Zephyr should be good; a fix thread ::Edit 7th September::

[(PSN)RenovaKunumaru]

2 hours ago, Caelward said:

I still kind of want a Tailwind that lasts for as long as you specifically want it, not based on mods equipped. Continue to use the ability and become a directed rocket that uses a reasonable amount of energy over time.

I wonder if that could be an augment one day, a simple 'hold 1 to continue dashing' augment might be a nice way to fill out that spot since Tailwind currently has no augments.

I've been against this from the beginning because with Zephyrs energy pool, something like that forces her into efficiency builds and unless PoE, could be a pain to control on tileset maps.

However, if that's what everyone wants, fine. I have arcane energize, efficiency means nothing to me. Was just looking out for everyone else.

Edited October 24, 2017 by (PS4)RenovaKunumaru

[Birdframe_Prime]

1 hour ago, Vrayden said:

These are pretty great fixes, though I'd like to see Tailwind become a toggled movement mode.

On Zephyr, a full-sized frame (rather than a shrinking one to maximise the space available in mission tiles) that has a rather low energy pool anyway, toggles are a bad move. Toggles are always a punishment for frames that have strong abilities, not a bonus that lets you use them all the time whenever you want, since they disable energy regen and resources that cause it and on top of that there are enemies specifically designed to drain these abilities at double or even triple speed, and duration casts will always be the way to get around those. I would much rather have a reliable cast that does the same thing every time, exactly as I've modded it to do, than one that, the second I get a Leech Eximus or Disruptor Eximus in the room, I get a gimped version of or one that prevents me from catching that much-needed pulse from an energy restore because I happen to have pressed 1 at the wrong time.

That said, Caelward here touches upon a nice option;

2 hours ago, Caelward said:

I wonder if that could be an augment one day, a simple 'hold 1 to continue dashing' augment might be a nice way to fill out that spot since Tailwind currently has no augments.

This I could get behind. As a purely optional augment that you would use for mobility on her? That would work. I'm guessing that we could make it function a little like the new Sky Archwing on the Plains, where that method uses the thrusters for high speed but also means you can roll the archwing over in a six-axis style of movement, tone that same function down and apply it to the Augment? Yeah, I could see that working quite well for players that like the open spaces.

Less so for any actual tile set... as doors and corridors still exist... but still, functional.

2 hours ago, Vrayden said:

It'd be cool if Tornado funnels held onto bullets or other projectiles fired into them, doing damage to captured targets before tossing them out. Or at least I feel like enemies should take more damage when they finally hit the ground. Or be disarmed by the winds pulling the weapons from their hands. 

There's a very specific reason that I haven't included that kind of damage scaling or function. Damage scaling, for example, isn't necessary on a Crowd Control ability, that makes it too powerful in the 'control/damage' scale of abilities. (Stomp? Great radial control, total affect on enemies, low damage. Avalanche, great radial control, lower range than Stomp, but proportional increase in Damage. Vortex, amazing radial control, lower range than both Stomp or Avalanche, massively increased duration and groups enemies into a single point rather than leaving them where they were, proportional decrease in damage to virtually nothing. You see?) Tornado would have a large range of effect, long duration CC with the re-capture function, and Status effects out the ears due to the ability to choose what Status type you want to use per funnel, increasing the damage would tip it too far into the over-powered side of things.

That said, it's also the reason for no fall damage or no disarming. Yeah, it would be cool, I completely agree, but I deliberately tried to make the CC and reliability so high on the scale of things that damage and further CC would be un-necessary.

It's also because, while the change is definitely needed to Tornado... I just want to make it reliable, not the new meta, if you see what I mean ^^ Powerful, but not over-powered.

Thanks for stopping in, both of you, I appreciate it!

[Vrayden]

Entirely reasonable. I guess I'm still hung up on what I thought Warframe would become back during alpha and not what it's actually become.

[Birdframe_Prime]

8 minutes ago, Vrayden said:

Entirely reasonable. I guess I'm still hung up on what I thought Warframe would become back during alpha and not what it's actually become.

Aren't we all?

People who started Warframe and didn't realise what the Operators were or would be, people who started Warframe and saw all these cool abilities and based-tenno-god style of gameplay that didn't realise that it was a horde-based shooter that meant enemies would eventually out-scale you...

I picked up Zephyr because of the change in play, the lightweight floaty behaviour, the ability to hit those skyboxes and entirely avoid all the Parkour 1.0 puzzles while laughing at the non-Zephyr peasants with their Super Jump Excaliburs... Only to find out that her amazing-looking Dive Bomb was short-range, poor damage, unreliable and un-aimable, while her amazing-looking Tornado was vague, slow, wandered off, was interfered with by everyone, and in turn interfered with everyone else...

Contrary to the popular belief, though, Parkour 2.0 didn't make her movement obsolete. I was surprised, actually, because I suddenly had extra options for mobility when I used to only have the basics. Before we only had a Jump, a copter, a dive roll and Tailwind, in the space of a few months we suddenly had jump, in-air melee dashes, coptering, dive rolling, a Bullet Jump, Aim Gliding and Tailwind. All these extra options for staying in the air, and the maps were getting retuned to remove the respawn ceiling and just put in invisible walls... What a time to be a Zephyr player!

From having to cast and re-cast Tailwind every time you wanted to go somewhere new, now we had the ability to bullet jump, cast, secondary jump or dive roll for a change in direction, smash something out of the air with an aerial melee attack, recast Tailwind, Aim Glide to the wall, bounce off it with the new wall climbing animations, and never touch the floor ever again!

And then... the game just left her behind. Every new frame got new tricks, every old frame started getting reworked tricks, the way crowd control abilities worked, the way damage scaled, the way enemies developed resistances or counters to our powers, and Zephyr... my poor, enthusiastic, lovable air caster, just got left.

[Caelward]

8 hours ago, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

I've been against this from the beginning because with Zephyrs energy pool, something like that forces her into efficiency builds and unless PoE, could be a pain to control on tileset maps.

However, if that's what everyone wants, fine. I have arcane energize, efficiency means nothing to me. Was just looking out for everyone else.

Well, the idea of an Augment is that it isn't forced on anyone after all. Tailwind currently doesn't have one and Augments are optional changes to abilities that change or expand on gameplay.

And as for energy drain, Tailwind moves Zephyr along the map very quickly, she doesn't have to stay in that form all that long. But it's something that should be talked about. Ideally, an augmented Tailwind would note how much energy a regular burst of tailwind would have cost you to use and how much distance you would have covered. Now when you augment it, have the drain take so much energy for so much distance based on the capabilities of the base Tailwind as it is, and we're using the same amount of energy, but without the jarring in and out that tailwind usually costs us.

Hmm, that should be it for now really, This conversation should be its own post, rather than buried in a rework thread..

[RunningTree3]

RE: Tailwind

I would be well-satisfied if Tailwind followed the likes of Atlas, Rhino, Valkyr... and simply gained multi-casting bonuses:

1st cast as normal
2nd cast within 2 seconds: 50% energy cost, 2*distance
3rd cast within 2 seconds: 25% energy cost, 4* distance
subsequent casts within 2 second windows treated as 3rd cast

It's not even energy cost that I'm interested in, mostly distance -- but also not modifying the stats of the base casting, so short flights are still an option.

If nothing else changes, I believe this would be the most useful for the smallest degree of change -- especially given that this mechanic has precedent.

[Birdframe_Prime]

1 minute ago, RunningTree3 said:

If nothing else changes, I believe this would be the most useful for the smallest degree of change -- especially given that this mechanic has precedent.

Agreed, although I'd definitely still like them to unlock that fixed casting animation we currently have. Giving us a boost in a direction we want is brilliant, until it means we can't do anything else while using it. Giving it the efficiency treatment of other 1-casts of a similar nature would just be a bonus for us all right there ^^

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

How can you go so in depth with literally all of your comments? This is a disgrace to a writer such as myself! Love it!

[Birdframe_Prime]

27 minutes ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

How can you go so in depth with literally all of your comments? This is a disgrace to a writer such as myself! Love it!

About twenty years of writing practice tends to do that for a person when it's on top of the other decade-and-change of growing up reading everything I could get my grubby hands on. Meanwhile you have to try publishing, professional Editing, print and graphic design, maths, physics, world travel, more reading (constant reading...), mercenary style writing for money including ghost writing, comics, drawing, gaming, sneaking up on wild prides of lions and herds of elephants, hiking, growing a beard and becoming a Viking (complete with 5 foot two-handed Scottish Claymore sword), cosplay for conventions, falling in love for real, falling out of it badly, falling in again, falling out of it in grace, discovering the exact tax laws regarding being a landlord and renting your home out as apartments, trying to hold on to the same job for twelve years, picking up that Americans like a good English accent and picking up some recording equipment and then wondering... what the heck do I say? Giving up and going back to photography, more drawing, more reading and then, if you have time, comment on a few forums. There's a lot you need to do in life, and a lot more that you can do if you want to.

If you want to write, as in, truly write... first you have to Live.

Life is life, hmm? It leaves a mark on everyone.

In my case, that mark is being... verbose? Loquacious? Overly talkative and probably annoying because of it. Be careful, you don't want to end up like me ^^

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

1 hour ago, Thaylien said:

About twenty years of writing practice tends to do that for a person when it's on top of the other decade-and-change of growing up reading everything I could get my grubby hands on. Meanwhile you have to try publishing, professional Editing, print and graphic design, maths, physics, world travel, more reading (constant reading...), mercenary style writing for money including ghost writing, comics, drawing, gaming, sneaking up on wild prides of lions and herds of elephants, hiking, growing a beard and becoming a Viking (complete with 5 foot two-handed Scottish Claymore sword), cosplay for conventions, falling in love for real, falling out of it badly, falling in again, falling out of it in grace, discovering the exact tax laws regarding being a landlord and renting your home out as apartments, trying to hold on to the same job for twelve years, picking up that Americans like a good English accent and picking up some recording equipment and then wondering... what the heck do I say? Giving up and going back to photography, more drawing, more reading and then, if you have time, comment on a few forums. There's a lot you need to do in life, and a lot more that you can do if you want to.

If you want to write, as in, truly write... first you have to Live.

Life is life, hmm? It leaves a mark on everyone.

In my case, that mark is being... verbose? Loquacious? Overly talkative and probably annoying because of it. Be careful, you don't want to end up like me ^^

You know, just a "practice" would be great, lol.

[Birdframe_Prime]

10 hours ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

You know, just a "practice" would be great, lol.

Practicing writing will only perfect what you know, my friend, and all you know is what you've seen and done. If all you've seen and done has been 'grow up, go to school, play some games and browse the internet' then sure, you may turn out a good story or two, and you'll be creative and imaginative within that sphere. But that's big fish in a little pond thinking ^^

Go out and do things! The more things you've done, the more experience you have, the more living you do... it all mounts up into an ever increasing lake, lagoon or even an ocean of emotional growth and mental flexibility to draw on.

Do you want a shameless self promotion? Here's a shameless self promotion, I go to Zambia on the semi-regular, I take pictures with an old Olympus E-10 camera that has no zoom on it, so my shots are always from exactly where I'm standing (usually I'm behind a tree or cover of some kind) but it's something I vastly enjoy.

But I go there because I have relatives there, it costs me only the flight and whatever I want to do there, I'm not saying you need to go there, just... branch out and go do some things you never thought about before.

Have some photos:

Spoiler

Find something you really, really want to do, and then go do it. Then come back from that and try writing again. You'll be amazed at the difference.

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

1 hour ago, Thaylien said:

Practicing writing will only perfect what you know, my friend, and all you know is what you've seen and done. If all you've seen and done has been 'grow up, go to school, play some games and browse the internet' then sure, you may turn out a good story or two, and you'll be creative and imaginative within that sphere. But that's big fish in a little pond thinking ^^

Go out and do things! The more things you've done, the more experience you have, the more living you do... it all mounts up into an ever increasing lake, lagoon or even an ocean of emotional growth and mental flexibility to draw on.

Do you want a shameless self promotion? Here's a shameless self promotion, I go to Zambia on the semi-regular, I take pictures with an old Olympus E-10 camera that has no zoom on it, so my shots are always from exactly where I'm standing (usually I'm behind a tree or cover of some kind) but it's something I vastly enjoy.

But I go there because I have relatives there, it costs me only the flight and whatever I want to do there, I'm not saying you need to go there, just... branch out and go do some things you never thought about before.

Have some photos:

  Reveal hidden contents

Find something you really, really want to do, and then go do it. Then come back from that and try writing again. You'll be amazed at the difference.

So what you're saying is "experience new things". Thanks.

[Arkenai7]

Being concise is also a skill.

[Birdframe_Prime]

2 hours ago, Arkenai7 said:

Being concise is also a skill.

Quite.

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

3 hours ago, Arkenai7 said:

Being concise is also a skill.

Thaylien is actually on the superior "women's explanation". He might respond with six paragraphs to this post, lol.

(just playing)

[Birdframe_Prime]

22 hours ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

He might respond with six paragraphs to this post, lol.

Once I replied to a player,
In poetry, written for kicks.
It shocked everyone who read it
I know, I just couldn't resist.

The rhyming doesn't work really,
I've not tried my best, you can tell.
But forgive me my humour and
Time waste, it bumps my thread quite well.

Something just needed to be said
About my long winded writing.
It's full and in-depth, you've seen it,
And my sarcasm is biting.

But when I'm given a challenge,
I rise to attack it head-on.
Six paragraphs, he said up there,
So now you just have to read on.

Paragraphs, he said, not Stanzas,
I know it's a silly idea.
But if I can pull it off right,
Then I think I win this one here.

It's the end of my silliness,
The poem is done, now I'm gone.
Don't challenge a published writer,
You only get massively dunked on.

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

6 hours ago, Thaylien said:

Once I replied to a player,
In poetry, written for kicks.
It shocked everyone who read it
I know, I just couldn't resist.

The rhyming doesn't work really,
I've not tried my best, you can tell.
But forgive me my humour and
Time waste, it bumps my thread quite well.

Something just needed to be said
About my long winded writing.
It's full and in-depth, you've seen it,
And my sarcasm is biting.

But when I'm given a challenge,
I rise to attack it head-on.
Six paragraphs, he said up there,
So now you just have to read on.

Paragraphs, he said, not Stanzas,
I know it's a silly idea.
But if I can pull it off right,
Then I think I win this one here.

It's the end of my silliness,
The poem is done, now I'm gone.
Don't challenge a published writer,
You only get massively dunked on.

And the crowd goes wild!!!

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

@Thaylien

Once I responded to a reply,

Yet for it, I tried something new.

Poetry? Is it really?

Not usually something I do.

 

However I made an exception.

I thought, "Time to test my skills!"

Thaylien, I may not be a poet.

But I always revive from the kill.

 

I applaud your well-thought responses.

Hell, I may even envy it.

New things everyday is something I enjoy.

But sarcasm is mine, not yours.

 

Much appreciation to rising to the occasion,

And head-on is admirable too.

Yes, six paragraphs is just what I said.

But you use something... new.

 

Stanzas are something very peculiar.

Not quite my forte.

But I think I'm the real successor here.

Unless you go another round, I've slayed.

 

So because this is a Zephyr thread,

Maybe this is the ending.

But forever, you'll always be going on...

Knowing Art Prince is the King!

 

[Birdframe_Prime]

8 hours ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

Knowing Art Prince is the King!

Sometimes I find myself quite impressed,
It's often hard to write some new poetry,
When students of mine, hard pressed, try their best,
In their attempts to get one over me.

But you've fallen for the common mistake,
Of not recognising the theme of mine,
See the rhymes made couplets with the line break,
And consistent eight syllables a line,

So I come to you now with a sonnet,
In Iambic pentameter you see,
The challenge is ongoing, don't fret,
It will take more than you've got to beat me.

At the end of the day you're outmatched friend,
If you can't respond, then this is the end.

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

Impressed, once more you will be.
I'm sorry, just too good at it.
Maybe now the student teaches the master,
Because now, I will never forfeit.

Fallen for a mistake? I'm just getting started!
Theme is something I can do.
I admire your attempt to be consistent,
But guess who loses it at the very end? You.

You said that you went for eight syllables each,
And yet, this is what you say,
"You only get massively dunked on."
That's nine, now you've caught yourself in a fray.

I can appreciate you understand what an honor this must be...
To meet your end to a King, yes, still speaking of me.

[Birdframe_Prime]

1 hour ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

"You only get massively dunked on."

Eh, so I forgot to clip a single syllable.

But boy, you didn't even attempt a true sonnet... I am so disappointed.

Edited November 2, 2017 by Thaylien

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

4 minutes ago, Thaylien said:

Eh, so I forgot to clip a single syllable.

But boy, you didn't even attempt a true sonnet... I am so disappointed.

*laughing so hard right now*

But yeah, I was not doing a sonnet.

[Birdframe_Prime]

1 hour ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

*laughing so hard right now*

But yeah, I was not doing a sonnet.

Unless you can Shakespeare while you combat, you lose points there.

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

Just now, Thaylien said:

Unless you can Shakespeare while you combat, you lose points there.

I may not be able to Shakespeare, but I can shake my Mag...

[Birdframe_Prime]

2 hours ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

I may not be able to Shakespeare, but I can shake my Mag...

Well, you shake your Mag, I'll be over here racing my Zephyr XD