Ember is OP in some way

[Tainted_Fate]

Hi, I am a new Warframe player, started two months ago (50 daily logins, MR15), and I cant understand how developers think Ember should work.

I dont have Ember prime, I have standard version of this warframe and I didnt even polarize slots and I mean with right mods all what you need to do is to activate World on Fire when mission starts, and basically thats it. Its limitless because with my build it consumes 0.75 energy/second and deals like 700+ dmg without any additional skill buffs, and I dont have augment for knockback. You are running around and opponents ~40 lvls die, I tried it on Greneer at Sedna, I tried it on Infested at Eris and it works well, all enemies are getting burned fast. So you dont need primary or secondary or melee weapon, you dont need to aim, you dont need timing, in some way and in some missions like Defense you dont need even to play this game if we can say so. You just stand and thats it, you dont even need to recast someting like Limbo (another strange warframe to me).

I can understand that at Sorties and at some Nightmare missions with some mods you will get your a** kicked, and some energy leech mobs and nulifiers can do some problems to you (if you dont have leveled and modded weapon at least in one slot), but its like in 90% of content you just press one button once and run around, and in some content you may not even run, just stand still and you will have top damage.

This is strange, cheese, zero skill demanding gameplay and you will be top at damage in most cases. And I found it very disappointing for players in my squad, Ember especially with Overextended just kills everything in low-mid lvl missions even before squad mates can notice enemies. How come one warframe is so overpowered for farming and, for exmaple, leveling weapons? You can place three 0 level weapons with this warframe and level it to max in one survival mission (with affinity bonus ofc). As I said, I am a new player, I dont have and dont know all warframes, but I have many of them now, so I want to ask maybe more expirienced players - is this okay and what is your opinion on this?

Edited November 9, 2017 by Tainted_Fate

[Firetempest]

This has NEVER been brought up before. 

I better get my kicks in before they nerf it.

[(XBOX)Riknav]

TBH, I can destroy ember players with equinox, but that's besides the point.

I do find ember players disheartening for new players who are just trying the game out. Its when they go into most populated low-mid level map points, quick alerts (extermination and capture), and crossfire missions with syndicates. I feel she does take away the fun of learning and co-op etiquette. I know when I moved to xbox from pc, I was furious to have an ember on my team. But I just leave if it bothers me too much. But this doesn't resolve the overall issue.

We already know that DE are reworking frames. The initial theory was to eliminate all press-4-to-win buttons. It's just that ember got revamped before they decided to go on this spree. So I believe when its ember's turn again she will get the adjustment. Let's just hope its for the better.

 

Edited November 9, 2017 by (XB1)Riknav

[Tachibana_Hibiki]

There are a few warframes that many people find frustrating to play along with due to them passively destroying most enemies in obscene range leaving their teammates with nothing to shoot at.

Ember being noticeable offender due to being able to do that on the go.

Problem persists since early days of the game and doesn't seem to be leaving anytime soon. It is also constantly being brought up.

 

[Trichouette]

14 minutes ago, Tainted_Fate said:

As I said, I am a new player, I dont have and dont know all warframes, but I have many of them now, so I want to ask maybe more expirienced players - is this okay and what is your opinion on this?

Since the game isn't about difficulty but rather about farming missions quickly, it's absolutely fine to have this kind of frame.

Equinox can do the same, gara can do the same (with less range, but it works at higher level) and you can even do the same with an ignis.

[MessoR]

Deleted comment.

Too sleepy to convey my thoughts properly. Please ignore.

Edited November 9, 2017 by MessoR

[(XBOX)Riknav]

1 minute ago, MessoR said:

Cheesing is possible with most of frames. You just get very different sorts of cheese.

There's not many cheese who can cheese a cheeser and make them less of a cheeser. But those cheese are only seen in certain parts of the universe.

[Kialandi]

50 days and MR 15?

You will burn out fast at this pace.

Also noone is forcing you to play Ember. Or to cheese the game in any way. 

Just pick something else or do not use Embers 4th ability. Simple as that.

[phoenix1992]

Go refer to the other 10 million reheated posts and topics and post considering this.

 

[zNightWolfz]

ember is fine the way she is she good for all sorts of missions

[PsiWarp]

I don't like playing with Embers with WoF on all mission long when it's overkill, but it's not infuriating enough to make me abort when seeing one since I'll just outpace them to the next groups to shoot. They can keep it on for all I care if enemies get bullet-spongy enough and better yet if Firequake is equipped.

[Tainted_Fate]

2 минуты назад, Kialandi сказал:

50 days and MR 15?

I played LA2 and Vanilla WoW and Ragnarok back in the days, and playing PoE now too, Im quite nerdy, if I found a good game I just cant take myself away from it.

4 минуты назад, Kialandi сказал:

Also noone is forcing you to play Ember. Or to cheese the game in any way. 

Yes, thats why I am not playing her most of the time, my most played Warframes are Mesa, Mag Prime, Frost and Rhino. I use her if I need to farm fast or to level some things fast, but I think its not good that some warframe can basically ruin others squad players expirience. But other players take her, and if they do, all mission I just run around cant kill anyone because everything is already dead, so even if you dont take Ember your game expirience may be hurt.

[Kialandi]

1 minute ago, Tainted_Fate said:

I played LA2 and Vanilla WoW and Ragnarok back in the days, and playing PoE now too, Im quite nerdy, if I found a good game I just cant take myself away from it.

Yes, thats why I am not playing her most of the time, my most played Warframes are Mesa, Mag Prime, Frost and Rhino. I use her if I need to farm fast or to level some things fast, but I think its not good that some warframe can basically ruin others squad players expirience. But other players take her, and if they do, all mission I just run around cant kill anyone because everything is already dead, so even if you dont take Ember your game expirience may be hurt.

I mostly play Solo. Noone ruins my games this way.

What do you NEED to level fast? What do you NEED to farm fast?

If you do everything fast, soon there will be nothing to do.

I speak from my own experience. I needed everything fast as well. Ran out of things to do and stopped playing for months.

Right now I am slowly leveling stuff on plains. It is slow asf. But at least i get to play the game.

[Ceryk]

Sadly, the way this game is designed really allows for a lot of cheese. They have been getting better lately about trying to make abilities less cheesable, but at the end of the day if you don't want to deal with the cheese you need to actively choose avoid it.

[_-ASH-_]

7 minutes ago, Tainted_Fate said:

I played LA2 and Vanilla WoW and Ragnarok back in the days, and playing PoE now too, Im quite nerdy, if I found a good game I just cant take myself away from it.

Yes, thats why I am not playing her most of the time, my most played Warframes are Mesa, Mag Prime, Frost and Rhino. I use her if I need to farm fast or to level some things fast, but I think its not good that some warframe can basically ruin others squad players expirience. But other players take her, and if they do, all mission I just run around cant kill anyone because everything is already dead, so even if you dont take Ember your game expirience may be hurt.

Wait what?
You made a whole post about Ember cheesing and how you just have to stand there to kill everything and yet your most played is

Mesa?

Anyway,every frame in this game is capable of cheesing certain missions. Mag for Corpus,Ash(not BS spammers) for high level armored Grineers/Kela Assassination,Loki for Spy,Frost for anything except infested,Valkyr for.....well.....everything.

[Tainted_Fate]

8 минут назад, Kialandi сказал:

I mostly play Solo. Noone ruins my games this way.

Its your choice to play solo, some players enjoy random company. I play solo mostly Spy missions so I can control things. But this is probably off-topic because its a topic not about you or me ))

11 минут назад, Kialandi сказал:

What do you NEED to level fast? What do you NEED to farm fast?

Lets replace "NEED" with "WANT", I just spelled that wrong.

12 минут назад, Kialandi сказал:

Ran out of things to do and stopped playing for months.

No problem, thats why other games exist. Some players enjoy fast pace, some slow pace, main thing is enjoyment. Its like you are setting a goal is to play only Warframe and you arrange things so you can play it as long as you can, but Warframe is not the only game to play. Its normal to burnout and than switch to another game, then return, and you are talking about burning out like this is bad. Its okay if you have certain mentality.

[(PSN)HSomDevil]

1 hour ago, Tainted_Fate said:

You are running around and opponents ~40 lvls die

Therein lies the catch.

[Tainted_Fate]

18 минут назад, _-ASH-_ сказал:

You made a whole post about Ember cheesing and how you just have to stand there to kill everything and yet your most played is

Mesa?

Guys can we not focus on my personality, topic is not about me, topic about YOUR opinion on certain warframe's gameplay.

As for Mesa, she doesnt feel cheese to me, at least you need to watch for cooldowns, for energy pool, you need at least to turn around while ulting, I mean, there is something you are doing at least, you cant just stand in one place forever (without help of your teammates) and punish things that are on the other side of the map and are not even in your line of sight. 

Limbo is strange to me too by the way. Basically your are vulnerable only while recasting 2 and 4 skill. Yesterday we did 100lvl Sortie defense with Limbo (me) and Mesa and some random guys and yes it felt cheese in some way too. But I was one-shotted few times while recasting Cataclysm AND Mesa needed to have very solid damage output, but still I felt it was something with cheese involved.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Tainted_Fate

[phoenix1992]

*sigh*

You know, what - Whatever, let's say it.

If you can gain the maxed efficiency (meaning corrupted mods), are MR 15 and roll into low tier mission in which "700 damage" is the top kek - your own personal issue.  Any frame with dual stat, corrupted, primed and event mods, will dominate 'level 40" content, because the said content was introduced before the said mods and tuned for builds without them.


PS: Taken from another topic 

 

Edited November 9, 2017 by phoenix1992

[Tainted_Fate]

11 минут назад, phoenix1992 сказал:

*sigh*

You know, what - Whatever, let's say it.

If you can gain the maxed efficiency (meaning corrupted mods), are MR 15 and roll into low tier mission in which "700 damage" is the top kek - your own personal issue.  Any frame with dual stat, corrupted, primed and event mods, will dominate 'level 40" content, because the said content was introduced before the said mods and tuned for builds without them.


PS: Taken from another topic 

 

Maybe I said something wrong, but Ember dominates 90% or even more content. With pressing one skill button at the start of the game, thats it. Dont need any weapons, dont need to aim, you dont even need to spam certain things or recast them, and you dont need any teammates or team play. Its very, very strange gameplay, thats all what I can say.

[phoenix1992]

Just now, Tainted_Fate said:

Maybe I said something wrong, but Ember dominates 90% or even more content. With pressing one skill button at the start of the game, thats it. Dont need any weapons, dont need to aim, you dont even need to spam certain things or recast them, and you dont need any teammates or team play. Its very, very strange gameplay, thats all what I can say.

Ember does not dominate 90% or even more of the content, because the content is not limited to star charts and Lith/Meso relics. 

All you can say is that you are playing mediocre content with mods that are not meant for that content, and I know that since you mentioned it in your original post

 

1 hour ago, Tainted_Fate said:

I have standard version of this warframe and I didnt even polarize slots and I mean with right mods all what you need to do is to activate World on Fire when mission starts, and basically thats it. Its limitless because with my build it consumes 0.75 energy/second

Keep on ignoring that point, please.

And I have a suspicion that you don't run versus corpus that much to begin with. You know the guys that Ignore your WoF (It can't go trough Nulifiers or take them down), cancel your abilities (Scramblers and such) or flat out laugh at your "700 damage fire" (Bursa units).
 

[METAHUMVN]

1 hour ago, Tainted_Fate said:

As I said, I am a new player, I dont have and dont know all warframes, but I have many of them now, so I want to ask maybe more expirienced players - is this okay and what is your opinion on this?

It's totally fine.

Ember's powers don't scale at all, and she's really squishy. TBH, warframe needs a few OP frames that can cheese stuff because the game can get quite grindy at times and I don't wanna be tryhard all the time. Also, remember that Ember's WoF range is limited, even with a max range build. By the time an enemy gets in range to be burned, they're also in range to shoot you down. And remember, not all enemies in range get burned right away, so once you're surrounded by a lvl 100 mob of chargers, you'll be dead pretty quick. This is all from personal experience. 

 

[Tainted_Fate]

14 минут назад, UF-1215 сказал:

By the time an enemy gets in range to be burned, they're also in range to shoot you down

Sorry for pulling this out of context, but you dont have to be in line of sight for WoF to work. You can solo stand behind the cover near some door choke (hard to explain, english is not my main language), and you can stand there for 30 min on some Uranus survival mission without a single action basically AFK. Additionally, status chance is high, I dont remember correctly but its like 40+ percent to apply heat status and mobs cant shoot at you while being burned.

 

24 минуты назад, phoenix1992 сказал:

And I have a suspicion that you don't run versus corpus that much to begin with. You know the guys that Ignore your WoF (It can't go trough Nulifiers or take them down), cancel your abilities (Scramblers and such) or flat out laugh at your "700 damage fire" (Bursa units).

Thats why I said literally in the first post that this CAN cause a problems if you dont have at least one leveled and modded weapon equipped to drop nulifier shields and kill some leech and cancel-units. Learn to read before "having a suspicion", mate. 

Edited November 9, 2017 by Tainted_Fate

[phoenix1992]

Just now, Tainted_Fate said:

Thats why I said literally in the first post that this CAN cause a problems if you dont have at least one leveled and modded weapon equipped to drop nulifier shields and kill some leech and cancel-units. Learn to read before "having a suspicion", mate. 

Kinda contradicts your other point "mate".  

 

20 minutes ago, phoenix1992 said:

27 minutes ago, Tainted_Fate said:

Maybe I said something wrong, but Ember dominates 90% or even more content. With pressing one skill button at the start of the game, thats it. Dont need any weapons, dont need to aim, you dont even need to spam certain things or recast them, and you dont need any teammates or team play. Its very, very strange gameplay, thats all what I can say.

 

Is it 90% of the content with 1 button, or 90% of the fodder units without any special skills?
 

[METAHUMVN]

1 minute ago, Tainted_Fate said:

Sorry for pulling this out of context, but you dont have to be in line of sight for WoF to work. You can solo stand behind the cover near some door choke (hard to explain, english is not my main language), and you can stand there for 30 min on some Neptune survival mission without a single action basically AFK. Additionally, status chance is high, I dont remember correctly but its like 40+ percent to apply heat status and mobs cant shoot at you while being burned.

 

Thats why I said literally in the first post that this CAN cause a problems if you dont have at least one leveled and modded weapon equipped to drop nulifier shields and kill some leech and cancel-units. Learn to read before "having a suspicion", mate. 

Dude, I'm going to be honest. What's your point of bringing this up? Let me give a list of all the OP frames in this game, as a more experienced Tenno, 

Excalibur: with the right frame and melee weapon build, you can have an eternal exalted blade and literally slide attack your way through an entire mission without every running out of energy and while constantly blinding enemies. Anything under lvl 50 will die immediately. 

Ash: enough said. 

Saryn: go to Berehynia and you'll see what I mean. 

Banshee: slap on Resonance Quake and mod for both max eff and cont. Everything around you within a 300M radius will die once RQ reaches max range and dmg. 

Mesa: use the same build you do for RQ Banshee. Stand in the middle of the map, press 4, hold down your LMB, and spin. Everything under lvl 100 dies in one shot, given that you have a well-modded secondary. 

Nidus: in close-range infested missions, a well-modded Nidus becomes virtually immortal and can survive SOLO up to 100 waves on Akkad. It's been done, just look it up on Youtube. 

Oberon: the most hated frame yes. But mod for max range and efficiency and spam reckoning. Everything around will die OR be down on the floor long enough to be killed by a teammate. 

Trinity: OHAHAHAHAHA. I don't think I have to explain her. 

Wukong: Oh yes, Wukong the immortal. One of his powers actually involves reviving himself from the dead. 

Nezha: Pretty much immortal too. 

Etc. 

Pretty much every frame in the game, when modded in an "meta" fashion, will be OP in one way or another. 

All of the frames, except for a select few really sucky frames that need reworks, either fall into two categories once you metabuild them: (1) frames that kill everything around them and (2) frames that can't get killed. That's called maximization. 

That's just the nature of the game. A build that makes sorties tolerable will certainly make 90% of the regular level starchart missions seem like cheese. That's just the way the game is. I don't know if you play sorties and raids and Eidolon strikes often, but if you do, I hope you understand where I'm coming from. 

I know where you're coming from concerning Ember, but I'm just really curious as to why you're bringing this up now. Ember's been like this ever since she's come out and DE hasn't even spoken of reworking her, probably because they think she's balanced. I mean, if you don't like Ember, stop playing her. And don't S#&$ on us who do, because Warframe is a hard game, we Tenno who've been playing for years now get tired sometimes of having to aim at every single little enemy on the map and press the LMB. Sometimes we'd rather just press 4 and sit in a corner so that we can save our energy and do other stuff in the game that actually matters, stuff you can't cheese, like Eidolon strikes, raids, cancerous sorties, nightmare missions with horrid modifiers, kuva flood missions, etc.