Eidolon Captures need some change

[Toran]

Even while successfully doing Triple-Eidolon-Captures with two mates and with little effort, the captures themselves aren't very satisfying.

Lures have to go
Lures are a pain in the behind and the most annoying part of the hunt, even after the helpful updates. You need to pamper them, they constantly keep blocking your sight and sometimes they don't hold the Eidolons although they have the needed number, are close enough and charged. I wonder who came up with the lures and why all agreed lures were a brilliant idea...

If you want to keep in the lures, let them cling/attach to the Eidolon once charged and close enough. At that point we shouldn't have to protect them any longer and should be free for teamplay.

Eidolon captures are a team effort, but they don't feel like teamplay
A successful Eidolon hunt is more about team composition than anything else, not at last thanks to the Eidolon lures... that's why the typical setup still is Chroma, Trinity, Harrow and Volt. Volt has lost importance with all the chaos and the steep angles going on against the new Sentients.

To make sure the lures bind to the Sentient, you usually stay extremely close, resulting in the mentioned extreme angles and little idea of your mates' positions.

When it comes to shooting a limb (Syonvia), it's even worse and it's not adviced to make it a team effort. Best tactic is to get some distance (three to four void dashes) with Chroma and deal with the upper and harder to hit Syonvias first. You'll have a much better shooting field and less relative movement to struggle with. That tactic however makes Chroma's new buff a solo thing again...

In our runs, and as Chroma, I just get next to a teammate for the very last phase when aiming doesn't matter much anymore and spreading the buff is more important.

New Eidolons are bigger but amp range hasn't increased
Why you haven't thought of this? Sure, I still can hit the big ones with Shraksun, but I have to stand right under them (and that's what I do)! Even the amps with higher range have to be pretty close and look up in high angles to get the best multi-hits. Your typical view includes lots of grass blades... I'm convinced you designed the amps with the original Teralyst in mind and new sentients weren't planned yet. Please increase all amp ranges by 33-40%.

Some suggestions to make Eidolon more fun and more open to other warframes

• Remove the Eidolon Lures - they're reason no.1 for meta teams.
• Increase the Amp range and by that the awareness of the tactical situation
• Allow us to mark Synovias. Imagine you no longer had to babysit lures: you could get to a suitable position and shoot a marked Synovia together. Teams with no highend riven-modded sniper rifles could work down a limb in synergy and with combined buffs.
• Tone down the sentients' effects somewhat. At the moment it's almost on par with that infamous Pokémon episode...
• Refine hitboxes on the extremities - arms etc. often block the hitbox of Synovias, although you have, visually, a clean line for the shot. Then it's a bit guesswork and scanning along those invisible boxes till the yellow hp-bar finally shows up. Not so cool.

Edited February 15, 2018 by Toran
added request for finer hitboxes

[Tovon]

I agree with everything you said, however do you have any ideas as to capturing eidolons without lures?

[Snorvyn]

Lures attaching to sentient instead of linking and still being vulnurable and pain when move in front of you, was pretty good idea....
that way you could get lure midfight and attach it fast without caring for its health that much

[Toran]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Tovon:

I agree with everything you said, however do you have any ideas as to capturing eidolons without lures?

What's difference between kill and capture if you ignore dragging along some lures? Answer: none.

[Doxorn]

10 minutes ago, Toran said:

What's difference between kill and capture if you ignore dragging along some lures? Answer: none.

The difference is if you don't capture the Teralyst with 2 Lures you don't get Flawless Sentient Core and it will teleport away to another location after each synovia gets destroyed.

[Toran]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Doxorn:

The difference is if you don't capture the Teralyst with 2 Lures you don't get Flawless Sentient Core and it will teleport away to another location after each synovia gets destroyed.

I know all that (I do captures only ). I meant technically. Technically there is no difference, you do exactly the same stuff, destroy the shields, destroy the synovias, destroy the eidolon (even the animation is the same, there's no capture to see, it just trickles away) .

When having lures along is more an annoyance than a challenge, it cries out for a change. Keeping them alive till they're charged or bring in charged lures that directly stick to the Eidolon should be enough really. Or scrap em altogether and come up with a different idea to "capture" an Eidolon.

[Xebov]

The lures mainly suffer from the bad AI and path finding. This issue could be solved by positioning the Lures 5m beind the player, increasing the tether range and reducing the line of sight issue where tethers constantly get lost. They could also work on a new AI...

 

The Eidolons are to big. It looks nice if they walk around, but it just means that it suffers the same issue like all other NPCs using damage areas. What could help in a short run would be the capability of penetrating the eidolon, so you can still hit the areas if they are covered by another Eidolon part. Another solution could be to remove the parts from the Eidolon itself and let them circle or form a protective shield that can be damaged.

 

About the team play. You wont get much of it into this. It will be hard to design something that is nothing more than a bullet sponge to require team efford.

[(XBOX)Tucker D Dawg]

1 hour ago, Toran said:

Even while successfully doing Triple-Eidolon-Captures with two mates and with little effort,

This was predictable - and disappointing. They need to be more challenging. Design objectives like "but can also be done as a lower-level player if properly prepared. " will just make the fight boring. 

2 hours ago, Toran said:

Eidolon captures are a team effort, but they don't feel like teamplay

Also predictable. And they don't in anyway live up to "Taking down a Teralyst mirrors the tactics of a Trial in terms of teamwork and communication,"

The fight is barely a week old, the meta is forming, the tedium setting in.  

[radastir]

vor 12 Stunden schrieb Tovon:

I agree with everything you said, however do you have any ideas as to capturing eidolons without lures?

Jumping on their neck and choking them till they pass out! 

[Threa]

I agree with everything you posted here. The first Eidolon is usually fun because it's a bit easier to see what's going on and you're able to target the limbs better. But once you get to the second and third Eidolon's it becomes incredibly frustrating. I've completely stopped Eidolon hunting until they add some major changes. It's SUPER punishing to random groups who don't have the meta comp, removing the lures or buffing them would help make the fights more enjoyable and allow players to focus more on the Eidolon mechanics. 

[Toran]

vor 6 Stunden schrieb radastir:

Jumping on their neck and choking them till they pass out! 

A viable option, now that Chroma's Vex Armour's has been hotfixed (during night cycle of course...) for increased melee damage  

[MunsuLight]

I think the only thing I disagree with you is about the Lures. Without the lures, this would just be a I can kill all the limbs as fast as I can without a healer .. So the new meta would be something like and Harrow .. And 3 damage dealers (Something Like Chroma's, Roar's Rhino, Maybe "Amp Octavia" or the frame you want to use) (or Volt, but like you said Volt with the bigger one is not that useful).. but for the rest yes.. I agree with everything