Event Gripe: Players Joining And Not Participating.

[Boomstick720]

 

 

Anyway, rather than discussing whether the threshold for T3 reward is too high, we should be discussing - why are the rewards locked behind a purely quantitative task instead of a qualitative task anyway? Locking a reward behind a non-skill based, and instead high repetition based task is....you guessed it - boring.

 

The last time they put the barrier as quantitative, which was the survival event, people were *@##$ing about how it was so unfair to new players.

 

Here is the problem.  You make it too "qualitative", people *@##$ about it being too hard.  You make it too "quantitative", people *@##$ about it being too grindy.  The former only rewards a select few who are good enough at the game and have a good group with which to play with.  The latter only rewards the few that have enough time to play this game for hours upon hours every day.  I think this event is actually pretty balanced, although 100 is a bit excessive.  I'd probably drop it to 75, but even then if you do all the missions available (all but 2 have been up for at least 5-6 hours), you would still make the "cut".

 

OT:  Yeah it gets annoying, but honestly, I just play solo most of the time to avoid it, and I think its far more fun and challenging.  Helps alleviate the feeling of grind.

[TwiceDead]

The last time they put the barrier as quantitative, which was the survival event, people were *@##$ing about how it was so unfair to new players.

 

Here is the problem.  You make it too "qualitative", people $#*(@ about it being too hard.  You make it too "quantitative", people $#*(@ about it being too grindy.  The former only rewards a select few who are good enough at the game and have a good group with which to play with.  The latter only rewards the few that have enough time to play this game for hours upon hours every day.  I think this event is actually pretty balanced, although 100 is a bit excessive.  I'd probably drop it to 75, but even then if you do all the missions available (all but 2 have been up for at least 5-6 hours), you would still make the "cut".

 

OT:  Yeah it gets annoying, but honestly, I just play solo most of the time to avoid it, and I think its far more fun and challenging.  Helps alleviate the feeling of grind.

The event is supposed to be played over the span of 7 days after all. By that math, you could do 15 missions a day and still reach the T3 rewards. Alleviates the feeling of grind I suppose. Can't really say much after own experience since I completed 100 missions in two days, so I am mostly speaking hypothetically at this point. 

[notionphil]

The last time they put the barrier as quantitative, which was the survival event, people were *@##$ing about how it was so unfair to new players.

 

Here is the problem.  You make it too "qualitative", people $#*(@ about it being too hard.  You make it too "quantitative", people $#*(@ about it being too grindy.  The former only rewards a select few who are good enough at the game and have a good group with which to play with.  The latter only rewards the few that have enough time to play this game for hours upon hours every day.  I think this event is actually pretty balanced, although 100 is a bit excessive.  I'd probably drop it to 75, but even then if you do all the missions available (all but 2 have been up for at least 5-6 hours), you would still make the "cut".

 

OT:  Yeah it gets annoying, but honestly, I just play solo most of the time to avoid it, and I think its far more fun and challenging.  Helps alleviate the feeling of grind.

 

I said it shouldn't be "purely quantitative". That doesn't mean it should be purely qualitative.

 

There should always be 'another way out'. A qualatitive goal gives players something to strive for. And if they miss, they end up hitting the qualitative goal along the way.

 

EX: Survive 20m in one session OR a total of 1h, across different sessions. By the end of 1h of total survival, you may find that you had a good enough run to make your 20m. Either way, win, win.

 

AKA - shoot for the stars, and if you fall, at least you'll land on the moon :)

Edited October 26, 2013 by notionphil

[EelPlus]

The event is supposed to be played over the span of 7 days after all. By that math, you could do 15 missions a day and still reach the T3 rewards. Alleviates the feeling of grind I suppose. Can't really say much after own experience since I completed 100 missions in two days, so I am mostly speaking hypothetically at this point. 

The problem with that is the 7 days is pure speculation.  There have been events in the past that have ended prematurely (meaning before the event time frame ended) because all objectives were completed. DE gave no official indication on whether or not this event will actually last 7 days (IE under the extremely unlikely circumstance that every single player chose a single faction to support, the event may have ended almost immediately).  I feel like I have to grind it out early just in case the event ends before Wednesday.

[-Kittens-]

So what you're saying is that those who simply can't keep up with the ones who kill everything with a single button press and run at the speed of light because they haven't advanced enough in the game should go out of their way and do the event missions solo just so they don't risk making the others wait a few seconds at the extraction point?

 

I hate rushers.

 

hate.

 

You should really read the thread a little closer.

[scavenge]

I did a good 170 runs now, not one leeched. Seen around 15 players just sitting in spawn by now.

[OrdoCorvus]

Is that why I've seen people joining missions and never even moving from the spot they spawn/drop in from? They can leech the rewards without actually playing? I hope that isn't the case. If so, DE, you managed to screw up another event.

It's not DE's fault that people are $&*^ing over their fellow players.

I mean, I guess I could blame DE for not being more cynical, but I'm a glass-half-full type of guy, so I won't do that.

I'd probably have made the same mistake if I were a developer. That is, assuming the players actually want to, you know, play the game.

[Terasa]

I hate rushers.

 

hate.

 

You should really read the thread a little closer.

 What I commented on was you quoting Sasuga and saying he's just creating excuses for not being able to actually help his teammates when, as I see it, is not the case. 

 

 I wasn't responding to the opening post, which, in regard to afkers, until now I have done at least 80 missions and haven't seen a single one, but I really don't understand how the game can have no system at all to deal with this issue. A vote kicking or maybe just the game checking if the player attacked enemies before allowing them to keep the items and rewards collected should work. Anyway, I agree that something should be done about this.

 

 Now, if I am missing something, can you please explain to me? And without the condescension, please.

 

 Edit: On hindsight, maybe my first post did seem aggressive. If that's so, my bad. Ignore the last part on this one.

 I would really like to know what is it that, as it seems, I am failing to notice, though.

Edited October 27, 2013 by Terasa

[fatpig84]

Over 200 games here.

I clear rooms in 5 minutes with an Ignis (not AOE powers).... So I don't feel the pinch of AFKers much.

 

But then again, i was not leveling gear and using all maxed so...

[PapaKicks]

Simple detection - If a player has zeros all the way down for their stats for more than X missions. Disqualify them from the event.

 

That will eliminate most of the leechers.

[Eliard]

Simple detection - If a player has zeros all the way down for their stats for more than X missions. Disqualify them from the event.

 

That will eliminate most of the leechers.

 

It might have to be more than just that, as players (usually) spawn in with enough energy to use a skill once or twice. They could just press 1 or 2 upon entering, and not make another move.

[PapaKicks]

It might have to be more than just that, as players (usually) spawn in with enough energy to use a skill once or twice. They could just press 1 or 2 upon entering, and not make another move.

 

True, but my suggestion was for this specific event, not a long term fix. So they wouldn't know to press 1 or 2 upon entering because they wouldn't know they could be DQ'ed.

[NitroMidgets]

There probably should have been some sort of numbers check upon completion to deny those leeching from getting a reward. Zero kills or no revives and they get a Mission Failed. I mean since they were hired to take a side and they finished without actually doing anything for either side.

[panthernet]

This issue must be resolved, i hope devs are reading this topic. All this crap is REALY annoying!! Just played the event match where 3 players was AFK with 0 in result. Yes i have the gear and skill to make it alone but such thing are making me sick!

 

Seriously guys, some AFK detecting system is a MUST HAVE for every MMO game. How long Warframe is running and still no detection tools? Punish, punish and punish! WHen i'm entering the matchmaking i hope to enjoy the gameplay with a team and corrsponding difficulty, when i'm going to farm one location for many times i want all my teammates partcipating so i can do it quick!

 

Please do something, don't make such misfeatures to ruin the whole fun.

 

I'm dissatisfied with the whole situation of ingame players control, for ex. overcrowded main chats with many people using badwords and spamming and i can't even quick-ignore them.

Edited October 27, 2013 by panthernet

[PapaKicks]

This issue must be resolved, i hope devs are reading this topic. All this crap is REALY annoying!! Just played the event match where 3 players was AFK with 0 in result. Yes i have the gear and skill to make it alone but such thing are making me sick!

 

Seriously guys, some AFK detecting system is a MUST HAVE for every MMO game. How long Warframe is running and still no detection tools? Punish, punish and punish! WHen i'm entering the matchmaking i hope to enjoy the gameplay with a team and corrsponding difficulty, when i'm going to farm one location for many times i want all my teammates partcipating so i can do it quick!

 

Please do something, don't make such misfeatures to ruin the whole fun.

 

I'm dissatisfied with the whole situation of ingame players control, for ex. overcrowded main chats with many people using badwords and spamming and i can't even quick-ignore them.

 

They do have afk detection, but no real penalties for it. If you go AFK too long your sentinel will stop attacking. You will also stop dealing damage automatically (auto-parry + reflection).

 

The only penalty though is getting no money for a mission. But credit for everything else including end mission blueprints etc.

[Llyssa]

I'd like to point out some of us are absolute battle monsters.

 

I've had a number of matches where I've managed more than twice as many kills as all the rest of my team combined(and they WERE trying!)

 

I've also had a few matches where all I did was walk around picking up loot from rooms emptied before I finished loading. In those, no matter how fast I run, I get at most MAYBE one kill, if I'm lucky.

 

I can imagine that this has made more than a few people stop caring. If you're expecting the map to be flattened as soon as you load in, there's not much incentive to actually run to try and see whether or not you can get lucky.

 

That doesn't excuse it, but I can *definitely* understand it.

[OrdoCorvus]

I'd like to point out some of us are absolute battle monsters.

 

I've had a number of matches where I've managed more than twice as many kills as all the rest of my team combined(and they WERE trying!)

 

I've also had a few matches where all I did was walk around picking up loot from rooms emptied before I finished loading. In those, no matter how fast I run, I get at most MAYBE one kill, if I'm lucky.

 

I can imagine that this has made more than a few people stop caring. If you're expecting the map to be flattened as soon as you load in, there's not much incentive to actually run to try and see whether or not you can get lucky.

 

That doesn't excuse it, but I can *definitely* understand it.

 

Like I said, all I want is for people to try. Or at the very least, have to put in the effort to at least look like they're trying.

[PixlSheep]

I try my hardest to keep up with everyone but I find myself being significantly weaker than everyone else.

[DarknightK]

IN my opnion to anti-leeching, I would say implement a system that:

 

-Kicks players for not moving after 3 minutes of inactivity as soon as the game starts

 

-Kicks players for inactivity for more than 5 minutes (if they moved)

 

-Does not give players ANY rewards or EXP for having zeroes down the board.

 

 

But the reputation system is supposed to be a fill-in for dem leechers, supposedly matching you with players of them same rank and providing synergy with similar reputation.

I guess leechers would get negative reputation, which could make things a lot more balanced in terms of matchmaking.

[Sinistro6]

So basicly what AFKrs are saying: "The event is boring so I rather you take care of the boring stuff for me. Blame DE for my lazyness."

 

DE, please give us votekick. This is getting old.

[OrdoCorvus]

IN my opnion to anti-leeching, I would say implement a system that:

 

-Kicks players for not moving after 3 minutes of inactivity as soon as the game starts

 

-Kicks players for inactivity for more than 5 minutes (if they moved)

 

-Does not give players ANY rewards or EXP for having zeroes down the board.

 

 

But the reputation system is supposed to be a fill-in for dem leechers, supposedly matching you with players of them same rank and providing synergy with similar reputation.

I guess leechers would get negative reputation, which could make things a lot more balanced in terms of matchmaking.

 

Something like this would not be a bad notion.

 

Have several criteria that must be met, nobody can accidentally fail that hard.

 

There would be ways around it, but if you have to do that much work to avoid playing the game, you're better off just doing the mission.

[Letter13]

Do you know what I do when someone joins my mission and leeches?

I switch teleport them into a fire trap.

Also, try to keep it civil people.

[TwiceDead]

Do you know what I do when someone joins my mission and leeches?

I switch teleport them into a fire trap.

Also, try to keep it civil people.

 

Even if they die, they still get the completion reward on their counter for this event. 

... Or do they? 

[PapaKicks]

Even if they die, they still get the completion reward on their counter for this event. 

... Or do they? 

 

You still get end mission rewards as a corpse, so I would assume they get completion credit as well.

[Dalethor]

I think that DE might be trying to come up with a solution to this issue that does not impose or seem to impose a bunch of arbitrary rules on the way a player chooses to complete missions, or experience the game in general. While they have clearly made their general dislike for certain play styles known, and introduced game mechanics to discourage that practice, they have also not imposed anything saying that its not allowed at all. They seem to have a much higher priority on allowing players the freedom to play and experience the game as they wish; that seems to be the overriding message they are sending here. 

 

Perhaps in upcoming updates we might see some kind of game mechanic introduced to discourage people from taking advantage of their fellow players, but as was stated in a recent live stream, they will hold off on any kind of arbitrary statements of what's allowed or not. As I recall, the statement was "we'll try the carrot before the stick. But if the carrot doesn't work we will be using the stick." Not a word for word quote, but the idea was there. not sure what the carrot will look like exactly, and it is definitely a difficult spot, trying to keep the freedom to play as you wish intact while keeping the griefers at a minimum. Perhaps the best way to deal with the issue is on a individual basis, as was said previously in the thread, the team didn't progress until the person finally gave it up and left the group. Anyway, I have no idea what the right solution is, but I thought I might try to shed light on the dilemma DE finds themselves in with regard to the general issue of griefers.