AoE Changes - subtle but impactful? [post Devstream discussion]

[_LotusPrime_]

1 hour ago, Tiltskillet said:

  What I am saying is that we're far more powerful than two years ago. 

 

2 years ago ? sure . 3-4 years ago ? debatable

1 hour ago, Tiltskillet said:

And if you're killing enemies like flies now, you still will be after the update.

the concern isnt about the few nerfs , its about the approach , road going forward , i dont know anyone elses specific points on going against the aoe nerf mention but thats my stance , im against the approach 
 

1 hour ago, Tiltskillet said:

    I think you're forgetting some important things that happened in that same update.

Okay , list  me some things in that update then , im not saying there wont be any ups but till the enemy ehp scaling was also nerfed 2 months later , the state for endgame was pretty ehh 

[Tiltskillet]

43 minutes ago, _LotusPrime_ said:

Okay , list  me some things in that update then ,

It seems better to just link it so you can read it yourself.   There's a lot, and I'm hoping that's obvious to you after you refresh your memory.

RIP 100% status shotguns tho. :/)

 

52 minutes ago, _LotusPrime_ said:

till the enemy ehp scaling was also nerfed 2 months later

It was nerfed again after this?  I don't remember that.  But if so, why in the world wouldn't it count?  :P

Now I'm not sure if we're even on the same page  You brought up radial fall-off--the universal (temporarily) 90% happened with the update above.  The same time self damage was removed.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 5 horas, Venus-Venera dijo:

and they also want to offer sp relics. for great 1 se per mission as a reward. 4 insta rez from vazarin are completely used up in the first minute...

devs have probably played too many games like eve online and want to top it. so after work we continue to work in a virtual game.

 They fix something that's obviously is overused, they buff every other weapon apart from that One Trick Pony and you say they don't play their game because they make a healthy change? The only one who doesn't seem to play the game is you.

So there are hundreds of videos that do not use explosive weapons and we see them killing everything very well. Now show me videos of you dying uselessly even with AOE weapons today so we know you're just bad and that's it.

hace 4 horas, cute_moth.npc dijo:

You can always stop playing if you don't enjoy this game ^^

I'm going to enjoy that mode.

1 steel essence.. Plus acolytes every few minutes, double void traces and something fun to fight against!

This is definitely something we wanted for more than a year now!

[_LotusPrime_]

11 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

It seems better to just link it so you can read it yourself.   There's a lot, and I'm hoping that's obvious to you after you refresh your memory.

RIP 100% status shotguns tho. :/)

 

It was nerfed again after this?  I don't remember that.  But if so, why in the world wouldn't it count?  :P

Now I'm not sure if we're even on the same page  You brought up radial fall-off--the universal (temporarily) 90% happened with the update above.  The same time self damage was removed.

if they wouldnt remove self damage after theyve just introduced fall off and stagger , dont you think it wouldve been too much ? It was a compensation buff, although chroma was affected by that , mostly it was as a buff to lauchers yes ... im still not sure what you imply by all this now , the post i made response to yours was that there wasnt ONLY buffs and i am right , and youre agreeing with me here , are you arguing for that there was more nerfs than buffs or am i missing something ?

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 3 horas, PrimalordialBob dijo:

This argument is one about player efficiency. DE nerfed your ability to clear out fodder but kept the number of fodder. When repeating a mission dozens of times players will be less efficient than before.

hace 3 horas, 0_The_F00l dijo:

I believe that's the point

Exactly, the game is almost 2 years with this and it was time for a change.

[_LotusPrime_]

11 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

 

??? They cant nerf too much anyway 

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 10 minutos, _LotusPrime_ dijo:

??? They cant nerf too much anyway 

Too much? seriously. Since 2013 there have been many nerfs and buffs here. Well crybabies always use the same argument at least use your main account to comment nonsenses.

[Jarriaga]

On 2022-08-29 at 1:19 PM, _LotusPrime_ said:

Aoe is so disruptive in which missions that everyones involved? Do you mean pubs? Why should pubs be the determinator of balance when most the time you fight 30 lvl enemies, in rare occasion its lvl 120

Because pubs are the most seamless and fastest multiplayer option available with the least amount of downtime. Not to mention DE are certain to have metrics that validate the distribution and split between public players vs dedicated squad players and how wide the gap is.

That's info neither you or me have access to, but info they absolutely have considering they have made decisions in the past tied to lack of mission node activity.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 7 minutos, Jarriaga dijo:

Because pubs are the most seamless and fastest multiplayer option available with the least amount of downtime. Not to mention DE are certain to have metrics that validate the distribution and split between public players vs dedicated squad players and how wide the gap is.

That's info neither you or me have access to, but info they absolutely have considering they have made decisions in the past tied to lack of mission node activity.

I think that DE should implement some kind of special mission that requires doing missions with low MR people daily or weekly, that to revive the origin system a bit for the new ppl or also some master/disciple system.

[Jarriaga]

2 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

I think that DE should implement some kind of special mission that requires doing missions with low MR people daily or weekly, that to revive the origin system a bit for the new ones or some master/disciple system.

I agree with this if your equipment is restricted as to only disrup them (Baby/new players) with your skill rather than your gear.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

I don't know if it's just me thinking about this but, after the announcement about the changes in the devstream i see a lot of new account complaining about things that shouldn't bother them with the time they have in their accounts. I think a lot of ppl are using secondary accounts to said S#&$ or just some bot companies get paid by some rich kid. I say this because I have already seen similar things in others multiplayer games.

[(XBOX)TheWayOfWisdom]

1 minute ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

I don't know if it's just me thinking about this but, after the announcement about the changes in the devstream i see a lot of new account complaining about things that shouldn't bother them with the time they have their accounts.

Forum account join date isn't your Warframe start date fyi. It's just the first time you visited the forums. You could've played for 3 years and just now visited the forums, which would make your account seem much newer.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 2 minutos, (XBOX)TheWayOfWisdom dijo:

Forum account join date isn't your Warframe start date fyi. It's just the first time you visited the forums. You could've played for 3 years and just now visited the forums, which would make your account seem much newer.

It's almost the same, you've been playing a game for 8 years and you never thought to enter not once in the forum, not until they said they would nerf the monkey and the aoe, nor when they nerfed ash or ember, i never saw so much "new" accounts on the forum complaining about the same.

[_LotusPrime_]

38 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

Too much? seriously. Since 2013 there have been many nerfs and buffs here. Well crybabies always use the same argument at least use your main account to comment nonsenses.

i didnt response to your specific post to give a fair argument , clown posts require short and quippy reponses

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 1 minuto, _LotusPrime_ dijo:

i didnt response to your specific post to give a fair argument , clown posts require short and quippy reponses

No real arguments as always.

[_LotusPrime_]

1 minute ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

No real arguments as always.

if you want arguments you can just read previous posts of mine to other people , im not gonna give everyone the same respected response , i just wanted to make fun of your anger bait post 

[CosoMalvadoNG]

Justo ahora, _LotusPrime_ dijo:

if you want arguments you can just read previous posts of mine to other people , im not gonna give everyone the same respected response , i just wanted to make fun of your anger bait post 

I can said the same. 

The only thing you've said over and over again is in short "the nerf doesn't suit me that's why it's wrong"

[_LotusPrime_]

I mean i also mean what i say i wasnt just meme ing . DE cant legitimately turn this game into another corridor shooter , we are actually past that point , they can only nerf so much , i would still be against nerfing too much tho regardless.

[_LotusPrime_]

1 minute ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

I
The only thing you've said over and over again is in short "the nerf doesn't suit me that's why it's wrong"

Suit yourself friend , i dont need to convince everyone , people with brains can read my previous posts if they want to , its all out there , couple pages before in fact.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 1 minuto, _LotusPrime_ dijo:

I mean i also mean what i say i wasnt just meme ing . DE cant legitimately turn this game into another corridor shooter , we are actually past that point , they can only nerf so much , i would still be against nerfing too much tho regardless.

Nerfing has always been better than buffing in any multiplayer game. When you buff you usually break things and when you nerf you do it to fix things. If you don't like it is a completely different story and it's ur problem.

[_LotusPrime_]

41 minutes ago, Jarriaga said:

Because pubs are the most seamless and fastest multiplayer option available with the least amount of downtime. Not to mention DE are certain to have metrics that validate the distribution and split between public players vs dedicated squad players and how wide the gap is.

That's info neither you or me have access to, but info they absolutely have considering they have made decisions in the past tied to lack of mission node activity.

In any given time there are only couple or so co-op nodes or missions that attract lot of people , whether its fissures , cetus night-time , ESO and SO , hydron , all these nodes have a thing in common ; its actually that you dont even get to see much laucher weapons clearing everything , its either a warframe ability or the weapon thats been buffed by a warframe 
 

I mean sure let them nerf the launchers but thats not even what clears those nodes real fast practically , if they really think kuva bramna does it , it seems DE team might have some disconnetion there. 

and the post youre quoting me i was arguing that ; since DE already expects players to complete vital mission on solo base , nerfing aoe weapons on the base of 'this disrupts balance ' is simply just doesnt sit from a logical stance point , but of course one could say 'ah of course theyre just nerfing aoe because they wanna reduce efficency' sure  i wouldnt say that point is illogical not that i would agree with that sentiment necessarily.

 

[Tiltskillet]

1 hour ago, _LotusPrime_ said:

if they wouldnt remove self damage after theyve just introduced fall off and stagger , dont you think it wouldve been too much ? It was a compensation buf

Yes, it would have been too much.  But I'd definitely put it the other way around.  90% falloff was an attempt at compensating for the removal of self damage.

1 hour ago, _LotusPrime_ said:

im still not sure what you imply by all this now , the post i made response to yours was that there wasnt ONLY buffs and i am right , and youre agreeing with me here , are you arguing for that there was more nerfs than buffs or am i missing something ?

No, I'm not agreeing with you.  Like I already said once:  "I didn't say there hadn't been any nerfs nor enemy buffs."  And this fixation on the quantity of these things  is purely your own. 

What matters is quality, and how effectively we can do things.  And for every big nerf we've had, there have been larger buffs at the same time or soon thereafter.  Some of our favorite tools aren't as good, but there are even better ones available.  Good bye Berserker multiplicative attack speed: I'll miss you dearly.  But hello Primary Merciless and an open mod slot.

[_LotusPrime_]

5 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

Nerfing has always been better than buffing in any multiplayer game. When you buff you usually break things and when you nerf you do it to fix things. If you don't like it is a completely different story and it's ur problem.

nerfing the outlier is always the easy route not always the best route.

Do you mean the games you forget their names because they were insignificant ? What if DE can actually balance the game on top of ridiculous power creep ? why is that not a choice , i believe DE team still has enough passion to chase that but obviously thats up to them

[_LotusPrime_]

10 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

WOW? FFXIV? Ragnarok Online? Dota? LoL? Outraider? I could go on mentioning more but nah im lazy as f *ck.

lol and dota has still ridiculous power creep but they failed to balance it properly  , wow okay failed most dropped , outriders was a huge fail , ragnarok who not even popular , warframe is the only 3d action online has that gives player to have ridiculous mobility and damage yet it stands tall after 10 years.

FF14 s a hit for sure okay i dont play that game , do they nerf too much or do they have bullet/hit  sponge units ? 

Edit ; edited yes

 

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 12 minutos, _LotusPrime_ dijo:

lol and dota has still ridiculous power creep , wow okay failed most dropped , outriders was a huge fail , ragnarok who not even popular , warframe is the only 3d action online has that gives player to have ridiculous mobility and damage yet it stands tall after 10 years , people in ranked suffer their life for goodness sake. 

Again no arguments. What does popularity have to do with anything in the first place? Ragnarok Online is a game that is 20 years old and still has an audience, what is your point? lol/Dota 2 are competitive games and if they do constant nerfs of course they buff things and broken a lot of them and then nerf them that way it how work. Have you even entered the outrider discord? there are quite a few people playing that. What does mobility have to do with a logic nerf? Are you telling me that if you nerf  the AOE the weapons that don't have AOE won't work for the current content? Are you dumb or are you playing dumb?.