remove vampyric liminus

[spider_enigma]

being repeatedly killed in immortal enemies is not fun and never will be

[Zakkhar]

Do not stand in fire.

[sunderthefirmament]

30 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

being repeatedly killed in immortal enemies is not fun and never will be

Honestly, I hate them.  This is a game mode where enemies hit hard enough and loadouts are restricted enough that health tanking isn't always an option.  So when these shadowy little bastards show up and camp in objective areas (alchemy, survival life supports that require killing in the zone, mirror defense, etc.), there really isn't much counterplay.  

 

JuSt UsE tHe OpErAtOr!11!!!

 

 

...Transference Distortion

 

 

[spider_enigma]

36 minutes ago, sunderthefirmament said:

Honestly, I hate them.  This is a game mode where enemies hit hard enough and loadouts are restricted enough that health tanking isn't always an option.  So when these shadowy little bastards show up and camp in objective areas (alchemy, survival life supports that require killing in the zone, mirror defense, etc.), there really isn't much counterplay.  

 

JuSt UsE tHe OpErAtOr!11!!!

 

 

...Transference Distortion

 

 

cant if its disabled lmao no operator or drifter

38 minutes ago, Zakkhar said:

Do not stand in fire.

its proximity to the enemy not an object i can walk around, and they cant be killed and are fast

[sunderthefirmament]

5 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

cant if its disabled lmao no operator or drifter

Exactly my point.  And even when you can use operator/drifter, it's not especially effective in dealing with the liminus.

 

My other complaint about them is that their location becomes difficult to determine.  EDA is infamous for just an obscene amount of VFX spam.  Seeing tiny crawling shadow enemies with a faint aura in the midst of all the VFX is difficult, to say the least.  Yeah, liminus have a UI indicator as well, but it's red, and it blends in with all the other red UI indicators that are constantly crowding the screen in EDA (certain necramechs, demolisher necramechs, red life support towers, gruzzling, and more).  Combine this general visual mess with the fact that the liminus can and will teleport to random players or locations with no discernible trigger, and you've got a recipe for frustration.

 

I get that they're supposed to reward constant movement and spatial awareness, but they're poorly implemented and frustrating.  They end up further incentivizing overguard tanks and Mesmer Shield, which are already heavily favored by this game mode.  It's bad design.

 

How would I fix them?  Here are some ideas:

• Remove them.
• Lower their damage, or have it build up from a faint tickle to something actually dangerous after several seconds, with clear audio indicators that this is happening.
• Change their UI indicator color.
• Greatly lower their speed.
• If they KO a player, they disappear for a long period of time.
• If the players kill a necramech, angel, or gruzzling, all liminus disappear for a long period of time.
• If the players find a voca, all liminus disappear for a long period of time.
• Reduce presence of other VFX spam in EDA (the on-death explosions and auras are really egregious).

[Zakkhar]

49 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

1 hour ago, Zakkhar said:

Do not stand in fire.

its proximity to the enemy not an object i can walk around, and they cant be killed and are fast

Can be pulled away from those. Not faster than Warfarme.

[savourypastry]

On 2024-09-07 at 5:48 PM, sunderthefirmament said:

How would I fix them?  Here are some ideas:

• Remove them.
• Lower their damage, or have it build up from a faint tickle to something actually dangerous after several seconds, with clear audio indicators that this is happening.
• Change their UI indicator color.
• Greatly lower their speed.
• If they KO a player, they disappear for a long period of time.
• If the players kill a necramech, angel, or gruzzling, all liminus disappear for a long period of time.
• If the players find a voca, all liminus disappear for a long period of time.
• Reduce presence of other VFX spam in EDA (the on-death explosions and auras are really egregious).

I like some of these ideas. I'd also add hitting them with an operator amp disables them for a short time, like with gravitational anomalies. Also means that the transference restriction debuff goes from an auto-pick to an actual consideration.

[dwqrf]

Or you know, just play Dante and spam Overguard so they don't even exist anymore. You know. Ez.

[sXeth]

On 2024-09-07 at 11:56 AM, Zakkhar said:

Do not stand in fire.

Fire teleports instantly to you if you get more then maybe 20m away, even if crowd controlled (many of which also do not work on them despite that being their alleged counter. I actually went to bat for Liminus being one of the very few good modifiers when initially looking at the list but the implementation is so much a mess.

DAs a write off anyhow. Outside of abbreviated abilities DE never so much as said a peep in months about the barrage of feedback, so safe to assume the modes abandoned and all the buggy and wonky stuff will never be addressed. (Compared to for instance DuViri still getting new decrees)

Edited yesterday at 02:39 AM by sXeth

[Zakkhar]

2 hours ago, sXeth said:

Fire teleports

Teleport is instantenous movement. They do not teleport. They move slowly (compared to parkouring Warframes). Be aware of our surroundings, stay on the move. Even if they teleported (which the dont) they still do not insta kill you (you got time to react). If you are tanky enough you can even rez people out of operator while standing in them. If you have trouble noticing whether they are on you and where they are at all times, use map overlay (tap M).

Unless your need a Raid Leader to yell at you every time you fail? Or a loud sound whenever you are in standing in them? (Deadly Boss Mods)

 

[sXeth]

7 hours ago, Zakkhar said:

Teleport is instantenous movement. They do not teleport. They move slowly (compared to parkouring Warframes). Be aware of our surroundings, stay on the move. Even if they teleported (which the dont) they still do not insta kill you (you got time to react). If you are tanky enough you can even rez people out of operator while standing in them. If you have trouble noticing whether they are on you and where they are at all times, use map overlay (tap M).

Unless your need a Raid Leader to yell at you every time you fail? Or a loud sound whenever you are in standing in them? (Deadly Boss Mods)

 

If you get any noticeable distance away they will teleport or jump to you. Same way Operative defenses just hop across a level instantly if you try and shove them in a closet, No animation or execution. Just suddenly in the new location. Complete with still having any active CC effect still on them. In extreme examples even going from a player to another one who are multiple rooms hundreds of metres apart (good old survival randoms)

 

Is it a glitch or unintentional, probably. Its likely they upcycled code from spectres or something else designed to follow you. But as previously noted not holding my breath for any of the DA glitches to actually get fixed at this point.

 

Conceptually I like Archimedea, mixing up the gameplay and having dynamic difficulty mixups. The goofiness of RNG loadouts in a build based game, many bugs and glitches, and a lack of dynamics in many of the “difficulty” modifiers kills it though. (With being stick to the Sanctum missions as a distant fourth)

Edited 23 hours ago by sXeth