IANOBW Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 You mentioned that you wanted the removal of Arcane helmets. At the moment, we (you and I, people with Arcane helmets) have the best of both worlds. If you want the looks but don't like the Stats, go with the cosmetic helmets. If you want the Stats and don't care about the looks, go with the Arcane. The new players? They obviously don't have access to these helmets, and that's okay. I've missed a few events, I missed out on those weapons/Mods. I understand where you're coming from when you say it's not fair. I still disagree with the removal though. Just like all the Vandal weapons, like Lato, Braton, Snipetron, these helmets are just simply a thing for when you played. Chances are, I'll never obtain a Snipetron, Braton or Lato Vandal. So… why not get rid of those, too? I know, they were rewarded to those who played the Closed Beta or whatever, but still, it's all about when you played. I was playing when the Arcane helmets were around. They are my reward for being around then, just like those Vandal weapons are rewards to the Closed Beta players. Well, I in which case, why not just give them back in events? I mean, the old event weapons are coming back, so why don't the old arcane helmets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IANOBW Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 I started laying a year ago and I don't get bothered in the least bit about these helmets, he'll I had my best friend over xbox send me a video of him deleting his Excal prime(I love excal) because it was xp glitching him, anyone who is complaining about other people being here first need to respect those people No, they really don't While disrespecting the founders who basically made the game what it is today, I see no reason as to why new players should be locked out of content that was in no way exclusive before. Arcane helmets were obtainable from alerts. That isn't exclusivity, and doesn't make me as a player any way more worthy than anyone who doesn't have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archeyef Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Or, and I know this is crazy but hear me out, make the buffs from the helmets into, I don't know, helmet sigils with the stats attached. Limit them to the warframes that originally hosted them. You can apply one sigil to whatever helmet you are using, and switch them out at will like other sigils. Package them with the associated warframe. Come up with appropriate ones for the new frames that never had them. Run a script to distribute them retroactively to players that already have the frames. That way, instead of screwing some players over, everyone benefits. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
low1991 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Except, the advantages aren't minuscule. Take for example: http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Essence_Loki_Helmet http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Aurora_Frost_Helmet#Arcane_Variant http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Storm_Volt_Helmet And there are many more. A lot of players like to min-max. Why wouldn't they? If they have a chance to have a more powerful Warframe, why would they miss that chance? You can't say you've never wanted to make a specific build for your frame/weapon. Not having easy access to Arcane helmets is wrong. Every player has a right to them. They shouldn't be punished for not being around at the right time. This is why all the old event weapons are being re-released. http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Power_Efficiency_(Mechanic) http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Streamline It's at least 3 Mod points for those Arcane Helmets. Power Efficiency have a hard cap of 75%. +x% Shield/Health/Armor (stats) have little effect to game. Str, Duration,Range: depends. Not all Arcane helmets are good. Example:http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Avalon_Excalibur_Helmet I have already been punished for not being in time for Prime chamber (+100% Dmg on first ammo of magazine, AKA the most expensive), so i know the feeling. But for arcane, alot of the benefits are so minor that it's able to avoid using for Min-Max build. Old event weapon being released is become for new players to gain XP mastery rank. For example: SNiptorn, it's S#&$ seriously... but it's exclusive till recent re-released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PickleMonster21 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Well, I in which case, why not just give them back in events? I mean, the old event weapons are coming back, so why don't the old arcane helmets?Old event weapons, the Strun Wraith, the Wraith Twin Vipers? Maybe the ProvaVandal soon?I was about to make a point but I realised it would have worked in YOUR favour xD However, I have no problem with bringing them back. In fact, I wasn't a fan of the removal change. They should have allowed people the best of both worlds. If you want the stats, take the stats. If you want the looks, take the looks. Should have been as simple as that. But people would still complain. "I like this helmet more. Why can't I have these stats on this helmet instead?" And I think that's what the current Arcanes have tried to do, even though I've never acquired any. But still… you can't take my Arcane Locust helmet from me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IANOBW Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 Or, and I know this is crazy but hear me out, make the buffs from the helmets into, I don't know, helmet sigils with the stats attached. Limit them to the warframes that originally hosted them. You can apply one sigil to whatever helmet you are using, and switch them out at will like other sigils. Package them with the associated warframe. Come up with appropriate ones for the new frames that never had them. Run a script to distribute them retroactively to players that already have the frames. That way, instead of screwing some players over, everyone benefits. Just a thought. I can't judge a solution, but I think the final judgement has to be fair to everyone. That means either removing them, or making them available to everyone. http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Power_Efficiency_(Mechanic) http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Streamline It's at least 3 Mod points for those Arcane Helmets. Power Efficiency have a hard cap of 75%. +x% Shield/Health/Armor (stats) have little effect to game. Str, Duration,Range: depends. Not all Arcane helmets are good. Example:http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Avalon_Excalibur_Helmet I have already been punished for not being in time for Prime chamber (+100% Dmg on first ammo of magazine, AKA the most expensive), so i know the feeling. But for arcane, alot of the benefits are so minor that it's able to avoid using for Min-Max build. Old event weapon being released is become for new players to gain XP mastery rank. For example: SNiptorn, it's S#&$ seriously... but it's exclusive till recent re-released. Yeah, not all arcane helmets are good (actually, most are really good). But that isn't the point. They shouldn't be exclusives to old players, is my point, for the ones that are worth using do make better builds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archeyef Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 You can judge a solution based on how many people it benefits relative to other solutions. Generally, the solution that benefits the most people while having the least amount of drawbacks, short term or long term, is the best solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IANOBW Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 Old event weapons, the Strun Wraith, the Wraith Twin Vipers? Maybe the ProvaVandal soon? I was about to make a point but I realised it would have worked in YOUR favour xD However, I have no problem with bringing them back. In fact, I wasn't a fan of the removal change. They should have allowed people the best of both worlds. If you want the stats, take the stats. If you want the looks, take the looks. Should have been as simple as that. But people would still complain. "I like this helmet more. Why can't I have these stats on this helmet instead?" And I think that's what the current Arcanes have tried to do, even though I've never acquired any. But still… you can't take my Arcane Locust helmet from me! Yeah, it's difficult trying to keep everyone happy. I mean, I'm happy now, but I have friends who aren't, and I totally understand why. I don't think a complete removal of arcane helmets is gonna happen any time soon, but I can hope. I just see it as an issue that will get worse and worse as time goes on, with more and more players = higher demand = more outrageous prices for arcane helmets = almost pay to win aspect. But I digress. I've said pretty much all I can about my view on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodso Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 i use to have arcane storm for volt but when they removed arcane helms i removed the arcane part from the helm i also have a arcane ash helm for my regular ash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Onyxflamegod Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 (edited) http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Aurora_Frost_Helmet#Arcane_Variant Arcane aurora is garbage now, protip. Especially if you're speccing for bubble, it does less than arcane squall, for you. and by the time the armor would be needed for frost himself, 75 armor isn't gonna help much. Also Arcane Avenger outstats Arcane Storm for volt. Also a moot point. Edited October 17, 2015 by (PS4)Onyxflamegod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAD9eR Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 its REAL simple OP : if you like em wear em , if you dont , dont !!! they wont be removed as people have invested plat and trade time into em. andif people slag you for not wearing an arcane helmet , why the hell are you listening to them anyway , warframe has always been about "its not the best but it looks cool and I like it " attitude to weps and gear. only tryhard's complain about things others have that they missed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Master4733 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 its REAL simple OP : if you like em wear em , if you dont , dont !!! they wont be removed as people have invested plat and trade time into em. andif people slag you for not wearing an arcane helmet , why the hell are you listening to them anyway , warframe has always been about "its not the best but it looks cool and I like it " attitude to weps and gear. only tryhard's complain about things others have that they missed This guy knows the truth about gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IANOBW Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 its REAL simple OP : if you like em wear em , if you dont , dont !!! they wont be removed as people have invested plat and trade time into em. andif people slag you for not wearing an arcane helmet , why the hell are you listening to them anyway , warframe has always been about "its not the best but it looks cool and I like it " attitude to weps and gear. only tryhard's complain about things others have that they missed What? This isn't the issue. I'm not concerned with myself, more than I'm concerned about others. I do wear my arcanes, as out of place as they look. But newer player should have access to them as easy as I did before they were removed from market and alert circulation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrsrkr Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Yes.That's not how this works. The current arcanes are discontinued products. They were discontinued for a reason, which I believe was stats should not be mixed with cosmetics. You cannot bring back arcanes (in their current state) without bringing back the problem. However, those with the arcanes have no reason to lose them because other players can't have them. That has nothing to do with them, and everything to do with the players themselves. It was a limited time offer and you missed your chance. No one is being punished. Everyone who was there at the time got rewarded. Not the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
low1991 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 They shouldn't be exclusives to old players, is my point, for the ones that are worth using do make better builds. They aren't exclusive... you can buy them from other players... They are trade-able. DE didn't shut off new players from getting Arcane helmet. It's the market (player driven) whom did it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAD9eR Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 omg :D new players are SUPPOSED to be at a disadvantage as they havn't put in the time to aquire such gear . giving new players everything on a platter will just make people play less . counter productive to DE and the community as a whole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)PeetSquared Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 (edited) The bonuses aren't even that big of a deal. I could also care less about noobs being at a 'disadvantage' (which is a notion I don't agree with, since a noob can just farm prime parts and mods and sell them for the plat to buy arcane helms...yknow, like I did when I was a noob). I wish people would stop caring about everyone else all the time. This goes for real life too. Nothing more sad than a coveter and even worse, someone who wants to take some others kid's toys away. I'll just say right now, keep your mitts off my toybox. Anyway, these stat bonuses are like 15%...cool when you have it, no big deal when you don't. If it is important to an individual player, then the process of getting the helmets represents yet another activity to enjoy in the game, which is a good thing. Not trying to be a jerk, OP, but there are so many other things that DE's time would be better served doing...making AW better, the Kubrow process better, reworks of outdated frames and weapons, etc... Edited October 17, 2015 by (PS4)PeetSquared Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IANOBW Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 That's not how this works. The current arcanes are discontinued products. They were discontinued for a reason, which I believe was stats should not be mixed with cosmetics. You cannot bring back arcanes (in their current state) without bringing back the problem. However, those with the arcanes have no reason to lose them because other players can't have them. That has nothing to do with them, and everything to do with the players themselves. It was a limited time offer and you missed your chance. No one is being punished. Everyone who was there at the time got rewarded. Not the same thing. Well, I didn't miss my chance, but I don't see why newer players should have to lose the opportunity. IMO, nobody should have them, or everyone should. Fine if you disagree, but that's just my view on it. They aren't exclusive... you can buy them from other players... They are trade-able. DE didn't shut off new players from getting Arcane helmet. It's the market (player driven) whom did it. You need platinum to purchase them from other players. That is the only way you will get them. This is not OK, and it shouldn't be left like this. omg :D new players are SUPPOSED to be at a disadvantage as they havn't put in the time to aquire such gear . giving new players everything on a platter will just make people play less . counter productive to DE and the community as a whole They weren't around at the time. We shouldn't punish them for that. Hell, we got given everything to us on a platter, and now we somehow have the judgement to say that new players don't deserve these things we got for free because they weren't around? Really? The bonuses aren't even that big of a deal. I could also care less about noobs being at a 'disadvantage' (which is a notion I don't agree with, since a noob can just farm prime parts and mods and sell them for the plat to buy arcane helms...yknow, like I did when I was a noob). I wish people would stop caring about everyone else all the time. This goes for real life too. Nothing more sad than a coveter and even worse, someone who wants to take some others kid's toys away. I'll just say right now, keep your mitts off my toybox. Anyway, these stat bonuses are like 15%...cool when you have it, no big deal when you don't. If it is important to an individual player, then the process of getting the helmets represents yet another activity to enjoy in the game, which is a good thing. Not trying to be a jerk, OP, but there are so many other things that DE's time would be better served doing...making AW better, the Kubrow process better, reworks of outdated frames and weapons, etc... Yeah, there are many things more important than this, but this issue will slow-cook, as it has been for a while now. Eventually, I believe it will have to be dealt with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LascarCapable Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Thread cleaned. I see it's for now pretty civil for that kind of subject. Keep it like this, folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboticApplesWithLasers Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I have a single arcane helmet, for me it's a source of pride. Not having arcane pendragon has never made me a worse excal, I'll still top damage 50% of the time. It don't matter what they have our house they build, all that matter is playstyle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barkano Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 (edited) Agreeed with OP and 100% i personaly own some of this arcane helmets. from my point of view there are 3 posible solutions for this: a) Remove them all! b) Normal Variants turns into Arcanes (Arcanes comeback) c) oooor we find a way to use the helm that we want but still getting the bonus of the arcanes. (but this dont solve the real problem behind the arcanes) Edited October 17, 2015 by Barkano Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motorfirebox Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 Except, the advantages aren't minuscule. Take for example: http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Essence_Loki_Helmet http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Aurora_Frost_Helmet#Arcane_Variant http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Storm_Volt_Helmet Yes, the advantages are miniscule. The best of them are the equivalent of a rank 1 or rank 2 mod, with an associated drawback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Fbeast2 Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 I purchased my helmets with plat from the market before player trading was ever implemented. I have enough plat now and I would want my credit card refunded for the purchase. And we all know that is not going to happen. That is the problem DE is facing if they do decide to remove Old Arcanes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)obsidiancurse Posted October 17, 2015 Share Posted October 17, 2015 No amount of compensation could make up for my arcanes being taken. Have no problem with DE bringing them back, the current arcanes are tied to cosmetics so there is no reason why not. Just make the stats transferable like the current ones. Ie the vanguard speed boost can be transferred to other rhino helmets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IANOBW Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 Yes, the advantages are miniscule. The best of them are the equivalent of a rank 1 or rank 2 mod, with an associated drawback. I implore you to reconsider. A +15% buff is nothing to laugh at, especially when you can get one for no mod cost/slot and the downside is a 5% reduction to something you don't need in your build anyway. I purchased my helmets with plat from the market before player trading was ever implemented. I have enough plat now and I would want my credit card refunded for the purchase. And we all know that is not going to happen. That is the problem DE is facing if they do decide to remove Old Arcanes. No amount of compensation could make up for my arcanes being taken. Have no problem with DE bringing them back, the current arcanes are tied to cosmetics so there is no reason why not. Just make the stats transferable like the current ones. Ie the vanguard speed boost can be transferred to other rhino helmets. Yeah, it's a tough one. IMO, the better solution would be to give refunds in some shape or form - many ideas have been suggested, from legendary cores, to regular cores, to free regular helmets for future updates. But you can never please everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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