The Warframe Market Is A Joke And Actively Discourages Impulse Purchases (Updated, Includes Solution To Installed Catalysts/weapon Slot On Weapons)

[Grilleds]

 You should get into a debate if you aren't going to see it through.

 

 

 

 I'd imagine he is. He just thinks differently about the issue. 

Its not his position that makes me ask that, its how he chooses to argue it. For example, how he quoted me was before I fixed the wording on my post, almost a full hour before his reply. Meaning he had planned to reply to me for almost a full hour and in all that time he only ended up typing two sentences, making me wonder if I am being trolled. Poes law and all makes it kind of hard to tell sometimes. But I digress, on the topic at hand:

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I still have not heard any justification for single Skana costing more then dual Skana. Despite the few people who seem to be claiming that items are priced correctly. I do happen to believe all items should be priced much lower (roughly 50% lower across the board), but I also believe that more thought should be put into said pricing, as the current market prices of items seem arbitrary, as though very little thought was put into deciding the prices. If items were priced correctly, this would not be the case. 

[Blatantfool]

Its not his position that makes me ask that, its how he chooses to argue it. For example, how he quoted me was before I fixed the wording on my post, almost a full hour before his reply. Meaning he had planned to reply to me for almost a full hour and in all that time he only ended up typing two sentences, making me wonder if I am being trolled. Poes law and all makes it kind of hard to tell sometimes. But I digress, on the topic at hand:

---------

I still have not heard any justification for single Skana costing more then dual Skana. Despite the few people who seem to be claiming that items are priced correctly. I do happen to believe all items should be priced much lower (roughly 50% lower across the board), but I also believe that more thought should be put into said pricing, as the current market prices of items seem arbitrary, as though very little thought was put into deciding the prices. If items were priced correctly, this would not be the case. 

 

 Yeah. I know. The market is silly.

[_Absolom_]

The market is silly.

Words of wisdom.

Let's hope their cause vanishes soon.

[Pallie]

i love that the stalker pack costs so much tbh

it's supposed to be something special that you ar supposed to obtain the "legit" way

and it's not just reskins

the stalker kunai even have different models

also different stats  and even some special effects like being more or less effective on certain enemies or the dread having higher velocity projectiles

 

Then don't put up the weapons for sale since its supposedly meant to be "earned" God I swear if this was nexon or EA all of you people would be saying the company is greedy.

[bobafetthotmail]

Whats amazing is that they don't want our cash, and have released 2 gigs of content in four months on a two gig game. They aren't having capitol problems, and they reward playing above money. This is a amazing concept.

I find it amusing that the only positive comment you can muster about the latest updates is their physical size on disk.

Fallout 3 and New Vegas (properly modded) occupy MUCH more disk space, so they must be so much better....

 

 

Also encouraging buying large platinum packs by having pricey weaponry encourages leftover platinum. That platinum is what feeds the mod trade keeping this game free to play for players who don't wish to pay.

Because people does not buy more plat just for trade, no, trade has to be done only with leftover platinum after they bought 4 What Stalker? packs in a row.

 

Yeah, totally makes sense.

 

Further more by reducing the price you increase the buying power of platinum causing people to buy less of the top packs due to lack of need

And this is bad how? The sales of small stuff will heavily overshadow the sales of packs, like they are actually supposed to.

Atm they simply don't sell.

 

 

W

by increasing the buying power of a platinum you decrease your ability to buy platinum by trading mods.

Platinum power up vs mod power stagnant = Inability to afford mod farm time required per platinum.

Did you come up with this on your own?

 

Mods have the same value, plat has the same value (respective to cash), any price change of items won't change mod trade in the slightest because it's the mod-value VS cash the thing that matters for their price. Platinum is just the medium used for the transaction, its numbers are totally irrelevant for mod trade.

 

 

 

 

 

That would stimulate the economy and simulate inflation allowing the poor to obtain their share with greater ease.

Dafuck are you talking about? Inflation is "devalue money" which usually means poor get even poorer.

 

Mod value is unchanged and this means their plat price has to rise to keep their value in line with the cash value, you only screw people that purchased plat before this "inflation" because if they purchased plat afterwards they would have gotten more plat for their money.

 

Yeah, great idea, amazing. Let's increase prices of cosmetics and screw over all past plat buyers. Because that is going to increase their confidence and push them to invest more in a game that can screw them again in the future.

 

oh alas i disagree with lowering prices on weapons. for priorly stated reasons.

 

But raising platinum received per dollar I'm for :D.

The two options have same end result... because you know... math.

 

If I get 100 plat for 10$ and an item costs 100 plat, then in practice that item costs 10$.

If I lower the price by a factor of 2, to 50 plat, in practice the item costs 5$.

If I increase the plat/dollar ratio by a factor of 2 to 200 plat per 10$, then an item costing 100 plat is still worth 10$ at the end.

 

Which makes me wonder if you actually understand what you are talking about.

Edited January 15, 2014 by bobafetthotmail

[Grilleds]

The two options have same end result... because you know... math.

 

If I get 100 plat for 10$ and an item costs 100 plat, then in practice that item costs 10$.

If I lower the price by a factor of 2, to 50 plat, in practice the item costs 5$.

If I increase the plat/dollar ratio by a factor of 2 to 200 plat per 10$, then an item costing 100 plat is still worth 10$ at the end.

 

Which makes me wonder if you actually understand what you are talking about.

He also completely glosses over that changing the prices of the items on the market would fix little issues like the Skana issue I mentioned above. If the prices were perfectly balanced across the board, but a bit too expensive, then yes increasing platinum received per dollar would be a fix, but as it is the problem is clearly the market prices which are in desperate need of some rethinking, hence increasing the amount of platinum per dollar would still leave some pretty big issues.

 

The only justifcation I can think of for not reducing the prices in the market is that it would upset a few people who paid full price before, which is a bad argument when you consider that price changing is commonly done both in other games as well as in real life, and the fact that this community will complain no matter what DE does. Honestly if a DE staff member wore a tacky tie to a livestream I wouldn't be surprised if THAT somehow ended up resulting in rage topics.

[bobafetthotmail]

He also completely glosses over that changing the prices of the items on the market would fix little issues like the Skana issue I mentioned above. If the prices were perfectly balanced across the board, but a bit too expensive, then yes increasing platinum received per dollar would be a fix, but as it is the problem is clearly the market prices which are in desperate need of some rethinking, hence increasing the amount of platinum per dollar would still leave some pretty big issues.

Well, of course without a rethink of item prices market will remain a joke. I was just pointing out major inconsistencies in his stuff.

 

I still think they don't change prices because they don't really know. (i.e. they don't play enough their own game)

Edited January 15, 2014 by bobafetthotmail

[HurpadurpusRex]

 You should get into a debate if you aren't going to see it through.

 

 

 

 I'd imagine he is. He just thinks differently about the issue. 

I stopped largely because when one flamer would stop another would step in. Just stop look at the time span, I respond just to have people call me; stupid, or say I don't know what I'm talking about as a blanket statement,  a joke, or suggest I don't know math, that I say dumb things, swear at me, ask me if I'm real; I'm sure this list gos on. This is not a debate, this is mudslinging and verbal blood sport, and in breach of the site rules of respect. They bring up Obtuse things, then demand I prove them not obtuse. Its a black hole. I'd rather be playing.

 

I really don't know why your encouraging me to go back, I was happy to let them conclude my defeat and eat the carcass. May be you can see that conversation ending in a better way; we share a difference of opinion in that.

[bobafetthotmail]

I stopped largely because when one flamer would stop another would step in. Just stop look at the time span, I respond just to have people call me; stupid, or say I don't know what I'm talking about as a blanket statement,  a joke, or suggest I don't know math, that I say dumb things, swear at me, ask me if I'm real; I'm sure this list gos on. This is not a debate, this is mudslinging and verbal blood sport, and in breach of the site rules of respect.

Everyone here is being pretty polite for an internet discussion. Don't expect to post stuff and see everyone applauding at you whatever you do.

 

You state things that make little sense to quite a few people (me included) and deliberately ignore arguments against your ideas, maybe it's language barrier issues (not a native speaker?).

 

You pull up that statement about inflation helping poor getting their share, which is flat out wrong due to the simple definition of "inflation" you find in dictionaries. It's nothing you need to prove, you either clarify what you wanted to say or it's wrong.

 

You use "sales rate" to talk about the difference in discount price of items between two games. But "sales rate" is "how much stuff is sold per X time". That's a definition you find in dictionaries. Again as above.

 

Your math is correct, but the logic behind it is very flawed because you did not compare items that have the same intrinsic value between two different games.

 

Here the issue is that Dual Skanas and a bunch of other stuff isn't worth the equivalent $$ to their plat price not that 75% discount on the highest priced item in two games results in more or less the same price over two wildly different items.

 

What you should compare within the two games to understand how much WF prices are off, is how useful is a specific item in that game, and what price that item has in the market, converted already in $$. Of course comparing between items with similar usefulness.

 

 

Blatantfool is simply saying that discussions work like this (I suspect that post has a typo btw). If you can't stand the heat of being proven wrong or can't use the language well enough to say what you are actually thinking, don't begin one.

Edited January 15, 2014 by bobafetthotmail

[MidgetSasquatch]

IMO f2p is awesome. You get to try out the game without shelling out cash. If you like the game and play allot, spend some cash and get better gear.

 

I LOVE this game and use my limited game time nearly exclusively on Warframe, therefore I became a founder and have no regrets.

 

None of the plat I've spent has been on weapons or frames. Slots, Taters,... MORE slots, MORE taters, a few colors, a pretty scarf and I'm good.

 

Currently have 17 of the 21 frames. Basically all but Necros. SO many weapons I stopped counting

 

As you said, gear is easy to farm. Even expensive gear just takes some patients

 

I'm guessing that you didn't expect so many players to disagree with you.

 

The bottom line is, IF YOU THINK IT'S TOO EXPENSIVE DON'T BUY IT!

[Aggh]

On the idea of increasing the amount of plat per dollar spent: that still doesn't change the relative value of purchasing weapons and frames.  Most people will still only spend plat on weapons, slots, cosmetics and maybe some rushing since they'll still get more out of their money doing so.

 

Hell, with the lack of endgame content, for many people, grinding for weapons and frames is one of the few goals to work  towards in this game.  So unless a weapon is incredibly OP or interesting, there's very little reason to spend money on weapons/frames.  Once you've got that shiny new weapon/frame all you can do with it is grind for other weapons/frames/mods.

 

 

Actually, if you understood how economics works...

If nobody is buying the product because the price is too high eventually it will force the price to change if the company selling the goods (albeit virtual in this case) wants to stay in business.

It's a pretty basic principle referred to as equlibrium price.

As it stands, obviously enough people are buying at the prices offered... so what incentive does DE have to lower the price outside of swinging sales?

 

That's an assumption.  DE is new to the f2p model.  The lack of changes in pricing is more likely representative of the fact that they're making enough money (they've talked quite often about how warframe has been more successful than they ever expected it to be) and are being cautious with how they change their pricing model.  This is of course despite the fact that they would be likely to make more money if their prices were more reasonable.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Aggh

[Chazman80]

This a good thread. Still, DE need to make money.  I'm sure their operating costs are pretty high.

[Lennek]

What I find really out of sorts is the price of the bboosters.i play world of tanks, Mech Warrior Online, And The Hunter. I refuse to buy them at there price right now when other free to plays offer much better. Heck The Hunter is 15 bucks for 3 months. Wot is much better priced as well.they are all f2p games that are doing vary well for themselves.

[cman9898]

Hey brah? I couldn't have put it better myself. I'm no rich kid by any means, but I have bought a few things from the market and then later been like why the heck did I do that? So its gotten to the point that I only use plat for wep/warframe slots and potatoes. I think your idea would work amazingly. Now the next thing is getting the DE to see reason with this.

[Grilleds]

I stopped largely because when one flamer would stop another would step in. Just stop look at the time span, I respond just to have people call me; stupid, or say I don't know what I'm talking about as a blanket statement,  a joke, or suggest I don't know math, that I say dumb things, swear at me, ask me if I'm real; I'm sure this list gos on. This is not a debate, this is mudslinging and verbal blood sport, and in breach of the site rules of respect. They bring up Obtuse things, then demand I prove them not obtuse. Its a black hole. I'd rather be playing.

 

I really don't know why your encouraging me to go back, I was happy to let them conclude my defeat and eat the carcass. May be you can see that conversation ending in a better way; we share a difference of opinion in that.

There has been no flaming, some condescending tones, but no flaming. Stop playing the victim once you have lost the debate. You clearly did not know what you were talking about for the reasons I have elaborated on in an above post, which you ignored. As the poster below you pointed out, you also have a nasty habit of ignoring arguments against your ideas, which makes people's impatience toward you quite justified.

 

This a good thread. Still, DE need to make money.  I'm sure their operating costs are pretty high.

 

People who post this do not seem to understand how impulse buying works. Generally impulse purchases are under 5 dollars. Meaning if the market prices are reduced with that in mind, more overall purchases will be made. Meaning more money overall. This was stated in the OP. Appealing solely to the upmarket is only profitable when manufacturing expensive products, which digital goods clearly don't count as.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Grilleds

[TriggerHappyWhiteGuy]

With all the discounts plat is reasonably priced and I think the reason for that those weapons are so high is because DE wants people to go and earn them. But if you still feel like you want those market weapons now just buy the BP and craft then rush it.You will save lots of plat that way and you will get it now and resources are way to easy to get if you are low on one.

[shut]

Prime weapons are cheaper in Trade chat than their normal counterparts are in the Marketplace.

 

This thread is more relevant than ever.

[koolen]

It's because DE don't want people to buy them, exept if they need it NOW! Warframe is a grind based game, remember it. And the items that you can't grind are not expensive ( eg: catalyst, reactor, forma, slots)

[(PSN)Lord_Gremlin]

Prime weapons are cheaper in Trade chat than their normal counterparts are in the Marketplace.

 

This thread is more relevant than ever.

They should stop sampling their fieldrones and just add all prime items to the market, while prime access will give prime cosmetics - sydannas, sentinel parts etc.

Come on. It's time to detonite that injector already.

[bobafetthotmail]

Prime weapons are cheaper in Trade chat than their normal counterparts are in the Marketplace.

 

This thread is more relevant than ever.

This. I can buy a whole Prime arsenal (primary/secondary/melee/warframe) for the same plat cost of a SINGLE totally worthless random weapon from the market.

[VeryNinja]

I have to agree with this- every time I see platinum mentioned, there is a constant pattern.

"dude dont buy anythin except for slots and colors"

"only get slots and skins everything else rips u off"

"SLOTS COLORS AND SKINS ONLY"

"only buy alots and potatoes ever k"

[Sphyrik]

This is an excellent idea, all my +1s

[Kamal965]

What I have noticed is that most of the newly released weapons are reasonably priced - at least, they are in comparison to the older weapons. Such as the 150 platinum for the Penta, when compared to the 225 for the Vulkar. Most weapons are now being released in the $8-11 dollar range.

 

Of course, that doesn't change the fact that the older weapons' prices need to be scaled down.

[STARSBarry]

but then the devaluing of items will rage people who have bought them..... 

 

see this icon.... see this grand master symbol that means I am either insane or have no idea what the true value of money is.... and im also out of platinum (I know right) and know what I say

 

bloody cheapen the prices you dont even have to refund me, iv been thinking this for a LOOOOONG time now that theres no decent "cheap" packs for impulse buyers to get a hold of.... I mean the 3 core pack for 75 plat sums it up perfectly 1 rare core with a CHANCE of another 2 WAIT WHAT!

 

I do think DE needs to invest in some market research of what is the sweet spot of cheaper items = more cash flow due to small impulse buys

[NanakoAC]

I'm sure everybody by now has noticed how absurdly priced everything is in the Warframe market.

 

DE, why is everything so expensive? I know you're new to the whole F2P scene, but making everything cost an arm and a leg is not how you make a profit. Who are you appealing to with garbage like this?

That IS how you make a profit. It works. If it didn't, the prices would be lower, believe me. DE doesn't need business advice from players.

 

They are appealing to wealthy people who value their time highly. There are a lot more of those than you think.  Especially parents, married people, and people who have long work hours. There's a massive middle/upper class of people in all western nations that have too much money on their hands, and not enough time.

 

If you're not one of them, or haven't run a business cating to them, you might not really understand it. But high prices do work. 

 

Really, the business model of F2P games is just setting massive prices on everything, and then attracting as many people as you possibly can, to see them. There's always going to be a percentage that will pay those prices, and that's more than enough to support farther development.