Concerns On Archwing.

[FATEdPondera]

I've been looking over the forums lately, and, seeing as how some people are hyped for Archwing, some don't care, and some hate the hype, I wanted to get my own questions out there before the wednesday update of +1 hype.

 

I am somewhat concerned, myself. If this is done wrong, it could be more a chore than a fight. The first question I have is are the archwing models going to be able to be modded themselves or are those mods going to fit on the warframe itself? I have misgivings over modding a warframe for either optimal infantry combat or optimal space combat. Like, if we're able to just ACE infantry combat, but in space, we die horrifically from an extraction gone wrong and lose everything? That'll probably make some people, including me, very angry.

 

Second, are we going to be able to use the weapons we carried into the mission with us? In the demo videos I saw, Excalibur was slicing things apart in repetitive looking sword combos with a weapon that looks like a car door. Is that weapon a place holder? Part of the archwing module itself? Something Excalibur found floating around in space? I'd think that an Orthos Prime or a Galatine would be able to be used just as well in space as it would on the ground. In fact, I think it's in the Serro's codex file that its original purpose was slicing up starship hulls.

 

While we're at it, are stances going to be able to be used in space? I know there's no gravity, but the idea of not having any control over our weapons and using dynasty warrior style repetetive attacks causes me some distress. Do not really want.

 

Third, there's been a lot of talk about abilities lately, but... are we going to be able to them in space? When subjected to a vacuum from a shield polarize gone wrong in a corpus ship tileset, abilities still seemed to be able to function. Obviously, someone like Zephyr is going to have kind of a hard time of it (no wind in space), and, unless her flames are self-oxidizing, Ember isn't going to be of much use....and Hydroid's tentacles need a surface to burst out of.... How exactly are you going to make this work, DE? The ranges involved (space is big), the style of movement (jet packs on our butts), even the environment (no gravity) clashes heavily with everything that Warframe has become thus far.

 

Now, don't get me wrong. This is not a thread screaming that the archwing will suck. I'm not that pessimistic. However, I do issue a very confused and concerned....

 

HUH.....?!?!?

[Kthal]

You should probably watch some of the most recent Devstreams, answers your questions.

 

 

More specifically, abilities are tied to your Archwing, weapons are specific to the Archwing gametype and pull from a separate mod-pool. (Archwing mods will not drop from normal enemies, and normal mods will not drop from Archwing enemies - mentioned on Devstream)

 

If you see the weapon meshes side by side, Archwing gear is significantly larger.

Edited October 20, 2014 by Kthal

[Kalvorax]

The recent devstream, about 45 mins in or so, has them playing a WIP demo.

Not sure how to answer one.

 

2) The archwings will have their own weapons it seems.

 

This also answers 3) The archwings will have their own abilites.

[ValhaHazred]

1. They have their own mod slots independent of the Frame.

 

2. The wings have their own weapons. Two melee (giant sword and giant hammer) and two ranged (autocannon and rocket shotgun) at launch. They thought it was weird taking on vehicles with infantry weapons and some (Ignis for example) don't make sense in space.

 

We don't know about stances yet. I don't see why not.

 

3. The Warframe's void pool fuels the Archwing, it's powers are converted to the Archwing's own.

Edited October 20, 2014 by ValhaHazred

[Guest]

Excalibur was slicing things apart (...) with a weapon that looks like a car door

 

I was gonna make a constructive post but I really lost it at this point.

[CrystalRibbon]

the Devstreams already stated it all.

 

1. Its not discused yet i think but they said theyre be like warframes with different set of stuff sepate from the warframe it self.

 

2-3. are answered in the devstreams and the posters above. <3

Edited October 20, 2014 by CrystalRibbon

[KuroShiranui]

Not sure what you meant by dying horribly during extraction, but if you watched the devstreams (seriously, do watch it), bumping into obstacles would just disorient you, not destroying you. If I remember there are no HP reductions whatsoever, or if it did, i'm pretty sure it's not significant. 

 

There will be different weapons for the mode, 2 guns and 2 melees. As stated in the previous post.

 

The melee combos are indeed repetitive, because it's supposed to be one-shotting enemies at a time. I think they mentioned this in the previous devstream. Also, this is still just the early phase for a new game mode so don't hope too much. New updates are always rough on start.

 

Stances would be an interesting addition, but as stated above, we're probably one-shotting enemies so it doesn't really matter for now.

 

The abilities are based on the Archwing you're gonna use. There'll be 2 at launch, so there will be 2 sets of abilities. Think of it as a separate Warframe, 2 new ones with 2 sets of abilities to try out. One for defensive, and another for offensive.

[NalkorRN]

1. They have their own mod slots independent of the Frame.

 

2. The wings have their own weapons. Two melee (giant sword and giant hammer) and two ranged (autocannon and rocket shotgun) at launch. They thought it was weird taking on vehicles with infantry weapons and some (Ignis for example) don't make sense in space.

 

We don't know about stances yet. I don't see why not.

 

3. The Warframe's void pool fuels the Archwing, it's powers are converted to the Archwing's own.

This is crap reasoning. Infantry weapons can have high caliber rounds like say, an Anti-Materiel round. A round that can punch through vehicles and kill the driver. That kind of bullet creates a unique gunshot wound, it turns men into legs, punches through engine blocks like they aren't even there and splatters the driver behind them.

 

The Ignis makes perfect sense too. I've used mine on Corpus ships (back when I played anyway) and they worked in a vacuum. The Ignis can just function like Dead Space 2's Flamethrower, just have it use a special fuel that actually exists that allows it to function in an environment with no oxygen. Plus, a big sword and hammer make very little sense in a zero-gravity vacuum. I doubt you could use them effectively, as simply hitting an enemy with a hammer would send them in the opposite direction. A big hammer and sword aren't nearly as effective as say, a hammer-shaped weapon that, upon contacting any hard surface, fires a few metal balls at thousands of miles per hour right out of the head, essentially turning it into a kind of melee railgun. Get rid of the big sword and replace it with one of those mono-molecular blades that function by severing molecular bonds, it'd be a weapon that would always deal full damage because it would literally be destroying the armor and flesh/organs/bones of the victim with each swing.

 

There, this thread finally managed to draw me into actually posting in... months I think. So there you have it, my way of improving this space combat: make it so the hammer is a damn portal railgun that fires big metal projectiles right on impact into some poor sod's face/chest, and a monomolecular blade that can and will be able to cut through anything and utterly ignore any and all resistances. Doesn't that sound so much better than just a plain old big hammer and sword?

[Maou]

I'll probably wait until it releases before I judge it.

 

Hype was never a really big thing for me.

[NalkorRN]

I'll probably wait until it releases before I judge it.

 

Hype was never a really big thing for me.

I pre-ordered Defiance before it was released because of the hype. Ever since then, I refuse to fall victim to hype of any kind.

[FATEdPondera]

*snip*

 

I always did kind of wonder what kind of ammunition Tenno weapons used to inflict such horrific wounds. Obviously, you can see the Bolter firing spikes as long as a small yappy dog and having the weight of bricks, and this primarily does.... puncture damage, shocking no one. Then, look at the Braton Prime with it's slash damage, and enemies killed by it just fall apart. Like they've been torn apart by razor wire at high speed. What kind of bullet does THAT?!

 

As for the Ignis, I think the word you're looking for is self-oxidizing, and I have my own misgivings about the Ignis. The way the weapon currently works, it projects what appears to be pure flame that almost rises and diffuses in a way the further out from the barrel it travels. The way it SHOULD work is similar to a hose, or super soaker.... except the liquid is on fire.

 

Lastly, instead of a hammer doing all that, why not just make the railgun and cut out the middle man? A hammer can still be a decent weapon in space. True, without gravity, it lacks its smashing into the ground capacity, but mass is still mass. If you hit someone with enough speed and enough mass, you can effectively render them into a pulpy mess even if the concept of "weight" is absent from a zero-G environment.

 

I was gonna make a constructive post but I really lost it at this point.

 

Sorry. =p I wasn't really trying to criticize. I just have a unique style of narration.

[Maou]

I pre-ordered Defiance before it was released because of the hype. Ever since then, I refuse to fall victim to hype of any kind.

Same as I did with Halo ODST, though the soundtracks were good, can't really say the gameplay was anyway different.

[Frostmire]

Although i kinda like the idea of using our current weapons as showed in some of the concept artworks , i prefer to have archwing have its own weapons and abilities , as the current weapon/ability system is just too broken :|

 

 

My biggest concern with Archwing is the possible ( 99%)  need for buying archwing and archwing's weapons slots 

[ValhaHazred]

Snip

 

Yeah, yeah there are specific anti-vehicular weapons that are man portable but think about it a little more. The vast majority of weapons in Warframe really aren't, as powerful as they may be in comparison to modern weapons. The Afuris aren't going to do anything but tickle a Gunship.

 

It's also a bit different since it isn't a guy with a huge, unwieldy rifle taking out a tank. Instead it's a post human warrior god with a rediculously huge weapon trying to take out friggen starships.

 

Both of the melee weapons are rocket powered and the sword is plasma edged.

 

Mono-molecular edges are just very sharp, not molecule destroying. You might be confusing them with the High-Frequency blades from Metal Gear, they do function that way.

Edited October 20, 2014 by ValhaHazred

[dashashou]

one can see the rails sadly 

[NalkorRN]

one can see the rails sadly 

What do you mean by that? Like, a rail-shooter a-la Star Fox 64?

[vaugahn]

one can see the rails sadly

It's already been confirmed by a dev that Archwing missions will take place in a mission zone, not on rails.

[dashashou]

by rails you can see X mobs over there  , x towers that you need to  slash  it might be an open map  but the mobs look on a  tight course  

[Buzkyl]

by rails you can see X mobs over there  , x towers that you need to  slash  it might be an open map  but the mobs look on a  tight course  

 

 

As evident by the Devs stream,  still a work in progress.

 

Still going to assume that even if its Open map, there's still has to be some sort of pathing for enemies or we would have mobs on 2 ends of the map.

[vaugahn]

by rails you can see X mobs over there  , x towers that you need to  slash  it might be an open map  but the mobs look on a  tight course

So you mean like every game ever created?

Yes, mobs move towards the player.

Yes, the player moves towards objectives.

That makes it on rails how?