Mutagen Samples are STILL a problem.

[(XBOX)Atuelliss]

Mutagen sample required amounts and frequency of drops are ridiculous. 

The drop rate is horrendous compared to every other resource, and its required to complete every single items research in the Bio Lab. These should either be increased in drop rates, or lowered required amounts.

Ive been reading about projected plans for a drop rate increase yet thats been well on a year now.

This is literally stiffling low level clans who are having major difficulty researching anything, and larger clans who have astronomical(and ridiculously so) requirements.

[(PSN)s3d_sas]

Drop booster + nekros + hydroid 

u will be fine 

[(XBOX)Atuelliss]

Booster, 2 nekros's and a hydroid 40+ waves of ODD. And no, not fine. The drop rates and requirement amounts ARE absurd, whether you "suck it up" and grind it out or not really isnt the point.

Also, did you miss the entire part about the smaller, low level clans? Many of them aren't at high wave ODD capability levels, some dont even have Nekros. Hydroid sure, but this wasnt a useful response.

[trunks013]

me and my friend realy made a joke out of it. Each time we drop one we go like 

Just 3998 mutagene samples to go . Just 3998 mutagene samples ^.^ decreasing the number each time.

But i'm the kind of guy trying to empty a canot full of water while being in it with an empty delmonte fruit can ( the little ones )

[KeLaRo]

idea: 

we are able to convert Mutagen Samples amount in Mutagen Mass.

Ms amount -->MM

 

why dont have also the reverse process???

MM---->Ms amount

I guess in Cetus there should be someone able to do this :3 

[(PSN)CannaWhoopazz13]

My ghost clan is all new players, and we got quite a bit of the Bio lab research done.  I think the main problem is that Mutagen Samples only drop in 2 areas: Orokin Derelict and Eris.  You can get Detonite and Fieldron samples much earlier, so those requirements are easier to meet; you get a lot running random missions.  But you have to go out of your way to get Mutagen Samples, which makes it feel like the drop rates are horrible compared to Fieldron or Detonite Samples.

 

My only issue is that the Hema requires 5000 Mutagen Samples for a Ghost Clan!  That's crazy.  The rest of them can be researched after a couple runs in the Derelict, but that Hema requirement is outrageous...

[Tali]

17 minutes ago, (PS4)s3d_sas said:

Drop booster + nekros + hydroid 

u will be fine 

A booster should not be required to get a decent amount. Just look at all other resources, they can be acquired relatively easy with out any modifiers, only mutagen samples requires you to get the "whole farming machine" to get decent drops.

[(XBOX)Atuelliss]

We've been trying to make jokes about it while we grind it out. 4-8 of us will run these for awhile and come out with a few thousand. But the whole tripling of resources per clan size is hurting us, and some of my friends who just started and made a clan are hurting to even get 1-5 for basic research since they are all about the same playing level and arent really capable to hit eris yet.

A clan shouldnt have to literally slave away for ONE resource type. EVERY other resource can be gathered in at least the hundreds, per simple runs.

The idea that theres nothing wrong with mutagen samples literally makes me laugh at the people who act like its a simple thing.

[GnarlsDarkley]

ODS yields 150-200 MS an hour each with a single nekros.

done this many times with my clan and we got Hema in a week

[SilverRook]

It was specified why this was done and was the case and will not be changed. 

I'm assuming your talking about HEMA.

Its meant to be a collaborative process. 500 samples per clan member.

Got 82 doing a 20 minute run on ODS.
nekros resource booster. job done.

repeat ten times. Make sure your clan mates do the same.

you dont HAVE to build hema......
 

[YUNoJump]

The biggest thing I hate about the whole Mutagen debacle is that DE went back and forth on it for 2 weeks straight, saying they were going to change the Hema costs, then the drop rates, then remodel the entire system for getting Mutagen, but then they just backed right out of everything. At least they've promised to keep the Hema out of any future research requirements, but the whole process seemed like the devs were set in their ways for the system, but had to resist bending to the considerable community outcry. I mean, the "players who already have it will be offended" argument? That was just a poor excuse that has since been contradicted multiple times over. 

A lot of the clan research/resource drop stuff is lost in a very old version of the game, a version which seems to (falsely) imply that Infested weapons are supposed to be inherently better as a class. As such Mutagen doesn't drop anywhere, and the only place on the Starchart that it drops from has incredibly low drop rates, due to what is essentially just a basic coding error that would take 5 minutes to fix, but that DE has decided needs to be kept in place. If the starchart only allows for 2 locations for Mutagen to drop from (due to the idea that a faction drops its own research part), then mutagen should at least work properly. 

[(XBOX)Atuelliss]

Again, many of you are entirely missing the intent of the post and sounding silly.

Sure, my clan is larger and we managed to get the bio lab mostly researched. It sucks to grind for the Hema, but hey we're trying.

However, the samples drop in very few locations and in tiny frequency, most of which are not feasible for lower level newer players who are trying this game out together.

A Ghost Clan, with 6 players, all still on Jupiter, have virtually no way of researching anything in their Bio Lab.

Their most advanced member has collected 12 samples the entire time.

That *IS* an issue, whether you've lost perspective on this or not because YOU can now grind those out on your own doesn't really matter. Whether DE did it on purpose, or doesn't see an issue, again does not matter. The purpose of this board is Feedback, so they are getting feedback they've heard because obviously they need to hear it again, and again, and again, and again.

Saying it's simple because you've reached a level that you can grind it, or that it's already been discussed/etc is useless. The title of this very post emphasizes "still" for a reason.

They need to keep hearing it.

[SilverRook]

9 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Atuelliss said:

It sucks to grind for the Hema, but hey we're trying.

However, the samples drop in very few locations and in tiny frequency, most of which are not feasible for lower level newer players who are trying this game out together.

A Ghost Clan, with 6 players, all still on Jupiter, have virtually no way of researching anything in their Bio Lab.

.....

Hema isn't meant for low level players that haven't even gotten past jupiter yet.

 

You're literally asking for an end game weapon for new players.....

 

Sorry to have to say this - but -    Git Gud

 

or invite more players that ARE at that area that can contribute.

 

see we have 5 end game players in our 15 man clan - we recently had to upgrade to shadow clan so we could accept more members 

and even we haven't gotten hema yet and we aren't even a big clan...... yeh farming for hema sucks - but don't make it your priority and its not a problem.

Edited December 20, 2017 by SilverRook

[(XBOX)Atuelliss]

Silverook, once again you're not paying attention.  

I am talking about TWO clans. MY clan is not a newbie clan, we are endgame at storm level and ALL of us are 25+ maxed frames, and we are grinding the hema. The second clan is of a group of friends of mine who are trying to simply do ANY research in their bio lab.

I literally differentiated between this and specified they werent going for the hema. Youve failed to recognize this and are repeating the same useless statement as if that was the point.

 

Sorry to say this - but - stop being a judgemental Endgamer and read the ENTIRE thing instead of only parts of it 

 

Sample drops are broken. The entire community knows this. Some accept it, while others of us continue to voice it because DE does actually listen sometimes. It's that simple. 

 

Edited December 20, 2017 by (XB1)Atuelliss
Typo

[SilverRook]

6 hours ago, (Xbox One)Atuelliss said:

Silverook, once again you're not paying attention.  

I am talking about TWO clans. MY clan is not a newbie clan, we are endgame at storm level and ALL of us are 25+ maxed frames, and we are grinding the hema. The second clan is of a group of friends of mine who are trying to simply do ANY research in their bio lab.

I literally differentiated between this and specified they werent going for the hema. Youve failed to recognize this and are repeating the same useless statement as if that was the point.

 

Sorry to say this - but - stop being a judgemental Endgamer and read the ENTIRE thing instead of only parts of it 

 

Sample drops are broken. The entire community knows this. Some accept it, while others of us continue to voice it because DE does actually listen sometimes. It's that simple. 

 

you're right i tend not to pay attention fully to people saying omg this is too hard its so unfair - this should be changed.

 

*I* did that with mastery ranks - i knuckled down sucked in my gut bit my lip and  ..... got good and did it 

 

considering you can get taxi'd to ODS ....... whats stopping them ?

 

i'll taxi 3 of them right now - give me there names.

 

 

for the record - i'm not a judgemental endgamer....... every single one of my clan members i have met in public/relay/region  and helped to the point i said hey you know what - we have pretty much everything researched, would you like to join us ? 

I am consistently helping randoms out in chat 

even going up to shadow clan to accommodate more members after having *pretty much* single-handedly built the dojo up myself using my own plat and resources.....  nooooooo i'm a selfish judgemental gamer that hates everyone....

 

I have strong values in helping others help themselves, so people going awwww this is too hard for me is just an excuse.

get some learning - get better.   

 

If you gave up at everything that's hard in life and in gaming for that matter ......  you wouldn't get very far.

 

I've offered to help and given my reasons as to why this issue isn't really an issue.

Edited December 20, 2017 by SilverRook

[(XBOX)Atuelliss]

You're right, you're not a judgemental endgamer, you're just poorly mannered.

I built my entire dojo solo and then started recruiting, so as much as you might like to say otherwise I AM good and STILL know its broken. Just because we bit down and ground through it doesn't mean we cant speak up about balancing it for our friends.

I am MR18 who could be 20 if I bothered taking the tests. You keep telling me to get good, but Im actually in 20+ frames 3 forma deep, 30+ weapons 4 forma deep, Storm clan fully done, PoE done, raiding both normal and nightmare. But yeah, somehow *I* am giving up and whining.

So apparently I'm not some whining idiot. I'm a player who sucked it up and did it even though it IS broken and now that I brought more friends to the game, am just trying to affect change by using the INTENDED forum for the feedback.

The sheer fact you couldnt be bothered to read each post fully and then rushed to comment about "git gud" just makes you a tool. No matter how nice you are to your clanmates or randoms, you literally came into a FEEDBACK forum meant to express these very topics TO the Devs and chastised me for pointing out something everyone knows is true.

I actually feel bad for you. I feel bad that you're so engrossed in how "good you got" that because you managed to grind through something, that you have no understanding of why someone else should still try and effect change to a skewed system.

They dont need to change the Hema, but since every item in the Bio Lab takes mutagen samples, there SHOULD be a way for newer clans to get them in other locations other than Eris/OD. Wherever an infested mission is, maybe it could drop some, at least then it'd be a semblence of balance.

But you can't see this, your ego is too big to let you look over it and see the little guy in the same shoes you and I were once in just trying to start out and recognize the battle uphill wasn't as balanced as it should have been.

Just because YOU don't believe it to be an issue, doesn't mean it isn't. When a massive part of the community has already spoken up about how it IS one, and the Devs have acknowledged prior they need to increase the drop rate, that means you're mistaken. Sorry guy.

I also find it hilarious you keep making this about me. This post wasn't  even created for me. I created it for my friends in their new clan to try and effect change for balance.

You might as well just stop responding, because you clearly have no view of what's going on in this post but you keep injecting your ego.

Edited January 5, 2018 by (XB1)Atuelliss

[Luzzu]

On 12/20/2017 at 8:33 AM, (Xbox One)Atuelliss said:

Silverook, once again you're not paying attention.  

I am talking about TWO clans. MY clan is not a newbie clan, we are endgame at storm level and ALL of us are 25+ maxed frames, and we are grinding the hema. The second clan is of a group of friends of mine who are trying to simply do ANY research in their bio lab.

I literally differentiated between this and specified they werent going for the hema. Youve failed to recognize this and are repeating the same useless statement as if that was the point.

 

Sorry to say this - but - stop being a judgemental Endgamer and read the ENTIRE thing instead of only parts of it 

 

Sample drops are broken. The entire community knows this. Some accept it, while others of us continue to voice it because DE does actually listen sometimes. It's that simple. 

 

It seems the more logical people get on this forum, the more people just don't get it.

 

I know exactly what you're saying - Hema's research requirements are disproportionate and mostly out of reach to newer players. I could see a resource dump for something that is more common, like Nano Spores, or Ferrite - resources that are more obtainable early on. Hema's kind of an oddball like that, and I can easily say that farming for it wasn't fun. I one-clicked a Hema for a clan I joined when I came back to Warframe. I had several tens of thousands ready to go and they needed it so I finished it for them, not knowing the value of what I just gave them. Then, I left because their leader was an idiot and had to research my own Hema from 0 Mutagen. By comparison, it was the most time-consuming thing to research and the reward was not worth it. I haven't even used my Hema blueprint yet.

 

As for the others that are replying to you, if they don't get it now, they just won't get it. It's the way these forums work. Your point is that Mutagen Samples are disproportionately harder to acquire compared to every other resource and Hema requires an absurd amount of them. Everyone who has either ignored your point or disagreed with it seems to have forgotten that they were once a new player. Should there be research that is hard to complete? Absolutely. But it should be something members of all skill levels with any amount of time played can be a part of.

 

On 12/20/2017 at 7:49 AM, SilverRook said:

Hema isn't meant for low level players that haven't even gotten past jupiter yet.

 

You're literally asking for an end game weapon for new players.....

LOL.

 

On 12/20/2017 at 7:49 AM, SilverRook said:

Sorry to have to say this - but -    Git Gud

 

or invite more players that ARE at that area that can contribute.

You are unbelievably pompous for someone who doesn't seem to be able to read. The point of this thread as I understand it is to say that Mutagen Samples are something that cannot easily be contributed. Requiring a base amount of 5,000 Mutagen Samples when they're already gated to all new players is not good design. If it required a massive amount of Nano Spores, it would make more sense not because Nano Spores are easier to get, but because new players have access to them and can contribute to their clans earlier.

 

There's already lists of dozens of reasons why clans aren't intuitive for new players; ridiculous research requirements are just an unnecessary item on that list.

[(PSN)shadowraith_666]

Mutagen samples are a pain to farm compared to fieldron and detonite samples, perhaps now that mercury has been overtaken by the infested MS can be added to the resource list, also maybe have corrupted ancients from void/fissures/new loka ancients also red veil chargers drop them as well.

[SilverRook]

22 hours ago, Luzzu said:

It seems the more logical people get on this forum, the more people just don't get it.

 

I know exactly what you're saying - Hema's research requirements are disproportionate and mostly out of reach to newer players. I could see a resource dump for something that is more common, like Nano Spores, or Ferrite - resources that are more obtainable early on. Hema's kind of an oddball like that, and I can easily say that farming for it wasn't fun. I one-clicked a Hema for a clan I joined when I came back to Warframe. I had several tens of thousands ready to go and they needed it so I finished it for them, not knowing the value of what I just gave them. Then, I left because their leader was an idiot and had to research my own Hema from 0 Mutagen. By comparison, it was the most time-consuming thing to research and the reward was not worth it. I haven't even used my Hema blueprint yet.

 

As for the others that are replying to you, if they don't get it now, they just won't get it. It's the way these forums work. Your point is that Mutagen Samples are disproportionately harder to acquire compared to every other resource and Hema requires an absurd amount of them. Everyone who has either ignored your point or disagreed with it seems to have forgotten that they were once a new player. Should there be research that is hard to complete? Absolutely. But it should be something members of all skill levels with any amount of time played can be a part of.

 

LOL.

 

You are unbelievably pompous for someone who doesn't seem to be able to read. The point of this thread as I understand it is to say that Mutagen Samples are something that cannot easily be contributed. Requiring a base amount of 5,000 Mutagen Samples when they're already gated to all new players is not good design. If it required a massive amount of Nano Spores, it would make more sense not because Nano Spores are easier to get, but because new players have access to them and can contribute to their clans earlier.

 

There's already lists of dozens of reasons why clans aren't intuitive for new players; ridiculous research requirements are just an unnecessary item on that list.

 

 

 

LOL

 

ok lets break down your "logic" 

 

How the frak are they gaited to new players ? btw ???

buy a derelict blueprint build the key go to derelict .......

you can get there from ANYWHERE

 

 

 

ok ...your turn.... GO! 

 

if you mean that the level spawns enemies at lvl 25-35 and they aren't able to survive very easily there .....

 

i refer you to me previous statement of 

 

 

but please continue to highlight how "pompous" i am for laying out the facts for you.

 

 

new players aren't able to get to the derelict and farm mutagen samples like the rest of us .... BECAAAUUUUUUUSSSSSSEEEEE ? ??? ? ? ?

Edited December 25, 2017 by SilverRook