The new Zenurik... Just no

[Emulad0or]

8 minutes ago, Serenna187 said:

so your suggestion is..to build any and all frames with max efficiency and kill any form of build diversity?

No, I'm not, but if you want to spam abilities, you will need max efficiency, but you don't want to spam and only want to use when necessarie, you don't need all the efficiency, it goes from your gameplay. What you want is to be able to spam abilities without the efficiency. You have to adapt your build to your playstile or adapt your playstile to your build, if you can only play the game one way (spamming abilities), then yes, only that build (efficiency) will work for you... 

12 minutes ago, Nirrel said:

LOL, really? 6.25 ? You are talking about max efficiency build max efficiency build wich means that generally speaking probably it's not even worth anymore to cast it's so gimped. Why aren't you coming up with an example usable in game

Again, yesterday's sortie with the Nyx, I use that build as my main, I use all her skills (maybe not in every mission, but on situations) and I have no problem whatsoever with full efficiency and Mind Control, Psychic Bolts or Chaos, and my build doesn't even get to 130% Duration because I focus more on range and efficiency. Hey, 6.25 and I get to have that eximus heavy gunner as a pet for over 30 sec? That sounds pretty usable in game to me...

[Tizodd]

5 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

...if you want to spam abilities, you will need max efficiency...

Without some form of energy regen, it's impossible to spam abilities for any length of time.  Energy Overflow made it possible to use abilities without depending on energy pizzas or an EV Trinity.  Removing energy overflow will slow the game quite a bit.

[DE] really needs to give frames innate energy regen.  Otherwise we might as well be playing any of the other countless generic shooters out there.

[Gurpgork]

1 hour ago, Emulad0or said:

This is the problem right here, you just want to spam all your skills without even thinking or planning...

I can't speak for anyone else in this thread, but what I want isn't another OP infinite energy exploit. What I want is a concrete, consistent way to know exactly how much energy I'm going to have in a mission so that I can think or plan for it. With Energy Overflow, I can take my duration and my efficiency and weigh it against my energy gain and know exactly how often I will be able to use my abilities. That's something that I simply cannot do with energy orbs. I could get 30 of them in 5 minutes, or I could get zero, and I have absolutely no way of knowing how much energy I'm going to have until the loot is on the floor.

And if infinite abiliity spam is what you're concerned about (and it is a legitimate problem), then why are you going after Energy Overflow of all things? Energy Overflow is powerful, yes, but it's hardly broken. It's simply not going to let you bypass the energy economy and spam every ability indiscriminately at minimum efficiency, like everybody seems to make it out to be. Honestly, the only thing that breaks it is max efficiency, but only because it single-handedly lets you quadruple the effective power of the passive. 

If you want to curb ability spam, look at Team Restores, Energy Vampire, Thurible, Rage, and the efficiency stat, not at the one and only form of energy gain that's actually somewhat balanced. 

Edited October 3, 2017 by Gurpgork

[Serenna187]

26 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

No, I'm not, but if you want to spam abilities, you will need max efficiency, but you don't want to spam and only want to use when necessarie, you don't need all the efficiency, it goes from your gameplay. What you want is to be able to spam abilities without the efficiency. You have to adapt your build to your playstile or adapt your playstile to your build, if you can only play the game one way (spamming abilities), then yes, only that build (efficiency) will work for you... 

Most of my frames run either 130 or max efficiency if it makes sense.Only a handfull of frames run at basic or negative efficiency to actually use their potential,namely Atlas,Banshee,Chroma,armor strip Frost,Nidus,Octavia,Buff Rhino,Saryn.

My playstyle didn't change much once i switched over to the Zenurik focus,but it sure as hell was a damn QoL change i don't want to lose

To make it more understandable for the hardheads out there:
We got Google nowadays right?DE pulls the plug on your internet and hands you the 30 volume version of the Brockhaus Encyclopedia.
DE takes away your TV and hands you a thumb cinema
DE Takes your chair and replaces it with a shabby old log with a honeycoated branch right where you could sit
DE takes your chocolate and hands you a watery bio carrot and pats your hat
DE takes your car and gives you an old school bicycle without transmission

Hell DE is about to place Bucket Prime on Pillar Prime just like that

Edited October 3, 2017 by Serenna187

[Emulad0or]

15 minutes ago, Tizodd said:

[DE] really needs to give frames innate energy regen.  Otherwise we might as well be playing any of the other countless generic shooters out there.

No, they don't. With tons of energy, we could just spam abilities on every enemy, why would we need new weapons in the game? Just remove all weapons, leave just the MK1 so we can mod our Exalted weapons and let's just do it all with abilities... 

This is what I'm saying about building to your playstile, there are tons of ways to get energy aside from Energy Overload, we have Energy Siphon, Energy Orbs, Energy Pizzas, Arcane Energise, Rage, Trinity, Harrow... Want to go to the heat of the battle? Use a Rage. Want to quickly get energy to burst everyone? Use a pizza. Want consistent energy during the mission? Use Energy Siphon. Want everyone on your squad to have energy maxed during the mission? Get a Trinity.

10 minutes ago, Gurpgork said:

I can't speak for anyone else in this thread, but what I want isn't another OP infinite energy exploit. What I want is a concrete, consistent way to know exactly how much energy I'm going to have in a mission so that I can think or plan for it. With Energy Overflow, I can take my duration and my efficiency and weigh it against my energy gain and know exactly how often I will be able to use my abilities. That's something that I simply cannot do with energy orbs. I could get 30 of them in 5 minutes, or I could get zero, and I have absolutely no way of knowing how much energy I'm going to have until the loot is on the floor.

Energy Siphon does the same, only slower, without the 2min delay to start working, and for everyone on the squad. Why Energy Overflow then if not for the OP infinite energy exploit?

Energy Overflow is not the only way to get energy in the game, it's not even the only free and consistent way to get energy. The problem is that the people got to used to have that easy infinite energy regen and now they don't want to adapt to the new situation. One that you cannot cheese all the time with abilities.

2 minutes ago, Serenna187 said:

-snip-

DE gives you a weapon that can blow up rooms without even aiming (Simulor), gives you a 20m lightsaber that can kill anything it touches and you can leave it on forever before reloading (gammacor). Then, DE removes those things that made life so convinient for us, and we all stopped playing the game because of that... No, wait, we are still here, we adapted and found other ways, we had to relearn how to aim to actually kill enemies, we had to relearn to release the fire button to not run out of ammo. Now we just need to relearn to not press 1,2,3 or 4 every enemie we see.

[Serenna187]

4 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

No, they don't. With tons of energy, we could just spam abilities on every enemy, why would we need new weapons in the game? Just remove all weapons, leave just the MK1 so we can mod our Exalted weapons and let's just do it all with abilities... 

This is what I'm saying about building to your playstile, there are tons of ways to get energy aside from Energy Overload, we have Energy Siphon, Energy Orbs, Energy Pizzas, Arcane Energise, Rage, Trinity, Harrow... Want to go to the heat of the battle? Use a Rage. Want to quickly get energy to burst everyone? Use a pizza. Want consistent energy during the mission? Use Energy Siphon. Want everyone on your squad to have energy maxed during the mission? Get a Trinity.

Energy Siphon does the same, only slower, without the 2min delay to start working, and for everyone on the squad. Why Energy Overflow then if not for the OP infinite energy exploit?

Energy Overflow is not the only way to get energy in the game, it's not even the only free and consistent way to get energy. The problem is that the people got to used to have that easy infinite energy regen and now they don't want to adapt to the new situation. One that you cannot cheese all the time with abilities.

DE gives you a weapon that can blow up rooms without even aiming (Simulor), gives you a 20m lightsaber that can kill anything it touches and you can leave it on forever before reloading (gammacor). Then, DE removes those things that made life so convinient for us, and we all stopped playing the game because of that... No, wait, we are still here, we adapted and found other ways, we had to relearn how to aim to actually kill enemies, we had to relearn to release the fire button to not run out of ammo. Now we just need to relearn to not press 1,2,3 or 4 every enemie we see.

what keeps you from tossing 50 energy pizzas and spam anyway?nothing,do you do it?no.Do powers alone carry you through raids or sortie 3 alone?no unless its a mbf and you go limbo.

It's called Energy Overflow still.learn reading
lets see.Energy Siphon 0.6/sec gets you nowhere,Energy orbs highly rng,Energy Pizzas bandaid bs,Arcane Energize takes months to farm or costs 5k platinum in trade by now,Rage doesn't work on squishy frames or actual high level and is yet another bandaid,Trinity and Harrow did i mention rng already?
Do you actually play outside of clan squads' safety bubble where everything it set up perfectly?Or do you go to reruit chat for ever little fissure you want to play?

Other games utilize cooldowns but de scrapped that mechanic due to people camping all day long this way.straight up energy regen is a thing in most games,and now de scraps that too for the luls

those weapons were ditched and forgotten,the same will happen to any frame that doesn't fit the new sheme,well lets call this game equinox intead then

[Gurpgork]

15 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

This is what I'm saying about building to your playstile, there are tons of ways to get energy aside from Energy Overload, we have Energy Siphon, Energy Orbs, Energy Pizzas, Arcane Energise, Rage, Trinity, Harrow... Want to go to the heat of the battle? Use a Rage. Want to quickly get energy to burst everyone? Use a pizza. Want consistent energy during the mission? Use Energy Siphon. Want everyone on your squad to have energy maxed during the mission? Get a Trinity.

Once again, Trinity, Rage, and Team Restores are infinitely more broken than Energy Overflow will ever be. Why is Trinity giving an entire team a full energy pool in the blink of an eye completely acceptable, but 4 energy per second just for myself is completely overpowered and needs to be removed from the game? Sure, maybe 4 per second is a little too strong, and it could be reduced to 2 or 3 to make it more balanced, but Energy Overflow is an order of magnitude weaker than the other options you're repeatedly pointing to. 

17 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

Why Energy Overflow then if not for the OP infinite energy exploit?

It isn't overpowered, and it's certainly not overpowered if you compare it to the other ways we have to gain energy. It's only infinite energy if you have really high efficiency, or if the only thing you need to sustain with it is an extremely long duration-based buff.

At base efficiency, Energy Overflow is only enough energy to cast your first ability once every 6.25 seconds, and only enough to cast your 4th ability once every 25 seconds. That's nowhere near unlimited, but everybody who's in opposition of it seems to act like Energy Overflow gives you infinite energy forever regardless of how much efficiency you have, which is blatantly untrue. 

22 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

One that you cannot cheese all the time with abilities.

If I wanted to cheese everything with infinite ability spam, I wouldn't use Energy Overflow. I'd spam Team Restores and ask someone to play Trinity. All I do with Energy Overflow is run Chroma without Rage and run Banshee, Volt, and Mag with a little less efficiency (I'm talking 160% instead of 175%). Why is my Volt breaking the game while the actual methods for bypassing the energy economy entirely are completely okay?

[Emulad0or]

2 minutes ago, Serenna187 said:

what keeps you from tossing 50 energy pizzas and spam anyway?

200 pizzas cap per mission? The cost to buy and use those?

7 minutes ago, Serenna187 said:

those weapons were ditched and forgotten,the same will happen to any frame that doesn't fit the new sheme,well lets call this game equinox intead then

So because you can't play it that way, it will be forgotten? I like my Gammacor, thank you very much. You can't play anything other than Equinox? Play only Equinox then, I myself will keep playing with several frames. And this conversation is pointless, it is changing, you like it or not. Adapt or quit the game, not my problem.

6 minutes ago, Gurpgork said:

Once again, Trinity, Rage, and Team Restores are infinitely more broken than Energy Overflow will ever be. Why is Trinity giving an entire team a full energy pool in the blink of an eye completely acceptable, but 4 energy per second just for myself is completely overpowered and needs to be removed from the game? Sure, maybe 4 per second is a little too strong, and it could be reduced to 2 or 3 to make it more balanced, but Energy Overflow is an order of magnitude weaker than the other options you're repeatedly pointing to. 

True, but those have a cost, be it resources, the lack of another frame on the team, taking damage, while Energy Overflow is free, use it once, 4 energy/sec for the rest of the mission. What you were arguing is consistent energy regen to plan your build and gameplay around, we already have Energy Siphon that does exactly that.

10 minutes ago, Gurpgork said:

At base efficiency, Energy Overflow is only enough energy to cast your first ability once every 6.25 seconds, and only enough to cast your 4th ability once every 25 seconds. That's nowhere near unlimited, but everybody who's in opposition of it seems to act like Energy Overflow gives you infinite energy forever regardless of how much efficiency you have, which is blatantly untrue. 

Now, get your max efficincy AND Energy Overflow, and you cast or first ability once every 1.56~seconds. Some abilities have a longer cast delay than that. That's your inifite energy, you can spam 1 non stop and never run out of energy. Your 4? Once every 6.25 seconds. Isn't that a little too much? Yeah... 

14 minutes ago, Gurpgork said:

All I do with Energy Overflow is run Chroma without Rage and run Banshee, Volt, and Mag with a little less efficiency

So there is an easy fix, put Rage on your Chroma, and add more efficiency to the others. Problem solved. Will it change your build? Sure, little less strength on your Chroma maybe, not like losing 30% will keep him from staying alive... Again, just adapt

[Bloop]

While it is true we don't have something practical yet, to see how it actually turns out, it does sound bad at the moment. My only suggestion to changing it would be making it far more interactive, say:
-After focus activation, the operator will have 2 ''Void marks'', which will deploy on 2 enemies you dash through. Killing the marked enemies will either:
a) guarantee energy drop, and double roll the energy drop if it was set to happen on said enemy.
or b) regen x energy.
Then to balance it out (fun thing considering other energy sources) they could just give it a cooldown.
I don't really mind the energy overflow removal despite relying on it quite often as my build are usually energy hungry (80% efficiency and below, thanks to the fact that OE has opened nice paths to building differently), as I still have tons of pads and whatnot. However, it would be nice to have an interactive ability that affected both warframe and operator, but did it effectively.

[Serenna187]

Void dashing is the possibly worst solution they could've picked,the buble enforces camping,if you manage to deploy it in the first place without getting killed or having to wait 20 sec to switch to your glass operator due to a crappy host,if you survive that that is

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

2 hours ago, Mudfam said:

Do you even read?

My entire point from the very start is that I DON'T want to sit in a corner with a pizza or newfangled zenurik bubble. I want to stay mobile, and also use my abilities. I look for ways to play the game that are fun and still present some form of challenge, a hard balance to achieve when almost everything is disgustingly overpowered. I have zero interest in efficient farming of anything except the odd relic when a new prime has just been released.

Energy orbs just aren't an actual thing. If I can play 3 minutes straight or complete a mission without seeing a single one because of RNG then they might as well not exist.

I use all sorts builds, mostly balanced builds with a bit of everything, including efficienty. Rage is useless on squishy frames that can't heal.

I've been playing this game for years and thousands of hours, I've done absolutely everything you can possibly think to do in this game with every possible build you can imagine. Zenurik EO was the only thing ever that didn't feel uttely and completely broken, and made me actually enjoy the game again after having become disenchanted with its utterly dysfunctional mechanics.

Hard to beliebe that's actually your reality when sitting in a corner with useless builds is really the only possibility when staying away from power management, getting hit and base stats, which you've been very clear about you try to avoid. What eater more then prooves how O.P. it is or states that you've been sitting in corners the whole time and simply don't want the bubbles, what kinda makes this whole "i wanna be mobile and it's fine" rant controversal and unbelieveable in the first place.

 

[Gurpgork]

43 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

True, but those have a cost, be it resources, the lack of another frame on the team, taking damage, while Energy Overflow is free, use it once, 4 energy/sec for the rest of the mission.

Are the hours I spent grinding focus and lenses not a cost of using Energy Overflow? It took me significantly more time and effort to max out Energy Overflow than it did for me to amass energy pads, and energy pads are immensely more powerful than Energy Overflow. 

43 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

Now, get your max efficincy AND Energy Overflow, and you cast or first ability once every 1.56~seconds. Some abilities have a longer cast delay than that. That's your inifite energy, you can spam 1 non stop and never run out of energy. Your 4? Once every 6.25 seconds. Isn't that a little too much? Yeah... 

The efficiency stat is the far bigger culprit here than Energy Overflow. Two mods let you quadruple the effectiveness of your abilities and all forms of energy gain at the same time. Efficiency is the only power stat that scales exponentially (whereas the rest of them scale linearly), the only power stat that can quadruple the power of abilities on its own (casting four times as many abilities off of the same amount of energy), and is thus the only power stat that has a cap.

If the efficiency stat wasn't as hilariously broken as it is, then Energy Overflow simply wouldn't be overpowered. 

43 minutes ago, Emulad0or said:

So there is an easy fix, put Rage on your Chroma, and add more efficiency to the others. Problem solved. Will it change your build? Sure, little less strength on your Chroma maybe, not like losing 30% will keep him from staying alive... Again, just adapt

I never said there was no solution. I also never said that it would be a herculean task to accommodate for the loss of Energy Overflow. I've been playing this game for 3 years and well over a thousand hours. I know how to adapt to changes, even if they're changes that I don't like. 

That doesn't mean it's a good change, or that it makes sense. They're going after one of the weakest forms of energy gain in the game while completely ignoring the ones that are blatantly overpowered, and have been blatantly overpowered for years. 

"Just adapt" is also a really dismissive and unhelpful response to people giving feedback in a feedback forum. 

Edited October 3, 2017 by Gurpgork

[Nilani]

heres a thought to all you who are sad over the EO getting removed we have energy syphon and if de feels that the comunity wants it they can buff it you know with a simple number change o -o just a thought

[Serenna187]

15 minutes ago, Ceramor said:

heres a thought to all you who are sad over the EO getting removed we have energy syphon and if de feels that the comunity wants it they can buff it you know with a simple number change o -o just a thought

a simple number change,,yes that is what it is.but we all know de's way of fixing...make another mod for it! or add another bandaid gimmick,see body count,see energy pizzas,see arcane energize,see energy overflow

[Mudfam]

1 hour ago, Emulad0or said:

No, they don't. With tons of energy, we could just spam abilities on every enemy, why would we need new weapons in the game? Just remove all weapons, leave just the MK1 so we can mod our Exalted weapons and let's just do it all with abilities... 

This is what I'm saying about building to your playstile, there are tons of ways to get energy aside from Energy Overload, we have Energy Siphon, Energy Orbs, Energy Pizzas, Arcane Energise, Rage, Trinity, Harrow... Want to go to the heat of the battle? Use a Rage. Want to quickly get energy to burst everyone? Use a pizza. Want consistent energy during the mission? Use Energy Siphon. Want everyone on your squad to have energy maxed during the mission? Get a Trinity.

Energy Siphon does the same, only slower, without the 2min delay to start working, and for everyone on the squad. Why Energy Overflow then if not for the OP infinite energy exploit?

Energy Overflow is not the only way to get energy in the game, it's not even the only free and consistent way to get energy. The problem is that the people got to used to have that easy infinite energy regen and now they don't want to adapt to the new situation. One that you cannot cheese all the time with abilities.

DE gives you a weapon that can blow up rooms without even aiming (Simulor), gives you a 20m lightsaber that can kill anything it touches and you can leave it on forever before reloading (gammacor). Then, DE removes those things that made life so convinient for us, and we all stopped playing the game because of that... No, wait, we are still here, we adapted and found other ways, we had to relearn how to aim to actually kill enemies, we had to relearn to release the fire button to not run out of ammo. Now we just need to relearn to not press 1,2,3 or 4 every enemie we see.

Damn...

It's Energy Overflow. Do you know how it works?

Exalted weapons cannot take advantage of it. It does not work for channeled abilities. Channeled abilities can exploit broken efficiency modding, especially as they have no duration.

Energy orbs are RNG. This means they may as well not exist for all practical purposes, because they might indeed not. Along with that goes the 5k plat energize.

Rage does not work on squishy frames with no healing.

Energy siphon is a bloody joke. Esp as it's virtually impossible to face higher level enemies without corrosive projection.

It's 4 energy per second, this doesn't allow you to spam abilities.

The remaining forms of energy regen are clearly bad and do indeed allow for absurd levels of ability spam.

 

None of your "arguments" make any sense whatsoever. We're not talking about nerfing one annoying weapon that encouraged a lazy plastyle here, we're talking about literally killing half the abilities in the game, 1/4 of the frames and a more active plastyle in favour of the lazy overpowered stuff that most people use already. And why? Literally every overpowered build / tactic / frame remains untouched, the one sensible energy mechanic and the weaker frames that struggled to keep are getting axed instead.

What is your agenda here? Just what..?

[Mudfam]

26 minutes ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Hard to beliebe that's actually your reality when sitting in a corner with useless builds is really the only possibility when staying away from power management, getting hit and base stats, which you've been very clear about you try to avoid. What eater more then prooves how O.P. it is or states that you've been sitting in corners the whole time and simply don't want the bubbles, what kinda makes this whole "i wanna be mobile and it's fine" rant controversal and unbelieveable in the first place.

Literally didn't understand a single thing you just said.

I'm done arguing with you. You ignore most of what I say, and deliberately pick out and misinterpret little bits with something fanciful and unsubstantial. You don't seem to have any sort of point to make, just ineffectually and stubbornly shooting down logical and factual well argued points made by others.

The pattern of zero substance to any argument against EO and consistently ignoring all real issues persists yet unbroken...

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

2 hours ago, Serenna187 said:

from what imaginary statistic did you fetch that number?From my near 2 years of playing the vast majority uses either zenurik or naramon for the pathetic shadowstep cheese.3rd place goes to vazarin for the instant revives followed by madurai.A whole damn lot of players also don't bother with focus to begin with

 

2 hours ago, Nirrel said:

That wasn't my point. And I'm pretty tired to point out again and again in my posts that it's not a question of NEED, I said it clearly in my previous posts.

BTW where did you get that info about 80% of player base not using zenurik? I thought that the problem with focus was that ppl only used zenurik or naramon with the odd player using other scools...

Okay, I do admit I was exaggerating. Many, many players don't use Zenurik. And with how many people have Focus compared to how many are playing compared to how many use Zenurik. You can round to about only 30% of players using Zenurik.

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

1 minute ago, Mudfam said:

logical and factual

While literally shouting unlogical make believe about how beein floodet with energy and the resulting zero effort, min-max playstyle was supposed to be healthy because you'd resort to trinity and plates otherwise for the same results.

 

Enjoy your thread and the results tho, knowing that DE never reverts nerfs to unbalanced stuff. That goes especially for stuff with such a ridiculously wide spread fan base.

[Nirrel]

3 hours ago, Emulad0or said:

No, I'm not, but if you want to spam abilities, you will need max efficiency, but you don't want to spam and only want to use when necessarie, you don't need all the efficiency, it goes from your gameplay. What you want is to be able to spam abilities without the efficiency. You have to adapt your build to your playstile or adapt your playstile to your build, if you can only play the game one way (spamming abilities), then yes, only that build (efficiency) will work for you... 

Again, yesterday's sortie with the Nyx, I use that build as my main, I use all her skills (maybe not in every mission, but on situations) and I have no problem whatsoever with full efficiency and Mind Control, Psychic Bolts or Chaos, and my build doesn't even get to 130% Duration because I focus more on range and efficiency. Hey, 6.25 and I get to have that eximus heavy gunner as a pet for over 30 sec? That sounds pretty usable in game to me...

I'm happy that there are a handful of frames that can build for max efficiency and still be effective.

In the case of nyx practicaly not very much downside to it at all just a bit of duration but it does not interfer at all how efficient those abilities will work and you can cast them 4 times as many times. Not the best example. (I mostly play oberon and on high levels keep renewal up constantly, so I do not use zenurik...but that doesn't mean that other frames shouldn't either.) You wont be able to do that with the vast majority of frames. You are obsessed with the thought that we do not build for efficiency at all wich is true only for a handful of niche builds. But even with a good efficiency in many cases you wont be able to keep up if you want to make any creative/fun use of all abilities of a frame unless we have a support frame in the team or stacked up on pizzas.

43 minutes ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

 

Okay, I do admit I was exaggerating. Many, many players don't use Zenurik. And with how many people have Focus compared to how many are playing compared to how many use Zenurik. You can round to about only 30% of players using Zenurik.

No, you can't, it's just a guess and as such pretty much useless as information.

However even if you would be right is still a third of the playerbase. I'm not sure you are aware how substantial is that...

Edited October 3, 2017 by Nirrel

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

43 minutes ago, Nirrel said:

I'm happy that there are a handful of frames that can build for max efficiency and still be effective.

In the case of nyx practicaly not very much downside to it at all just a bit of duration but it does not interfer at all how efficient those abilities will work and you can cast them 4 times as many times. Not the best example. (I mostly play oberon and on high levels keep renewal up constantly, so I do not use zenurik...but that doesn't mean that other frames shouldn't either.) You wont be able to do that with the vast majority of frames. You are obsessed with the thought that we do not build for efficiency at all wich is true only for a handful of niche builds. But even with a good efficiency in many cases you wont be able to keep up if you want to make any creative/fun use of all abilities of a frame unless we have a support frame in the team or stacked up on pizzas.

No, you can't, it's just a guess and as such pretty much useless as information.

However even if you would be right is still a third of the playerbase. I'm not sure you are aware how substantial is that...

Yes, a third of the playerbase who can adapt to the changes, or drop the game.

[Serenna187]

10 minutes ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

Yes, a third of the playerbase who can adapt to the changes, or drop the game.

a third of the playerbase...by the official registered players count that's 10million people,just sayin

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

Just now, Serenna187 said:

a third of the playerbase...by the official registered players count that's 10million people,just sayin

When I said a third, I clearly meant active. You can now cut that substantially.

[(PSN)thefallenloser]

4 hours ago, Tizodd said:

Without some form of energy regen, it's impossible to spam abilities for any length of time.  Energy Overflow made it possible to use abilities without depending on energy pizzas or an EV Trinity.  Removing energy overflow will slow the game quite a bit.

[DE] really needs to give frames innate energy regen.  Otherwise we might as well be playing any of the other countless generic shooters out there.

I don't. I don't have EV Trinity unless it's LOR and I never use EO...

[Serenna187]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

When I said a third, I clearly meant active. You can now cut that substantially.

Looking at Steampsy's statistics,its still 12million active players recently,840k in the last 2 weeks.but you won't give a damn anyway

[Mudfam]

1 hour ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

While literally shouting unlogical make believe about how beein floodet with energy and the resulting zero effort, min-max playstyle was supposed to be healthy because you'd resort to trinity and plates otherwise for the same results.

 

Enjoy your thread and the results tho, knowing that DE never reverts nerfs to unbalanced stuff. That goes especially for stuff with such a ridiculously wide spread fan base.

Everything you just said is quite specifically the opposite of everything I said. How did you even manage that? This is like a child plugging their ears and making noise to drown out the other's voice. It's so outrageously and glaringly ridiculous that I actually laughed out loud when I read it.

You want to brazenly ignore what I say and have the last word, parroting the same flimsy babble that has been throughly and repeatedly demolished, when your argument (or lack of) never had half a leg to stand on? Whatever. You really should not be expecting to win an argument when you never had anything resembling a point to make. Resorting to overt make-believe is a pretty pathetic direction to take in a discussion.
 

 

1 hour ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

Okay, I do admit I was exaggerating. Many, many players don't use Zenurik. And with how many people have Focus compared to how many are playing compared to how many use Zenurik. You can round to about only 30% of players using Zenurik.

 

47 minutes ago, Nirrel said:

No, you can't, it's just a guess and as such pretty much useless as information.

Eh, these statistics, real or otherwise, don't mean anything anyway. The problem with Focus 1.0 is that 95% of it wasn't worth using at all. The exceptions being Naramon which was too powerful and not at all fun, Vazarin saw some use, but reviving doesn't matter at all to most people, the rest was either truly useless or overlooked. When I explain to people how madurai works they're like "oh really?!". A lot of Zenurik users probably see it as minor QoL thing, a bit of extra energy they didn't really need anyway, only a handful of caster frames really benefit from it. For most missions you wouldn't even bother using focus at all because the mission will be over or nearly by the time it's available.

IMO Focus 1.0 was just an epic fail except for Zenurik's EO and Vazarin's niche for support frames. What we're getting with 2.0 looks no better at all, the best of it is gone, and the rest looks like mostly misconceived gimmicks to try to get us to use our operators. I don't see how this can be either useful or fun, as operators are clunky as hell and break the flow of the game. Even if they improve it massively I don't see the appeal.