The Community Has Viver Fever, And The Only Cure Is...

[Spacetimer]

(10*Current Enemy Level) every reward checkpoint.

 

Speed-run a T1C? Enjoy your instant 120 points.

 

Stay 1 hour into T4S? 1000 points every 5 minutes sounds pretty good.

 

 

The problem is not that there is a Best Place - it's that the gap is too enormous. Running 100 captures might still give you less Reputation than one wave of Viver. We need to move away from finding the best place to grind in order to make any progress, and back to the (assumedly) original intention of having a semi-passive leveling system. 

[Megakruemel]

I really like your ideas but please don't change powers going through walls... i put range on for a reason. if i can't kill people with my ultimate that costs 100+ energy because they hide behind a barrel...

god might help you-

 

i myself do not know what i am capable of.

 

I might punch my monitor or something D:

[--MZez--]

Why should they change this? If they change we all find something else and after that we do the same so what gonna happend? U think DE is gonna nerf the whole game just cause of 1 map? If there is no A there wil be B you know and etc. If u dont like it then dont play it and go play ceberus in pluto and stop making it difficult for other players/new players that wanna play viver. #FREE VIVER

[Yurilica]

This is a really constructive and well thought out post, thanks for contributing.

 

Unfortunately, the suggestions in that post only serve to solve the symptom(excessive Viver farming) and not the cause that made Viver farming happen.

 

Viver has always been around, as well as the tools to farm it.

 

Q: Why is there suddenly a need to farm up such a storm on Viver?

A: Because vets that have the tools to farm it can't stand the thought of going through all the content in the game again, multiple times, just to max a single Syndicate and buy the mods/items they want from it. Rep requirements and gain are whack.

 

There's also the fact that if it wasn't for Viver, players wouldn't even be aware that certain mods are bugged or flat out don't work.

 

The Entropy Burst mod for Supra for instance - it's flat additive status chance works, but mods that add %status don't process properly and calculate only the raw base chance(2.5% on the Supra), completely ignoring the raw +20 status that the Entropy mod gives.

 

It's only due to the existence of Viver hyperfarming that players have been able to acquire and test those mods at this point in time.

 

Imagine if there were no hyperfarming methods and then coming across a thread with a title:

 

"I grinded Rep for 2 months and this mod doesn't even work"

 

That'd be trouble. So much trouble. Viver is a hidden blessing for DE and they should appreciate the cleverness of their playerbase. Otherwise, there'd be soooo much disappointment in the long run. So much disappointment.

 

The solution isn't to just fix Viver - it's to both eliminate the need for Viver and only after that eliminate the possibility of hyperfarming.

 

Otherwise, players will just discover another hyperfarming method. There's plenty to go around.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Yurilica

[S.T.M.P.D]

Now if DE would use one of OP's ideas, it's gonna be №2. I feel so confident about this, that I almost ready to bet Bo Prime Handle on it.

Well that's mean.

People have called it Xini, ODD, 0% tax Sechura, Loot Cave, Pistol/Knife Only Operation Locker, Normal Kiting, Quad-kiting, Act 4 chest farming, and the Secret Cow Level.

Farming. Farming Never Changes. Go on DE, you can change whatever you want. Players will *always and forever* find the path of least resistance. Nobody likes slow grind games.

Viver made/makes me happy. I don't think the strategy people use is fun, but the reward is actually worth my time. It makes me want to play. It makes me feel accomplished after each run, instead of frustrated - as I stated in my previous thread.

Don't strangle, don't throttle, don't restrict. Let players be EXTREME. That's all I ask.

Ah, but that's the other problem! Players whine when they have no endgame. Syndicates are supposed to be a form of endgame, and now that it's been broken the whining will reach a ridiculous pitch, you know? The glut of "goodbye" threads because the leaving player has run out of things to do will become a flood if something is not done.

[democrator]

I know people abuse Viver Farm and I personally joined a couple of squads who were focused on farming. As everyone know, you spam powers, you get a ton of rep. 

 

Now, lets talk about the other end i.e. none focused squads. I joined random squads to level my weapons/frame. These were squads with 10+ mastery rank but with low lvl weapons and frames. We got massacred. The problem I noticed were:

1. The enemies were really strong

2. The capture points were too far apart. By the time, we neutralised and captured one, the other one is taken. 

3. Lack of communication: We did not have a strategy on how to beat the round since we randomly joined the mission. We were rushing to every node that was taken by enemy. 

 

Overall, it was much harder than normal farm. And the reward was 150rep/round.

 

Based on these experiences, personally, I am ok with people farming Viver. After the recent Viver changes, people who are farming Viver are taking chances. In all the recent strategies I saw, tenno's win 100-90+ or so. One mistake and they could easily lose all the rep. Before the nerf, tenno's were winning 100-10 ish. If people are strategizing, working as a team and taking risks, I don't see why they shouldn't be rewarded. 

 

Whenever I want to level warframe/weapons, I join random squad and play Viver instead of joining a farm squad. If people don't like farming, they just need to join a normal squad which does not have the farm mindset. 

 

Say DE limits following nerfs:

1. Increase map size - The capture points are already far apart. I managed to solo this map now. But increasing the map size will make it much harder and possibly make it impossible to solo or run with random squads.

2. Change faction - I think making it Grineer should increase difficulty. But from my recent missions, you can get high rep by just using Excalibur. So removing corpus isn't the right solution

3. Increase enemy level - Even now, the farm builds people have are low on health and shields. They could die with one shot. 

 

In my opinion, farming is boring. I hate it personally and I think its killing my keyboard. Syndicates was supposed to be a sure way to earn what you want by sacrificing some standing. But turns out, to get standing - you need to farm. If DE can take a look at the insane amount of standing, people won't have a need to farm and we won't have these isses.

 

[Yurilica]

Well that's mean.

Ah, but that's the other problem! Players whine when they have no endgame. Syndicates are supposed to be a form of endgame

 

Syndicates are not and were never created for the purpose of being "endgame" content.

 

The Focus system is supposed to be endgame. Syndicates aren't. They're side-show bonuses.

 

 

Syndicates are supposed to be a passive thing, where you accumulate points by simply playing the game.

 

But what if you already have 600+ hours played and have probably seen and played through almost everything that Warframe has to offer?

 

There's all these shiny and potentially interesting mods and items.... but you'd have to redo the game completely just to be able to max one Syndicate.

 

I'm 100% sure you wouldn't do that. That's the crux of the issues. Syndicates ARE NOT endgame, they're side-game, a passive point gain that can work effectively for new players, but asks for horrible, horrible grinding of already seen content from veteran players.

 

 

Then you get veteran players that have almost all frames, mods and weapons at their disposal, all looking for a way to eliminate the grind.

In other words - they have tools. All of them.

And they discover Viver. First a simple strategy, then more and more elaborate setups... until you've reached a point where you can earn 14k Rep with boosters.

 

Viver was discovered and refined out of sheer necessity. If you eliminate Viver, but don't eliminate the cause that made Viver necessary, you do nothing. You just force your playerbase to experiment for a few days until they find another hyperfarm spot.

 

You need to cut the issue at the root instead of treating just a symptom.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Yurilica

[ranks21]

these forumers and their suggestions after they already got their level 5 syndicate rankings plainly doesn't want anyone else to do the same as they've don't to reach there as quickly as them. they want to control the market with the mods they get from the syndicates to sell at whatever price for however long.

 

 because of said forumers and their suggestions, they've been numerous nerfs, silly buffs, hillarious changes, that just makes what the game used to be fun and enjoyable is now becoming just another meh.

 

 just read some of your own suggestions you want to be applied now and do us a favor and start from scratch with it.

 

 elitist, master, grandmaster or whatever you want as a "title" give the new comers a chance to do the same and enjoy the same stuff you did when you were having fun.

 

 if you don't like what everyone else is doing in public matches or missions, there is an invite only and solo and friends only tab where you can play and do whatever you want how you want and for how long you want. stop being greedy and selfish.

Edited November 11, 2014 by ranks21

[Macdermott]

                -with a fully developed team it takes 40 mins to farm for 3.5k reputation on average on viver, eris without a resource booster for one round....you need about 240k reputation to reach the maximum title of ONE and only ONE syndicate...that is roughtl 78-80 hours of gameplay alone that only involves farming at viver, eris with the method that ppl use (mag, excal, trin/limbo, x-warframe)...this calculation does not include the reputation cost of the mods and time that the mods take in order to acquire

 

Dude.  Did nobody do the math on this before implementing Syndicates?

 

Seriously?

 

If it was intended to take this long, then the rewards should not have been made public knowledge until someone had reached the next tier.  At least it would have prevented some of the early farming and people would be "surprised" by the awesome mods and such.

[Garuger]

I really dislike all your opinions because that will make DE do even worse witth grind . Viver is good i get what i want and my skills do that what you are saying is going to forever grind, no thank you . I prefer to faint from excausation farming viver till i get max EVERYTHING and never look back on broken Syndicates than have to use broken rng from DE .And i will do it , 12 hours straight so far and everything is getting maxed hope till tommorow will finish and get some rest or milk it till it gets nerfed.For every action there is always equal and opposite reaction . Viver is our reaction towards DE and their "endgame" like it was with Xini before Viver and there will be more future "viver" there always will be until DE fix their RNG and their methods no matter the frames we have to use or how to use them there always  going to be a way

Edited November 11, 2014 by Garuger

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

these forumers and their suggestions after they already got their level 5 syndicate rankings plainly doesn't want anyone else to do the same as they've don't to reach there as quickly as them. they want to control the market with the mods they get from the syndicates to sell at whatever price for however long.

 

 because of said forumers and their suggestions, they've been numerous nerfs, silly buffs, hillarious changes, that just makes what the game used to be fun and enjoyable is now becoming just another meh.

 

 just read some of your own suggestions you want to be applied now and do us a favor and start from scratch with it.

 

 elitist, master, grandmaster or whatever you want as a "title" give the new comers a chance to do the same and enjoy the same stuff you did when you were having fun.

 

 if you don't like what everyone else is doing in public matches or missions, there is an invite only and solo and friends only tab where you can play and do whatever you want how you want and for how long you want. stop being greedy and selfish.

 

Hey I agree with your post, but I want to ask you to stop focusing against Grand Masters, because honestly not all of us are 100% caught up with the game, elitist, etc.

 

Many of us Grand Masters are actually quite casual players and want the same things as you.  We're not all really that far ahead of anyone in the game. We made contributions early on, and we got platinum, one warframe and two weapons for it, but other than that, we're not the "Illuminati of Warframe" that some believe us to be.  Just regular players like you, who loved the game early on enough to support it.

 

The whole founder vs. non-founder wars happened months ago, and still resurfaces from time to time and it gets ugly, but I ask that you please understand that not all Grand Masters are elitists, jerks, etc. and try not to add fuel to the fire.

 

=)

Edited November 11, 2014 by sushidubya

[ranks21]

well said Garuger well said. I already found 3 other types of missions that I can grind and get points because of exploring to see where the most points gained is at.  some veterans are just selfish and spitefull and wants all the glory to themselves and crew then turn around and make the game  distastefull for others.

[vaugahn]

well said Garuger well said. I already found 3 other types of missions that I can grind and get points because of exploring to see where the most points gained is at.  some veterans are just selfish and spitefull and wants all the glory to themselves and crew then turn around and make the game  distastefull for others.

 

No offense, but you are totally misinterpreting the situation here. I know blaming someone feels good and people like to jump right to that, but take a step back and just think for a second, before posting something so off-base.

[Garuger]

well said Garuger well said. I already found 3 other types of missions that I can grind and get points because of exploring to see where the most points gained is at.  some veterans are just selfish and spitefull and wants all the glory to themselves and crew then turn around and make the game  distastefull for others.

I am a veteran of course a new player is not at my level and there should be a huge gap between me with over 2k hours and a new guy of barely 100 hours or less . However DE only think the new players and have done NOTHING to vets if you want to hate me hate me i could not care less . No  matter thought the fact remains the same that we should not be forced to those mesures to get something  that simple . It is jsut a broken Tokken system

[Garuger]

No offense, but you are totally misinterpreting the situation here. I know blaming someone feels good and people like to jump right to that, but take a step back and just think for a second, before posting something so off-base.

He is sour because he cant do Viver runs and despises all that they do . It is in the same class with ppl that cried over the arcane helms and won

[Zeromanicus]

Well basically, the more you nerf stuff, the harder it'll get for non-hardcore players who aren't highly specced working in a team.

[Garuger]

Well basically, the more you nerf stuff, the harder it'll get for non-hardcore players who aren't highly specced working in a team.

That would be interesting result for DE aiming the vets in such a volume that would hurt new players XD

[vaugahn]

He is sour because he cant do Viver runs and despises all that they do . It is in the same class with ppl that cried over the arcane helms and won

 

Nobody cried over arcane helms...that was an obvious change, anyone could have seen it coming a mile away. Not the topic for this thread though.

 

He's eager to dump the blame on veterans, but what people aren't realizing here is that an exploit doesn't help anyone. Use of exploits make it harder to diagnose the actual problem, and obfuscate potential solutions. 

[Damuranashi]

What a catchy name to call it. Good!

[Garuger]

Nobody cried over arcane helms...that was an obvious change, anyone could have seen it coming a mile away. Not the topic for this thread though.

 

He's eager to dump the blame on veterans, but what people aren't realizing here is that an exploit doesn't help anyone. Use of exploits make it harder to diagnose the actual problem, and obfuscate potential solutions. 

Viver introduced something i seeked as a vet a challenge / reward / skill and co - op .None of this excist in the warframe at the moment with that comob . The team should be able to co op in order to win and had to have the proper mods if 1 was not good the whole think crumbled that does not excist in warframe

[Skaleek]

Magnetic fields shouldnt be too affected by the walls fyi. Think of Magneto in Xmen if you want a simple example. I dont think the frames should be nerfed because they can abuse a specific mapset. I think you should leave the frames alone and simply stagger the spawns (if you really want to limit our method of grinding). I honestly think Viver is just the symptom off the massive grind that is syndicates, but thats been expressed by others ad nauseum.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Skaleek

[vaugahn]

Viver introduced something i seeked as a vet a challenge

 

Let me just stop you right here...as a fellow "vet" (whatever that means), I'm almost embarrassed that you think Viver was in any way challenging. 

 

Rule of thumb: any game mode that can be played by a macro is not a challenge.

[Khawz]

#2 is just horrible, changing a warframe because of literally one map is really dumb.

[Cat_Jam]

Wave set / minutes / round (n) gives a certain rep number (x)...

 

So: [ (55n)-100 = x ] for defense and survival and [ (50(n^2))-(50n) = x ] (?) for interception missions.               

 

waves / minutes : rep                                         rounds : rep

5 = 175                                                            1 = 50 {first round is set to 50 because the formula would mean 0 rep is given]

10 = 450                                                          2 = 100

15 = 725                                                          3 = 300

20 = 1000                                                         4 = 600

25 = 1275                                                         5 = 1000

30 = 1550                                                         6 = 1500

35 = 1825                                                         7 = 2100

40 = 2100                                                         8 = 2800

etc                                                                   etc

 

It'd encourage people to go on for a longer run rather than leave at the first set of waves / 5 minutes / round.

[Altey]

That's syndicate reputation system fault