Focus System Is A Bad Job.

[Sevlessa]

If you think that second post was referring specifically to you and you alone, your ego has to be bigger than the missteps made with the Focus rollout.

 

It's not necessary to misrepresent reality to cover your mistakes, nor is it necessary to project your errors in reasoning onto others. It's very easy to follow your posts, see what you quoted, and recognize the ridiculous exaggerations and illogical leaps you made. You can just accept that you made some rather extreme missteps in reasoning and move on. You don't have to misrepresent reality even further in a feeble attempt to drag others down with you.

 

Besides, what it boils down to is still this: It is completely irrelevant that the current cap makes it impossible to max out Focus in under a year, because the cap itself is not meant to be a long-term mechanic. The capped rate isn't actually intended to be finishable because it's going to be changed/removed as soon as exploits are fixed, and affinity rate being unreasonable can't be changed until people stop being able to gain 100k focus in fifteen minutes with zero effort. So it's impossible to max the system out at the moment. Yes, it is. And water is wet, and the Mk1-Braton sucks. What, in other words, is your point? What does it add to the discussion to state the obvious?

 

I am honestly amazed by the degree to which you've managed to miss the point.

 

Why do you keep make the things you say up? Do you not realize how useless that is to reasonable conversation? Please try to stick to actual statements made by DE and actual things DE has done when discussing the game.

 

Why do you believe the focus cap isn't meant to be a long term mechanic? Why, as you've stated earlier, do you believe that the numbers used in the focus system (amount gained, costs to upgrade, etc.) are simply arbitrary amounts DE threw in as placeholders? Doesn't it seem just a tad more likely that they're not the most incompetent developers on the planet and actually used numbers they thought were reasonable?

 

The reason I talk about the absurd length of time it takes to max out focus trees is because this is the amount of time DE felt was reasonable when they introduced the system. They're not so moronic that they're incapable of doing simple arithmetic, as your beliefs would imply. They're fully capable of adding up the focus costs, comparing them to daily focus gains, and calculating how long it will take to max out. They wanted it to take 1.5 years at 75k per day, or a decade without no-lifing or cheesing, to max out the trees. I comment to let them know that a conscious decision they made for the game is something that I do not like.

 

The problem isn't that I'm stating the obvious. It's that you somehow keep missing the obvious.

[traybong111]

The reason I talk about the absurd length of time it takes to max out focus trees is because this is the amount of time DE felt was reasonable when they introduced the system. They're not so moronic that they're incapable of doing simple arithmetic, as your beliefs would imply. They're fully capable of adding up the focus costs, comparing them to daily focus gains, and calculating how long it will take to max out. They wanted it to take 1.5 years at 75k per day, or a decade without no-lifing or cheesing, to max out the trees. I comment to let them know that a conscious decision they made for the game is something that I do not like.

 

 

Considering the pre-Vivergate numbers involved in Syndicate grind (IIRC, you could forma and fully re-level 32 frames and 190 weapons with the amount of affinity you needed to max a single Syndicate before they reduced the grind tenfold -- you can see the exact math in in this archived thread) I honestly wouldn't be surprised if DE made the same mistake and just slapped some vaguely big numbers to extend the grind for the moment. 

 

I'm not trying to confirm FelisImpurrator's doubt of DE being "so moronic that they're incapable of doing simple arithmetic," but I do have my doubts when it comes to DE's plan of setting up grind extension. 

Edited December 15, 2015 by traybong111

[Sevlessa]

 I honestly wouldn't be surprised if DE made the same mistake and just slapped some vaguely big numbers to extend the grind for the moment. 

 

Are you sure that's what they actually did, and they didn't instead use numbers that they considered reasonable at the time, then change them after the ensuing backlash?

[traybong111]

Are you sure that's what they actually did, and they didn't instead use numbers that they considered reasonable at the time, then change them after the ensuing backlash?

 

I can't say I'm sure; I prefer to think that they were sloppy with numbers rather than that they planned the numbers to be truly ridiculous.

 

Initially, total affinity required to max a single Syndicate was higher than the total affinity required to reach MR17--the highest possible MR for non-founder at the time of U15 was MR18. I really don't want to think DE calculated that players should reach MR17 before maxing a single Syndicate without buying anything from them. I don't think that was their intention either, because if they saw those numbers with any perspective (like the percentage of players who've gone past MR12~15 at the time) they'd have realized such affinity requirement would turn people away from the trading market that Syndicates were intended for, instead of retaining players to the grind.

 

If I had to choose between developers who rush out things before carefully looking at numbers and developers with unrealistic, near-delusional expectations, I'd prefer the former. While I think their past missteps indicate that they simply rush things rather than having severely skewed perspectives, I can understand why someone would think they often fall to the latter category. 

Edited December 15, 2015 by traybong111

[Sevlessa]

Honestly, it's incredibly hard for me to fathom a scenario where the devs would use arbitrary numbers for any sort of system like this. The level of incompetence necessary to use numbers without actually calculating the effect they will have is staggering. How would someone even go about doing that? Can you seriously picture the devs sitting down to decide how much XP is needed for the next rank, throwing out a number that arbitrarily large, and calling it a day? It just doesn't sound remotely realistic

 

I'm not saying it's impossible. It's just that it's the kind of thing that so stretches believability that I'd need some solid evidence to give the idea any credibility.

 

If I had to choose between developers who rush out things before carefully looking at numbers and developers with unrealistic, near-delusional expectations, I'd prefer the former. 

 

I really, really don't want either of those. Here's hoping for some improvement on the dev side.

[letir]

How would someone even go about doing that? Can you seriously picture the devs sitting down to decide how much XP is needed for the next rank, throwing out a number that arbitrarily large, and calling it a day? It just doesn't sound remotely realistic

I was a beta-tester for a F2P project some time. Trust me, it's possible, with "right" kind of developers. They can throw random numbers, make a mad decisions, create a bunch of totatly OP or UP weapons, etc.

 

Then you, as player, look at their work, you cannot help but ask: "WTF was that? How can anyone in the right mind just do THIS?"

[FrostySpikes]

Well i dont think is that terrible but yeah its not a good system. But is still on beta and everything is subject of change so yeah you shouldnt be complaining as DE wasnt going to fix it. At least what ive seen these years is that DE is a company that actually gives a sht of community complaints and their feedback and not just money.

 

Give them some weeks and theyll solve this, also this system is not really important at all by now... its just a free immortality we didnt have b4, look at the new things we got now and not how bad they are. The complete game is still on beta so if u dont like it go and play smt else and come back some years later

[FelisImpurrator]

 

Are you quite done yet with that inane line of "reasoning" that goes "I'm right, therefore you must be lying, and you should just accept that my logic is superior"?

 

Honestly, I'm not even going to bother engaging further with your lovely attitude. Have fun in whatever little world you occupy where placeholder values are a more "incompetent" move than automatically assuming insanity or malice (because one would presumably have to do so in order to believe that DE somehow wants a system to take a year and a half of daily playtime in order to finish).

 

/[DE]luminati Confirmed

[HunterFenrir]

Are you quite done yet with that inane line of "reasoning" that goes "I'm right, therefore you must be lying, and you should just accept that my logic is superior"?

Honestly, I'm not even going to bother engaging further with your lovely attitude. Have fun in whatever little world you occupy where placeholder values are a more "incompetent" move than automatically assuming insanity or malice (because one would presumably have to do so in order to believe that DE somehow wants a system to take a year and a half of daily playtime in order to finish).

/[DE]luminati Confirmed

Finally someone to give a big fat slap to sevlessa or however it's spelled. Have a cookie sir :D Edited December 16, 2015 by HunterFenrir

[Sevlessa]

Are you quite done yet with that inane line of "reasoning" that goes "I'm right, therefore you must be lying, and you should just accept that my logic is superior"?

 

This is another wonderful example of you making things up. I never claimed that you're lying. It's significantly more likely that you honestly believe the things you say, even when they blatantly contradict reality. I'd also wager that you're unable to recognize any of your flaws. That's what makes it impossible to communicate with you on any reasonable level.

 

I'll join with you on no longer engaging, though. Luckily this forum has a wonderful list I can use so that I don't screw up and attempt discourse with you again.

 

 

Have fun in whatever little world you occupy where placeholder values are a more "incompetent" move than automatically assuming insanity or malice (because one would presumably have to do so in order to believe that DE somehow wants a system to take a year and a half of daily playtime in order to finish).

 

That is one spectacular and irrational leap of illogic. "People think things are good that I think are bad, so they must be either insane or malicious." Yeah, I won't be missing out by avoiding whatever future bombs you drop. Simply amazing.

[HunterFenrir]

This is another wonderful example of you making things up. I never claimed that you're lying. It's significantly more likely that you honestly believe the things you say, even when they blatantly contradict reality. I'd also wager that you're unable to recognize any of your flaws. That's what makes it impossible to communicate with you on any reasonable level.

I'll join with you on no longer engaging, though. Luckily this forum has a wonderful list I can use so that I don't screw up and attempt discourse with you again.

That is one spectacular and irrational leap of illogic. "People think things are good that I think are bad, so they must be either insane or malicious." Yeah, I won't be missing out by avoiding whatever future bombs you drop. Simply amazing.

I hope you don't mind me asking to tone down your sassy/snobbish sounding tone? As correct as your points are it's really infuriating to read your replies.

[Ventose]

the 75k cap actually allows for rapid unlocking of "skills" (3 on first day), reasonably fast leveling of "skills" (2-3 days of focus farming to lvl first 2 points/ skill and only after slows down) and finally the passives are crazy good e.g. +3 energy/second (not fully lvld yet) or crit chance buff on melee, these are huge boons man, the stuff of dreams; I honestly don't get what are you guys so upset about, besides it's wednesday so expect an update on Focus, it's awesome as is and it's soon ;) to be epic.

Edited December 16, 2015 by Ventose

[Voltage]

have you never played a beta??? WE ARE TESTERS!

Technically this is a beta but IMO this isnt just saying...

[Senoinya]

Don't forget the fact that this promotes kill-stealing that actually has some merit for complaint and argument between players, unlike before where it was just some guy you find maybe every other month or so that whines because he didn't get the most kills. Why doesn't this work like affinity where your allies' kills still count for you too? Isn't this supposed to be a co-op game? My allies should benefit me just as I benefit them, there shouldn't be anything like this that promotes team separation.

[Kotsender_Quasimir]

personally i'm quite content with the system (i'm zenurik, other schools may need buffs), the only real problem is focus affinity not being shared, because it leaves supporters in the dust and promotes press-4-to-win rivalry / kills teamplay. but i think once enough plat was spent on greater lenses and affinity boosters this will be "fixed" soon enough (no accusation, it's just the most rational scenario i can think of).