[The Outdated Parkour Thread] It Finally Happened! (Voice Your Opinion In The Poll!)

[taiiat]

If sprint speeds weren't so slow, we wouldn't consider coptor anything but a funny move.  DE could have solved the whole coptor controvery by just upping the sprint speeds and getting rid of coptor.  Then no one would compare coptor to parkour.

do you remember before when Sprint Speeds were normalized?

Loki at 1.6 speed base caused legitimate issues in the game. constantly warping around to other players, even able to run through geometry sometimes.

 

i don't think just increasing Sprint Speed a whole bunch is a very good solution. but we can probably nudge it a bit.

t would be slow and boooring just making it to the objective.

pls

 

you can move very quickly with just sliding and flip jumps & s..t.

[Tr1ples1xer]

And you probably sure hope it is buff to copter which makes it 5 times faster, shoots you 5 times further and allows you to go vertically and also enables unlimited usage while in air with each copter bringing exponentially more speed.

I like it as it is now to be honest, I fear any kind of change... and lets just say this post is not your finest. I can already link wallruns like a madman not my fault if you can't play.

[ThePresident777]

Nerfing sprint speed because geometry can be gotten through is a classic example of reacting to one broken issue, in this case broken geometry, by braking another, in this case sprint speed.  Sprint speed is game play.  Game play is being destroyed so as to not fix actual issues some where else.  I do not see any sense in it.  I expect that players would think like this but I see no reason why professional developers would do so.

 

EDIT:  I forgot to mention volt speed with mods, it gets really fast.  I so I suspect that sprint speeds are no longer an issue in terms of geometry and warping.

Edited November 11, 2014 by ThePresident777

[Wurdyburd]

I made this:

to show what can be done already.

 

This video certainly shows off the current mobility provided by aerial attacks and parkour as it currently stands, but it also outlines a few other points:

1) We have great mobility with jumping off walls and such, combined with aerial attacks for better directional control, but the problem persists, that we have nowhere to go. Exploration isn't encouraged at all in this game except for caches, a relatively new addition, and one that, like everything else, sits on the ground in locations you can walk to.

 

2) There's no truly exciting combinations of tilesets. The video showed off the secret Tower room, high above the generators that lead to the elevator. DE designed that room to look like a hallway, with two doors [that will never open]. Why DON'T those rooms go anywhere? More specifically, why can't we use parkour and ventilation shafts and secret tunnels to reach destinations in maps, outside of being forced to travel in a single, set path from Spawn A through rooms 1, 2, 3, to Objective B, back through rooms 4, 5, 6, to Exit C? Could you not go through a ventilation shaft in room 2, to come out in Objective B? And then backtrack to room 3 to come out in room 6? The path would be shorter, but more difficult.

Parkour is exciting and all, but once you're done flinging yourself around, you still have to leave through the same door like everyone else.

 

3) Being airborne and staying on the walls isn't encouraged in the slightest. Enemies can still shoot you just as easily as if you were sprinting on the ground, shooting accuracy is actually decreased, and enemies spawn faster than you can kill them, until you run out of stamina and fight on the ground, just like everybody else. The majority of combat featured in the above video is actually done on the ground. Racing around in large rooms and taking complex paths is cool and all, but ultimately the only advantage is to get a couple of seconds to recharge your shields

 

Ultimately, we can argue for days on how parkour can be improved, but I think the real issue is that we need a reason to do it at all.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Wurdyburd

[taiiat]

so I suspect that sprint speeds are no longer an issue in terms of geometry and warping.

it's possible. but it was an issue in the past, and i don't know if it still would be one.

[Magnar21]

-snip-

All of my this. These changes would make Warframe infinately more fun  to play.

[ThePresident777]

Nice video, DE should consider doing something like this to show off what the game can do, instead of Rhino ripping Zanuka in half with his hands. Then, we can have more informed discussions.

Also, that video shows parkour and coptoring working together to span longer distances that are not found on all maps. So, coptoring is not holding back parkour. It's not an either or choice.

Edited November 11, 2014 by ThePresident777

[SlyBoots]

We can't deny that not being able to kill flying enemies when going sword alone was a problem!

 

i see your problem and raise you a fuckin simple solution: let us tilt the torso just like when aiming dem guns, quick draw with secondary. directional melee as a solution to anything gameplay mechanics related is a wee bit outlandish, and certainly very clunky with the fixed range of where you hit, suddenly lost momentum at the end and all...

Edited November 11, 2014 by SlyBoots

[Tr1ples1xer]

Nice video, DE should consider doing something like this to show off what the game can do, instead of Rhino ripping Zanuka in half with his hands. Then, we can have more informed discussions.

Also, that video shows parkour and coptoring working together to span longer distances that are not found on all maps. So, coptoring is not holding back parkour. It's not an either or choice.

Yeah I made it to show what was already possible, I was tired of people saying that parkour is broken and that it doesn't work. I love wallrunning as much as coptering and they go so well together I had to show it off because I think it is underused.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Tr1ples1xer

[Limpinator]

I think the main step to fixing the parkour would be to stop the auto rolls/crouching still animations after you fall from any height no matter how fast you are going. Like in the third example of the warframe running in the corridor. A drop that small should not force the rolling animation or the crouching one. There should be a height and angle factor that should determine the kind of fall you take. And if the rolling animation is used, speed should be another main factor on how far and fast the roll is. Cause rolling after a simple vault is just completely unnecessary.      

[unknow99]

i see your problem and raise you a fuckin simple solution: let us tilt the torso just like when aiming dem guns, quick draw with secondary. directional melee as a solution to anything gameplay mechanics related is a wee bit outlandish, and certainly very clunky with the fixed range of where you hit, suddenly lost momentum at the end and all...

I agree 50% with you : it's an odd way to solve it. :p

 

Yeah I made it to show what was already possible, I was tired of people saying that parkour is broken and that it doesn't work. I love wallrunning as much as coptering and they go so well together I had to show it off because I think it is underused.

I may say that your video is the accomplishment of the current system. Congrats, really!(it's also instructive)

 

But even you know that Parkour can be more than this...At least for someone doing really basic things...

 

(Same for Stealth, underused.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYY7e-AEQkc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYY7e-AEQkc

But I digress.)

[DSpite]

Just want to add something to what I have already said before:

 

We can't really have "normal" Parkour, as in, get things added that are done now in other games where we grab ledges, and run on walls in more controlled directions etc etc because that implies a few things:

 

* That we don't have better ways of doing so, when in most cases, we do.

* We have similar limitation to normal humans, when we are not meant to.

* DE will go out of their way to make a massive amount of changes to actual map surfaces.

 

If Parkour 2.0 is going to be "a thing", I'd rather us have a Super Parkour system, where we can stick to walls like Zanuka and shoot, re-do infinite Wallruns, and have much greater air directional control and landing control. Basically, it should trivialize any coptering.

 

You know how Excalibur has Super Jump? Why can't we say, crouch-ready, power up a meter and then launch ourselves? Jump onto a wall, hang on without sliding, look around for a new spot, jump again, rinse repeat. Grab the damn ceiling, run across that.

 

To me that would be Parkour 2.0

 

If we keep going back to what is still in the OP original post, I'm still insisting that version is dead. That version belongs in a "normal" game like the one with the Ninja Rabbit, because THAT rabbit does not have 20 Exoskeletons he can put on with enough super powers to wipe the map clean of other Ninja Rabbits a thousand times over.

 

If we are going to go Ninja, we would have to do it Super Power style.

 

... and DE will STILL have to re-look at maps and probably either take out a LOT of ledges, or start creating enemy units that can chase us around better. And players being players, I'm pretty sure we will make an even BIGGER mockery of the AI then we already do.

 

It's a slippery slope. Or not, when you can hang to walls, unless DE starts covering them in oil.

[ThePresident777]

I'm all for Super Power style.  It's what I expect from Warframe.  Although, I don't think it has to trivalize coptor in the future.  Trivialize current coptor, absolutely.  But, I don't see why coptor has to take a back seat to Super Power Style Parkour.  I don't see why coptor can't be Super Powered too.  It's been demonstrated that parkour and coptor complement each other.

 

I also don't see why enemies have to become super powered to match us.  I can see some enemies being super powered, but, I see no reason for all of them to be super powered.  Contrast makes the game interesting and helps high light what the Tenno are.  Currently, enemies have super jumping mechanics that the Tenno wish they could have and it brakes the immersion.  I understand it's to avoid path finding problems.  But, it still is odd.

[fatpig84]

Copter and directional melee is fun.

And who said they are "killing the game" ?

If you want to work on Parkour, ask DE give back the wall leap speed (previously when you leap off a wall, you flew extremely fast and if skilled you can bounce around like spider man) back first as a start.

[Mesyra]

nearly 1k upvotes. wow.

 

and for this image:

 

 

there is actually a proper chain of wall runs you can do to cross that entire chasm of Lava down there. I do it every time I go through that room.

[taiiat]

there is actually a proper chain of wall runs you can do to cross that entire chasm of Lava down there. I do it every time I go through that room.

the image is talking about getting to the center platform in that tile.

 

it's easy to fling yourself at mach 88 to the other end of the Tile.

[gaurdianaq]

Finally got around to reading all this, and I agree with everything +1!

[Jinryusai]

I totally agree with this idea floating around that coptering and now directional melee just threw any real and interesting parkour outta the window. I was furious when I initially saw directional melee although I decided to wait expecting some tweaks to that. But to be fair I was already horrified when I saw glimpse of it on some prime time.

 

Few weeks later and still nothing. I even wanted to change the title to protest against directional melee but resisted. I don't even know now... I feel this thread in the end is pointless. So is the thread for animations. Back then I totally thought something would change after a year. But my character is still pointing his weapon into the ground while bullets are flying in front of me. The biggest (and one of very few) tweaks were ability to cast abilities on the move (basically animations only affecting your upper body).

 

If directional melee was drastically tweaked and nerfed, then copter restricted, we can hope for something along the lines of parkour 2.0

Reconstructing or adding completely new levels would be too much as someone said.

And what would removing directional melee and copter do? NOTHING. Because doing that won't make people do what you want them to. the only thing that would is if your idea made them pointless. that is the only way to beat those two features, improve the one you want the one to shine so ignore D. Melee and coptering. Soon parkour shall outshine them all.

 

you cannot deny that it shall happen if it's fixed. if it don't get fixed, then people shall simply run if the other mobility options get removed.

 

And these two things in no way impact the work being done on parkour. These are not the answer to parkour. And merfing it won't have any effect on the work on the parkour.

 

Highly doubt nerfing them would light a fire under their &#!.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Jinryusai

[Jinryusai]

i see your problem and raise you a fuckin simple solution: let us tilt the torso just like when aiming dem guns, quick draw with secondary. directional melee as a solution to anything gameplay mechanics related is a wee bit outlandish, and certainly very clunky with the fixed range of where you hit, suddenly lost momentum at the end and all...

So the Tenno can magically pull a pistol out of their &#! when none is equipped?

 

So little people mad at copter/D. Melee for no good reason. Often it's an animation issue by looking wierd which can be fixed.

 

Another is a trivialized parkour system which can be revamped.

 

Now those are real solutions...

[Jinryusai]

Movement and speed are what separate Warframe from every other shooter I've played (a small category, admittedly), and they're what have kept me playing for as long as I have.  I would love to see some improvements to it all the same, even if not to the level of Overgrowth.

 

Seriously, though, Overgrowth has probably the best third-person movement I've ever seen.  Warframe with Overgrowth's wallrunning and animation flow?  I might need to take a cold shower.

 

Directional air melee seems a lot like a cop-out, granting the increased maneuvrability that should come from the existing parkour.  Coptering and flip-rolling are faster than sprinting in a straight line, so why should I sprint?  It's incredibly silly how non-organic rushing is in a game about crazy space-ninjas.  Witness the majesty of a four-frame cell of armored strikers flipping and spinning through the air, borne aloft by glitchy momentum and weapon physics that would make even Thor raise an eyebrow.

 

EDIT:  It's also worth noting that the fastest method of movement I've found is the carefully-timed sprint-slide-jump that results most times in a forward flip at Warp 4, catapulting me across the tile if I don't clip straight out of the map.  When I get to my destination, I'm pinned to the wall until my momentum arbitrarily runs out of time, which is annoying and nonsensical.  Fixing glitches needs to be a priority.

Well, considering Direct melee is for aerial attacks, doesn't seem like a cop out...

 

Also played Shinobi and other ninja games which have some nice mobility...

 

These two things do make warframe unique and fun

Edited November 12, 2014 by Jinryusai

[Jinryusai]

And lets not forget D. melee can mesh well with parkour especially to reach distant destinations or higher platforms. 

 

use your imaginations rather than use tunnel vision...

[ENIAK_Prime]

I... I... wow. Just... +1.

If we had this, and more secret passages (https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/341705-more-secret-passages/), game would be so much closer to being perfect.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Soldatto

[unknow99]

Just want to add something to what I have already said before:

 

We can't really have "normal" Parkour, as in, get things added that are done now in other games where we grab ledges, and run on walls in more controlled directions etc etc because that implies a few things:

 

* That we don't have better ways of doing so, when in most cases, we do.

* We have similar limitation to normal humans, when we are not meant to.

* DE will go out of their way to make a massive amount of changes to actual map surfaces.

 

If Parkour 2.0 is going to be "a thing", I'd rather us have a Super Parkour system, where we can stick to walls like Zanuka and shoot, re-do infinite Wallruns, and have much greater air directional control and landing control. Basically, it should trivialize any coptering.

 

You know how Excalibur has Super Jump? Why can't we say, crouch-ready, power up a meter and then launch ourselves? Jump onto a wall, hang on without sliding, look around for a new spot, jump again, rinse repeat. Grab the damn ceiling, run across that.

 

To me that would be Parkour 2.0

 

If we keep going back to what is still in the OP original post, I'm still insisting that version is dead. That version belongs in a "normal" game like the one with the Ninja Rabbit, because THAT rabbit does not have 20 Exoskeletons he can put on with enough super powers to wipe the map clean of other Ninja Rabbits a thousand times over.

 

If we are going to go Ninja, we would have to do it Super Power style.

 

... and DE will STILL have to re-look at maps and probably either take out a LOT of ledges, or start creating enemy units that can chase us around better. And players being players, I'm pretty sure we will make an even BIGGER mockery of the AI then we already do.

 

It's a slippery slope. Or not, when you can hang to walls, unless DE starts covering them in oil.

DSpite!...

 

I gave you an upvote. Suppa Ninja style is something we all wish for.

 

However, if you want to run/jump/do backflips, you need to know how to...Walk.

 

If going all Yamakasi but basic moves are lacking, you can say what you want, people will always think that D.E. skips priorities... :/ Just like when we get to fly in space but we still don't know how to...Swim. :p

 

You see my point (and OP's point)?

Edited November 12, 2014 by unknow99

[Lukap99]

Just want to add something to what I have already said before:

 

We can't really have "normal" Parkour, as in, get things added that are done now in other games where we grab ledges, and run on walls in more controlled directions etc etc because that implies a few things:

 

* That we don't have better ways of doing so, when in most cases, we do.

* We have similar limitation to normal humans, when we are not meant to.

* DE will go out of their way to make a massive amount of changes to actual map surfaces.

 

If Parkour 2.0 is going to be "a thing", I'd rather us have a Super Parkour system, where we can stick to walls like Zanuka and shoot, re-do infinite Wallruns, and have much greater air directional control and landing control. Basically, it should trivialize any coptering.

 

You know how Excalibur has Super Jump? Why can't we say, crouch-ready, power up a meter and then launch ourselves? Jump onto a wall, hang on without sliding, look around for a new spot, jump again, rinse repeat. Grab the damn ceiling, run across that.

 

To me that would be Parkour 2.0

 

If we keep going back to what is still in the OP original post, I'm still insisting that version is dead. That version belongs in a "normal" game like the one with the Ninja Rabbit, because THAT rabbit does not have 20 Exoskeletons he can put on with enough super powers to wipe the map clean of other Ninja Rabbits a thousand times over.

 

If we are going to go Ninja, we would have to do it Super Power style.

 

... and DE will STILL have to re-look at maps and probably either take out a LOT of ledges, or start creating enemy units that can chase us around better. And players being players, I'm pretty sure we will make an even BIGGER mockery of the AI then we already do.

 

It's a slippery slope. Or not, when you can hang to walls, unless DE starts covering them in oil.

 

DE want full run 'n' gun up to 11 around five updates ago, maybe more.

This would fit into the game perfectly.

But, like unknow99 said, you learn to walk before you can run.

It's in DE's best interest to fix regular parkour motions (tighter jump control, controlling where you jump when doing a wallrun, better ledge detection, vaults) before we supercharge it.

[SlyBoots]

So the Tenno can magically pull a pistol out of their @$$ when none is equipped?

 

So little people mad at copter/D. Melee for no good reason. Often it's an animation issue by looking wierd which can be fixed.

 

Another is a trivialized parkour system which can be revamped.

 

Now those are real solutions...

 

maybe only have quick draw for your secondary when you have one equipped? (just like you only have quick melee when you actually have a melee weapon equipped...) tilted torso for melee should enable you to deal with most stuff anyway plus it's not like i said directional melee should be removed... i mean we agree on movement can be improved so let's not get sidetracked.

Edited November 12, 2014 by SlyBoots