Crit weapons vs non-crit

[Endorphinz]

Many players know this by now: weapons that can support critical hit-based builds far easily eclipse non-critical weapon builds, for several reasons. Elitists of the game tend to shun and look down on players who prefer to use elemental damage builds.

On top of raw damage output from weapons like vaykor marelok and tonkor, crit weapons gain a massive benefit from headshots (hence the preference by 'pro' players) which do 4x damage rather than the standard 2x damage from non-crits! Rewarding precision should be something that equally benefits any weapon type.

On top of that, there are the shadow debt/acolyte mods. You know, argon scope, sharpened bullet, hydraulic crosshairs; they all provide a boost exclusively to weapon critical hits, leaving other weapons even further in the dust. Other weapons gain no such benefits, unless you want to possibly slap on status chance/fire rate on said weapons. But then again, those stats don't exclusively benefit non-critical weapons.

As for melee weapons, well, I don't even have to say anything about it. One word: Berserker. This mod provides the absolute highest potential DPS increase for any melee weapon (+90% attack speed!!) only for critical hits with a melee weapon. And I'm not even going to get into body count/blood rush, that's a whole another discussion for melee combo counters.

The viability of crit-weapons far surpasses most other weapons in higher-level gameplay because of these skewed advantages. There aren't many pure damage-based weapons I'd feel comfortable taking to a sortie mission; the ones that come to mind are tigris, sobek, redeemer.

(By the way, secondary weapons are largely untouched by this, due to the fact that the crit mods for secondaries are weaker than their rifle counterparts, and the lack of weapons with viable crit stats.)

I guess what I'm trying to say is that there needs to be something that will benefit non-crit weapons more than crit weapons, but I don't know what that is. The only benefit that comes to mind right now is that objects take no critical damage.

[EineSohn]

If just crits were based on location instead of random(like in borderlands)...

Instead of crit weapons VS raw weapons, every weapon would get bonuses for aiming well. 

[Misgenesis]

Crits need to be scaled back and Status done something about.

Honestly criticals stop being criticals when you have a over 50% chance. Scale back critical chance and buff critical multipliers accordingly.

Edited August 9, 2016 by Misgenesis

[ThePredicament]

At the grand scheme of things, crits weapons are still reliant on pure damage, which we all know falls off fast with armor. The only significant difference is the 4x mult from headshots and again, that's still just pure damage. Straight damage weapons are pretty underrated though, weapons like Supra (which technically can out damage Soma P), Tigris, and Boltor (P/Telos) can perform well into high end levels. Aside from Tonkor, most of the other crit weapons in the game have some huge drawbacks especially during late game, such as crazy ammo consumption, lower fire rate, and those that don't have guaranteed crits are still effected by varying amounts of damage sag.

[Endorphinz]

I suppose all of this will be answered with damage 3.0. But, that's in the far-off future of uncertainty, and it just annoys me that they're not interested in changing anything about it anytime soon.

[Aglethe]

14 hours ago, Endorphinz said:

I suppose all of this will be answered with damage 3.0. But, that's in the far-off future of uncertainty, and it just annoys me that they're not interested in changing anything about it anytime soon.

Well, many of the weapons they've chosen for the syndicate melees are status based (the Lecta and the Sydon, they also mentioned that it was between a status dagger and a scythe for Red Veil, so it's like that the Rakta Dark Dagger will see a status buff (for all the sucidal fun melee radion procs bring :/ ) ) and the Galatine is more status based as well. So we could be seeing a round about buff to status that way. They also mentioned at Tenno Con that they'd been talking about a variety of ideas to buff status (supposedly Rebecca said at one point that a status version of Berserker was something they were considering, but that didn't sound entirely definite), so we might see something before damage 3.0 . They could do a new round of status focused event mods or something without waiting for the full damage rework.

Though they seem to have their collective noses to the grindstone with The War Within, so there's probably not much bandwidth to go around for anything else right now.

Also, a small correction, Berserker provides a 75% attack speed boost at max, not 90. It ends up being about a ~13-14% dps increase over a maxed Prime Fury, though PF does apply to finishers, unlike Berserker, so it's not an entirely cut and dried comparison.

[(PSN)lhbuch]

As mentioned,this is true except for extremely high level enemies where straight damage falls off, then you will need something to strip armor, or reduce health or bypass shields...

[(XBOX)TeenyRagtag]

I'm hoping to see some improvements in the status area of weapons because I are allowed more creativity with loadouts and modding when it comes to status. 

[bubbabenali]

On ‎09‎.‎08‎.‎2016 at 7:57 PM, EineSohn said:

If just crits were based on location instead of random(like in borderlands)...

Instead of crit weapons VS raw weapons, every weapon would get bonuses for aiming well. 

You get damage boni even without crit weapons when hitting weakspots.

But if you get these hits also as a random crit the multiplicator is going nuts.

[EineSohn]

31 minutes ago, bubbabenali said:

You get damage boni even without crit weapons when hitting weakspots.

But if you get these hits also as a random crit the multiplicator is going nuts.

Yes, of course I'm aware of that. I'm just putting my point that I prefer that instead of random and motive-less crits. That could be a way to mess with balance, if needed.

But for now, I just want my 1% crit increase to snipers : <

[--RV--LadySpiderwick]

Status relies on both the damage of chosen element/s but also the % chance to trigger it, but crit chance too relies on the physical damage just as status relies on elemental damage. I wouldn't mind status getting a buff because status can be endgame too if you do it right. But that being said how a weapon is modded currently impacts how strong it is.

[Takkov]

I think the same a Little Arachnid, and rely quite often on both crit and status for my weapons to perform well, especially in the melee department, but also for most other weapons, that benefit from crit/status builds. Especially when you get to high level content status becomes very important, if you take for example a corrupted heavy gunner at lvl 120 and attack it with a redcrit War even the red crits are not really high, while a status build galatine finishes it off in ~12 continuous attacking, less if you let the slash procs do their work.

Even the 100% status corrosive ninkondi kills the corrupted heavy faster than the war can

The war takes quite a lot of hits more and the only thing you can make for it to kill the heavies faster might be putting some corrosive/shattering impact on it, especially shattering impact gets really good the higher you are going to play, vs armor of course. For Corpus gas/toxin procs and magnetic procs are really good, as they bypass the shields, or completely evaporate them. And if you are running with 4 corrosive projections, viral will perform wonderfully in every situation.