Founder's thoughts on umbra?

[(PSN)cdzbrbr]

7 minutes ago, Vitrescence said:

Primes ARE Upgrades. However. He was made back then Primes were still being modified and tweeked, as someone else stated in the thread before. If Excal was released now, he'd be the upgrade. When they do their tweek for him, he should be (hopefully will be). 

You forgot to quote the rest. He was fairly made an upgrade to excalibur. I will repeat myself: I'd eb bothered too if Excal Prime was worse than Umbra. He'll be not, rest assured.

[Lockheed]

1 minute ago, Varacal said:

then wouldnt the ones that should be complaining the ones from chinaframe and not the founders from our servers?

Except that it de-values both Umbra and Excal-Prime by releasing Umbra here.

[Ryko]

If I was a founder..and i paid for excal prime

I still wouldnt care if  they released excal umbra vandal prime wraith

Its a virtual item...grow up kid

[Lockheed]

1 minute ago, (PS4)cdzbrbr said:

You forgot to quote the rest. He was fairly made an upgrade to excalibur. I will repeat myself: I'd eb bothered too if Excal Prime was worse than Umbra. He'll be not, rest assured.

Excalibur Prime has a 25 armour increase on his stats (225 base, 250 Prime). There really isn't any room for Umbra to be a global upgrade to base Excalibur without either A) changing the stats to Excalibur Prime a fair bit,  or B) Simply making Umbra better than Excalibur Prime.

[GKDK]

4 minutes ago, Miro_X said:

Except that it de-values both Umbra and Excal-Prime by releasing Umbra here.

Why do we have to care about that? 

Why do we even have to care about how Warframe China founders feel? They don't even have anything to do with us. Heck they don't even call this game Warframe LMAO

Edited May 4, 2017 by GKDK

[Syndrella]

2 minutes ago, Vitrescence said:

Woah, what? So basically kick out all the founders since they aren't needed anymore?

 

Ouch.

Nope, I meant they are not the same weight anymore as they had in the beginnings and I am sure I paid more for this game than the many founders did. I said the promise and "pact" there were no pact just a promise from the devs to not re relase the founder packs to anothrs which was a short and bad promise from the devs side what they said in some devstreams ago but that happens the life going on. This not mean in the future this won't changing because the remaining founders cannot do so much only coming back with a lawsuit but there is no really anything in terms which why they could do. I am on the side those whom paid for something they would be welcomed but not for restricting and removing others to experience the same things what they did. That is just unfair and unethical.

[(PSN)cdzbrbr]

Just now, Miro_X said:

Excalibur Prime has a 25 armour increase on his stats (225 base, 250 Prime). There really isn't any room for Umbra to be a global upgrade to base Excalibur without either A) changing the stats to Excalibur Prime a fair bit,  or B) Simply making Umbra better than Excalibur Prime.

In my eyes and I really hope you agree with me, the fairest thing is to give that same 25 armor buff. No more, no less. Definetly don't trust wiki on this one (that's where you got the global upgrade thing from, right?).

[ShinseiArashi]

Wow.. Some of you really don't get where I'm coming from.

 

"No, it wouldn't because what happens in China frame doesn't matter, as long as they are not releasing the founders items that were already contractually exclusive before they got the rights to offer the game there. Excel umbra is not stepping on any founders toes because he will not be the only umbra and the founders still have their exclusive."

 

Releasing Excal Umbra IS stepping on Founders toes. Maybe not our founders, but China-Founders. Excal Umbra came out with their Founder Pack, and deserves to remain exclusive to them as a result.

 

 

"then wouldnt the ones that should be complaining the ones from chinaframe and not the founders from our servers?"

Maybe, but considering I'm a Founder myself, and know how I would feel if DE released Excal Prime in China, of course I'll defend them.

 

 

"But we have their Nikana Prime and Spira Prime already which was their Lato prime and Skana Prime. Quite obvious DE doesn't care. I greatly believe regardless this year or not, Excalibur Umbra will come to us as per China's founder pack. 

It's the thorn in DE's side with it ALWAYS being questioned and they have always responded on Devstreams that if they have news they will share. They didn't block it out like they did with Hema. "

I could be wrong, but as far as I know our Saryn Prime was out just before China's Founder pack. If it came after, then there's one kick in the balls for China Founder's already, and I, in no way, support another.

[NeithanDiniem]

4 minutes ago, Miro_X said:

Except that it de-values both Umbra and Excal-Prime by releasing Umbra here.

It doesn't devalue umbra at all when China frame were the ones that came to DE with the idea for Umbra being their founders package and that he would NOT be exclusive to them alone.

[Echo]

Just now, Syndrella said:

Nope, I meant they are not the same weight anymore as they had in the beginnings and I am sure I paid more for this game than the many founders did. I said the promise and "pact" there were no pact just a promise from the devs to not re relase the founder packs to anothrs which was a short and bad promise from the devs side what they said in some devstreams ago but that happens the life going on. This not mean in the future this won't changing because the remaining founders cannot do so much only coming back with a lawsuit but there is no really anything in terms which why they could do. I am on the side those whom paid for something they would be welcomed but not for restricting and removing others to experience the same things what they did. That is just unfair and unethical.

I don't even wanna talk about how much money I have poured into this game, ON TOP of my founder packs. Many other Founders are in the same boat with tons of money put into this game. Just because they are founders doesn't mean they stopped putting money into a game they loved. If it was not for founders, you wouldn't have the Warframe you have today. 

No one is coming back with a lawsuit either, we just want to make sure that we aren't getting screwed over by a bad decision.

[Phatose]

Look, any way it's a moot point.  If DE were just going to release it as a simple Excalibur Prime alternative, they would've done so already.  DE realizes that playing technical genie, and holding to the letter of an agreement without holding to the spirit of the agreement is a bad idea.   Especially when they're stilling selling Exclusivity, demonstrating that the Exclusivity you're selling is subject to obsolescence isn't going to help your sales.

No sense in getting worked up over entitled non-founders wanting DE to play technical genie just because they missed the boat.

 

[ShinseiArashi]

1 minute ago, Syndrella said:

Nope, I meant they are not the same weight anymore as they had in the beginnings and I am sure I paid more for this game than the many founders did. I said the promise and "pact" there were no pact just a promise from the devs to not re relase the founder packs to anothrs which was a short and bad promise from the devs side what they said in some devstreams ago but that happens the life going on. This not mean in the future this won't changing because the remaining founders cannot do so much only coming back with a lawsuit but there is no really anything in terms which why they could do. I am on the side those whom paid for something they would be welcomed but not for restricting and removing others to experience the same things what they did. That is just unfair and unethical.

HA! You paid more for this game than Founder's have? Where's the math to support this?

You do realize that most Founder's have likely continued supporting Warframe and DE right?

Like myself for example, I've bought SEVERAL complete Prime Access packs, in addition to the odd bit of Plat. I've easily put well over $1000 into this game. So please do not go around assuming that Founder's haven't continued to support the game.

[NeithanDiniem]

1 minute ago, Syndrella said:

Nope, I meant they are not the same weight anymore as they had in the beginnings and I am sure I paid more for this game than the many founders did. I said the promise and "pact" there were no pact just a promise from the devs to not re relase the founder packs to anothrs which was a short and bad promise from the devs side what they said in some devstreams ago but that happens the life going on. This not mean in the future this won't changing because the remaining founders cannot do so much only coming back with a lawsuit but there is no really anything in terms which why they could do. I am on the side those whom paid for something they would be welcomed but not for restricting and removing others to experience the same things what they did. That is just unfair and unethical.

A bill of sale is a legally binding contract and said bill had a confirmation requiring a digital signature that verified that the one signing knew the binding aspects of the sale regarding the exclusivity if the item. It was not just a promise. Do better yourself and learn some more about digital sales and laws regarding them.

[Ryko]

Whats the big deal about excal prime?

Do founder use excal prime exclusively? Do they not use any other warframe? If they do use other frames Im guessing excal prime sits on the shelf as much as regular excal. Unless of course they want to just flash their prime in a relay ..

Meh.

[NeithanDiniem]

5 minutes ago, ShinseiArashi said:

Wow.. Some of you really don't get where I'm coming from.

 

"No, it wouldn't because what happens in China frame doesn't matter, as long as they are not releasing the founders items that were already contractually exclusive before they got the rights to offer the game there. Excel umbra is not stepping on any founders toes because he will not be the only umbra and the founders still have their exclusive."

 

Releasing Excal Umbra IS stepping on Founders toes. Maybe not our founders, but China-Founders. Excal Umbra came out with their Founder Pack, and deserves to remain exclusive to them as a result.

 

 

"then wouldnt the ones that should be complaining the ones from chinaframe and not the founders from our servers?"

Maybe, but considering I'm a Founder myself, and know how I would feel if DE released Excal Prime in China, of course I'll defend them.

 

 

"But we have their Nikana Prime and Spira Prime already which was their Lato prime and Skana Prime. Quite obvious DE doesn't care. I greatly believe regardless this year or not, Excalibur Umbra will come to us as per China's founder pack. 

It's the thorn in DE's side with it ALWAYS being questioned and they have always responded on Devstreams that if they have news they will share. They didn't block it out like they did with Hema. "

I could be wrong, but as far as I know our Saryn Prime was out just before China's Founder pack. If it came after, then there's one kick in the balls for China Founder's already, and I, in no way, support another.

China founders knew in advance before the offer was made that their founders pack was not exclusive. It was THEIR idea. Stop assuming they are upset about it when you aren't one of them.

Edited May 4, 2017 by NeithanDiniem

[Syndrella]

Just now, Vitrescence said:

I don't even wanna talk about how much money I have poured into this game, ON TOP of my founder packs. Many other Founders are in the same boat with tons of money put into this game. Just because they are founders doesn't mean they stopped putting money into a game they loved. If it was not for founders, you wouldn't have the Warframe you have today. 

No one is coming back with a lawsuit either, we just want to make sure that we aren't getting screwed over by a bad decision.

Already screwed with bad decisions when you guys got the primes. I was founder also in another game but with a clear and good communication we secured a game developing and that pack does not do with anything with that said games only miscleanusses which good for me and doesn't bother others. If they re release the prime access for this then they must ask the same price for it that is lowering the annoyance but we are not the same, many can be annoyed with things like these others get it better.

[ShinseiArashi]

1 minute ago, LeNinja_RyKo said:

Whats the big deal about excal prime?

Do founder use excal prime exclusively? Do they not use any other warframe? If they do use other frames Im guessing excal prime sits on the shelf as much as regular excal. Unless of course they want to just flash their prime in a relay ..

Meh.

Imo the big deal isn't even Excal Umbra or Prime. The big issue is, imo, the ethics and morality behind releasing a Founder's item, an exclusive item, to another portion of the world FOR FREE.

[Varacal]

2 minutes ago, LeNinja_RyKo said:

Whats the big deal about excal prime?

Do founder use excal prime exclusively? Do they not use any other warframe? If they do use other frames Im guessing excal prime sits on the shelf as much as regular excal. Unless of course they want to just flash their prime in a relay ..

and its value only returns when there's a topic about excal, like in this case

[Echo]

Just now, Syndrella said:

Already screwed with bad decisions when you guys got the primes. I was founder also in another game but with a clear and good communication we secured a game developing and that pack does not do with anything with that said games only miscleanusses which good for me and doesn't bother others. If they re release the prime access for this then they must ask the same price for it that is lowering the annoyance but we are not the same, many can be annoyed with things like these others get it better.

I suggest you read the responses above that were directed at you. You are saying a lot of statements that are completely false.

[Syndrella]

3 minutes ago, ShinseiArashi said:

HA! You paid more for this game than Founder's have? Where's the math to support this?

You do realize that most Founder's have likely continued supporting Warframe and DE right?

Like myself for example, I've bought SEVERAL complete Prime Access packs, in addition to the odd bit of Plat. I've easily put well over $1000 into this game. So please do not go around assuming that Founder's haven't continued to support the game.

As I do and I suppose I paid too a tons of money because I like the game like you. I am not in your money pocket so just accept the fact I did a lot for the game and not needed in return nothing.

[Freezing-Dragon]

We don't know the mechanics for umbra... yet I still seeing Founders 'complains' about it.

Seriously..

You got what you PAID for:

The FOUNDER Sigil

FOUNDER badges

what else you want?

We are getting the EXCALIBUR UMBRA not Excalibur Umbra Prime

Until more info about Umbra, it still in fogged of mystery.

[ShinseiArashi]

1 minute ago, NeithanDiniem said:

China founders knew in advance before the offer was made that their founders pack was not exclusive. It was THEIR idea. Stop assuming they are upset about it when you aren't one of them.

When did I ever assume they are upset about this? If anything as a Founder I'm the one upset about this because I don't want the same S#&$ happening to the Exclusive content I paid for as a Founder.

[Echo]

3 minutes ago, LeNinja_RyKo said:

Whats the big deal about excal prime?

Do founder use excal prime exclusively? Do they not use any other warframe? If they do use other frames Im guessing excal prime sits on the shelf as much as regular excal. Unless of course they want to just flash their prime in a relay ..

Meh.

Dunno about you, but a few of us actually like using him in missions. :)

[Yurugani]

57 minutes ago, (PS4)cdzbrbr said:

Didn't mean to insult. It was a genuine question. 

i see you have a fiancee so you're not a kid.

Bear with me:

Lamborghini released a few limited models (think of them as warframes).: Reventon in 2007, sesto elemento in 2010, veneno later on, can't remember the year.

You think a reventon owner is complaining at lamborghini for sesto elemento and veneno releases?

No they're not. That's how (successful) adults deal with the thing. I should say that the veneno eat the crap out of the reventon too. (although reventon is still my fav lambo by far, trivial but had to share lol)

 

---

Wanted to start off by saying while you might think you're not trying to be rude or throw insults around or whatever, but that's exactly what you are doing. You're essentially saying to everybody who's disagreeing with you "Grow the f**k up kid, you're r3tarded if you don't.". Everybody is different, everybody does things a different way than you and all "successful" adults deal with things in different ways and might not even deal with it. There are billions of people with billions of different ways of doing things. Not everything is the same as you say it is so grow up and realize that and stop belittling anybody who thinks otherwise.

---

Now to get into your statement. As Vitrescence said:

51 minutes ago, Vitrescence said:

This is a different case, however. It's like comparing apples to oranges. Cars are a different area than Videogames. Cars, Watches, etc. Those all have "limited releases" for their items - it's an accepted and sought after thing in those particular fields. (Nice car choice btw). In a game like this, it's a different story. When it's said that there will be a specific item given to players that will be exclusive to them for helping out, that means they shouldn't release the same thing again under a different name. It may be "Umbra" it may look "different" but it is China's Prime. So it's a free Prime. 

I wouldn't mind as much if it was like, a skin, or something like that. I can only hope that it doesn't reduce our NA Excal Prime to a Paperweight in my inventory. With no value what so ever.

A statement I 100% agree with.

Now, you're comparing a car that wasn't marketed as exclusive, one that can be shown off daily, used to get to and from places and even sold if they need to, to an exclusive digital item. Anybody buying the Sesto Elemento did not buy it knowing/thinking "This is an exclusive thing that nobody else will be able to get ever again.". It's a car that 20 of were produced, but those can be sold and bought so it doesn't make it exclusive to a specific person forever, if they decide to sell it. So on that, if they felt anything short of "Oh. Huh." to the Veneno being released, then they could easily sell their Sesto Elemento to get a Veneno. Everybody buying Excalibur Prime went into it knowing "Hey this is an exclusive item that nobody else can get ever again and I get it for helping out the developers of this game and when I get it I have it permanently and cannot trade or sell it.". Umbra, as others have said, would illicit a feeling of betrayal and "Why did I even buy this if people could just wait a couple years and get something better." and how it would just be a giant middle finger to all of the founders to who spent alot of money on Excalibur Prime.

I don't have much else to say as most others have touched on it already.

Good day.

Edited May 4, 2017 by _Kekka_

[Lockheed]

8 minutes ago, ShinseiArashi said:

HA! You paid more for this game than Founder's have? Where's the math to support this?

You do realize that most Founder's have likely continued supporting Warframe and DE right?

Like myself for example, I've bought SEVERAL complete Prime Access packs, in addition to the odd bit of Plat. I've easily put well over $1000 into this game. So please do not go around assuming that Founder's haven't continued to support the game.

You and me both. I have thousands of hours in this game, and have paid several hundred dollars, between the founders pack and the prime access. Founders have and do continue to support this game.

 

10 minutes ago, (PS4)cdzbrbr said:

In my eyes and I really hope you agree with me, the fairest thing is to give that same 25 armor buff. No more, no less. Definetly don't trust wiki on this one (that's where you got the global upgrade thing from, right?).

Again, should he not be the intermediary between Excalibur Prime and Excalibur Base, all this is doing is making a second Excalibur Prime, something which was supposed to be an item exclusive to Founders. I don't mind if he's a "global upgrade" but IMHO he shouldn't be matching the Prime Warframe stats, just like the Dragon Nikana doesn't match the Nikana Prime's stats.

Edited May 4, 2017 by Miro_X
grammar edit