Please, for the love of god, revert health types back to the old system.

[TheThaumaturgicAlchemist]

I never come here to complain, but I really can’t stand the new enemy weaknesses/health change. 

That’s all I want. I’m not even sure if I have the right tag… Just please put it back to the “overly complicated” way it used to be. No one asked for this change, and three Forma isn’t going to compensate for all the build changes I now have to look through. 

(I can't speak for anyone else but I like the new status and shield regen change.) 

Oh, and if possible, Kuva Jesters that can ride on our Warframes would be nice too. Thank you. 

[Mithost]

What about the new enemy weaknesses/health is making you wish for DE to revert it? It's fair to request that DE revisits these types of changes if you are not finding them fun or enjoyable, but letting the team know what about the changes you dislike can be really important in justifying why you think they should revert it.

[ChangelingRain]

I'm not in favor of reverting them, but I do feel like some enemies have lost a bit of texture since stuff like moas and all don't have their own special resistances. Thankfully there's already a system for this, with stuff like Hyekka Masters having 80% resistance to Slash and Heat - giving robotic enemies 80% resistance to toxin and etc could restore some of that, and the like.

[Vazumongr]

Now maybe it's because I'm an old head Warframe player and have been playing the game for at least 10 years, but the simplification and watering down of one of the most intriguing parts of the game is a tragedy. I hope I'm in the minority because it would be terrible for the well-being of the game if the majority of players felt the same as me, but this update ruins a significant part of the game. I truly mean ruins, I don't have much interest in playing at the moment. The introduction and power-creep of Overguard was already pushing me to the door but this watering down and removal of system depth is probably shutting the door. For years the game has been going into the direction of making it simpler to "do big damage." With near total neglect for everything else in the game. It's disappointing. There's no reward for understanding the systems. There's no rationale for min-maxing your weapons in your loadouts for specific enemy units. They've just been slowly removing depth from the game. Warframe's charm, in my opinion at least, was in that depth. The deep intricate systems that took more than a 5 second glance to gain a deep understanding, especially mastery, of. Now it's just a symbol match game. "Match the symbol, do 50% more damage. Match the wrong symbol, do 50% less damage." Personally, I feel a lot of the systemic changes would have to be pulled back for me to really find the game interesting again. This resistance update and Overguard are the two biggest systemic changes that are pushing me out the door.

The game has evolved into a near unrecognizable version compared to what it use to be 10+ years ago. In that evolution, certain players definitely watched it turn into something they had no interest in, and that's fine. This time, it seems I am falling into that group. I wish the best for DE, Warframe, and the game's community. I hope this is a step in the right direction for the game, even if it's a step I've no interest in following. It's been an incredibly fun journey, an uncountable amount of great memories. I hope for the majority of players, you love this change. I hope this change makes the game more enjoyable for you. I hope this hyper-simplification is what you have been hoping for. For DE, I hope this is truly in-line with your vision of Warframe.

[Gaxxian]

To me, the weakness/resistance being tied to the faction instead of the damage type if the thing that pains me to hight leveles... its just so absurd and gamey.... and then you have the corrupted units changing factions mid-mission and changing their weaknesses because... reasons.

They could have done 5 types of "healths":

- Flesh
- Mechanic
- Tau
- Armor
- Shields

Each with it own weaknesses/resistances, and at least this would have more sense and you could have an interesting mix of units in the same mission.

[Gaxxian]

But this isnt the only bad decision. Since now enemies ehp depends more on raw hp numbers, now dmg abilities without scaling are even worse than before. You did a meager 4k dmg with your 4th? Too bad that now you are STILL doing 4k dmg while the enemies have x3 hp.

But ofc, they will not change anything. Dont forget that they arent reading here...

[Ahnez]

On my experience it feels like the change made it a bit easier for me to do damage to raknoids in orb vallis with my vulkar. Before that it was like those things werent even corpus with so much armor or resistance to magnetic. And i dont have op stuff like some kuva bramma weapons that some players use to one shot demolishers and everything. So I feel somewhat positive about it.

[BghElwood]

They turned the game into a simplified version of Pokémon and the puncture impact flip was just obnoxious.  I am honestly having a hard time playing the game.  I log in.  I go into my orbiter and remember that I need to redo every single build for every weapon that I own.  Not to mention the Kuva and Tenet weapons that have innate elements that will have to be re-farmed and combined via Valence Fusion.  As well as any rivens that have elemental effects on them.  I sit there and scroll through the arsenal screen for five minutes trying to figure out where to start.  I get overwhelmed realizing that this game has now become a lot of WORK and log off.  So yeah, I am all for going back to the original health system.

[CrendKing]

I'm neutral on the armor type change, simply because before the change we already kill ALL regular enemies with Viral Slash with pretty much the same TTK. The "overly complicated" system is really just an illusion. Moa's special resistance? Mechanical Grineer? Who cares? Shower them with some bullets and they all die in a second like the rest. At least now the game is honest and straightforward about the mechanisms.

I'm more interested in the damage type change. Viral + DoT builds still being the kings should be the next on the chopping block. How about nerfing Viral to max +160% HP damage at 10 stacks? Sure, something else like Blast or Electricity will be the new king, but at least we have new toys to play for a while.

[Zext]

Nearly no one actually engaged with the old system. The old system wasn't even designed in a way that was reasonable to engage with, as opposite weaknesses were muddled in the same pile of mobs from the same faction. Alloy and Ferrite armor being mixed in the same pile of mobs was particularly bad, as the gap between the right element was magnitudes of power apart. Every meta this game has ever had just revolved around 'how much of this system can we ignore at a time.'

[Xylena_Lazarow]

1 hour ago, Zext said:

how much of this system can we ignore at a time

All of it, now that we can disregard Armor too!

[Venus-Venera]

vor 9 Stunden schrieb Zext:

Nearly no one actually engaged with the old system. The old system wasn't even designed in a way that was reasonable to engage with, as opposite weaknesses were muddled in the same pile of mobs from the same faction. Alloy and Ferrite armor being mixed in the same pile of mobs was particularly bad, as the gap between the right element was magnitudes of power apart. Every meta this game has ever had just revolved around 'how much of this system can we ignore at a time.'

you asked all the players?

Am 28.6.2024 um 07:29 schrieb Ahnez:

On my experience it feels like the change made it a bit easier for me to do damage to raknoids in orb vallis with my vulkar. Before that it was like those things werent even corpus with so much armor or resistance to magnetic. And i dont have op stuff like some kuva bramma weapons that some players use to one shot demolishers and everything. So I feel somewhat positive about it.

depends on the weapon. good weapons still perform very well. I can kill SP greener and infested in 1-2 seconds with magnetic+heat acceltra prime with cd+multishot arcane and fire rate arcane in 1-2 seconds. I don't even need viral.

but! there are a lot of weapons from the trash can that barely do any damage even with the best mods! and it's precisely these weapons that are at a huge disadvantage! because in the past too many people had problems with greener and that's why armor strip or slash were used so often! because without armor a greener was a free kill....
and what do we have now? now health scales! and viral is nice, but it doesn't compensate for the low damage of the weapon! because I play SP circuit a lot and I've experienced things that are absolutely not OK. ranged weapons that hardly have any ammo. mele weapons that do ridiculous damage with the best mods. and and and...

[PollexMessier]

On 2024-06-27 at 12:12 AM, Gaxxian said:

To me, the weakness/resistance being tied to the faction instead of the damage type if the thing that pains me to hight leveles... its just so absurd and gamey.... and then you have the corrupted units changing factions mid-mission and changing their weaknesses because... reasons.

They could have done 5 types of "healths":

- Flesh
- Mechanic
- Tau
- Armor
- Shields

Each with it own weaknesses/resistances, and at least this would have more sense and you could have an interesting mix of units in the same mission.

This would be a much better approach imo.

Like the difference between alloy and ferrite armor was incredibly stupid. As well as shields and proto shields.

Personally I think stuff like armor and shields should have been consolidated and health types remained largely the same. You also would deal damage bonuses against an enemy's health type even if they had armor. So the faction elemental resistances could've been tied exclusively to raw health, while armor and shields had their own logical resistances and weaknesses, and robotics should have a different set of resistances and weaknesses from non-robotic enemies of the same faction.

This all kindof keeps things dynamic and interesting while still consolidating a lot of health types to be less all over the place to the point of being impossible to build for.

The way they did it is yet another change that feels like it was exclusively for the benefit of mobile users...

Edited yesterday at 08:16 AM by PollexMessier

[sXeth]

15 hours ago, Zext said:

Nearly no one actually engaged with the old system. The old system wasn't even designed in a way that was reasonable to engage with, as opposite weaknesses were muddled in the same pile of mobs from the same faction. Alloy and Ferrite armor being mixed in the same pile of mobs was particularly bad, as the gap between the right element was magnitudes of power apart. Every meta this game has ever had just revolved around 'how much of this system can we ignore at a time.'

Yeah other then obligatory radiation vs eidolons I can’t think of ever having engaged or felt a need to engage with the old one, or the new one for that matter. Even the Eidolon bit was really down to a”may as well since Im only using this sniper here”.

And yeah, the “meta” hasn’t really shifted. Some options went from D tier to B tier. Magnetic is still outperformed by Toxin for Corpus (even corpus eximus) because starting the race half or more finished beats accelerating faster from the start. Niche use to make an anti eximus weapon which would be better dome with that new pistol arcane Blast mostly shines because it works still if you kill the enemies where most other DoTs get “wasted” because only a rare person shoots then moves on and trusts the status rng to land right to kill the dude in 2 seconds. Gas remains a niche. Cold does hard CC but the things you need to CC cap out the status.p (the +1x crit dmg is less then 12% on most builds you’d apply it too)

Viral remains absolute king because the goal is always HP equals Zero, not shields or armour.

I dunno what people would be struggling to reforma either. Only Cryo rounds (and its counterparts) have a different polarity. And Cold was never prevalent in the old system either.

 

Edited 23 hours ago by sXeth

[(PSN)Sentiel]

On 2024-06-27 at 9:14 AM, Gaxxian said:

But this isnt the only bad decision. Since now enemies ehp depends more on raw hp numbers, now dmg abilities without scaling are even worse than before. You did a meager 4k dmg with your 4th? Too bad that now you are STILL doing 4k dmg while the enemies have x3 hp.

But ofc, they will not change anything. Dont forget that they arent reading here...

I like how Reb even proved it herself when she said she's happy with how well the community received Jade, yet there's a dozen of threads of people not liking her design and asking for a skin or a toggle because it makes them uncomfortable.

They absolutely do not give a f, at least not about what is written here. Maybe if someone screams loud enough on Twitter.

[Gaxxian]

hace 33 minutos, (PSN)Sentiel dijo:

I like how Reb even proved it herself when she said she's happy with how well the community received Jade, yet there's a dozen of threads of people not liking her design and asking for a skin or a toggle because it makes them uncomfortable.

She also reacted the idea of making a blueprint for air support pack like it was totally new idea... as if people haven't been asking for it on the forums for years.