ThePododo Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Nah, too much player spreading. You'd probably have to wait five minutes to get into a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladeus-Ex-Machina Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Most of us have our loyalties and misgivings, but at the end of the day, we are promiscuous and rewards driven. We would change sides in a conflict for a better reward. We would pass alerts that are below us. We would ignore other Tenno in need of help because we prioritise time and rewards over morality. I have no reason to burn bridges with the Lotus, so she is an ally; if not the best ally in the game. I'd trust her as equally as any of my Syndicates. While she ordered us into cryosleep and into danger more times than preferable, it's a Tenno's purpose to pursue a better future. If that means cutting down progress, than so be it. But if I had to choose between her and an Orokin Reactor or Catalyst, our loyalty and morality become blurry as hell. Depending on the long term consequences, either option is debable, but until they put such an option in game, any anti-Lotus sentiment is hollow. You'll follow her for than gifts, and would jump hoops any Grineer, Corpus or even Infested offering similar. Question the Lous if you want, but in an imperfect world you must often pick the least worse option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaxillian Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 (edited) You're conflating in-world opinion with out-of-world (player) opinion. In-world, your'e Tenno is free to think whatever they want about the Lotus, to doubt the necessity of the mission and to worry about her direction. But short of not playing any mission you do not have the option to act on those opinions. Out-of-world, as a player, you would be ignorant to do so, The devs have told us that the Tenno are "The good guys" our action are "good" we know that in-game we can _only_ perform actions approved or dictated by the Lotus, hence she _must_ also be a "good guy" (Not sure what you think "word-of-god" means but when the devs say X is true, as authors of the setting that is QED "word-of-god"). We also know that DE have stated that the Lotus is akin to our "Space mom" that she will always be there for us even if (for specific mission only) we chose to take a mission from other characters. They also said that, no, we'll not be able to replace the Lotus with a syndicate announcer (for the reasons I'm restating) We also know that repeating the same hundreds of lines in with different VO is not content. Much in the same way adding ambient occlusion wasn't content. It add nothing for the player to _do_ it simply improves an existing mechanism. Content is something we _do_ another announcer is not content. Content is quantitative, duplicate VO is (possibly) qualitative. We also understand that duplicating the VO work for _every_ historical piece of content and every future piece of content is completely ridiculous considering no content is added. For the same time investiture we could double the lines of unique VO in the game (actual content) Can I maybe get a source that they said no to this, because I don't seem to remember a time of them saying this. The way I see it in a game where you have so many choices, why not just include more? The players opinion should matter in-game as well as out, if I am understanding you correctly, then we shouldn't have a pre-destined decision made for us. Adding more decisions is content in my definition and just to show that my definition is politically correct I will literally post the definition. "things that are held or included into something." meaning that it can be anything because it does not specify what is added in only that something is added in. Though everyone has their own definition and I can respect that, this is the way I see it. To add on, adding who to follow would also change the players amount and diversity of objectives. It's not just getting a new announcer, it's choosing who to follow, who's morals you agree with. Like if I wanted to follow a bunch of genocidal savages then I'd go to the red veil. It's almost like expanding on the already implemented syndicates, which in is pretty much doing the same thing you're against and still being considered content. Edited July 27, 2015 by Vaxillian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)ELECTROxShOcKZz Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 (edited) Can I maybe get a source that they said no to this, because I don't seem to remember a time of them saying this. The way I see it in a game where you have so many choices, why not just include more? The players opinion should matter in-game as well as out, if I am understanding you correctly, then we shouldn't have a pre-destined decision made for us. Adding more decisions is content in my definition and just to show that my definition is politically correct I will literally post the definition. "things that are held or included into something." meaning that it can be anything because it does not specify what is added in only that something is added in. Though everyone has their own definition and I can respect that, this is the way I see it. To add on, adding who to follow would also change the players amount and diversity of objectives. It's not just getting a new announcer, it's choosing who to follow, who's morals you agree with. Like if I wanted to follow a bunch of genocidal savages then I'd go to the red veil. It's almost like expanding on the already implemented syndicates, which in is pretty much doing the same thing you're against and still being considered content. First thing is i dont believe the Red Veil are genocidal savages i believe that the Red veil see the world as corrupted and that they are sadistic yes but want to cleanse the system via a purge i agree with the Red veil because we have the infested corrupted grineer and corpus so they are seen and not pure. As a Red veil opperative i personally agree with their motives. Also, i would love to see this source too as i never remember this being a thing that DE meantioned so until you provide proof I am calling BS on your statement (SilentMobius) i completely agree with you just add on the current syndicates. Allowing the player to chose who and what they want to believe and pursue in the game will allow for a more diverse and interesting game and allowing the pvp into affect we could add Syndicate conflicts e.g. Red Veil v.s Arbiters of hexis in a tenno versus tenno area and the syndicate that emerges as the winner gets certain rewards with that syndicate and the team that loses gets a small reward for siding with that syndicate. Edited July 27, 2015 by (PS4)ELECTROxShOcKZz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Institute-Marksman Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 (edited) Oh, pitiful you, unable to comprehend the beautiful complexity of the Lotus. Stuck in a perpetual loop of apologetical behaviour aimed towards Syndicates.Why do you Meddlers persist so long after you've been defeated?All who seek truth are welcome amongst the loyal Tenno. Followers of the Lotus welcomes you.The Lotus be the Word, and the Word be Balance. Edited July 27, 2015 by Institute-Marksman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omnimorph Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Most of us have our loyalties and misgivings, but at the end of the day, we are promiscuous and rewards driven. We would change sides in a conflict for a better reward. We would pass alerts that are below us. We would ignore other Tenno in need of help because we prioritise time and rewards over morality. Speak for yourself :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)ELECTROxShOcKZz Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 Oh, pitiful you, unable to comprehend the beautiful complexity of the Lotus. Stuck in a perpetual loop of apologetical behaviour aimed towards Syndicates. Why do you Meddlers persist so long after you've been defeated? All who seek truth are welcome amongst the loyal Tenno. Followers of the Lotus welcomes you. The Lotus be the Word, and the Word be Balance. You say those who seek truth are welcome amongst the tenno yet US the tenno dont know much about the lotus and the only reason we trusted to her is because she came to our aid in the time of awakening and helped us escape Vor we are Tenno ones who chose deserve to chose freely and if we make a mistake we shall correct it. I may not trust the lotus but i still follow under her command as we the tenno have no choice in this, I cant trust her as we do not know the past behind the one who we follow so tell me this would you follow a person you have just met IRL, or would you be cautious and ready incase they lead you astray. I personally would follow the Red Veil because I agree with their motives and want to purse their motives to the end. The lotus is about balance but with the pursuit of balance can come chaos so I do not trust her to bring balance to the system as we know nothing from her past we can tell she is from the orokin era and does show a little bit of care and emotion for the tenno (Unless she is decieving us with false emotions a.k.a crocodile tears) but we do not know her true motive as she is creating a army of tenno who follow her blindly. One day the rest of you tenno will understand the lotus for what she is capable of. -Electro- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethChamberlain Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I'm not following the groups that send death squads after me or other tenno. All I want is their stuff, their ideals don't mean anything to me when they threaten me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEsoJD Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Has any tenno demonstrated defiance towards the lotus in anyway so far? If they truly have freewill, it would seem natural that at least one would act out. Sure she gives options in missions/situations, but that's it. It's never an option that is unfavorable for her. She also probably has knowledge of the past that she hasn't disclosed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrotSalad Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I'd like a choice, Her behaviour on twitch streams have me questioning my image of the voice associated with the Lotus. Either change her voice or let us align with another guide. Its unfair for DE rebecca to be expected to roleplay the lotus 24/7. But that is what i come to expect of her due to her role ingame!.Never realised it though until 3 months ago. I personally would love to replace her with Chinese lotus xD complete with non english dialogue.Maybe some clever audio enhancements to seperate her voice into something sounding very different so they dont have to re-record all those lines and stack up unused dialogue in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S0ulre4per Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I feel that there is something fishy going on with her.........but now we still need her. She gives us info about enemy.....smaller infos about our past (chroma warframe quest chain) Time will tell if she is our friend........ i seriously have trust issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S3EK3R Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Electro.. You talk about the Lotus like she wants to kill you the instant she doesn't need you. Aren't your precious Red Veil the same? Wouldn't they kill you in an instant when your usefulness ends? They suddenly deem you "corrupt" and then kill you. WE know nothing about the Red Veil? What are their motives? What is corrupt? Who decides who is corrupt and who is not? Their perverted sense of justice? "The old ways speak of a cleansing fire. We of the Red Veil must burn away this corruption to begin anew." This quote alone can be interpreted as a word of someone who wants to burn everything in the current world. Have you played Dragon Age? There's a cult there called the "Order of Fiery Promise". They want to destroy the world, so a new and less corrupt one can born. What is the proof that the new world will be clean? Pure? The Red Veil are nothing more then terrorists, and yet you want to side with them and stab the Lotus in the back? The Lotus, who freed you and cares for you? And just to remind you: Who sends death squads to kill the Tenno? The Lotus or the syndicates? I have every reason to distrust the syndicates, and no reason to betray or question the Lotus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)ELECTROxShOcKZz Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 Electro.. You talk about the Lotus like she wants to kill you the instant she doesn't need you. Aren't your precious Red Veil the same? Wouldn't they kill you in an instant when your usefulness ends? They suddenly deem you "corrupt" and then kill you. WE know nothing about the Red Veil? What are their motives? What is corrupt? Who decides who is corrupt and who is not? Their perverted sense of justice? "The old ways speak of a cleansing fire. We of the Red Veil must burn away this corruption to begin anew." This quote alone can be interpreted as a word of someone who wants to burn everything in the current world. Have you played Dragon Age? There's a cult there called the "Order of Fiery Promise". They want to destroy the world, so a new and less corrupt one can born. What is the proof that the new world will be clean? Pure? The Red Veil are nothing more then terrorists, and yet you want to side with them and stab the Lotus in the back? The Lotus, who freed you and cares for you? And just to remind you: Who sends death squads to kill the Tenno? The Lotus or the syndicates? I have every reason to distrust the syndicates, and no reason to betray or question the Lotus. yes i understand what you are saying and she only freed us and yes while she shows caring emotions towards the tenno it could all be a charade and the only reason the player trusts her is because shes there from the start and rescues us only once so and doesnt even bother to tell the tenno about their past or restore their memory or tell them what happened in the old war. The Red Veils motives are to cleanse the system through a great and violent purge which is accually in their syndicate description, I agree that they could discard any tenno who sides with them at any given time when they are seen as corrupted but as Tenno we have the ability to kill the Red Veil. I may not have a reason to trust the lotus but I also have no reason not to so for now Im going to remain loyal until a time presents itself where the lotus reveals a reason not to trust her and then and only then shall the pure fires of the veil shall strike. We should get a choice but in a choice comes multiple roads some will take the wrong road *cough* *cough* Arbiters, Suda but some will chose wisely like the Red Veil, New Loka and Perrin Sequence. I believe that the tenno will be betrayed by Dear Lotus only then we can see the world from a different perspective... Maybe even the Stalkers perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)inuyasha279 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 yes i understand what you are saying and she only freed us and yes while she shows caring emotions towards the tenno it could all be a charade and the only reason the player trusts her is because shes there from the start and rescues us only once so and doesnt even bother to tell the tenno about their past or restore their memory or tell them what happened in the old war. The Red Veils motives are to cleanse the system through a great and violent purge which is accually in their syndicate description, I agree that they could discard any tenno who sides with them at any given time when they are seen as corrupted but as Tenno we have the ability to kill the Red Veil. I may not have a reason to trust the lotus but I also have no reason not to so for now Im going to remain loyal until a time presents itself where the lotus reveals a reason not to trust her and then and only then shall the pure fires of the veil shall strike. We should get a choice but in a choice comes multiple roads some will take the wrong road *cough* *cough* Arbiters, Suda but some will chose wisely like the Red Veil, New Loka and Perrin Sequence. I believe that the tenno will be betrayed by Dear Lotus only then we can see the world from a different perspective... Maybe even the Stalkers perspective. I see you don't care about steel meridian, your ally...I honestly see the only wrong path is New Loka... those horrible people worshipping something so old and useless... "The old ways speak of a cleansing fire" Doesn't that mean orokin are Red Veil's idol? And the Tenno killed the orokin... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)ELECTROxShOcKZz Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 I see you don't care about steel meridian, your ally... I honestly see the only wrong path is New Loka... those horrible people worshipping something so old and useless... "The old ways speak of a cleansing fire" Doesn't that mean orokin are Red Veil's idol? And the Tenno killed the orokin... i only dont care about Steel Meridian because im sided with Loka, Red veil and perrin. So Steel Meridian are always sending their joke of a death squad after me so i dont bother and anyway they are of no use to me. Yes they might be the Red Veils idols but maybe the Veil may see the tennos reasons for killing the orokin and forgiven them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaxillian Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Has any tenno demonstrated defiance towards the lotus in anyway so far? If they truly have freewill, it would seem natural that at least one would act out. Sure she gives options in missions/situations, but that's it. It's never an option that is unfavorable for her. She also probably has knowledge of the past that she hasn't disclosed. Stalker. I'm not following the groups that send death squads after me or other tenno. All I want is their stuff, their ideals don't mean anything to me when they threaten me. Lotus sends a squad of tenno to wipe out entire ships while syndicates send elite death squds that don't even match up to a tenno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)inuyasha279 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 i only dont care about Steel Meridian because im sided with Loka, Red veil and perrin. So Steel Meridian are always sending their joke of a death squad after me so i dont bother and anyway they are of no use to me. Yes they might be the Red Veils idols but maybe the Veil may see the tennos reasons for killing the orokin and forgiven themlike the stalker... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)ELECTROxShOcKZz Posted July 28, 2015 Author Share Posted July 28, 2015 like the stalker... The stalker is a joke....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEsoJD Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 Stalker. I remember reading something along the lines of Stalker being a low ranked warrior. In the codex he quotes and refers to the Tenno as if he isn't one/separate. "Some have walked these desolate worlds while you have slept. Some like me. I remember what you did. I remember the day. The Tenno appeared at the Terminus, gleaming and victorious. Our cold and gold Emperors, breathless, bathed you in savior's silk. Then came the sound. Across all our worlds, all at once, the ceremonial Naga drums. A royal salute to the honored Tenno." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeargantHaztagazpacho Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 Damn the edge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhisperByte Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 I'm a dwarf and I want everyone in Iron Forge to die Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latronico Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 I think we should get a choice on who is the one to speak and guide us through our battles. I personally think we should be able to choose after the rank 3 unlocking the syndicate and maxing out a syndicate whether we become a operant of that syndicate and ditch the lotus. If this was a option i would've joined the red veil by now and i kinda wish we got a choice instead of blindly following the lotus into battle and be able to chose whose motives we think are right *cough* *cough* Red Veil #DeathToTheLotus "You are a fire as feared as you are respected" - Red Veil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altey Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 Why you care about us "betraying" the lotus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Grihaly Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 Why you care about us "betraying" the lotus? Because it is Tenno duty to follow the Lotus. Heresy puts you at the level of Corpus and Grineer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agentcheese Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 Because it is Tenno duty to follow the Lotus. Heresy puts you at the level of Corpus and Grineer. I don't see what's so bad about being at grineer or corpus levels. is there something bad about them that i missed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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