Feedback Megathread: Saryn Revisited.

[SwiftPotato12]

Exaclty, there is no time in this game for DoT abilities. Devs should focus on creating new content, stronger enemies and so on, NOT TRY TO SLOW THE GAME DOWN. It's like they're trying to extend the playtime this game has to offer by slowing YOU down.

 

I don't know about you, but I didn't like trying to keep up with a Saryn blowing through all enemies in the mission. While this is somewhat irrelevant, it made my game experience worse. In addition to that, most players that did that ended up getting downed later on. It doesn't slow down the game at all. A DoT is still a DoT if you aren't there to watch it. Its just one additional ability you have to do before running away.

[(PSN)Redemption_015]

What I enjoy is being able to build a frame that can flatten a room full of enemies in a second. Not a "cast and watch them twitch for 9 seconds before beating yo !".

 

You prefer running around just killing everything instantly? How utterly boring.

[Bizzaro21]

miasma still deals the exact same damage, just over time no in one go, and can be buffed by viral/toxin procs, her 3rd is actually something now, and spores have finally found a use, only bad thing is that if target dies from spores, that`s it, they don`t spread anymore, they should spread on death but with less range to avoid people spamming them and killing with guns for infinite loops

[Sabrewolfe]

Sorry guys I am having a bad day unrelated to Warframe and just so happened to hastily type this topic without really thinking. Appreciate your replies.

[PsychedelicSnake]

miasma still deals the exact same damage, just over time no in one go, and can be buffed by viral/toxin procs, her 3rd is actually something now, and spores have finally found a use, only bad thing is that if target dies from spores, that`s it, they don`t spread anymore, they should spread on death but with less range to avoid people spamming them and killing with guns for infinite loops

I can agree to that. Spreading on death but at reduced range compared to if you popped them yourself is something I'd like.

[akira_him]

Miasma now being nerfed, use to deal 375dmg over 4s, now only 350 over 3

used to do insane damage with -duration, now need way more energy to have same kind of damage

others, nothing really changed, you still relies on miasma

overall is a nerf, need tweaks for other 3 skills

[L3xhus]

You prefer running around just killing everything instantly? How utterly boring.

Yes I like to be able to run around and kill everything instantly. I also like playing Rhino.

The interesting part of "running around killing everything" is REACHING that point. Knowing that you finally reached what you wanted with that warframe. Having it nerfed after doing so isn't at all pleasant.

Yeah the "go play something else" nukeframe.

Haven't heard that one in a day or less.

[Eric1738]

miasma still deals the exact same damage, just over time no in one go, and can be buffed by viral/toxin procs, her 3rd is actually something now, and spores have finally found a use, only bad thing is that if target dies from spores, that`s it, they don`t spread anymore, they should spread on death but with less range to avoid people spamming them and killing with guns for infinite loops

The old negative duration build deals way more damage. The overall damage of Miasma is nerfed.

[Noteybook]

I don't really understand what this rework is trying to achieve. DE needs to stop punishing farming tools or change their game. I believe everyone is missing the point on this change on whether or not nerfing saryn but making her more "fun" is good. Let me explain:

 

Greedy pull mag was making farming and material gathering less tedious? Killed.

Mesa peacemaker is too strong and "braindead" but makes farming extremely effecient? Killed. (combined with the gmag nerf this was a complete overkill)

Now saryn was all that was left that left that could provide some relief to the grind. Killed.

 

I understand the direction they wanna go on. They want some depth and synergy on the frames. Too much "4" spamming, braindead gameplay with no substance is what they want to avoid. The problem though is that this is not how warframe works. You can't pretend that the game has depth and serious gameplay or some sort of insane mechanics. No. Warframe is a grindfest. That's all it is. You can't be thinking what rotations of the abilities I need or what combos there are or any other micro management they want to implement.

 

No the game is all about macro and EFFICIENCY. Efficient farming, quick completion of missions (with as much less energy expended and i dont mean in game energy but real life energy and exhaustion),specific roles for frames. Even in the missions just think about. How often do you actually care about what is happening in the screen? Like when you are grinding the T4 void defence missions do you actually care about what enemies are coming or how u going to fight them and what combos you going to execute? No you care about your energy, what spells to spam, the general position of the mobs(where are most of them etc), if there is a nullifier in the area to take out first etc etc. The game resembles more an MMO rpg rather than an action RPG.

 

These constant changes that DE wants to implement would have been awesome if the game was actually built COMPELTELY different. However when you have a completely braindead grindfest you can't pretend that your game is something else. Either change the whole gameplay mechanics or dont try to implement stuff that have no place in the game in its current stage.

 

And I believe it really is a shame cause warframe features an awesome movement system, as well as an interesting melee combat so in my opinion it would be really fitting to take a more "micro" approach on the gameplay as a whole. However at this stage as I said this is not how the game runs or feels. At even mid tier game not even late, you will find youself being swarmed with enemies and only caring about the overall situation rather than the specifics of the battlefield.

 

+1

 

When the game was slower paced and energy was shared in Closed Beta, I could understand. I actually miss how much slower paced and meaningful the game was.

 

Example:

is gameplay from early 2013. Do you see how slow it is? How much of a different feel the game has?

 

Please capture that again, DE. It is more faithful to dark sector and is more fun for the players. 

[Bizzaro21]

The old negative duration build deals way more damage. The overall damage of Miasma is nerfed.

no it isn`t, I have tried both, now with less strength than before it does overall more damage if you actually bother proccing viral or toxin to buff it not mash the 4 button and expect them to melt

[(PSN)Redemption_015]

Yes I like to be able to run around and kill everything instantly. I also like playing Rhino.

The interesting part of "running around killing everything" is REACHING that point. Knowing that you finally reached what you wanted with that warframe. Having it nerfed after doing so isn't at all pleasant.

 

You still can kill everything, you just need to make use of her other abilities now. Miasma now works better if you use the other abilities alongside it.

 

Did I've done some brain damage to you ?

 

Watching you type is giving me brain damage yes. If you haven't got anything other than 'go play something else frame' to say, leave this thread. The user is looking for solutions not your snooty comments.

[Eric1738]

no it isn`t, I have tried both, now with less strength than before it does overall more damage if you actually bother proccing viral or toxin to buff it not mash the 4 button and expect them to melt

Yes it is. The negative duration build increase the overall damage from 375*4 to 4500(check wiki for the old calculation). The weird interaction between old Miasma and negative duration is way more powerful than you would think. Right now if you manage to proc Viral and Toxin, you can get 1400*3=4200 overall damage.

Edited November 5, 2015 by Eric1738

[Educated_Beast]

Agree with OP. Played with sayrn last night and was just slow.

I like the fast pace of warframe, this felt like something differnt. The new armor is just plain ugly. Not only is the majority of player base heterosexual males, a flower just has not benefit Ina battle.

My Sayrn is going to go into the freezer with all my kubrows.

Slow =/= fun for me. I was OK with a change, but what's the point of a skill that needs another skill to be effective. By the time you get them all active, another player has killed everything...

DoT does not work in Warframe.

[Zamary]

Saryn is not even viable at any level, warframe is a fast action mmo hybrid, we do not have the luxury to setup combos to do the optimal amount of damage when your teammate are halfway through the map and obliterated everything, in short you cant, to much time is wasted in setting up and not enough time to kill anything, damage overtime is a great idea but in a fast paced action game we need direct damage not overtime damage

 

The DoT thing could work, if it would just spread from enemy to enemy after they died instead of stupidly having to combo everything in a game where that is never going to be viable.

[DraccoDoom]

There. See all those 3399's? Yea? Yea, THAT'S the kind of damage you can pump out every second. And that's JUST with 185% strength too

Ok, a bit under 4k, but want to take back that comment now?

Yeah show me these number on one heavy gunnel/bombard lv 50 for example(there number will drop hard). Not to mention that your testing on a group of infested (melee faction) with the least armor scalingand and that has a debuff for your miasma dmg, how about you do the same in a situation where you pick a group of range enemies your going to be dead before you do your whole combo or close to dead.

 

Infested is not the main faction we deal in the void its grineer.

 

ps. BTW i don't really have so many problems with the dmg (ther they your 4k post that was not true, and I was right in that regard).

No, my problem is energy consumption, efficiency here I have a bone to pick. Just making Saryn have big energy pool will not fix how are we suppose to fill it "first" or refill it after just one combo. The combo take just to much a hit on the energy you will never refill it if you don't use items hard.

Not even touching the time it takes to do one combo or the range you need to be to pull it off.

 

Limbo another frame that has heavy use on comboing powers has energy restore from one power, this helps him a ton with his combo gameplay, Saryn has nothing like that yet she has high need for one.

Edited November 5, 2015 by DraccoDoom

[DuncanHydroho]

Watching you type is giving me brain damage yes. If you haven't got anything other than 'go play something else frame' to say, leave this thread. The user is looking for solutions not your snooty comments.

I'm sorry to hear you're so brain scared and affected. But I hardly think there's a solution for someone that wants something to nuke everything in his way, in an online game, where things should be or get fair from all players perspective.

 

And by the way, I'm happy to know there's some one that his only concern is to criticize me.

Edited November 5, 2015 by DuncanHydroho

[Praisethasun]

A Positive thread about saryn?....Holy S#&$ M8

[BattledOne]

no it isn`t, I have tried both, now with less strength than before it does overall more damage if you actually bother proccing viral or toxin to buff it not mash the 4 button and expect them to melt

Then show us your math. I'd really like to see where my calculations are wrong because people keep saying you can deal more damage but my numbers show the opposite.

[L3xhus]

Oh well. Guess I'll just sell Saryn and play Ember and Rhino while building Mesa.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

I was more getting at the fact that if all enemies instantly hit the ground and stayed there from casting Miasma, it would scale endlessly and be tremendously OP, which is silly. Games are supposed to be challenging, I really like that they're adding synergy, combos etc to each Warframe's ability pool. It makes me feel like I'm actually playing the game and not simply a passenger viewing a highlight reel.

[KozaTheShadow]

I should be playing a game in a way I wan't to play a game. And having my time completely wasted isn't something I look kindly to.

THANK GOD I didn't spend a penny on the catalyst, if I did I wouldn't have the game on my pc anymore.

Your time is not wasted. You yourself limited your mindset and play style to only one variation, that variation happens to be the least favorable among DE and the player base and is openly shown to be so. You continue to pursue this play style, and then get angry when you refuse to adapt to something you know is already coming. 

 

Also, Rhino is probably the last nukeframe left standing, for now. 

[Hecko]

Don't expect crying here, neither trolling post here, I've already read other topics but even if the tweaks proposed are done, this does not make DE developers realize THE THING here.

This is not a dps on enemies game anymore. No one has time to cast 3 abilities with 20 enemies (level 90) around you shooting or stunning you, while you trying to teleport yourself with a tentacle to activate an injector, to activate a console, to activate a pad, to destroy the objective (you got the reference right ?).

 

You continue to forgetting it. Saryn wasn't a problem for her miasma, or her only-negative duration builds, it became a problem with all the mods (yeah I'm referring expecially at the derelict vault ones) you keep adding.
Using miasma wasn't lack of skills, it was just the more LOGIC way (with game mods and her abilities set up) to clean or stunning a room full of enemies, the ones who prefered to use more rainbows ways to doing it, weren't more pro, they were just stupid, or they didn't know her skills. Still DE saw a problem in the wrong corner.

 

The one!!1levol!1!one!!! attitude isn't our main objective while playing. 

 

We need crowd control, we need speed, not combining 3 different powers to get 1 decent one. DE developers this is not mass effect 3 multiplayer, and if u hadn't played it, do it now. That was the perfect balance beetween need of DPS on weapons and skill, crowd control, and AoE builds. Because after more than 3 years I'm sick of re-inventing completely on the same warframe my playstyle, and logging just for events.

 

What will it be next ? trinity ? you will turn her again to give mana only to herself ? Loki the spys king ?

What about oberon ? what about zephyr ? what about Atlas (usable just for getting more MR points) what about chroma ? what about limbo ?

Stop doing what you are doing, and KEEP IT SIMPLE.

 

peace.

[Miskye]

Lets try a different approach.

Instead of looking at the problems of the current kit. Lets find a solution to her kit that would make her shine.

Mission type/group setup/specific enemies

 

Is there a single mission type where she could excel at?

Capture/Assassination solo maybe

 

 

Personally found her too inefficient. Need to use pizza or rage to get the energy, to combo. Or kill more mobs.
Damage is fine tho on the single target.
Other frames can do it quicker. Without the need for the energy setup first.

 

1 of the better frames to deal with no shields mod in NM.
Can abuse that rage and regenerative molt.

Group setup..
But lets be honest here, she no longer fits in the hyper efficency group. So there will be an replacement.

If we arent looking for pure efficiency.
Maybe there is a group setup with other underused/niche frames that works. 
Spores with Chaos maybe.

But mostly i got questions.

Miasma Revisions

• Enemies hit by Miasma when under the effects of Miasma will have the duration timer reset.

How does this effect actually overwrite ?
If it had the +200% multiplier on the first and I recast the Miasma during the effect does it keep the +200% dmg multiplier rolling or does it reset to a basic Miasma. Or do i need to reapply the other effects before recasting to roll the Miasma effect. On the same tanky enemy/enemies

Only have the base 3/4 sec to pull the entire combo to keep Miasma rolling. Quite hard to keep a good spore rolling during this.
And doesnt work on weak enemies.

And is the duration timer an active update ? Or will it reset the dmg tick?
(think pre WoW dot change vs post WoW dot change) (reapply instant after tick or doesnt it matter. Hate losing dmg ticks)
 

[B0N3M4N]

I like how the rework is going, for my feedback I'd like to say that the only change that I'd like to see are:

 

More HPs on Molt;

 

More Power Range on Molt;

 

Molt's Augment Scaling with Duration;

 

Spore's spreading amount increased from the original target, I dunno maybe from 3 to 5 or so, scaling based on Power Strenght;

 

Less power cost for her 3rd and 4th, in the end if you want to push players on comboing her abilities then you should make her more efficent, because right now she eats a lot of power, especially with these last ones.

 

Other things are fine, Miasma is very good combined with Toxin and Viral Procs and all the abilities are synergizing very well, just some tweaks and she'll become the perfect Ability Damage-Dealing Warframe. Only thing that stops her is level scaling(especially armor), but we know that the team is working around it.

Edited November 5, 2015 by Redskull94

[PsychedelicSnake]

I respectfully disagree. That being said, I'm sure the Devs will take note of your feedback as well as the hundreds of other threads. I hope they don't revert their changes though, but instead build upon them.