A Complete Rework Of The Foundation Of Warframe.

[Azamagon]

Half finished and forgotten

This might seem a bit harsh, but doesn't this sum up pretty much ALL things they have added to this game?

They add lots of concepts, all with great potential, but just leave them half implemented and not thought through enough. Sad, really :(

 

The only thing done REALLY well in this game are the graphical parts, at least the external graphics. But you know what? They are ALSO starting to (seemingly at least) slack in some areas of these things, mainly in functional graphics

Due to offtopic, I'll leave details in a spoiler

* Phage is generally great looking and unique. However, there is no "impact" of its attack. It looks like its just barely tickling the enemies and they die.

* Zephyr, lots of details and great concept in this Warframe. But honestly, Tail Wind (for damaging purposes) seems like you hurt people out of nowhere. There is no "wind" or anything that connects to cut the enemies in pieces. And you always do a forward-leaning flight, no matter the direction you are going!

Dive Bomb looks hilarious imo. In a bad way.

[theGreatZamboni]

This might seem a bit harsh, but doesn't this sum up pretty much ALL things they have added to this game?

They add lots of concepts, all with great potential, but just leave them half implemented and not thought through enough. Sad, really :(

 

The only thing done REALLY well in this game are the graphical parts, at least the external graphics. But you know what? They are ALSO starting to (seemingly at least) slack in some areas of these things, mainly in functional graphics

Due to offtopic, I'll leave details in a spoiler

* Phage is generally great looking and unique. However, there is no "impact" of its attack. It looks like its just barely tickling the enemies and they die.

* Zephyr, lots of details and great concept in this Warframe. But honestly, Tail Wind (for damaging purposes) seems like you hurt people out of nowhere. There is no "wind" or anything that connects to cut the enemies in pieces. And you always do a forward-leaning flight, no matter the direction you are going!

Dive Bomb looks hilarious imo. In a bad way.

 

They move too quickly and don't show care in various aspects. The excuse being "The art team, the modeling team, etc, has to keep busy". And they can, just stock up on loads of content and release it in intervels. But I digress, still hoping things get better.

[Leprechaunator69]

These are some good ideas I do like the skill tree idea however I have my reservations on the attachment system talked about for example how would it work with weapons like the synapse or the embolist. 

 

Now just to point this out it won't matter how many times DE changes the game mechanics this game will still fail without a decent story to give players a reason for doing what they're doing (but that is a another matter for another forum).

 

So I can't give any ideas or critics until i fully understand how your weapon attachment system works with the more unconventional weapon types like infested weapons and such.

 

Edit: also to note for the people who say that DE would have trouble with this, I don't think they would as the issue with the current system is that it can't be balanced it either too strong for new players or too weak for older players. Serration, Hornet strike, and host of other mods along with energy and ammo consumable prevent any sort of balance being made in this game.

Edited March 4, 2014 by Leprechaunator69

[Rochalia]

This wall of text was one of the best ideas I've EVER read from any forum over any game on pure improvement of the game. All of these ideas sound fantastic and can completely and drastically change how the game is played, viewed and how much enjoyment comes from it. I already enjoy the game, but I am starting to run into issues where I just can't stand leveling my weapons because they're extremely weak until I mod them. But leveling takes time, time that leaves me useless and just a tag-along to the team, sapping off them rather than helping. I can't even play on my own so that I can level them and not be useless because that takes hours upon hours.

All in all, a simply amazing post, hope that DE looks at this and considers a lot of it because you've got a gold mine here. Well put together, simple and to the point, recap mostly and screenies.

Ever consider being a game developer? XD

[Kaboinglefop]

beautiful

yes

[Yousho]

It's hard to provide much constructive feedback to a raw concept.
I feel we would be better of discussing the meat and details of your idea in order to really speculate.
Interesting ideas though. The 'guns should have attachments not mods' idea is something I have been thinking of myself. 
I eagerly await the thread containing more specific details. 
 

[MrMuad]

I 100 percent disagree with gun attachments. if i wanted gun attachments, i would play battlefield or call of duty or some other game that's like that. 

[GuardWarg]

^Gun Attachments in BF and CoD pretty much work like the current weapon mod system in this game.

 

I like the ideas in this, but the cynical side of me knows most this will never happen (not in ways we'd want it anyway). "Open Beta" or not, there's way too much money (revenue from potatoes, forma, mod packs and platinum) at stake for DE to do this without heavy monetization and/or making the game buy-to-play(ala Guild Wars) or Limited access Free-to-play (DC Online Universe).

[Strill]

This is where the Power tree gets its chance to shine. Ember is a caster. With Overheat she becomes tanky, while still dealing damage. What if players could sacrifice the damage of Fireball or Fireblast, for increased damage reduction or duration on Overheat? Player could customize their powers to their liking. Tweak each powers' functionality to fit their play-style. Some Warframes will always better at certain roles, but due to the nature of the Power tree you can blur those lines. Allow players to sacrifice the power of Tesla Grenades, for an increase to the number of enemies that Bastille can trap and vice versa

Then that would force players into choosing one or two of their abilities to max out, and ignore the others. You'd have the same S#&$ty system we have now where no one ever uses Frost's Freeze or Ice Wave because his other two abilities are better, and you're better off using those two slots for efficiency/range mods.  I don't want another system where weaker abilities are ignored entirely. I want one where you can use all your warframe's abilities without gimping yourself.

 

Systems where you sacrifice diversity for power just plain suck. They lead you into monotonous gameplay where you spam the same skill over and over again.  I want a system where I can use more than just one ability thank you very much.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Strill

[Zirion_Bk]

Then that would force players into choosing one or two of their abilities to max out, and ignore the others. You'd have the same S#&$ty system we have now where no one ever uses Frost's Freeze or Ice Wave because his other two abilities are better, and you're better off using those two slots for efficiency/range mods.  I don't want another system where weaker abilities are ignored entirely. I want one where you can use all your warframe's abilities without gimping yourself.

 

Systems where you sacrifice diversity for power just plain suck. They lead you into monotonous gameplay where you spam the same skill over and over again.  I want a system where I can use more than just one ability thank you very much.

I agree there. I've played games where the only efficient way to do damage or heal was by sacrificing diversity for pure strength or healing power, and it became boring as meow quickly. And as another point, the skill paths don't seem to give much choice. I have to place a rank into every perk in order to get the last one, which is a major turnoff.

[Skynin]

Haven't seen this thread before
Amazing.

[CosyPigeon]

I 100 percent disagree with gun attachments. if i wanted gun attachments, i would play battlefield or call of duty or some other game that's like that. 

Says the guy playing Warframe, where you can have up to 8 attachments per weapon, and are in fact required to put attachments on weapons in order for them to be effective at higher levels. Deeeeeerrrrp. 

[(PSN)PD_33]

I like it, lets do it. I just couldnt read the whole thing. I think this man is genius.

 

I personally think Mods are ok, but some type of skill tree would be nice to customize your Tenno further.

 

We should address the reward system as well.

 

Also: Would be nice if you could get some other rewards other than mods or weapon/warframes parts.

 

Something that keep you playing.

Edited March 29, 2014 by (PS4)PD_33

[Skynin]

I think that progression should be based on Mastery and Crafting. There is no problems with resources (resources that player can get mostly depends on his skill to survive and fight now), crafting instead of current mod system can make customization deeper and more interesting.

Currently, we are very limited. Your ideas are great (some of these almost the same as mine, just with my level of english i'm unable to share them)
I love all this. Well done, thank you for this work!
 

[TioMegaManX]

Someone fire the current designer and give his job to OP.

[Llyssa]

I find it amusing that the people who agree with this idea most are ones who admit to not having actually read it. Speaks volumes.

[dashashou]

i think that everyone would agree that  the mod system needs an overhaul  from just adding more slots , to wholly reworking the system 

[MenschOfUber]

...

I read it and agree with it, how high of a volume does that speak to you?

Did YOU read it though?

[a-Arcadia]

too much info fut op is right

[Frostmire]

Someone fire the current designer and give his job to OP.

haha .

 

 

While i'm not sure if OP's solution to the foundation would work well , i agree 100% about how broken is the current system in the game , it is boring , repeatitive and have zero room for creativity .

[TioMegaManX]

haha .

 

 

While i'm not sure if OP's solution to the foundation would work well , i agree 100% about how broken is the current system in the game , it is boring , repeatitive and have zero room for creativity .

It has worked in the past.

[Solus_Ipse]

Foundation, eh?

 

No matter how great the new system is (or isn't), one thing about about Warframe it can't fix - the game doesn't present players with the right kind of challenges.

 

The right kind of challenge should either challenge us mentally or our skill. Not our luck and patience. Not to say mods/items should not be there, but they shouldn't have to be the focus, rather they should be bonuses, or at least equivalent to achievements in playing itself.

 

Chess challenges people mentally. Fighting games challenge people by skill (and mental reflexes too in high level play).

 

Here are a few challenges that Warframe offers: "wallrun in this tileset to get to this exit" and "shoot this napalm/bombard from further away as to avoid his attacks" and " equip damage increasing mods to kill higher level enemies because they only can scale in health and damage," and of course "repeat T3 Ext/Cap/MD/Def/Surv until I get x part." I don't have a choice, and it doesn't take much skill to do any of those things. No satisfaction (and I admit I suffer from Skinner's Box behaviour regarding Warframe...I really should quit for another year).

 

So how to present the right challenge?

 

1) Diverse enemies - and I don't mean different guys with different guns that do slightly different things. We need common fodder to practice on and harder enemies with larger movesets to actually fight with. That's not to say enemies with cheap gimmicks like "spams rockets" or "knocks down anyone moving in to melee" that lack any counter whatsoever besides the unskillful "back away and shoot it in the face."

 

2) Fundamental mechanics that scale with skill - dodging is the a big one that comes to mind that would apply to Warframe, and sadly is the only thing blatantly lacking in Warframe. I can't legitimately dodge a Bombard's rocket since it can easily a wall and explode, hitting me anyways. Wallrunning does not avoid gunfire whastever, making it useless except as a necessary means to traverse certain tiles. Rolling is useless against hitscan Grineer. It's not realistic but space ninjas should be able to dodge bullets through skill - then enemies can be buffed to deal increased damage to punish mistakes rather than forcing Blessing Trinities to become the only viable lategame option.

[Starbridge]

The idea of this is nice, but really.... do you know how long it would take to code all that?  It would take them at least a year to do that.  The problem with that being... doing a major content change like that would mean everyone in the office is working on it (keep in mind it would take a year to do) and that means the game wouldnt change at all for the next year until the new build for the game came out.  By that point there would be few people playing the game anymore because of lack of updates and patches.  Now, if you still want regular updates and a new build for the game your looking at an even longer wait, and then when the new build launches it would be so different that many people would just walk away.  I would be so bold as to say about the same number would come back as would just drop the game.

 

Games cannot really take on such an over haul like you had made your post about, it just doesnt help the game much in the long run.  As far as end game goes, DE is planning some really neat stuff.  Major patches happen about every 2 or 3 months and if you ask me that is freaking awesome.  Other companies takes months and months just for little update to fix a strange animation glitch or power/ability not working like it should and then leave major update take years.  DE may quickly roll out new patches and content but if you dig into the information behind the game it was done as an experiment to see how well they could do without having a major publisher over their head telling them what to do and what they cant do.

 

I just smile and giggle to myself when I see people posting things like this because 99% of them have no idea how to code and never want to learn it so there for dont know how long it takes to make even slight changes.  Coding is hard, I have done only minor things like making a web page clock sync with your desktop clock and things like that and it takes hours and weeks.  You can have 10 lines of code and it not work because you have a ";" in the wrong place.  Each line of code written has a possibility for error and then going back to find that error can be very time consuming.  Been there done that.

 

Warframe is one of those games that will always be added onto by the company because they give a damn about their product.  I love how I can not log in for 2 weeks (because of how busy I am with school) and then log in one day and find 5 new items added and an event going on.  MAN I LOVE THAT!

 

Like I said before, the idea is great but just not plausible for DE to make it happen in a timely manner before the game population just died.  Just enjoy the right, and wait to see what their idea of end game brings.

[Frostmire]

DE will probably not give a complete overhaul to the game at once but rather change the game bit by bit , like how they fixed the crappy damage 1.0 and are gonna release melee 2.0 later .

[Spunt1nk]

I love the idea of having the ability to change the gun physically as you referenced with the load out screen.

i wouldn't like to see become a COD thing but the ability to be able to fine tune things like zoom and accuracy on some of the weapons by adding a scope and or a different stock/barrel and still having the ability to use mods. even if you could use a mod to allow you to do this called "equip"

and depending on its tier you can add more to the gun at a time at the cost of something else like a barrel for more accuracy with the loss of power, or it could just take one mod slot to add the barrel... or/and even a point or two... extra than the mod itself costs depending on what you add.

this is a great idea in its self, i would love to see this integrated into the game!