Uh Did I Miss Something?

[WhiteCopain]

So I went into a T1 Def because I wanted to record a Mesa ult video since there weren't any decent ones I could find of just her shooting her ult over and over to show a friend. I got to wave 20, had a party of four but the mission screen literally registered me as dealing 99% of the damage since they were basically just letting me attack while the mag pulled in loot.

 

I got my wave 5 reward and my wave 20 reward, but waves 10/15 were blank, I had figured it was a bug since I was alt tabbing to find out a way to turn off screen shaking (Doesn't seem to be a way?) but then I ended the mission and checked my loot and I honestly got no wave 10/15 reward.... why?

 

I could get it maybe for the people who were afk or something, but I was there killing everything, I was cycling in and out of my ult, I was moving around and literally dealing ALL OF THE DAMAGE, did it honestly count me afk or something?

[(PSN)Pengu_Imperialus]

"Our ‘press 4 to win’ ultimates are metered primarily by the supply of energy. Finding an energy loophole means that Homer’s drinking bird can play the game for you. That is not team synergy. That is just broken." -DE Steve, Vivergate post

 

Pressing 4 may be considered by the loosest definition as "playing the game", but it's barely playing the game. It requires no skill or forethought, and it trivializes the game.

They eventually need to use hard caps on powers different stats or introduce cooldowns and max usage times on powers.  Just make it were you can't stand still for a full minute+ unloading some ult. 

[Kaotyke]

So them threads about survival camping and mesa pressing 4 was all in my head?

 

The community complains alot and generally asks for nerfs because players figure out new ways to play and they don't like it.

 

This is one of them, they hate it that a team of 4 can last for 40min+ by pressing 4 and limiting movement and not doing crazy parkour jumps etc

 

Steve loves nerfing things but pressing 4 is playing the game and he is wrong, you press 4 you are interacting with the game and a effect will happen, if you were not playing the game then no buttons are pressed and nothing happens in the game.

Let me tell you of the story of a Mesa that clicked a Macro and left the game for 60+ minutes to do whatever while the 2 others of the team (Nerkos and Mag) did the same and left Volt forever alone to deal with the Nullifiers, put Eletric Shield and Buff Mesa with Shock Troper....

Edited May 21, 2015 by Kao-Snake

[SilentMobius]

So them threads about survival camping and mesa pressing 4 was all in my head?

 

The community complains alot and generally asks for nerfs because players figure out new ways to play and they don't like it.

 

This is one of them, they hate it that a team of 4 can last for 40min+ by pressing 4 and limiting movement and not doing crazy parkour jumps etc

 

Steve loves nerfing things but pressing 4 is playing the game and he is wrong, you press 4 you are interacting with the game and a effect will happen, if you were not playing the game then no buttons are pressed and nothing happens in the game.

 

People can complain all they want, doesn't mean the devs made the change because of them.

 

And as Project lead If Steve says X isn't playing the game then it damn well isn't. 

 

Maybe you haven't played many MMO's but this happens all the time: New system comes out, players find a way to get rewards with minimal effort, devs patch so that doesn't work, official statement says that X wasn't playing the game.

 

Best get used to it, it'll keep happening, if you're camping in one spot relying on a particular combination of abilities it will get patched out.

[--RV--Meta]

"Our ‘press 4 to win’ ultimates are metered primarily by the supply of energy. Finding an energy loophole means that Homer’s drinking bird can play the game for you. That is not team synergy. That is just broken." -DE Steve, Vivergate post

 

Pressing 4 may be considered by the loosest definition as "playing the game", but it's barely playing the game. It requires no skill or forethought, and it trivializes the game.

 

I'd say that it is then up to the developers to better incentivize a more active play style rather than simply punishing the lazier methodology that THEY PUT IN THE GAME. It's not, in my opinion, "good" to punish the player(s) for playing the game the way they want to play it.

 

Having said that, I didn't even know about "AFK farming" strategies until after they started getting nerfed/punished and people started complaining about it.

[shinebox]

The underlying problem is the entire drop table system. 

 

When they make it so you have to burn through 120+ keys x 20 minute MINIMUM for the "C" rotation because there is a .008% chance of dropping the one part you are looking for, people naturally get jaded and disenchanted with the whole process.

 

There is no added incentive to running around killing all things with maximum effort versus sitting still and mashing 4.  The result is the same.

A forma BP or a worthless void key at 20, 40, 60, 80 and so on.

 

On top of that, before even getting to that point actually, you have to farm the higher tier void keys in the first place at 20, 40, 60, 80 minute intervals, as well while getting the shaft there too.  So to be more efficient, so that you aren't wasting the keys you took too damn long to farm in the first place.  You are going to try to find a setup to make those keys last as long as possible.

 

It's a double edged sword.  You want players to work for it and not just get everything they want in the first run, but at the same time we are grinding and grinding and grinding and grinding and not getting anywhere.  I don't blame the guys that want to sit still.  We all are getting gamed by RNG and drop tables, so we are going to find a way within the parameters of the game and available warframes to game the system back.

Edited May 21, 2015 by shinebox

[The_Ellimist]

DE are incentivising you to _not_ stay immobile in Mesa's ultimate all the time. "playing the frame how it was made" is not the same as "Only using the ultimate"

This x100

[JDP04]

i dunno guys, sometimes i just don't understand.

DE keep saying they don't like people just stand there and spamming powers, but they release mesa and mag's greedy pull that encouraging lazy gameplay.. :/

[DameDameNingen]

*things*

 

Was going to say something like this, but you put it far better than I could've.

 

Newer warframes noticeably tend to have more interesting ultimates than the 'F- you, room' button common among the first released, but Mesa is an exception. Some sort of ranged hysteria-like effect (maybe taking some stats from your equipped secondary) would have been much better.

 

I'm always baffled by people who defend standing still pressing 4 as a legitimate play style, rather than just a way of bypassing rng walls so you can do something more interesting. What is wrong with these people? What are they getting out of this? I'm honestly curious.

[Xriborg]

I'd say that it is then up to the developers to better incentivize a more active play style rather than simply punishing the lazier methodology that THEY PUT IN THE GAME. It's not, in my opinion, "good" to punish the player(s) for playing the game the way they want to play it.

 

Having said that, I didn't even know about "AFK farming" strategies until after they started getting nerfed/punished and people started complaining about it.

 

The players have to be playing the game first. Pressing 4 is not really playing the game. Pressing 4 to win is one step away from botting. This isn't a way to players to play, it's an exploit, and it needs to be closed.

 

Now yeah, it's up to DE to close it, and I don't think they're going to be able to do it without some sort of nerf.

[Ironlixivium]

They actually punish you for playing a frame how it was made? That's... an interesting choice..

 

Well I guess Excal's getting remade soon and I've basically been wanting exactly what they said they're making him. So I guess I can play that instead of Mesa

 

     You seem to be missing the point. He had a greedy mag restoring his energy. It's greedy pull not afk support pull big dif' there. A mesa with maxed efficiency and an r10 primed flow can stay in peacemaker for ~113s. That's not even half of the afk timer. In other words, if your reward was taken by the anti afk system while using peacemaker on mesa, you were exploiting. 

 

20 seconds i think or 30, i know its less than a minute.

 

     LOL. No. It's 5 minutes. The OP could've left a brick on his left mouse button for all the game knows. Although I think the afk system should be more complex, most people who sat still for 5 minutes deserved to have their reward revoked. I think it should be more along the lines of actions. I don't mean holding a button counts as not afk, I mean pressing it would count, once, then letting it go would count once again. Possibly have some way of telling whether its the keyboard or a macro, too. I don't mean like, macro usage = afk, but if you're one of those people who don't like to spam buttons or hold them, the toggle on would count, then the toggle off would count, but what the macro does wouldn't.

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

Moved to Players Helping Players subforum.

[ArcusVeles]

This sounds like the perfect excuse to ask them to rework Mesa's ult so you can move while shooting.  Turret mode is not fun and triggers AFK.  Pls let me slide in to a room and shoot everything in the face Equilibrium style, ty~