The Challenge Is Gone Once Again...

[PeanutMonster]

 

Why is everything getting so easy day after day? This is a co-op game, it doesn't matter if you die to a boss, your team mates will revive you. Boss fights are supposed to be challenging, but this game is nothing but a cakewalk when compared to any other game I have ever played. That is really disappointing.

Edited July 23, 2014 by PeanutMonster

[Phatose]

Solo mode exists.  Your teammates may not revive you....because they may not exist.

[BrotherIcarus]

Plays solo... Ye team mates will revive me, I suppose I can think of my 4 daily revives as friends.

 

Look at least play the bosses after the change before you condemn them.

[Nitresco]

Uh, have you tried Lephantis?

 

I spent 20 minutes fighting him solo with a Boltor Prime with what would amount to 2k damage per shot after factoring in weaknesses.

 

His nerf was justified, brev.

[Asterisk123]

F*** that. i soloed lephantis with a 5x boltor prime, and it tickled him. have to use hard hitting one shot guns. he was level 60 and took forever. and if you decide to go with a full squad, he scales to 80. he was just annoying as F***. "challenging" my &#!.

[KvotheTheArcane1]

super high numbers =/= proper form of a challenge.

Edited July 23, 2014 by KvotheTheArcane1

[PeanutMonster]

Solo mode exists.  Your teammates may not revive you....because they may not exist.

 

Solo also scales the bosses down to 1/4 of what they are with a team.

[Asterisk123]

it was ridiculous and needed the nerf. no one was going to farm for nekros or eleventh storm like that. but however tanky a boss might be in warframe, it's easy as hell because they'll have glowing parts for you to shoot. 

Edited July 23, 2014 by Asterisk123

[Midas]

super high numbers =/= proper form of a challenge.

I agree everyone on here is a child it was not ridiculous, you guys have never experienced "power" in warframe.

[Phatose]

Solo also scales the bosses down to 1/4 of what they are with a team.

 

As of yesterday, that was not true for Lephantis - thus the fix.

[KvotheTheArcane1]

I agree everyone on here is a child it was not ridiculous, you guys have never experienced "power" in warframe.

Er what? I'm not saying lephantis wasn't a "challenge". It was in the most basic sense, it was "hard", but it wasn't a good form of hard. It's not about how much power people have, it's about pure scaling being a bad form of challenge.

Edited July 23, 2014 by KvotheTheArcane1

[Midas]

it's all about power xD

[Arabaxus]

My Boltor Prime against Level 60 Lephantis solo, with R9 Serration R8 Heavy Cal and Max Storm/Cryo/Infected/Malig/Thermite was hitting for 32 a pop.

 

What makes me very annoyed is when people think a larger bullet sponge and OHKs without heathgates makes bosses a challenge. Was Lephantis any harder at level 60 than he was 40? No. Did it take longer to kill him? Yes. Would he be any harder at level 120? No. Would it take longer to kill him? Yes.

 

There is a difference between actual challenge and spongy. This nerf made him less spongy, not less challenging, because the original "buff" didn't make it any more challenging, just more time consuming.

[Midas]

My Boltor Prime against Level 60 Lephantis solo, with R9 Serration R8 Heavy Cal and Max Storm/Cryo/Infected/Malig/Thermite was hitting for 32 a pop.

 

What makes me very annoyed is when people think a larger bullet sponge and OHKs without heathgates makes bosses a challenge. Was Lephantis any harder at level 60 than he was 40? No. Did it take longer to kill him? Yes. Would he be any harder at level 120? No. Would it take longer to kill him? Yes.

 

There is a difference between actual challenge and spongy. This nerf made him less spongy, not less challenging, because the original "buff" didn't make it any more challenging, just more time consuming.

I did atleast 1000 damage per shot ;)

[McVolker]

I did atleast 1000 damage per shot ;)

That is good for you, I guess. We get that you adore bullet sponge bosses. Please understand that the majority of the players DO NOT enjoy bullet sponges.

[Arabaxus]

If I wanted bullet sponges, I'd play Borderlands 2, where Dual DP Unkempt Harolds hit bosses for 42 million damage a pop while they have some 40 Trillion HP at Level 80.

[Davoodoo]

Lets see ive been running alad v today, me mr16 fully equipped and modded, my teammates mr3 with starter gear, mr2 with starter gear, mr3 with boltor instead of mk1 braton. alad v lvl 60.

 

Whats funny?? challenge havent changed, neither for me nor for them, they will die after 1 hit and can at best scratch him and i just need to put extra few bullets in them and if i get hit im screwed.

[Arabaxus]

On one hand people complain Rhino is overused. On the other hand, Iron Skin and Roar are some of the most useful abilities in dealing with this kind of boss scaling, with Iron Skin being a makeshift healthgate so I don't get OHKed and Roar as a simple damage multiplier so I don't end up spending a hour holding down M1.

 

Ironically, the same people that call for buffs to enemies are the same people that complain Rhino is overused.

 

I'm pretty sure I can safely assume 95% of players don't enjoy getting OHKed.

 

If anything, I'd want Dark Souls challenge, a fair challenge that is difficult, not artificial difficulty caused by homing AoE OHK rockets.

[fatpig84]

People who use Boltor Prime and Soma deserve to be mocked.

If fighting him, use marelok and Latron Prime.

 

But most people can't aim for their lives so too bad I guess.

Edited July 24, 2014 by fatpig84

[Arabaxus]

People who use Boltor Prime and Soma deserve to be mocked.

If fighting him, use marelok and Latron Prime.

 

But most people can't aim for their lives so too bad I guess.

 

I do not understand. You make fun of people using the most powerful primary, but suggest using the most powerful secondary.

[RedPharaoh0817]

too much hate in this thread!

*grabs popcorn*

[fatpig84]

I do not understand. You make fun of people using the most powerful primary, but suggest using the most powerful secondary.

 

Because the Boltor Prime / Soma is only powerful due to their ROF and bullet hosing.

 

You are essentially wasting a ton of ammo to hit your  26k+ burst DPS. While with that ROF that makes it easy to kill weak foes, it is a waste of ammo when trying to hose down a bunch of level 90s barring you running 3x corrosive projection.

 

In contrast, Latron Prime, Sybaris and the 2 bows deal mostly damage per shot and nearly the same burst DPS. Their effect is even greater when combined with corrosive projection.

 

 

And also Marelok isn't the most "powerful secondary".

Angstrum, Wraith Vipers and Brakk beat it by far in raw burst damage and with far less aim required.

 

 

But this no longer matters, since DE has taken a step back and decide to pander to people who complain their boltor prime / Soma doing double digit damage. Instead of the players being smart about it and bring 3x corrosive projection or using high damage per shot weapons.

Edited July 24, 2014 by fatpig84

[JerZeyCJ]

I agree everyone on here is a child it was not ridiculous, you guys have never experienced "power" in warframe.

Annnd you've just discredited anything you have to say.

[TheHeraldXII]

 

 it doesn't matter if you die to a boss, your team mates will revive you. 

this game is nothing but a cakewalk when compared to any other game I have ever played. That is really disappointing.

These two points are related and also a good part of the reason why Warframe doesn't have any challenge in it (and still didn't when those bosses were made into the Super Space Sponges of the Universe). There is no punishment for messing up in this game in co-op but there is in solo, as such the challenges are designed around solo play*. You want challenge in Warframe, don't ask for easily dodgeable bullet sponges like level 80 Lephantis, ask for risks like having a finite number of lives before you're out of the fight for real.

 

On one hand people complain Rhino is overused. On the other hand, Iron Skin and Roar are some of the most useful abilities in dealing with this kind of boss scaling, with Iron Skin being a makeshift healthgate so I don't get OHKed and Roar as a simple damage multiplier so I don't end up spending a hour holding down M1.

 

Ironically, the same people that call for buffs to enemies are the same people that complain Rhino is overused.

 

I'm pretty sure I can safely assume 95% of players don't enjoy getting OHKed.

 

If anything, I'd want Dark Souls challenge, a fair challenge that is difficult, not artificial difficulty caused by homing AoE OHK rockets.

This guy knows what's up. Level 80 Lephantis wasn't a solution to the problem of Warframe lacking a real challenge, it was just another symptom.

 

*which IMO is the better way to go because there is absolutely nothing about Warframe that makes a good co-op game, only hamfisted ways to make it inefficient to play solo.

[Arabaxus]

Burst Damage doesn't matter when you realize this boss has some five or six digit health pool and previously, and still does, have insane damage reduction.

 

Yes, Soma is very bullet hosey, and does maybe close to 100 damage a bullet to a regular enemy. Boltor Prime is in no way bullet hosey. Unless you think bolts that deal four digit damage to regular enemies is bullet hosey.

 

Brakk is a hand shotgun. Your DPS goes down the drain anywhere not at close range, especially ever since they gave it damage dropoff.

 

Angstrum's on-paper DPS always assumes all your rockets hit. On paper, the Angstrum I shot Lephantis with should've done over 1000 damage per rocket (Multishot = 3 rockets totaling to over 4000 damage). They hit for about 40 damage.\

 

Wraith Twin Vipers are similar to Soma. Both of them are bullet hosey.

 

Marelok has good accuracy, respectable DPS, extremely good ammunition economy, and are good at almost any range except extremes.

 

Even if it is not the subjective "best", it is one of the most respectable secondaries. It sits in a tier among other secondaries comparable to the tier in which Soma and Boltor P rest in relative to primaries.