the personality displayed that's different.

 

9/10 I agree with you.

 

Depending on what route they go, I DO think it would be cool for Pre-Corpus Valkyr to have new audio effects - but that would only really make complete sense, imo, if she WAS "Undamaged" Valkyr, while more likely she'll be "Reclaimed" Valkyr or somesuch.

[Morec0]

Yes, yes it does a lot. The virus is the same (technocyte) and the Tenno are called Tenno because of Hayden Tenno. Can't tell if troll or just very very not smart. There are like 50 connections lorewise.

 

New powers would be awesome, but i doubt the DE will take up the work needed for it. Let's face it, it would be the same as making a completely new Warframe, which they wont.

 

However, the skins name defines the lore at this point. We either get a phantom that is not really there anymore or a restored Valkyr with removed scars.

 

Steve's said that Dark Sector is only 4/10ths canon, and further elaboration on the matter has pretty much led to the conclusion that they aren't connected to any point of meaningful nature. Whether or not the Proto-Skins have ANY place in the Warframe universe is irrelevant, because lore-wise they're utterly unimportant.

 

Warframe is SO FAR ahead in the future of its universe, that even in Cold War-era Dark Sector DID occur in the same universe it would have no barring on the overall lore and history.

[SilentMobius]

Yes, yes it does a lot. The virus is the same (technocyte) and the Tenno are called Tenno because of Hayden Tenno. Can't tell if troll or just very very not smart. There are like 50 connections lorewise.

 

New powers would be awesome, but i doubt the DE will take up the work needed for it. Let's face it, it would be the same as making a completely new Warframe, which they wont.

 

However, the skins name defines the lore at this point. We either get a phantom that is not really there anymore or a restored Valkyr with removed scars.

 

Are The Ghostbusters 4 men or 4 women? The groups in the 2016 movie and the 1984 movie have the same name so they must be the same right?

 

Obviously not.

 

Reboots/spiritual sequels can reuse ideas without having any canon connection in-world. the events of Dark Sector did no happen in the past of the Warframe universe, maybe something similar did, maybe not. All we do know 100% is that DS is not canon to Warframe.

[hawker_mech]

Lets just wait and see what DE will make out of Valkyr P

[BrazilianJoe]

It's best to not confuse headcanon for confirmed lore. Jus' sayin'.

 

 

Well, one may argue that the Codex is ambiguous at best:

 

Forged in the labs of the Zanuka project, the original Valkyr was subject to cruel experiments, leaving her scarred, angry and frighteningly adept at killing.

 

And that it is not explicit in affirming that her powers were changed, but it certainly induces to this conclusion. There is also this Lotus quote:

 

This is Valkyr, the tormented, the experiment.

Valkyr was crafted from torment, Tenno. Take control of her rage.

 

Which I don' t know where they pulled it from, but it's on the wiki. 

 

I totally think our Valkyr should have a Prime version in the future, but the little that has been dropped so far leans to the conclusion that she was something else prior to the Zanuka Project. 

 

 

It doen' t really NEED to be this way and is not the only possible conclusion. The extent of er torment and trauma could be limited to physical scars and mental trauma, but have her abilities still be the same. 

 

I just happen to think it's a loose end which is still up for grabs lore-wise, and since future frames are coming, why not tying up one to this story? It's a matter of seizing the opportunity. 

 

 

 

There's a lot of loose ends in the lore. Nova being designed by the Tenno High Council has also been debated a lot. We still don' t have a clue if the Tenno High Council was already something in the Orokin Era, or if only was created more recently.

 

If the Council is a recent thing, then it implies that Tenno/The Lotus has the ability to create Prime-quality stuff, instead of only scavenging Orokin gear in the Void. The fact that we hunt for Nova Prime parts in the Void leads to the former, but there may be other creative explanations.

Edited July 14, 2015 by -TP-BrazilianJoe

[Morec0]

Well, one may argue that the Codex is ambiguous at best:

 

Forged in the labs of the Zanuka project, the original Valkyr was subject to cruel experiments, leaving her scarred, angry and frighteningly adept at killing.

 

And that it is not explicit in affirming that her powers were changed, but it certainly induces to this conclusion. There is also this Lotus quote:

 

This is Valkyr, the tormented, the experiment.

Valkyr was crafted from torment, Tenno. Take control of her rage.

 

Which I don' t know where they pulled it from, but it's on the wiki. 

 

I totally think our Valkyr should have a Prime version in the future, but the little that has been dropped so far leans to the conclusion that she was something else prior to the Zanuka Project. 

 

 

It doen' t really NEED to be this way and is not the only possible conclusion. The extent of er torment and trauma could be limited to physical scars and mental trauma, but have her abilities still be the same. 

 

I just happen to think it's a loose end which is still up for grabs lore-wise, and since future frames are coming, why not tying up one to this story? It's a matter of seizing the opportunity. 

 

 

 

There's a lot of loose ends in the lore. Nova being designed by the Tenno High Council has also been debated a lot. We still don' t have a clue if the Tenno High Council was already something in the Orokin Era, or if only was created more recently.

 

If the Council is a recent thing, then it implies that Tenno/The Lotus has the ability to create Prime-quality stuff, instead of only scavenging Orokin gear in the Void. The fact that we hunt for Nova Prime parts in the Void leads to the former, but there may be other creative explanations.

 

The existence of a Nova Prime suggests to be this High Council DID exist in the Orokin Era. There are creative explanations, but as it stands what we currently know (or at least have been led to believe) about the matter would suggest that Nova's origins come from the Orokin in the Orokin Era, as with all other Primes. We've not seen any ability of ours to be able to create Prime equipment on our own, its only the exception of Warframes that we actually build the parts, everything else is just so much finding the bits and bobs of it in the Void and piecing them together.

 

 

And while I agree she was something else before the Zanuka Program, I don't think that something else had functionally different abilities. I think that "something else" leans more towards the personality she displays - the tormented rage and pain, a personality she gained due to Alad experimenting on her, basically skinning her for Zanuka, among other things. That twisted the personality she was before, made it into the basically berserk-animal she is now, the voice would demonstrate that, and maybe the look of her powers as well, but she remained very much with the same ability set.

 

I'm fairly certain of the theory that the Warframes are living creatures themselves - leaning towards the Rhino Codex and the notion that, with the Tenno being able to switch between frames at will, its unlikely that with their ability to do that (switch from frame to frame) them having the powers innately is unlikely. And as the RPC creature CLEARLY used Rhino's abilities, and certainly seemed to be a living creature, the progression would lead to Warframes for the Tenno.

 

I'd say that when Valkyr Prime comes around what we'll see from her is a Warframe with the same kit, but with visual and audio effects that lean towards another personality. Honorable war-leader? Battle-lusting blood knight? What it will be I don't know for certain, but I think that's what will come about from it.

[PookieNumnums]

Regardless of how the codex is worded

Those who played for the release of valkyr will remember that we rescued valkyr who had been captured by alad v and was mentioned failure may mean permanent loss of a new warframe type.

I think the codex says her rage was forged. She could still have been a berserker but maybe her demeanor is simply different. You're suggesting that their mental state affects who or what the tenno is capable of. If that was the case how do we have all these tenno wearing each other's clothes and using each others abilities. Limbo killed himself with math..

There are two types of definition. Denotation is the dictionary definition where connotation is the meaning implied by the writer. Lots of warframes lorific yet vague past and present history are not to be taken completely literal. Warrior poet vor. Corpus illuminati big brother.

What if I told you that corpus want to use the neural sentry or infestation to develop better methods of mind control and indoctrination.

And the queens are the most cybernetic and least human of all Grineer with only brain and face for organic material hooked up to more tubes than lotus and tyl regors lines in that event that constantly feed high quality clone DNA goop to quickly degenerating cells. And that they don't want to fix the clone decay with health as their major tool of manipulation to both mind and body of their army. Vay hek says sacrifice.

What If they are behind nef anyos efforts for the sake of destroying tyls progress and clone moral.

[DraccoDoom]

Its just a skin, but this power rework could really come in to play in the Prime version.

 

We know from the Lore that Valkyr now, isn't the same as pre-corpus Valkyr.

And there was a question like that said in one DevStream to Steve, "will Prime Valkyr be the same as corpus Valkyr , or not?" and from what I remember the answer was "we don't know yet" face and shoulder move from Steve.

 

I would like to see a rework for Valkyr for Prime version but for a skin I don't see them doing it.

Edited July 14, 2015 by DraccoDoom

[Kasseopea]

Are The Ghostbusters 4 men or 4 women? The groups in the 2016 movie and the 1984 movie have the same name so they must be the same right?

 

Obviously not.

 

Reboots/spiritual sequels can reuse ideas without having any canon connection in-world. the events of Dark Sector did no happen in the past of the Warframe universe, maybe something similar did, maybe not. All we do know 100% is that DS is not canon to Warframe.

 

Nice strawman argument there, but point stands - same weapons, same virus, same enemies. We even have 2 skins from that game (Nemesis Nyx is from there aswell), as well as names taken over. Warframe is not a reboot, its a sequel.

 

Problem is, they want to create a new plot that is totally cool and awesome, so they go "nooo, there is totally no connection between the game Dark Sector and Warframe. Oh, have we already told you about those maps we call DARK SECTOR?! Yeah, no connection there either."

 

Also, they have to keep Warframes mysterious, but in Dark Sector you could clearly see that humans were underneath.

 

So far all the did is go bloogy-woogey-woo and tell us that what little of story we had is meaningless - without creating any story on their own as of yet. Don't get me wrong, puzzling a story together is awesome when its done right, like in the Souls-series, but here?

 

And yes, it is canon, because it IS a fact that Tenno were named after Hayden Tenno, so there is SOME sort of connection, whether you like it or not. Sure, maybe thousands of years passed, but it does not change the facts. If Dark Sector had no connection to Warframe, we wouldnt get reminders from the Devs all the time. 

[Kasseopea]

Its just a skin, but this power rework could really come in to play in the Prime version.

 

We know from the Lore that Valkyr now, isn't the same as pre-corpus Valkyr.

And there was a question like that said in one DevStream to Steve, "will Prime Valkyr be the same as corpus Valkyr , or not?" and from what I remember the answer was "we don't know yet" face and shoulder move from Steve.

 

I would like to see a rework for Valkyr for Prime version but for a skin I don't see them doing it.

 

What would be possible though, is that we get the Healed Valkyr / Pre-Corpus Valkyr AND a Prime Valkyr under a different name together. Maybe Valkyr was more of a project name than the real name of the frame, thus they might release a completely different frame, that has a different name, different abilities and is primed, but based on Valkyr choronologically outgame, while Valkyr is based on her chronologically ingame.

 

You know, since Corpus did some nazi-level crap to her, they might as well used the same naming conventions. After all she is the only one having sort of divine name, while all the other frame are named after they speciality. Valkyr's speciality isn't bringing fallen warrior to Valhalla, so why the name? Frost, Rhino, Ember, Nova, Limbo, Loki (trickster) - its all about their functionality, only Valkyr is "out of the ordinary"

Edited July 14, 2015 by Kasseopea

[Morec0]

Nice strawman argument there, but point stands - same weapons, same virus, same enemies. We even have 2 skins from that game (Nemesis Nyx is from there aswell), as well as names taken over. Warframe is not a reboot, its a sequel.

 

Problem is, they want to create a new plot that is totally cool and awesome, so they go "nooo, there is totally no connection between the game Dark Sector and Warframe. Oh, have we already told you about those maps we call DARK SECTOR?! Yeah, no connection there either."

 

Also, they have to keep Warframes mysterious, but in Dark Sector you could clearly see that humans were underneath.

 

So far all the did is go bloogy-woogey-woo and tell us that what little of story we had is meaningless - without creating any story on their own as of yet. Don't get me wrong, puzzling a story together is awesome when its done right, like in the Souls-series, but here?

 

And yes, it is canon, because it IS a fact that Tenno were named after Hayden Tenno, so there is SOME sort of connection, whether you like it or not. Sure, maybe thousands of years passed, but it does not change the facts. If Dark Sector had no connection to Warframe, we wouldnt get reminders from the Devs all the time. 

 

Dark Sectors were actually renamed due to fan input, I think.

 

As for "what's under the Warframe", you have to remember that Hayden Tenno was a VERY different person from what the Tenno we play as in-game are. Hayden was never exposed to the Void, our Tenno were. Hayden only ever had his one war, our Tenno can switch between various frames at will. Warframe's Tenno are VERY different creatures from Hayden Tenno and Nadia Sudek of Dark Sector.

 

And there's no confirmation that we were in-game, named after Hayden Tenno. You're making base assumptions when there's only circumstantial evidence to support it. DE's said that the games are largely unconnected, there's no strong link between the two.

 

But it is NOT a sequel. That much is FACT. DE has NEVER used the word "Sequel" in response to Warframe, only "Spiritual Successor", you can try and put words in their mouth all you want, but...But in the end there's no similar themes, no similar characters, no similar locations, and only a few holdover names from the original - Technocyte, Tenno; and, hell, that's it! - it's LESS of a Sequel than Bioshock Infinite was to the other Bioshock games, and THAT was ALSO billed as a Spiritual Successor.

[Morec0]

What would be possible though, is that we get the Healed Valkyr / Pre-Corpus Valkyr AND a Prime Valkyr under a different name together. Maybe Valkyr was more of a project name than the real name of the frame, thus they might release a completely different frame, that has a different name, different abilities and is primed, but based on Valkyr choronologically outgame, while Valkyr is based on her chronologically ingame.

 

You know, since Corpus did some nazi-level crap to her, they might as well used the same naming conventions. After all she is the only one having sort of divine name, while all the other frame are named after they speciality. Valkyr's speciality isn't bringing fallen warrior to Valhalla, so why the name? Frost, Rhino, Ember, Nova, Limbo, Loki (trickster) - its all about their functionality, only Valkyr is "out of the ordinary"

 

... Loki? ... Hell, you even name him - WHY is Valkyr, who clips the name Valkyrie at that, suddenly meant to have that divine name while Loki's use of it is just "oh, he's a trickster, it doesn't mean anything more". Same for Excalibur, that's a freakin' legendary mythos right there. He doesn't get that treatment? Hell! NYX! THAT'S ANOTHER GODDESS'S NAME! TRINITY IS ALSO A REFERENCE TO THE HOLY TRINITY OF CHRISTIANITY!

 

Your statements REEK of bias and self-ego. 

[SilentMobius]

Nice strawman argument there, but point stands - same weapons, same virus, same enemies. We even have 2 skins from that game (Nemesis Nyx is from there aswell), as well as names taken over. Warframe is not a reboot, its a sequel. 

 

You need to watch devstream 52 https://youtu.be/j7QVemHYKn4?t=3393

 

Warframe is _explicitly_ not a sequel.

 

I don't need a strawman, I'm explaining things to you that have been definitively covered.

 

There is _a_ Hayden Tenno is the history of Warframe, that person may or may not share any of the traits of the character with the same name in the non-canon story of  Dark Sector. For all we know the Warframe Hayden my well be based on the Hard-Sci-Fi concept for Dark Sector that was never made

 

 

As has been said in other threads, there are Marathon references in Halo but the events of Marathon are not Canon to Halo.

Edited July 14, 2015 by SilentMobius

[PookieNumnums]

Nice strawman argument there, but point stands - same weapons, same virus, same enemies. We even have 2 skins from that game (Nemesis Nyx is from there aswell), as well as names taken over. Warframe is not a reboot, its a sequel.

Problem is, they want to create a new plot that is totally cool and awesome, so they go "nooo, there is totally no connection between the game Dark Sector and Warframe. Oh, have we already told you about those maps we call DARK SECTOR?! Yeah, no connection there either."

Also, they have to keep Warframes mysterious, but in Dark Sector you could clearly see that humans were underneath.

So far all the did is go bloogy-woogey-woo and tell us that what little of story we had is meaningless - without creating any story on their own as of yet. Don't get me wrong, puzzling a story together is awesome when its done right, like in the Souls-series, but here?

And yes, it is canon, because it IS a fact that Tenno were named after Hayden Tenno, so there is SOME sort of connection, whether you like it or not. Sure, maybe thousands of years passed, but it does not change the facts. If Dark Sector had no connection to Warframe, we wouldnt get reminders from the Devs all the time.

I was told by dev in reply to forum pm

Spiritual successor sums it up

I admitted defeat that warframe is not Canon. I knew it wasn't a sequel but me morec0 mobius and others have been over this time and time again. The spirit of it is what is important after all. So as long as it plucks the same heart strings and has the same feels then I guess its fine being 99% it's own thing

[Tengu147]

Nice strawman argument there, but point stands - same weapons, same virus, same enemies. We even have 2 skins from that game (Nemesis Nyx is from there aswell), as well as names taken over. Warframe is not a reboot, its a sequel.

 

Problem is, they want to create a new plot that is totally cool and awesome, so they go "nooo, there is totally no connection between the game Dark Sector and Warframe. Oh, have we already told you about those maps we call DARK SECTOR?! Yeah, no connection there either."

 

Also, they have to keep Warframes mysterious, but in Dark Sector you could clearly see that humans were underneath.

 

So far all the did is go bloogy-woogey-woo and tell us that what little of story we had is meaningless - without creating any story on their own as of yet. Don't get me wrong, puzzling a story together is awesome when its done right, like in the Souls-series, but here?

 

And yes, it is canon, because it IS a fact that Tenno were named after Hayden Tenno, so there is SOME sort of connection, whether you like it or not. Sure, maybe thousands of years passed, but it does not change the facts. If Dark Sector had no connection to Warframe, we wouldnt get reminders from the Devs all the time. 

 

You're looking at it the wrong way. Think of it like this:

 

Is there a Hayden Tenno in the Warframe universe? Yes. Most likely.

Is he the same Hayden Tenno from Dark Sector? Did the events of Dark Sector happen to him? No. Not likely.

 

Therefore, we can say that the Hayden of our universe may have used the Proto Excalibur armor and may have used the Glaive at some time in his life, and we may be named after him, but that does not mean it is the same guy from Dark Sector. Yes, the designs are similar, but guess what? The designs for Spider-Man's suit from both Raimi's Spider-Man (2002) and Webb's The Amazing Spider-Man (2012) are exactly the same, and are both worn by a 16 year old boy from New York named Peter Parker. But are they the same Peter Parker? No.

 

That's how I've chosen to look at it, and I'm quite satisfied.

[EmptyDevil]

 

There's a lot of loose ends in the lore. Nova being designed by the Tenno High Council has also been debated a lot. We still don' t have a clue if the Tenno High Council was already something in the Orokin Era, or if only was created more recently.

 

If the Council is a recent thing, then it implies that Tenno/The Lotus has the ability to create Prime-quality stuff, instead of only scavenging Orokin gear in the Void. The fact that we hunt for Nova Prime parts in the Void leads to the former, but there may be other creative explanations.

 

The Tenno High Council existing during the Orokin Era is very much likely. Nova Prime isn't the only Tenno-made prime because the Boar Prime is another one that was made by Tenno.

 

[MokutoBunshi]

It says "forged in the labs of the Zanuka Project" in her codex entry.

It would be interesting to see her powers from before.

 

Maybe a beast master! at any rate that would be a cool new warframe.

 

But if she was made in the zanuk project labs that means she either

 

A: has no prime

 

or

 

B: has a pre-corpus prime which should have her old abilities.

 

 

]\'[okuto Bunshi

 

Peace Out.

It says "forged in the labs of the Zanuka Project" in her codex entry.

It would be interesting to see her powers from before.

 

Maybe a beast master! at any rate that would be a cool new warframe.

 

But if she was made in the zanuk project labs that means she either

 

A: has no prime

 

or

 

B: has a pre-corpus prime which should have her old abilities.

 

 

]\'[okuto Bunshi

 

Peace Out.

[Elantira]

Yes, yes it does a lot. The virus is the same (technocyte) and the Tenno are called Tenno because of Hayden Tenno. Can't tell if troll or just very very not smart. There are like 50 connections lorewise.

 

New powers would be awesome, but i doubt the DE will take up the work needed for it. Let's face it, it would be the same as making a completely new Warframe, which they wont.

 

However, the skins name defines the lore at this point. We either get a phantom that is not really there anymore or a restored Valkyr with removed scars.

 

are you trolling or are you the not very very smart one? DE themselves have said that DS has nothing to do officially with warframe, this has been said a couple times, just because in your mind it does doesnt mean it has anything to do, while there is influence, its not connected by lore

Edited July 14, 2015 by Elantira

[owendawgx]

Name it "Valkyr Reborn" or something. Pre-corpus doesn't really fit.

[Kasseopea]

are you trolling or are you the not very very smart one? DE themselves have said that DS has nothing to do officially with warframe, this has been said a couple times, just because in your mind it does doesnt mean it has anything to do, while there is infuence, its not connected by lore

 

Dark Sectors were actually renamed due to fan input, I think.

 

As for "what's under the Warframe", you have to remember that Hayden Tenno was a VERY different person from what the Tenno we play as in-game are. Hayden was never exposed to the Void, our Tenno were. Hayden only ever had his one war, our Tenno can switch between various frames at will. Warframe's Tenno are VERY different creatures from Hayden Tenno and Nadia Sudek of Dark Sector.

 

And there's no confirmation that we were in-game, named after Hayden Tenno. You're making base assumptions when there's only circumstantial evidence to support it. DE's said that the games are largely unconnected, there's no strong link between the two.

 

But it is NOT a sequel. That much is FACT. DE has NEVER used the word "Sequel" in response to Warframe, only "Spiritual Successor", you can try and put words in their mouth all you want, but...But in the end there's no similar themes, no similar characters, no similar locations, and only a few holdover names from the original - Technocyte, Tenno; and, hell, that's it! - it's LESS of a Sequel than Bioshock Infinite was to the other Bioshock games, and THAT was ALSO billed as a Spiritual Successor.

 

Then i guess Nemesis was also a very different person? Because she turned into a warframe aswell and was a "normal" woman before.

 

And sorry, but DE says a lot of things - Year of Quality™ in example.

 

No idea whether the story writer changed or something else happened, but there are SO many connections.

 

Demon's Souls -> Dark Souls -> Bloodborne - Thats a spiritual successor. Stuff works the same way, but its a completely different setting, naming and overall plot.

 

Dark Sector and Warframe has literally the same stuff - the Glaive anyone? Why make Proto Ex & Nemesis Nyx? It was even in the text of the skin, that it was in honor of Hayden Tenno - the first Tenno. Lotus symbol?

 

Btw - here is it, directly from the wiki:

http://darksector.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_Sector

 

It was never confirmed, but neither was it denied, because it would be really, really difficult to deny a continuity, if they already said that Ex is a follower of Hayden and that Tenno are named after Hayden Tenno. No idea how to say it more cleary.

IF Warframe had nothing to do with Dark Sector, they would have written the lore differently. As it is now Ex's story is DIRECTLY tied to Dark Sector, we have Dark Sector sectors, the Proto Glaive, Proto Ex, Nemesis Nyx, Lotus and the technocyte virus being exactly the same. This is not how "spiritual successor" works. Until they rewrite the lore, rename items and the virus, remove those skins and some other stuff, the connections are there.

 

My guess is that they simply have a different Storywriter now and he wants to write his own story, kind of like those 20 differnt spiderman comics from different authors, who all claim they have nothing to do with each other.

Edited July 14, 2015 by Kasseopea

[Ishki88]

In a "Perfect World" 

 

Pure Valkyr will have

>New FX

>New Sounds

>Renamed Powers

>New Hysteria Combos/Stance

>More Shields/Health/Armor (They stole her skinssss but somehow still has a *^#@@ ton of armor)

>New Idles

 

But this world is not "perfect" so just expect a new skin :^)

[Morec0]

Then i guess Nemesis was also a very different person? Because she turned into a warframe aswell and was a "normal" woman before.

 

And sorry, but DE says a lot of things - Year of Quality™ in example.

 

No idea whether the story writer changed or something else happened, but there are SO many connections.

 

Demon's Souls -> Dark Souls -> Bloodborne - Thats a spiritual successor. Stuff works the same way, but its a completely different setting, naming and overall plot.

 

Dark Sector and Warframe has literally the same stuff - the Glaive anyone? Why make Proto Ex & Nemesis Nyx? It was even in the text of the skin, that it was in honor of Hayden Tenno - the first Tenno. Lotus symbol?

 

Btw - here is it, directly from the wiki:

http://darksector.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_Sector

 

It was never confirmed, but neither was it denied, because it would be really, really difficult to deny a continuity, if they already said that Ex is a follower of Hayden and that Tenno are named after Hayden Tenno. No idea how to say it more cleary.

IF Warframe had nothing to do with Dark Sector, they would have written the lore differently. As it is now Ex's story is DIRECTLY tied to Dark Sector, we have Dark Sector sectors, the Proto Glaive, Proto Ex, Nemesis Nyx, Lotus and the technocyte virus being exactly the same. This is not how "spiritual successor" works. Until they rewrite the lore, rename items and the virus, remove those skins and some other stuff, the connections are there.

 

My guess is that they simply have a different Storywriter now and he wants to write his own story, kind of like those 20 differnt spiderman comics from different authors, who all claim they have nothing to do with each other.

 

It also sure as hell ain't the same Nemesis from Dark Sector - I.E. not missin' a whole damn arm. Which if you want to be as strict as you are about it means:

 

1) It's JUST a reference skin.

 

or

 

2) The Nemesis user from this universe had a different styled Warframe.

 

As for your "DE says a lot of things", I'm sorry, but that just ruins every bit of credibility your argument could ever have. You're basically saying YOU know the universe better than the people who are MAKING IT, that YOU are above the author. That comment alone shows the arrogance you're approaching this all with; as I said earlier, you're choosing your own headcanon over the words of the creators themselves. You're an embodiment of arrogance in this situation, and little else.

 

They've never said Excalibur is a followers of Hayden Tenno. Nowhere has that been said.

 

The Glaive (the BASE glaive, mind you, not the Dark Sector reference-skin) is NOT the same, it's a VERY different look. Same with Excalibur. Same with Nyx. Same with EVERYTHING in that; hell, I've already pointed out that Warframe's Dark Sectors were named BASED ON A MOVEMENT IN THE COMMUNITY, NOT straight from DE (they were called "Badlands" before, I believe). Even the Lotus symbol is given a new meaning - from going from the black market to a matronly guide. Even the Technocyte virus, the crux of your argument, isn't the same. Compare how the Infested in this game look - soft, fleshing, meaty - to the Infested of Dark Sector - metallic, hard, carapace like. Every example you put out IS SO DIFFERENT IT'S NOT FUNNY.

 

Also, you may want to check your "directly from the wiki" link again:

 

 

Digital Extremes has recently created a free-to-play title called Warframe, and is a spiritual successor[2] to Dark Sector. This game borrows many names, similar models, and lore, but is set much farther in the future. 

 

There's a fitting trope for this... ah, yes: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HoistByHisOwnPetard

Edited July 14, 2015 by Morec0

[Kasseopea]

It also sure as hell ain't the same Nemesis from Dark Sector - I.E. not missin' a whole damn arm. Which if you want to be as strict as you are about it means:

 

1) It's JUST a reference skin.

 

or

 

2) The Nemesis user from this universe had a different styled Warframe.

 

As for your "DE says a lot of things", I'm sorry, but that just ruins every bit of credibility your argument could ever have. You're basically saying YOU know the universe better than the people who are MAKING IT, that YOU are above the author. That comment alone shows the arrogance you're approaching this all with; as I said earlier, you're choosing your own headcanon over the words of the creators themselves. You're an embodiment of arrogance in this situation, and little else.

 

They've never said Excalibur is a followers of Hayden Tenno. Nowhere has that been said.

 

The Glaive (the BASE glaive, mind you, not the Dark Sector reference-skin) is NOT the same, it's a VERY different look. Same with Excalibur. Same with Nyx. Same with EVERYTHING in that; hell, I've already pointed out that Warframe's Dark Sectors were named BASED ON A MOVEMENT IN THE COMMUNITY, NOT straight from DE (they were called "Badlands" before, I believe). Even the Lotus symbol is given a new meaning - from going from the black market to a matronly guide. Even the Technocyte virus, the crux of your argument, isn't the same. Compare how the Infested in this game look - soft, fleshing, meaty - to the Infested of Dark Sector - metallic, hard, carapace like. Every example you put out IS SO DIFFERENT IT'S NOT FUNNY.

 

Also, you may want to check your "directly from the wiki" link again:

 

 

 

There's a fitting trope for this... ah, yes: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HoistByHisOwnPetard

 

Yeah, lots of words. Hey, how about the Warframe wiki?

 

"According to the Official Tenno Alphabet Cipher, the design on Excalibur's right shoulder is in fact a word that spells out "Hayden Tenno". The same word can be found on top of Excalibur's head." - Yeah, i dont see any connection to Hayden Tenno either. Must be a f-ing coinsidence.

 

Besides, the technocyte virus IS the same - Hayden's arm is more durable and Nemesis is bulletproof. Im not sure you even played the game. If technocyte wasnt soft, Warframes couldnt move, so there you go. I don't really know where you see "metallic" technocyte either, aside from prime stuff. Most frames barely reflect light at all and it looks rather like rubber.

 

And glaive being different - yeah, right, because they look totally different. Glaive prime looks differnt, but normal glaive and Dark Sector glaive look almost the same aside from tiny differences.

 

As alredy said - i simply think that they want to keep up the mistery about the Tenno, because if Dark Sector would be admitted to be the prequel, it would mean that Tenno are human (as well as the Orokin. The wiki even states "The Tenno are descendants of an ancient and mystical civilization of lost warriors from the Orokin era on Earth" - although im sure its a coinsidence Tenno are human-sized, antropomorph, have 5 fingers including a tumb and resemble humans in suits in any other way. Ofc they are not like Hayden Tenno)

Has something of a streetmagician having cards falling out of his sleeve but nevertheless trying to perform the trick and make a card "show up" out of "nowhere" - same here, one day it will be "OMG, OROKIN ARE HUMAN" and people who played Dark Sector and read the WHOLE lore will be sitting there like "...oh...wow...yeah, totally didn't see that coming, yawn. Wanna go one with the Sentient plot again? Yeah? Thanks"

 

 

 

[Arkham Knight Spoiler]

 

 

 

Btw - The devs of Arkham Knight said that a certain character who EVERYONE suspected wasnt Arkham Knight and instead they would make a new character. Guess who Arkham Knight truly is. Sorry to crush your unfathomable faith in devs, but they are human as the Tenno (BOOOOM)

Edited July 14, 2015 by Kasseopea

[Elantira]

It also sure as hell ain't the same Nemesis from Dark Sector - I.E. not missin' a whole damn arm. Which if you want to be as strict as you are about it means:

 

1) It's JUST a reference skin.

 

or

 

2) The Nemesis user from this universe had a different styled Warframe.

 

As for your "DE says a lot of things", I'm sorry, but that just ruins every bit of credibility your argument could ever have. You're basically saying YOU know the universe better than the people who are MAKING IT, that YOU are above the author. That comment alone shows the arrogance you're approaching this all with; as I said earlier, you're choosing your own headcanon over the words of the creators themselves. You're an embodiment of arrogance in this situation, and little else.

 

They've never said Excalibur is a followers of Hayden Tenno. Nowhere has that been said.

 

The Glaive (the BASE glaive, mind you, not the Dark Sector reference-skin) is NOT the same, it's a VERY different look. Same with Excalibur. Same with Nyx. Same with EVERYTHING in that; hell, I've already pointed out that Warframe's Dark Sectors were named BASED ON A MOVEMENT IN THE COMMUNITY, NOT straight from DE (they were called "Badlands" before, I believe). Even the Lotus symbol is given a new meaning - from going from the black market to a matronly guide. Even the Technocyte virus, the crux of your argument, isn't the same. Compare how the Infested in this game look - soft, fleshing, meaty - to the Infested of Dark Sector - metallic, hard, carapace like. Every example you put out IS SO DIFFERENT IT'S NOT FUNNY.

 

Also, you may want to check your "directly from the wiki" link again:

 

 

 

There's a fitting trope for this... ah, yes: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HoistByHisOwnPetard

not only that, but if my memory serves me, hayden tenno got his powers throught technocyte virus, and we get it from the void

[Tengu147]

Then i guess Nemesis was also a very different person? Because she turned into a warframe aswell and was a "normal" woman before.

 

And sorry, but DE says a lot of things - Year of Quality™ in example.

 

No idea whether the story writer changed or something else happened, but there are SO many connections.

 

Demon's Souls -> Dark Souls -> Bloodborne - Thats a spiritual successor. Stuff works the same way, but its a completely different setting, naming and overall plot.

 

Dark Sector and Warframe has literally the same stuff - the Glaive anyone? Why make Proto Ex & Nemesis Nyx? It was even in the text of the skin, that it was in honor of Hayden Tenno - the first Tenno. Lotus symbol?

 

Btw - here is it, directly from the wiki:

http://darksector.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_Sector

 

It was never confirmed, but neither was it denied, because it would be really, really difficult to deny a continuity, if they already said that Ex is a follower of Hayden and that Tenno are named after Hayden Tenno. No idea how to say it more cleary.

IF Warframe had nothing to do with Dark Sector, they would have written the lore differently. As it is now Ex's story is DIRECTLY tied to Dark Sector, we have Dark Sector sectors, the Proto Glaive, Proto Ex, Nemesis Nyx, Lotus and the technocyte vyrus being exactly the same.

 

Do you just not understand Warframe's lore at all???

 

Nemesis (real name Nadia Sudek) never "turned into a Warframe". She wore an armour, and that armour is not a Warframe. Warframes don't exist in Dark Sector. Warframes have never been mentioned in Dark Sector. Our Warframes are vastly different from the armours in Dark Sector. Warframes are made up of so many materials -- Morphics, Rubedo, Orokin Cells, Plastids, -- materials never mentioned or used in Dark sector. Warframes utilise the Void Energy in a Tenno. Hayden and Nadia didn't have Void Energy. The Void does not exist in Dark Sector. Hayden Tenno does not were a Warframe. He did not turn into a Warframe. It is armour. How is that difficult to understand? Nemesis from Dark Sector and the Nyx Nemesis skin don't even look exactly the same so why are you comapring the two?

 

There are no connections to Dark Sector. There are easter-eggs and tributes. That is all they are. Easter-eggs and tributes. Yes, they have the same stuff. Yes, the Glaive talks about "the first Tenno". Yes, the Excalibur Proto-Armor is said to be of "ancient origins" (which can interpreted as an early version of Excalibur, not Hayden Tenno's armour). But it is not the same. Hayden Tenno from Dark Sector is not the first Tenno of the Warframe universe. They are not linked like that. There is no link like that. There is a man called Hayden Tenno in our universe but it is not the same guy from Dark Sector. It is not. Stop trying to say that it is because it is not. Stop trying to make "fetch" happen!

 

And don't tell me you trust wikis as reliable sources. Wikis that can be edited by people like you -- who have no idea what they are talking about, ignore facts and speculate and pull theories out of their rear ends because it fits their limited understanding and their headcanons. That's is your source, when DE have said that Dark Sector is 4-5/10 canon to Warframe, essentially not canon. GG.

 

Yes, DE say a lot of things and perhaps things have been retconned but are you the one that writes the lore of this game? [sarcasm]Or you are? ^_^' Pleased to meet you! Could you hurry up with the lore? I'm getting tired of waiting.[/sarcasm]

 

And how is Excalibur's Codex directly tied to Dark Sector? Excalibur's Codex mentions the Orokin and the Sentients and the Void, things that don't exist in Dark Sector! How are they directly tied if there are several things missing? HOW SWAY!!!

 

The lore does not nee to be written differently. You, however, need to get out that comfort zone that is lazy thinking and your headcanon and form a sensible theory with the facts that we have been giving.

 

The Lotus is not the same. The armours are not the same. The virus is certainly not the same. Hayden Tenno is not the same. It's not the same.

 

Just stop it.

 

Edit: Ninja'd by Morec0. Fingers aren't fast enough -_-

Edited July 14, 2015 by Tengu147