Oberon Feedback 20.3.1 and beyond

[-Onyx-Phalian]

3 minutes ago, Music4Therapy said:

Both of them are sources I wouldn't necessarily trust. There is a great video above from Meme Sage that shows his view, I suggest you check that out and let me know what you think. I watched all 3 vids, btw.

Well it's just that Tactical Potato and Mogamu are well known Warframe YouTubers who even have a large amount of respect from DE themselves. So with even big names in the Warframe community raising their voice about it, it would increase out chances of being heard by DE. 

 

Though I would admit that both bring up different problems with Oberon. TP bringing up Oberon's terrible energy consumption with little way to get any energy back while Mogamu brings up more mechanical problems about Smite's scaling and Reckoning's doing a lot of little things which amount to lots of nothing. 

Edited April 29, 2017 by Phalian

[Music4Therapy]

1 minute ago, Phalian said:

Well it's just that Tactical Potato and Mogamu are well known Warframe YouTubers who even have a large amount of respect from DE themselves. So with even big names in the Warframe community raising their voice about it, it would increase out chances of being heard by DE. 

Very true. I don't think that they realize that all of his issues are caused by him being heavily energy gated. Solve the energy issue, and everything else falls in line.

[-Onyx-Phalian]

Just now, Music4Therapy said:

Very true. I don't think that they realize that all of his issues are caused by him being heavily energy gated. Solve the energy issue, and everything else falls in line.

Actually that was the main topic of Tactical Potato's point. 

[(XBOX)VIOLATER X]

I dont know why oberon got a rework i thought his abilities were fine and had great synergy. The only problem i saw was his second and third abilities. His second doesnt match his abilites in terms of how builds on Oberon usually work ( i suggest a drain ability rather than duration based ). His second i think just needed a buff cuz it's fine in utility and works with his kit. Oberon did need a rework but what he got was an overhaul and from what i've seen it's not being well received lol. I loved the old bro but im afraid console one of my favorite frames are gonna be dead for im pretty sure some of you PC players feel the same.. side note why are they working on oberon and not say hydroid (kit seems fine just kinda lackluster), trinity (shes good but im getting tired of spamming my second), mesas fourth costs way too much for lower mr's, geuss people without zenurik are screwed, same for inaros his thirds a joke literally (darude sandstorm). I could go on but out of all the people i played with who use Oberon more than other frames i never heard he needs a rework not a buff.. anyway im not bashing DE i love this game just they done goofed remember how they did a little rework on volt and fixed it up a little later, hoping that happens so i can enjoy Oberon instead of putting him the closet.               Let me know if this xbox scrub knows what he's talking about or if i've learned nothing after 2+ years

[pavlo555]

Just now, Xydeth said:

i mean as it currently is ingame sorry.

greetings

Well, no problem.

Good evening!  At least it is for me.

 

[booty_hunter]

12 hours ago, RobWasHere said:

After today's few runs with Bro, I concluded that he desperately need some mechanic to get energy back, that I was sceptical before. Current Renewal is great, sometimes its hard to get allies to stay on carpet before casting, but 80 hp/s is ok to facetank non Trooper enemy in sortie 3. Why my opinion changed? Because of energy per target.

I had a run along with Nekros and Nidus. Renewal affected both shadows and maggots, sucking out of energy faster than Resonating Quake at 20 stacks. Oberon's pool is not big. That crippled me a lot. As renewal target every ally, specters, pets, minions makes it unusable.

Either remove cost per target or make some mechanic for Oberon to get energy back. Not to mention that his carpet is still too small.

Couldnt agree with you more here. making it only drain energy (or only buff) on frames will make him near perfect. Oberon Prime is coming soon^tm within the next two weeks. So I expect this problem will be fixed when he has a higher energy pool.

[n_0x]

2 hours ago, LokiTheCondom said:

Problem is he's incredibly underwhelming in doing everything at once.

Nidus is the Warframe who does too much of everything. 

1. Damage (Virulence and Ravenous) 

2. Tank (Parasitic Link)

3. CC (Larva and Ravenous)

4. Utility (Larva)

5. Heal (Ravenous)

6. Buff (Parasitic Link)

Wanting Oberon to be at least subpar to Nidus ain't too much to ask, y'know?

Yeah but nidus and by subsect inaros, do have a painfully obvious weakness: they have no shields. So the reason why nidus (and to a very lesser degree inaros) have their kits is for the high survivability that they need to function. 
I mean we have 3 true Jack of all Trades frames, two of which are actually functional and have clear weaknesses (inaros and nidus) and one that clearly has had issues so much that people asked for a rework. Not a buff but a rework. Because honestly speaking the question that everyone seems to want to look over and not ever want to answer still persits with oberon: "compared to who?"

In terms of just ability and no feelings being involved, who is oberon honestly filling a role for?

 

[Ardhanarishvara]

Oberon still needs a little more work, I think, though I am quite happy with the direction he's gone, and only hope for him to go further in this direction.

My outline:

STATS: 225 base energy, please. 200 minimum.

Passive: Add damage buff to pets, too.

Smite: Needs synergy with Reckoning. Would strongly suggest that in addition to the projectiles, shards also drop out of the target, similar to using Polarize, being about 15% of health/shields spread across them, multiplied by the enemy's armour rating so it can properly scale with Grineer, potentially but not necessarily with the bonus damage multiplier of the armour rating only being targeted against Grineer, like using a faction-specific damage weapon mod. These shards could then be picked up by Reckoning, and when slammed down, will explode, dealing additional damage. Additionally, upon being slammed by Reckoning, the shards will, as with enemy death, have a 50% chance of yielding health orbs. Would also suggest a 10% chance of energy orbs.
OPTIONAL: Would also ALSO suggest a 25% chance of "Armour Orbs", green orbs which would sort of act like a significantly weaker Health Conversion with longer duration.

Hallowed Ground: Strongly suggest a clear border line like it used to have. Furthermore, having to herd your teammates onto Hallowed Ground just so you can offer them the Iron Renewal buff is not a pleasant experience. Iron Renewal already has a duration mechanic for when Renewal is no longer active, so make it so that the buff is applied when teammates who are under the effect of Renewal step onto Hallowed Ground, and the duration will engage when they leave Hallowed Ground's area of effect, encouraging them to stay tight with their teammates. Make it so that if they stay on Hallowed Ground, but Oberon runs out of energy to keep Renewal up, they can still refresh the effect as long as there is a Hallowed Ground active.

Renewal: Would strongly suggest to offer Iron Renewal to the casting Oberon right off the bat, since he is expending energy to keep it up, the effect of which would be doubled if standing on Hallowed Ground. Would also suggest 25m healing AURA, with a short duration of remaining for when they leave its influence, similar to Iron Renewal. If a teammate is ahead of you in the mission, it becomes basically impossible for Renewal's initial wave to reach them and connect, forcing you to recast once you catch up. Also the team heal cost is a little bit too strict and makes it painful to use Oberon with anything other than absolutely maximum efficiency. If the whole team starts taking damage, you can run out of energy basically instantly even if running maximum power efficiency with not insignificant duration. It'd be nice if efficiency and/or duration could affect the cost of teammate healing.

Reckoning: No additional suggestions aside from the synergy with Smite.

Edited April 30, 2017 by Ardhanarishvara
Energy costs becoming a concern / Armour scaling on abilities should be handled carefully. / Reduced energy cost for team healing.

[-Onyx-Phalian]

1 minute ago, MarrikBroom said:

Thought. What if Reckoning was his energy regain mechanic? As in every enemy picked up by reckoning gives Oberon ten energy if they already suffer radiation. 

I would like Reckoning to receive the buffs suggested by Mogamu (increase to Armor Shred, marking targets so when they die in X seconds they have a 100% chance to drop Health Orbs instead of a 50% when killed by Reckoning) and move the energy regain to a suggestion above where Smite rewards Oberon with energy for each orb which hits an already Radiated enemy. This would allow synergy with Reckoning and Hallowed Ground as both give out Radiation like candy 

[Leonix13]

So here we have the Oberon rework that takes a frame with powers on top of powers, only to add more powers and "synergy" just to make one build good(ish)... What Oberon really needs is some of these powers to have a few effects removed so he can be properly focused.

Lets take Smite for starters... We have a single target spell with no travel time that causes knockdown, rad proc, and damage. In addition is also flings out orbs to strike again at random targets for damage and a puncture proc... Why does it have all that? It is a nuke or CC? Instead of adding scaling damage that still ends up meaningless let get rid of some of these random effects to make a power called Smite live up to it's name.

Renewal, here we have a power thats a short range, channeling, heal over time, that cleanses status, increases bleedout timers, and now it becomes "good" if you stack it with Hallowed Ground, and a Syndicate mod... Again a power with tons of bloated effects that becomes excuses as to why its not powerful enough to stand on it's own without a special mod and evtra other spell.

The list goes on, but its my hope is that come Monday DE looks at him and instead of messing with 1 power that has 7 effects to make it just ok they trim out a lot of unnecessary effects so each power can be good at it's intended role... Let Smite hit like the fist of god, let Hallowed Ground be your team's sanctuary, let Renewal bring you new life, and let Reckoning be the proper judgement to evil. 

Edited April 29, 2017 by Leonix13

[0scarmag]

even with the revist he feels so bad compared to everyone. I mean Nidus ult heals more then a support and i don't think Nidus is support. Is Oberon bad or am i just bad? cause it feels like every other warframe is better then Oberon

[Olianu]

So far I've been using him and have no real complaints.  His synergy and the damage scaling is a noticeable and positive change.  My only problem is I didn't see his passive working on my kubrow.  And thank you DE for keeping with his balance theme.

[Music4Therapy]

13 minutes ago, Phalian said:

I would like Reckoning to receive the buffs suggested by Mogamu (increase to Armor Shred, marking targets so when they die in X seconds they have a 100% chance to drop Health Orbs instead of a 50% when killed by Reckoning) and move the energy regain to a suggestion above where Smite rewards Oberon with energy for each orb which hits an already Radiated enemy. This would allow synergy with Reckoning and Hallowed Ground as both give out Radiation like candy 

I don't agree with the armor buff, I believe that if the Smite synergy that I suggested above that you mentioned were to be implemented it would be enough to where you could replace efficiency you were previously required to have with power strength to the bridge the gap. That said, I really hope the Smite change is implemented. (while you are on Hallowed Ground, projectiles created by Smite generate energy when they hit a target)

17 minutes ago, MarrikBroom said:

Thought. What if Reckoning was his energy regain mechanic? As in every enemy picked up by reckoning gives Oberon ten energy if they already suffer radiation.

It would  turn him into a mash 4 frame. His 4 would CC, enemies, apply radiation, deal increased damage due to targets being radiated, give him energy, and completely strip enemies of armor. Thats why I believe Smite, Hallowed Ground, or both should have the energy mechanic. You would cast Hallowed Ground, throw up Iron Renewal, be able to upkeep your energy via Smite's projectiles and use excess energy on Reckoning which would then strip enemies of armor, which in turn would cause the scaling Smite damage to be more effective.

Edited April 29, 2017 by Music4Therapy

[Netzwerkfehler]

After the recent renewal changes oberon no longer receives ev during renewal.

He just became a decent option for "fun" raids. CC immunity and phenix augment are very to carry lesser experienced players.

 

It should either work like effigy (disables es and zenurik, ev possible) or like Pacify & Provoke (all energy restore methods work). His Raid gameplay suffers a lot from this change.

Also it would be very good, if the armor buff is part of renewals base ability. When hit by renewal while on hallowed ground you get to keep the cc immunity buff instead.

 

Another approach would be to replace his still bad passive with "Oberon converts damage to him and his allies into energy

[Ardhanarishvara]

I do believe that, due to his bonus armour and health regain functions, Oberon is quite well suited to using Rage for managing his energy. I don't particularly think he needs a dedicated energy regain mechanic, just a larger starting pool.

Edited April 29, 2017 by Ardhanarishvara
Enemy --> Energy, elaboration.

[(XBOX)AFLIBERATOR]

Just want to spread this link to Mogamu's breakdown video for Oberon'a rework. Very well detailed explanation and presentation to back it up, recommend watch.

 

[Leonix13]

Oberon's synergy should be in his passive imo... Something like "Powers cost X energy less for not casting the same power twice"... This encourages you to be active with all of his powers and discourages spam while helping with energy consumption. Synergy for the sake of synergy is a trap that is currently the cause of new problems on top of old problems. 

[KX297]

There are a lot of complaints.

Some are just dumb.

Some are well thought out. 

Some people don't want to learn the new mechanics. Some are fine learning them.

Though, learning the new mechanics and adapting to a new play style doesn't mean that there aren't still issues with Oberon. 

He's still VERY energy inefficient.

Currently, I only feel that I can carry out my job well when running max efficiency with Rage. Which is unfortunate, becuase that eats three mod slots. 

But hey, he is FOR SURE better than what he was, and I suppose that's what really matters. 

Honestly, while I wouldn't mind him getting some way to refund his energy or cut the costs down, I wouldn't really be mad if they didn't add one.

Really, I'd be fine if they just buffed the Hallowed Ground base range by a fair margin and made it a FRIGGEN CIRCLE. 

I don't know why they insist on having these wierd Hallowed Ground shapes, but that is what irritates me more than anything. That, and that while they are trying to force us to use and fight on Hallowed Ground, they still havn't buffed its rather lame range.

Buff the range and make it 360°.

That would make me a happy Oberon.

Anything more is icing on the cake.

But that's just my opinion from playing him after the most recent changes.

[-Onyx-Phalian]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)AFLIBERATOR said:

Just want to spread this link to Mogamu's breakdown video for Oberon'a rework. Very well detailed explanation and presentation to back it up, recommend watch.

 

I have mentioned this before that both he and Tactical Potato have both put their hats in the ring about the problem's of Oberon's rework. 

tl;dr for both videos

Tactical Potato's video is about how Oberon's mandatory ability spam compared to his lack of energy gain + moderate energy pool causes a large problem wuickly

Mogamu's video is more of the scaling problems of Smite and Reckoning's clunkyness of trying to juggle too many things at once and failing at each because it doesn't do enough of one thing. 

AGayGuyPlays has even mentioned about the visuals (or more the lack there of) for Hallowed Ground and has mentioned his interest in Earth remastered style grass and Silver Grove style plants to make it more visually noticeable and make it more obvious of his nature background. 

[Leonix13]

Oberon has too much bloat! We have powers with 4-8 effects each, and they are holding him back. DE needs to trim out these unnecessary effects to make each better at what they are suppose to be... Smite has 5 major effects, and at least 3 are ether useless, unreliable, or redundant.

Stop adding effects, find what he heeds and get rid of the rest... Why does Renewal need 8 effects, and a Syndicate mod to be only "good"? Make it good on its own, and stop having extra effects hold it back.

[October0Night]

19 minutes ago, Olianu said:

So far I've been using him and have no real complaints.  His synergy and the damage scaling is a noticeable and positive change.  My only problem is I didn't see his passive working on my kubrow.  And thank you DE for keeping with his balance theme.

His pet revive passive is instant the sec your pet goes down it's back up happens so fast if you are not watching closely you will miss it. But it only happens once.

Edited April 29, 2017 by October0Night

[(XBOX)AFLIBERATOR]

4 minutes ago, Phalian said:

I have mentioned this before that both he and Tactical Potato have both put their hats in the ring about the problem's of Oberon's rework. 

tl;dr for both videos

Tactical Potato's video is about how Oberon's mandatory ability spam compared to his lack of energy gain + moderate energy pool causes a large problem wuickly

Mogamu's video is more of the scaling problems of Smite and Reckoning's clunkyness of trying to juggle too many things at once and failing at each because it doesn't do enough of one thing. 

AGayGuyPlays has even mentioned about the visuals (or more the lack there of) for Hallowed Ground and has mentioned his interest in Earth remastered style grass and Silver Grove style plants to make it more visually noticeable and make it more obvious of his nature background. 

Nice to see someone that has done their research, From what I can see from all these videos is that the issues Mogamu mentions are of more importance than TP & GGP. What TP says about the energy pool does merit some credit if Oberon was a caster frame, since he is a versatility frame he should only use his abilities at the right time and place. As for GGP visual is not that important since the buffs remain active for a short duration and I can only see myself use it for emergency buff and defense missions for extra damage. The rework and hotfixes so far are going in the right direction.

[Netzwerkfehler]

Why did renewal get nerfed? You do NOT gain energy from ev during renewal anymore. He just became a useful option to carry lesser experienced ppl through raids and now the nerf hammer strikes.

At least give us a reason

[Iccotak]

13 minutes ago, KX297 said:

I'd be fine if they just buffed the Hallowed Ground base range by a fair margin and made it a FRIGGEN CIRCLE. 

The more you increase your range it completes the circle

[-Onyx-Phalian]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)AFLIBERATOR said:

Nice to see someone that has done their research, From what I can see from all these videos is that the issues Mogamu mentions are of more importance than TP & GGP. What TP says about the energy pool does merit some credit if Oberon was a caster frame, since he is a versatility frame he should only use his abilities at the right time and place. As for GGP visual is not that important since the buffs remain active for a short duration and I can only see myself use it for emergency buff and defense missions for extra damage. The rework and hotfixes so far are going in the right direction.

The only problem is that we can't let up yet. If we want Oberon to truly shine along with the other warframes who have been released recently and received great reworks (aka, those who aren't Ash, lord knows he needs to be put right back on that list) because as of right now, he is slightly better than before but no where close to his competition.