Thoughts On Releasing The Aklato Prime And Dual Skana Prime [Please Be Civil And Constructive]

[Azawarau]

Yea this guy makes a strong point, according to the wiki page for Founders, http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Founders, Grand Masters alone are worth $388,000 in revenue for DE, no way in hell anyone would be dumb enough to refund that just so everyone else can get founders weapons.. although I want the weapons for the sake of mastery and collecting them there is another solution.... which someone may come up with in the near future.

Theyd be refunding virtual points rather than money directly

 

Though itd load the servers with plat, much of which would be from players who might not even be playing anymore

 

 

 

Actually you're twisting my words - so no we don't agree. Everyday plat revenue goes to keep the lights on and business running, Founders was so that they could have a business at all. As much as you would probably like to view those two scenarios as the same, they aren't. It's the difference between whats is Equal and what is Equitable. 

It does

 

And that keeps the game up and running

 

It pays for them to stay there and actually work on and improve the game that still i beta

[Kartumterek]

Theyd be refunding virtual points rather than money directly

 

Though itd load the servers with plat, much of which would be from players who might not even be playing anymore

 

 

 

It does

 

And that keeps the game up and running

 

It pays for them to stay there and actually work on and improve the game that still i beta

if it ever came to a Founders vote as to a yes or a no to allow, let me just save DE and everyone else time. My answer will always be NO. I don't care what you offer me. Why? Because I already took the offer provided. It is beyond ludicrous how things like this have never been an issue in all of my years of gaming, but in this game you guys cause such a RUKus.

NO. Final. End of story

Lock the thread too please. Every single one of these threads is just asking for Founder packages to come back, using different wording. You already locked the first post, lock this down too

[spacedkadet]

Why do u people still keep arguing about founders gear?

 

so dumb!

 

DE have stated time and time again they will NOT be coming back. What do you want? them to come to your house and write it on your forehead in permanent marker?

 

Founders packs where available to EVERYONE ON THE PLANET, it is not DE's fault you did not know about the game then or choose not to buy it at that time.

 

The game is "founded" get over it already.

[Azawarau]

if it ever came to a Founders vote as to a yes or a no to allow, let me just save DE and everyone else time. My answer will always be NO. I don't care what you offer me. Why? Because I already took the offer provided. It is beyond ludicrous how things like this have never been an issue in all of my years of gaming, but in this game you guys cause such a RUKus.

NO. Final. End of story

Lock the thread too please. Every single one of these threads is just asking for Founder packages to come back, using different wording. You already locked the first post, lock this down too

 

 

Why do u people still keep arguing about founders gear?

 

so dumb!

 

DE have stated time and time again they will NOT be coming back. What do you want? them to come to your house and write it on your forehead in permanent marker?

 

Founders packs where available to EVERYONE ON THE PLANET, it is not DE's fault you did not know about the game then or choose not to buy it at that time.

 

The game is "founded" get over it already.

Except this entire discussion is about something different than the founders gear

 

How about stop your derailing or be productive

[RoboDoge]

Except this entire discussion is about something different than the founders gear

 

How about stop your derailing or be productive

How so? Aklato Prime and Dual Skana Prime still have 2 Lato Prime and 2 Skana Prime.

[Valiant]

Funny how people think using 'technicalities' suddenly make it a different weapon and change the circumstances. Please, just stop trying to use loopholes. It sounds and comes across as desperate. If you're having to resort to loopholes it means that approach clearly isn't right.

Edited June 8, 2014 by Naith

[Azawarau]

How so? Aklato Prime and Dual Skana Prime still have 2 Lato Prime and 2 Skana Prime.

Its a different item

 

Its not an item you were promised

 

It has different stats and animations

 

It has nothing to do with what the founders were promised

 

Even if it did it wouldnt affect founders negatively since they could get it too however it becomes available

 

Compromise exists

 

 

 

Funny how people think using 'technicalities' suddenly make it a different weapon. Please, just stop trying to use loopholes. It sounds and comes across as desperate. If you're having to resort to loopholes it means that approach clearly isn't right.

Mk1 braton and braton prime are two separate weapons right?

 

What do the founders lose from this again?

Edited June 8, 2014 by Azawarau

[RoboDoge]

Its a different item

 

Its not an item you were promised

 

It has different stats and animations

 

It has nothing to do with what the founders were promised

 

Even if it did it wouldnt affect founders negatively since they could get it too however it becomes available

 

Compromise exists

 

 

 

Mk1 braton and braton prime are two separate weapons right?

 

What do the founders lose from this again?

Yea, totally different item. Same as if you took 2 Colt 1911 and used them as in each hand. They would not have anything similar to one Colt 1911 because you have more fire rate and possibly higher damage output.

 

 

They dont have any connections because they are two pistols instead of one.

 

 

Such intellect.

 

Very smart.

 

So scholar.

 

Wow.

[Valiant]

Mk1 braton and braton prime are two separate weapons right?

 

What do the founders lose from this again?

What?

 

Not sure of your point here. Comparing a MK1 and a Braton Prime to a Skana Prime/Lato Prime and dual versions doesn't make sense.

Edited June 8, 2014 by Naith

[Doom_Bunny]

What?

 

Not sure of your point here. Comparing a MK1 and a Braton Prime to a Skana Prime/Lato Prime and dual versions doesn't make sense.

The only difference between the MK1 braton and the braton are "technicalities" yet they are completely separate weapons. The skana/lato prime and the dual lato/skana prime have even more differences between them. More differences then the MK1 braton and the braton have between them selves.

[RoboDoge]

The only difference between the MK1 braton and the braton are "technicalities" yet they are completely separate weapons. The skana/lato prime and the dual lato/skana prime have even more differences between them. More differences then the MK1 braton and the braton have between them selves.

Same as Akbronco Prime has nothing with Bronco Prime? Except 2 Broncos are needed to build one AkBronco.

 

You people are using what you want for comparison. You are like any conservative party out there. Using techincalities when that is good for you, and shunning them off when it isnt.

[MeduSalem]

I sense this discussion/debate/war going on forever.

 

I wish there were already enough weapons/warframes around to surpass Mastery Rank 30 without relying on every single weapon available... That or more ways to earn Mastery Points. So people stop complaining about how they miss out on some Mastery Points they currently don't need anyways other than for e-peen.

 

The only real sense it has anyways is for collectors.

Edited June 8, 2014 by MeduSalem

[RoboDoge]

I sense this discussion/debate/war going on forever.

 

I wish there were already enough weapons/warframes around to surpass Mastery Rank 30 without relying on every single weapon available... so people stop complaining about how they miss out on some Mastery Points they currently don't need anyways other than for e-peen.

 

The only real sense it has anyways is for collectors.

I am also puzzled what MR are the people that demand Founders and Founders-like weapons.

[The_Lunatic_]

I sense this discussion/debate/war going on forever.

 

I wish there were already enough weapons/warframes around to surpass Mastery Rank 30 without relying on every single weapon available... That or more ways to earn Mastery Points. So people stop complaining about how they miss out on some Mastery Points they currently don't need anyways other than for e-peen.

 

The only real sense it has anyways is for collectors.

 

 

I really doubt anyone is actually bringing up Mastery as an argument.

 

It's a non-issue given all the other "special items" in the game.

 

The complaints are just spawning from jealousy.

 

Somebody has a shiny toy they want, so, they're going to cry for hours on end until DE gives in.

[TC-Guardian]

Just going off of the OP, if you found out there was a weapon on the game which literally cost nearly 300$ (Grand Masters in NZD) to get, and you knew you had limited time, so you scrapped together what money you could to get that weapon, made it, and got the weapon in time. How would you feel to find that there was going to be a even better, more epic version of the weapon being released for free because too many people complained about not getting the one you paid tons for.

Edited June 8, 2014 by TC-Guardian

[MeduSalem]

I really doubt anyone is actually bringing up Mastery as an argument.

 

Oh... there have been various people stating that one as an argument. Even in this thread. Even on the first page. xD

 

Mastery Points is the only valid one in my eyes, but it's near to useless to argue about it because currently Mastery Rank has no point whatsoever once you are able to craft every weapon. Don't know about the importance on the amount of trades/extractors though, I guess that's personal opinion.

 

And any other argument fails to deliver anyways. Collectors had their chance to get that stuff when Founders still were available and they can't blame DE for not being around back then.

 

The other thing about the Dual/Akimbo style stuff... It feels bad from a completionist's point of view that they will never come to existence because of the exlusives problem. But they are not really necessary anyways... It's not like their absence is a major problem to game balancing or something.

 

Refering back to the Mastery Ranks it may become a balancing problem once the Mastery Rank actually does something in the future for example with the upcoming focus system (if it's still dependend on the Mastery Rank).

 

The only way I can imagine those Dual/Akimbo-Style weapons to make it into the game is if the Founders got them exclusively and the non-founders get the single-variants instead so the founders still have their shiny exlusives, only better. But that wouldn't end this discussion, rather than being fuel for a new one or continuing existing ones.

 

So in the end it's just better to bury the whole damn discussion because there's no valid solution other than DE creating a sticky thread stating "Not going to happen. Ever. Period." and handing out warning points to everybody heating up such discussions in the future.

 

[Edit] Oh well there's one way they could make an introduction into the game.. if they were exlusives themselves either with an one-time event reward or with Prime Access - the later one being the best option.

Edited June 8, 2014 by MeduSalem

[Ignaesia]

I really doubt anyone is actually bringing up Mastery as an argument.

 

It's a non-issue given all the other "special items" in the game.

 

The complaints are just spawning from jealousy.

 

Somebody has a shiny toy they want, so, they're going to cry for hours on end until DE gives in.

 

Exactly. I'd really like a Braton Vandal but i'll never get one, i'll always be down 3000 mastery because of it but oh well. That's just how it goes.

 

The ironic thing is that the Founder's weapons, even the elusive Lato Prime, aren't even that good. It doesn't give us any kind of advantage over non-founders (a good thing). The only reason people want them is out of sheer jealousy.

[Doom_Bunny]

Same as Akbronco Prime has nothing with Bronco Prime? Except 2 Broncos are needed to build one AkBronco.

 

You people are using what you want for comparison. You are like any conservative party out there. Using techincalities when that is good for you, and shunning them off when it isnt.

Seems familiar though this trend has been in both parties through out the thread.

 

Yea, totally different item. Same as if you took 2 Colt 1911 and used them as in each hand. They would not have anything similar to one Colt 1911 because you have more fire rate and possibly higher damage output.

 

 

They dont have any connections because they are two pistols instead of one.

 

 

Such intellect.

 

Very smart.

 

So scholar.

 

Wow.

 

 

Ignoring the off topics about mastery and the founders pack, what seems to be familiar is that our argument is clear and well explained while the opposing party only can say no and throw insults.

 

When someone post something that is off topic the party against the two weapons either takes offense or makes it out to be that the party for the two weapons is actualy going arfter the off topic and not the two weapons that are being discussed.

 

So tell me who is the conservative the party? the party that has stayed with their argument about the weapons being separate and has explained them selves? or the party that hurls insults, beggs to close discussion because they believe it's the same old argument and believes they are entitled to items that where not included in the founders pack?

Edited June 8, 2014 by Postal_pat

[BerelHawdos]

As a founder I really don't care if new players can get the Skana prime. All I want is to be able to use it's skin on Dakra prime because it has way better stats, but looks uglier.

[CryogenicNinja]

Yay, now instead of pissed of non-founders we have pissed off founders, great idea!

Honestly, for the money and support the founders put into this game fairly early on, they deserve to have exclusive stuff. Even the stuff that they did get, almost purely cosmetic, item wise at least. If you were to pay hundreds of dollars for a certain package, to found out later that the most noticeable in game reward was released to every other person, and now all you have left to make yourself different is a badge and a picture, I doubt you'd be too happy. Here's another thing, think about how small the group of people are who are actually at mastery rank 15, of that small group, I find most are founders. If you're not mastery rank 15, you still have tons of guns to try out, warframes too. If the game is going until mastery rank 30 is achievable, very little people are going to have it. If DE stops making weapons at rank 30 on the dot, most founders won't even have mastery rank 30, that would mean you'd have to have ALL event weapons. Most likely, DE will go over the exact point of Mastery Rank 30 making it achievable for everyone.

[The_Lunatic_]

Oh... there have been various people stating that one as an argument. Even in this thread. Even on the first page. xD

 

Mastery Points is the only valid one in my eyes, but it's near to useless to argue about it because currently Mastery Rank has no point whatsoever once you are able to craft every weapon. Don't know about the importance on the amount of trades/extractors though, I guess that's personal opinion.

 

And any other argument fails to deliver anyways. Collectors had their chance to get that stuff when Founders still were available and they can't blame DE for not being around back then.

 

Well, I think people will use any argument they can think of to get what they want. Regardless of if they actually believe in it or not.

 

I mean, even then, this suggestion makes no sense if mastery points are an argument, because then the people whom own the prime weapons would also get the new weapons, giving them just the same mastery point advantage as before.

[MeduSalem]

Well, I think people will use any argument they can think of to get what they want. Regardless of if they actually believe in it or not.

 

I mean, even then, this suggestion makes no sense if mastery points are an argument, because then the people whom own the prime weapons would also get the new weapons, giving them just the same mastery point advantage as before.

 

This is true.

 

The Founders exlusives aren't the only exclusives anyways when it boils down to Mastery Points... There's like the temporary exclusives like Gorgon Wraith, Strun Wraith, Snipetron Vandal, Dex Furis, Twin Vipers Wraith and the Machete Wraith as well. They may make an re-appearance somehow as they are just locked into the vault for the time being, but non of them have been handed out again, some of them for almost a year now. Haven't seen anybody complaining about them regularly. The only exception being the Brakk and the re-introduction with the G3 hasn't been well received by people going the full length of the Gradivus Dilema.

 

So i don't get why it's just the damn Founders gear people go mad about and which only delivers mediocre performance if at all. I can only imagine completionists/collectors being jealous, but then again why they aren't jealous about event-gear they couldn't get because they weren't around back then?

Edited June 8, 2014 by MeduSalem

[RoboDoge]

This is true.

 

The Founders exlusives aren't the only exclusives anyways when it boils down to Mastery Points... There's like the temporary exclusives like Gorgon Wraith, Strun Wraith, Snipetron Vandal, Dex Furis, Twin Vipers Wraith and the Machete Wraith as well. They may make an re-appearance somehow as they are just locked into the vault for the time being, but non of them have been handed out again, some of them for almost a year now. Haven't seen anybody complaining about them regularly. The only exception being the Brakk and the re-introduction with the G3 hasn't been well received by people going the full length of the Gradivus Dilema.

 

So i don't get why it's just the damn Founders gear people go mad about and which only delivers mediocre performance if at all. I can only imagine completionists/collectors being jealous, but then again why they aren't jealous about event-gear they couldn't get because they weren't around back then?

Because they sit on throne of WANT. I bet that they would be perfect for Drangelic kingdom.

[5Billion]

People should not be using Mastery as a reason imo for getting Founder/Event weapons and Excal Prime.

DE has plans to release enough content to hit rank 30.

 

Even if you have 0 event, CBT or Founder equipment.You will still get there, just 6 to 8 months later.

No they aren't... DE releases like 1-2 weapons every 8 days or so, and each weapon is 3k mastery points, which isn't alot at all... when do they plan to release a heap of weapons bro? Only ones ive seen recently is the "sword and board" idea which is cool as S#&$ thogh

[dragonkingdx]

 

 

The only way I can imagine those Dual/Akimbo-Style weapons to make it into the game is if the Founders got them exclusively and the non-founders get the single-variants instead so the founders still have their shiny exlusives, only better. But that wouldn't end this discussion, rather than being fuel for a new one or continuing existing ones.

Then it turns into founders giving up what they have been complaining over (for literally the entire thread) just because they want a better version exclusively to themselves. o.o yay better weapons for the founders to sell out what they believe in. Only things ever promised were the single variants. Whereas they could just keep it and allow everyone to have a better version while still keeping the trinket they have held onto for so long. Founders wouldnt lose out from that as they still have their shiny shiny versions to themselves.

 

Since you cannot use a single pistol/blade on its own (the exception being a single pistol whilst carrying a datamass) its registered as a different weapon. Its made from technicalities like stated before that even some founders agreed with (unknowingly ofc). Mk1 braton, braton prime, braton vandal are all different weapons with different stats. Lex, lex prime and aklex are all different weapons with different stats. (you can tell aklex looks quite different from lex since it houses black skin) The argument you would need 2 to make it (making it like having 2 lato primes/skana primes) has no valid point. As no one would have 2 of them, as we are talking IF they were to release it.  Who is to say it couldn't take a few bolto's/akbolto to make (since regular bolto takes a lato) or 4 lato's and some argon to make aklato prime?

 

As long as something is not identical in every way shape or form its not the same item. ofc there are grounds for likeness but the promised DE had given does not state specifically that there will never be another version of the primed skana/lato just that the original lato/skana prime would not be re released. Which was at the start of the game before they got outdated and weaker. In the world of law there are grey areas that can be disputed on. This is one of them, as its not specifically stated that variants would never be re released DE does have the right to make them and it wouldn't break the original deal because it was not clearly defined in such a deal. (vagueness always gives room for dispute) Because this was not clearly defined in the agreement this topic is different from all of the others before it because it is not breaking the deal founders were given. Those asking for lato/skana prime and excalibur prime would have been an instant no because that was clearly defined. (yet some founders like to cling to instant no which can show how much they really understand the situation)

Edited June 8, 2014 by dragonkingdx