Weapon Mod Proposal: SWIFT STRIKE ... replacing Hornet Strike in mod builds.

[Doraz_]

Inspiration: John Wick

 

Slow firing weapons  make you feel every shot missed.

Usually, those weapon come with an involved reload as well.

 

While i was hoping "Pressurize Magazine" would gave me that feel, it does not at its current state at 90 percent buff.

 

How it Works:

SWIFT STRIKE

+200 Damage ( -20 than hornet)

Weapon is given 1 shot every 1 second ( capping at 3)  that can be fired indipendently from fire-rate, as fast as you can pull the trigger.

This would be a "buff wheel icon" like any other special effect from weapon mods on the top right of the screen.

When shots are all used, the weapon fires normally.

Bugs might be a-plenty  ...   it would be then trigger only at mouse_down input ( only semi automatic gunz then) ... cuz otherwise automatic weapons would shoot randomly like a struggling car engine!

 

This would further incentivize these playstyles

- exposing your warframe for a brief moment, deal a burst of damage and retreat, shotting from cover.

- Giving player that miss a shot a second chance at hitting the target.

 

The "super shots" still would use ammo of course ... the convenience of it would make me feel like it should give Negative damage to compensate xD

 

Wholesome gif of mr. keanu incoming

 

EDIT: oh yes. both primaries and secondaries  ... so a SWIFT Serration but really "a better name" Serration would be a +150 damage instead

[lukinu_u]

The idea is interesting, but the issue I see is how inconstant it would be depending on the weapon and the way it encourage macro.

Like you said with mouse_down, it would encourage a specific button mapping or macro to make best use of the mod, which would make it vastly stronger on PC. The fact it's stronger on PC wouldn't be an issue since it's already the case for other content due to use of a mouse + the way you can more easily use more button at the same, but that's still weird imo.
As for the inconstancy well... I don't think I need to explain. The weapon would make slow fire rate weapons much stronger and the 3 recharge delay encourage a shoot and melee playstyle, that is already one of the strongest aviable, so I don't think it's good.

To be interesting and not weirdly balanced depending on the weapon, I think a mod like that would need more restriction and stronger changes to really become a unique playstyle.
This is really different from your original idea but here is how I would see a similar mod :
"Remove the fire rate and magazine restriction to replace them with a heat mechanic - Semi-auto pistol only (The heat meter depend on the weapon's fire rate and magazine, affected by mods).
The mod is really different but overall achieve the same purpose : it gives you infinite as you wished and allow a more complexe ammo management, you can shoot a few bullets rapidely, keep a constant low dps or throw everything a burst but wait while your weapon cool down. The heat meter and cooldown need to be adjusted greatly to not be OP, but this could be interesting, especially has almost nobody use semi-auto pistols right now.
 

[Doraz_]

1 hour ago, lukinu_u said:

The idea is interesting, but the issue I see is how inconstant it would be depending on the weapon and the way it encourage macro.

Like you said with mouse_down, it would encourage a specific button mapping or macro to make best use of the mod, which would make it vastly stronger on PC. The fact it's stronger on PC wouldn't be an issue since it's already the case for other content due to use of a mouse + the way you can more easily use more button at the same, but that's still weird imo.
As for the inconstancy well... I don't think I need to explain. The weapon would make slow fire rate weapons much stronger and the 3 recharge delay encourage a shoot and melee playstyle, that is already one of the strongest aviable, so I don't think it's good.

To be interesting and not weirdly balanced depending on the weapon, I think a mod like that would need more restriction and stronger changes to really become a unique playstyle.
This is really different from your original idea but here is how I would see a similar mod :
"Remove the fire rate and magazine restriction to replace them with a heat mechanic - Semi-auto pistol only (The heat meter depend on the weapon's fire rate and magazine, affected by mods).
The mod is really different but overall achieve the same purpose : it gives you infinite as you wished and allow a more complexe ammo management, you can shoot a few bullets rapidely, keep a constant low dps or throw everything a burst but wait while your weapon cool down. The heat meter and cooldown need to be adjusted greatly to not be OP, but this could be interesting, especially has almost nobody use semi-auto pistols right now.
 

wow

your heat mechanic is indeed the more interesting option.

 

The ammo being infinite i don't care really, i was more focused on improving the feel of the shooting in chaotic scenarios (pretty much most of the starchart). Plus i wanted to retain the damage, inf. ammo feels too good to not have a drawback!

In your version it works cuz the drawback is heat management.

 

(now ... stupid rambling incoming +_+)

I don't like it "in concept", because it would make all weapons "world-building-wise" function the same ... or you can explain it with "void magic" replacing the firing mechanism ... but i'd then appreciate/require some visual effects to sell it (mostly UI and partcles).

Another thing i don't like is that it would completely change the feel of the weapon, making it the first mod (to my knowledge) to be a "replace" rather than being "additive".

The scenario i was trying to fix was this:

-equip lex/sepulcrum/ecc

- face 3 enemies 

-awquardly shoot at each one very slowly xD, while they shoot and scream at you.

 

BUT...

Your version is indeed, better tho.

I like it a lot, and it has so much potential.

 

An ui heat meter can replace the ammo count, nicely animated and easier to manage than numbers.

It would give players an actual new mechanic to build towards and manage during combat.

 

Fire-rate can finally stop being the "you will reload more often mod", instead having positive effect on the "Weapon Heat" equation, thus more dps without inconvinience.

 

Now, macro-wise ... in truth i am really proposing these kind of things cuz i don't wanna use them xD

 

That gameplay of "burst and rest", macro or not, is what semi-auto should dominate and excel imo, and use would indeed skyrocket.

 

Thanks for the reply tenno! 

[Doraz_]

I never thought about using Gauss to simulate it xD

 

So i did that, and the problems are

- Limited to Gauss

- You put yourself at a disadvantage when you can pick an automatic and go BRRRRRRT

 

Weapons like the tiberon and Argonak are perfect for this as you can switch fire modes on the fly

[Colyeses]

I appreciate what you're trying to do here, but from a game design perspective, I don't think it's a good idea to push slower firerate weapons to resemble rapidfires more. They have different styles for a reason, and that should be respected and preserved. 

Instead, I'd want the AoE statuses to be reworked to give them significantly more value on single-shot weapons. If the size of the blast, gas or electric procs were to scale with base damage, for example, snipers could get better crowd control value when built for it.

[Doraz_]

4 hours ago, Colyeses said:

I appreciate what you're trying to do here, but from a game design perspective, I don't think it's a good idea to push slower firerate weapons to resemble rapidfires more. They have different styles for a reason, and that should be respected and preserved. 

Instead, I'd want the AoE statuses to be reworked to give them significantly more value on single-shot weapons. If the size of the blast, gas or electric procs were to scale with base damage, for example, snipers could get better crowd control value when built for it.

I'm trying to realize this while preserving the semi-auto feel. That burst would be limited to a few shots at most, adding one "fast bullet" every second.

Another option that i was writing but I fell asleep -_- was to allow ak-imbo/dual wield guns to fire indipendently ( again, like Borderlands) so the fire rate would remain the same, but you can burst 2 shots quickly.

That on my Rivened Ak-Bolto Prime would feel amazing!

 

Your idea of linking damage with range is sensible and would work in some games, but not warframe in my opinion.

Reason being that damage goes from 0 to n+ millions ... it's just all over the scale, you'll get the best range every time.

You need a more reliable way to build damage and the damage itself needs to be reliable when dished out.

Thus I see a "clock" in between shots that buffs your damage to be more appropriate, incentivizing taking time between shots and not fire like a madman.

Make it increase range of aoe damage and it would pretty much make semi-auto a compelling option " TO HAVE FUN!" ( for once xD ... )

 

It's unfortunate that most of the ideas I see on the forum are really great, but WF structure makes it really hard for them to be properly realized and implemented.

 

I was playing Dauntless to check on the progress they are making, and while the server problems, lack of community, insane grind and high prices in the market are a big issue,

they managed to create a system where damage "usually" stays low, understandable and can interact with other systems.

Dps is easily readible,

Weapons "seem" to be very indipendent from one another and being capable of being scripted with all sorts of unique functionalities.

( "usually" as there are of course people that do god damage and make the game a cake-walk ... but that is very VERY far into progression, expecially solo).

 

[Xarteros]

remove damage from the mod entirely, and remove the mandatory mods. Bring back the tree-nodes we had back in closed beta before mod cards became a thing. Let players pick what stats to focus on as base stats, and make our mods be tradeoffs (keeping mods like Heavy Caliber, trading accuracy for more damage, or converting damage into elemental damage)

Focus should have been our way of expanding those tree-nodes further and selecting more at once. That's what the original theme was (making our most beloved weapons/frames stronger through continued use) and it's why DE made focus lenses work like that, but they gave us Starchild Wizards instead of improved weapons/frames

It's not too late DE, you can still make mods great again.

[Doraz_]

48 minutes ago, Xarteros said:

remove damage from the mod entirely, and remove the mandatory mods. Bring back the tree-nodes we had back in closed beta before mod cards became a thing. Let players pick what stats to focus on as base stats, and make our mods be tradeoffs (keeping mods like Heavy Caliber, trading accuracy for more damage, or converting damage into elemental damage)

Focus should have been our way of expanding those tree-nodes further and selecting more at once. That's what the original theme was (making our most beloved weapons/frames stronger through continued use) and it's why DE made focus lenses work like that, but they gave us Starchild Wizards instead of improved weapons/frames

It's not too late DE, you can still make mods great again.

i wasn't here when that was a thing

 

but the moment BNP showed it and explaind how it works, i immediately felt it was the systwm i would have preferred.

 

Each gun having it's own tree, even unique and specific to they way it functions ... I'm hyped even at the thought.

 

It even incentivizes DE in releasing fewer but better weapons (no re-skins, no mastery fodder) and guns become way more personal!

 

Unfortunately the streamlining (game-wide) that mods brought to the game is a convenience that is too strong to refuse :(

 

I end up saying this every time xD but this system could be implemented/brought back for specific weapons only, to add diversity.

[Doraz_]

I've done more testing, and i can only confirm my conclusions :(

 

Even my bare-bone change of 3 max "free-fast" shots refilling at 1 per second would take the Sepulcrum from " best gun ever" to " god tier, why would i play any other game ?! "

 

i'm done thinking about this xD ty for the talks

[(XBOX)An Angry Mod]

I feel like this would make an excellent augment for the Lex series. Ol' faithful could be brought up to current standards.

[kevoisvevo]

so basically discount knell as a mod then? i can get behind that.