Wolf Sledge's Fast Wind-up. Intentional or Oversight?

[Kontrollo]

So with U30 all "Glaives" got their wind-up changed from 0.6 to 1.2

Wolf Sledge is basically in the same class, however, it retains the old wind-up time. Can we get some clarification on whether this is working as intended or will get corrected, as well? TIA.

 

Example unmodded Wolf Sledge: https://gfycat.com/torndeficientimago

[Leqesai]

It is a similar mechanic but it isn't a glaive. Why would glaive changes affect the wolf sledge?

It can't equip glaive-exclusive mods which are the primary reason for the change IMO. Volatalie Rebound took advantage of the quick throw mechanics (and low charge timer) to effectively wipe enemies constantly. Also the Volatile Quick Return heavy explosion spam was game breaking (I mean lets not kid ourselves this is still about a mile ahead of 99% of other melee DPS options).

 

Wolf Sledge is cool and all, but its gimmick isn't consistent with the rationale related to nerfing glaives IMO.

 

[Kontrollo]

59 minutes ago, Leqesai said:

It is a similar mechanic but it isn't a glaive. Why would glaive changes affect the wolf sledge?

 

Update 29.5 (2020-11-19)

• Now uses the new Glaive hold melee to throw mechanics (no air throws at this time).
• Wolf Sledge now explodes on impact when Thrown.

 

I probably should've been more clear. You're right, it's a hammer. But it has a Glaive's throw.

[LillyRaccune]

You can't use any glaive/thrown mods on Wolf Sledge.

I just wish it was easier to get a hold of, I need it on PC. On my PS4 account I have two

[Kontrollo]

4 minutes ago, LillyRaccune said:

You can't use any glaive/thrown mods on Wolf Sledge.

 

 

18 minutes ago, Kontrollo said:

I probably should've been more clear. You're right, it's a hammer. But it has a Glaive's throw.

[Leqesai]

17 minutes ago, Kontrollo said:

Update 29.5 (2020-11-19)

• Now uses the new Glaive hold melee to throw mechanics (no air throws at this time).
• Wolf Sledge now explodes on impact when Thrown.

 

I probably should've been more clear. You're right, it's a hammer. But it has a Glaive's throw.

Correct, but this is a gimmick for Wolf Sledge. It is not a glaive. Glaives have mods that make this playstyle considerably more powerful than Wolf Sledge's gimmick. That's the point I'm trying to make. 

If Wolf Sledge could have the volatile mods then sure this might be a valid concern but it doesn't and is less useful as a glaive than even the crappiest glaive.

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

9 minutes ago, LillyRaccune said:

I just wish it was easier to get a hold of, I need it on PC. On my PS4 account I have two

If you would just slide me that spare BP... jk

[Kontrollo]

4 minutes ago, Leqesai said:

Correct, but this is a gimmick for Wolf Sledge. It is not a glaive. Glaives have mods that make this playstyle considerably more powerful than Wolf Sledge's gimmick. That's the point I'm trying to make. 

If Wolf Sledge could have the volatile mods then sure this might be a valid concern but it doesn't and is less useful as a glaive than even the crappiest glaive.

And so I'm asking for clarification whether it is or isn't intentional.

[Leqesai]

4 minutes ago, Kontrollo said:

And so I'm asking for clarification whether it is or isn't intentional.

It is intentional.

[Kontrollo]

11 minutes ago, Leqesai said:

It is intentional.

That's not for you to decide.

Maybe your feedback should be that if it isn't intentional, it should be allowed to use (some) of these mods?

[Leqesai]

43 minutes ago, Kontrollo said:

That's not for you to decide.

Maybe your feedback should be that if it isn't intentional, it should be allowed to use (some) of these mods?

The arrows of logic point to it being intentional, my dude. It is not a glaive ergo it makes sense that it doesn't have the glaive nerf. It has also been explained to you why it does not make sense for it to receive the glaive nerf based on the fact that it cannot use glaive mods nor can it pull damage efficiency near that of the glaive family. It is a gimmick. It makes sense that it doesn't receive the nerf. Again, all arrows of logic point to it being intentional. I'm not really sure why you're going back and forth on this. Do you WANT it to be nerfed? If so, can you come up with a rational argument that is more than "it works kind of like a glaive so it should have the glaive nerf"?

It is not a glaive. It is a hammer with a glaive-like gimmick. Functionally they're different, sir.

[Tiltskillet]

What was the Wolf Sledge's wind up speed before?  Currently it's listed in the Arsenal as 1.2, same as the glaives.

However a quick test shows it's obviously way faster than Halikar.  I'm not going to speak as to the devs' intentions, but there is a bug here.  Hopefully it's an Arsenal bug rather than a wind up speed bug.  

However that would sort of put the lie to the spin that wind up speed was increased for usability reasons.

[Kontrollo]

1 hour ago, Tiltskillet said:

What was the Wolf Sledge's wind up speed before?  Currently it's listed in the Arsenal as 1.2, same as the glaives.

However a quick test shows it's obviously way faster than Halikar.  I'm not going to speak as to the devs' intentions, but there is a bug here.  Hopefully it's an Arsenal bug rather than a wind up speed bug.  

However that would sort of put the lie to the spin that wind up speed was increased for usability reasons.

It was definitely slower before the Glaive rework than what it is now, and it worked a bit differently, too.

I'd say it was not quite as high as 1.2s, but it didn't have the (punch-through) auto-explosions, either. Nor two types of throws. Actually, I think the fast throw (not fully charged) might not even deal a different amount of damage now. It's a bit hard to gauge, the auto-explosions do have fall-off.

 

Edit: Actually, old wiki page said it had 1.2s wind-up duration.

[Kontrollo]

Almost forgot, but I did want to test this more rigorously.

So basically what I did was test against a high enough levelled Corpus' shields (high level Elite Crewman) with an unmodded Sledge.

• Fully charged throw:
  • Projectile: always 923 base damage (i.e. when non-crit) with guaranteed Impact proc, sometimes additional other.
  • Auto-explosion: 765, 769, 774, 777, sometimes Blast proc, and extra but lower damage on nearby Corpus => definitely has fall-off
  • Wind-up: seems to be 0.6s, maybe slightly shorter (0.55s). Checked animations by frame, 60fps, until the crosshair icon changes. There's additional animation until the hammer leaves the hand, total 0.717s for that
     
• Uncharged throw:
  • Projectile: again always 923 base damage (i.e. when non-crit) with guaranteed Impact proc, sometimes additional other.
  • Auto-explosion: 721, 723, 726, 752, (1546, but crit, i.e. maybe 773 base, depends on mult. assumption is 2x), sometimes Blast proc, and extra but lower damage on nearby Corpus => definitely has fall-off
  • Wind-up: managed to go as low as 0.433s until the hammer leaves the hand, when timed right. Would be roughly consistent with a minimum ~0.3s wind-up.

 

Conclusion: Maybe an uncharged throw has minimally lower explosion damage, but even if, it's hardly noticeable. Wind-up time can probably go as low as ~0.3s when uncharged (throw time 0.433s).

 

test recording: https://gfycat.com/shadyecstaticblowfish