If Excalibur Can't Bllind Through Walls, Why Can Mirage?

[Refreshing_OJ]

A returning player here, I was rather bummed out to learn that a huge part of Excalibur's kit was nerfed into oblivion. Since he's already an incredibly squishy frame, Radial Blind was fantastic for keeping him alive and controlling the flow of battle around him.

 

So, after returning expecting to be able to sustain his general squishiness by spamming his only reliable cc ability, I suddenly learn that it longer breaks the laws of physics by having penetrating light going straight through walls. Conseqently, in the current state that Radial Blind is, if a bombard or another heavy unit comes into range shortly after you cast it, you might as well invest in some plat to keep buying revives, because they simply will not be affected by the stun that was something of his life support.

 

Now, if this was an across the board nerf to all frames (for example, Rhino Stomp only stuns those in LoS, Accelerant doesn't go through walls, etc.), that would make sense to me, as that would be an attempt to make the game a little more difficult and more tactical. However, as it seems, a lot of the nerfs recently to Excalibur (such as the LoS nerf to Radial Javelin) has been in response to ways players were abusing the system to make the game way too easy.

 

Okay, I can understand that. You want us to play the game a little bit more tactically? Cool, I can understand that. You don't want us to abuse mechanics? Cool, I can understand that.

 

However, after building and playing Mirage, it's very confusing to me that she can proc the exact same stun based on the same general idea (bright flash of light), but it completely denies physics and can pierce through walls? Why is that the flagship Warframe is incredibly crippled in terms of cc, but a different frame with a generally speaking same mechanic can still do that form of cc?

 

DE, if you're going to nerf something, could you at least make it something that is across the board?

 

TL;DR: If Excalibur had Radial Blind nerfed to LoS, Mirage's prism shouldn't be able to proc the same stun through walls.

Edited April 4, 2015 by Refreshing_OJ

[KidMemphis]

It's simple...Excalibur can for so from do

Checkmate, Warframe Players!

[Ognj]

Because DE doesn't do nerfing properly and look into all similar abilities and fix them all accordingly, instead they just plug insta-nerf on most critical things in order to halt players getting stuff faster/easier.

[DiosGX]

Excal's radial jav doesn't SOUND that bad, but I haven't used it since. It claims that if you recently had LoS it will still hit them. It doesn't have to be what you can see at that absolute exact moment only.

 

It's just to stop people from standing in a corner with energy pancakes or hiding in the sewer tubes in void survival.

 

As for why Mirage can blind and Excal can't? Well, her blind is a freakin' ult. It also understandably LOOKS like it emits a lot more light than Excal's RB.

[Rayzenfloss]

Because DE didn't NERF Mirage YET.

Not like " The Poster Boy " who's been a Touch by Nerf hammer every now and then.

[CTanGod]

Excal's radial jav doesn't SOUND that bad, but I haven't used it since. It claims that if you recently had LoS it will still hit them. It doesn't have to be what you can see at that absolute exact moment only.

 

It's just to stop people from standing in a corner with energy pancakes or hiding in the sewer tubes in void survival.

 

As for why Mirage can blind and Excal can't? Well, her blind is a freakin' ult. It also understandably LOOKS like it emits a lot more light than Excal's RB.

Except Prism has same stats as Radial Blind, Same cost (since initial cast of Prism is 50 energy) and can be detonated instantly after the animation.

 

But I'm not expecting people to realise that this is simply broken on Mirage since she already has high dmg and most people just use her for dmg because for some reason people still think DMG/Tankyness >>> CC for some reason. Just look at Chroma, all frames are a better choice than him no matter what you do.

[Evanescent]

They posted on twitter that Scott's working on him! Sauce in Yuikami's thread!

[DiosGX]

Are you dissing Team Lizard Face? I'll have you know Chroma can eat your heart and acquire the power of the old kings. o 3o

 

Whilst you do have a fair point about the auto-detonation, I'm still going to insist that it is intended as an ult and not a second skill. If that kind of blinding capacity is really what you want though, you can just play Mirage. :P

[TheGrimCorsair]

They said they were gonna make LOS changes to powers as they made sense, and TBH, given that making the blind LOS for Mirage would hardly cripple her kit, yeah, they ought to go ahead with that.

[MegpoidBeetle]

They posted on twitter that Scott's working on him! Sauce in Yuikami's thread!

Super Jump now affected by LoS! Yay!

[GinKenshin]

just to remind you, the blind on prism is a side effect, these are too different abilities here, everyone just sees prism as a blinding tool.....maybe they have been blind themselves, seriously, it's a disco ball that shoots lasers, that's it.....I know some ppl abuse it and only use it for blinding, but don't just nerf her because of them, it's the same reason why excalibur was nerfed (I think), because of ppl who abuse using his 4th 

and there are other points, the biggest that it's an ult, and it costs double the energy, and you don't really see a lot of mirage players, most of them just use her 3rd and 1st and don't even bother with the rest of her kit 

 

[climatiseur]

Because they do things step by step to see how some changes work.

Eventually all similar abilities will get the same treatment, if applicable. Just be patient.

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

Did you notice the recent nerf that delted the stealth multiplier on blindet enemys?

Enemys can't see a attack coming from invisible tenno- legit multiplier

Enemys can't see anything at all- no reason anymore for a multiplyer.

Its actually even worse then logical mechanics on a particular frame. DE is straight @(*()$ with Excal players by nerfing mechanics on logical base and denying logic on still present benefits.

Edited April 4, 2015 by (PS4)CoolD2108

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

The LoS mechanic isn't that big of a problem to me as pure melee player. Excal has a great melee set with auguments to fit in this role perfectly. I never had a reason to hide anywhere to begin with but. No excal player had. But taking away this option while simultanely nerfing his melee is just sheer insanity.

[(PSN)SteampunkJester]

Probably because it's an ultimate and has a long *** cast time even with Natural Talent on.

[TheBrsrkr]

Space magic.

[(PSN)arod1alx7]

DE: hold up its Wednesday, gotta go nerf Excalibur

[LazyKnight]

If people keep complaining about LoS on Excalibur not being equitable across the Warframes, it could have a predictable result of irritating DE_Scott to the point that he just adds it to everything. 

Edited April 4, 2015 by LazyKnight

[Fierach]

The LoS mechanic isn't that big of a problem to me as pure melee player. Excal has a great melee set with auguments to fit in this role perfectly. I never had a reason to hide anywhere to begin with but. No excal player had. But taking away this option while simultanely nerfing his melee is just sheer insanity.

 

 

But his augments kinda suck.

 

The only really usable one at the moment is Surging Dash for an instant 1.5x or 2.x combo multipler into a group of enemies. Not far enough into Conclave to try his other augments though.

[Metalman007]

It's simple...Excalibur can for so from do

Checkmate, Warframe Players!

"...can for so from do."  from what school of grammar does that make any sense?  Please elucidate.

[TheBrsrkr]

"...can for so from do."  from what school of grammar does that make any sense?  Please elucidate.

It's a joke, like could you not go reach farther any under

[Thaumatos]

Excal's radial jav doesn't SOUND that bad, but I haven't used it since. It claims that if you recently had LoS it will still hit them. It doesn't have to be what you can see at that absolute exact moment only.

 

It's just to stop people from standing in a corner with energy pancakes or hiding in the sewer tubes in void survival.

 

As for why Mirage can blind and Excal can't? Well, her blind is a freakin' ult. It also understandably LOOKS like it emits a lot more light than Excal's RB.

Radial Javelin is subjected to the same mechanic that Radial Blind is...and it's an ultimate.

Logic ftw...

The real reason is: Scott felt like it.

I know the guy has a lot on his plate, but they need setup a balance team that he can manage.

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

But his augments kinda suck.

The only really usable one at the moment is Surging Dash for an instant 1.5x or 2.x combo multipler into a group of enemies. Not far enough into Conclave to try his other augments though.

At least the dash and javelin auguments are pretty much the same, its sheer preference if you wanna choose dps or mobility in your set. Dash gives a instant 1,5-2X multiplyer base but relies on recasting once you run outa targets, javelin gives similar numbers on a percentual value with a timer.

They are pretty close dps wise and worked together with the stealth multiplier excal had preU16. DE even worked on the mechanic to make them work better with radial blind by splitting the stun and blind-phase so you could stun them, get a multiplier and then attack them buffed for the best result.

Then they suddenly deleted the stealth multiplier....insanity.

Edited April 4, 2015 by (PS4)CoolD2108

[TheBrsrkr]

I don't think I made this clear enough in my first comment, so allow me to try again.....

#SpaceMagic.

[Fierach]

They are pretty much the same, its sheer preference if you wanna choose dps or mobility in your set. Dash gives a instant 1,5-2X multiplyer base but relies on recasting once you run outa targets, javelin gives similar numbers on a percentual value with a timer.

They are pretty close dps wise and worked together with the stealth multiplier excal had preU16. DE even worked on the mechanic to make them work better with radial blind by splitting the stun and blind-phase so you could stun them, get a multiplier and then attack them buffed for the best result.

Then they suddenly deleted the stealth multiplier....insanity.

 

If Surging Dash also gave extra duration to the combo multipler, then it'd be perfect.

 

Furious Javelin though, is extremely counter intutitive. You hit many targets, you'll get a good bonus. To increase the amount of targets you hit for a bonus, you can put on range, but overextended will make the damage bonus you get from it negative, and you'll weaken the Javelin itself.

 

To increase the strength of the bonus you get, you need power strength, but you'll run into the problem of actually killing your targets with the Javelin, leaving nothing to use the damage bonus on. If you try to maximize the duration of the bonus, you'll get less range, meaning less targets to get a bonus from.

 

Add in to the fact that since Javelin's now Line of Sight, even targets that would be in range might not get hit, and you won't get the damage bonus from them.

 

This is insanity and Furious Javelin is a terrible augment.