RealPandemonium Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Well, compared to ancient's aura, bubble is very small and can be destroyed. If the radius of disruptor aura can be toned down a bit but still cover itself (but doesn't cover other ancients). It would be more reasonable. I doubt they give a sh#3@ though. At least, AoE or non-Projectile skills should just use 1.0x multiplier. Most extreme cases will be solved, easy and fair. :3 Seems kind of silly to have the back plate just to reduce some powers' damage. Remember that you can use Radiation procs to disable Ancient auras. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted October 29, 2015 Author Share Posted October 29, 2015 Still no fix (U17.9) C'mon... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted November 5, 2015 Author Share Posted November 5, 2015 Its not just for warframes, its for weapons as well, i noticed with my quanta vandal.. Yeap just confirmed that most weapon AoE effect will deal only half damage on ancients. Such as Tonkor, in most cases the AoE explosion will hit ancients' 0.5x multiplier no matter where the explosion is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrostboundFlame Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 (edited) you guys find the weirdest crap to complain about... Edited November 11, 2015 by FrostboundFlame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G4d0 Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 There is also something wrong with snow globe health as well, it does not seem to stack on cast its hp go down as same rate as single globe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatersail Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 (edited) try against level 99 infested. Ancients used to take double damage from certain damage types "finishers" like ash used to hit healers for double I assume this is simply to do with weak-spots on ancients, and when they bend down they get hit in the head, its possible they also still have a weak right knee :) oh.. wikia Body Multipliers Head: 2.0xLimbs: 3.0x limbs 3x so.. ice wave dealing around 299%(rounded down) more damage is because it hits feet? Edited November 11, 2015 by Tatersail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealPandemonium Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 (edited) oh.. wikia Body Multipliers Head: 2.0x Limbs: 3.0x limbs 3x so.. ice wave dealing around 299%(rounded down) more damage is because it hits feet? That is one page that is extremely outdated and unreliable. I'm planning on updating it eventually. Ancients have 2.0 modifier on the head (the tentacley part,) .5 on the back plate (that thing on their back that's also partially above the back of their head,) and 1.0 everywhere else. Edited November 11, 2015 by RealPandemonium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted November 12, 2015 Author Share Posted November 12, 2015 (edited) That is one page that is extremely outdated and unreliable. I'm planning on updating it eventually. Ancients have 2.0 modifier on the head (the tentacley part,) .5 on the back plate (that thing on their back that's also partially above the back of their head,) and 1.0 everywhere else. Yea... There is no 3.0x part. Did ancients use to have that limb multiplier? But I still don't get it, why does AoE hit enemies' back by default? (Weapon AoE included in most cases as well) If developers want to avoid "AoE head shot", they can make radial ability and weapon AoE hit enemy torso. MOAs won't suffer 3.0x damage this way... By the way, new Saryn's miasma still ignores disruptor aura and hits ancient's torso though. Edited November 12, 2015 by aerosoul1337 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deimos87 Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 There is something wrong with Warframe ability damage. Then I started to test. Since the armor calculation is more complex, I started with infested Most noticeable: I cast tons of AoE and couldn't kill a single level 1 Ancient Disruptor. There was no any other enemy around. Ice Wave with 100% Power Strength on Swarm-Mutalist MOA Damage = 1572 (299% of expected damage) Avalanche with 100% Power Strength on Swarm-Mutalist MOA Damage = 3369 (299% of expected damage) Ice Wave with 100% Power Strength (Frost P max rank, Ancient Disruptor Level 1) Damage = 26 (5% of expected damage) Avalanche with 100% Power Strength (Frost P max rank, Ancient Disruptor Level 1) Damage = 56 (5% of expected damage) Even if we ignore Ancient Disruptor's aura, there are still something unreasonable. The following results are tested with max rank Frost P with 100% Power Strength. All skills were aimed for torso, headshots were avoided. Each result set has been tested for multiple times. Extremely abnormal results are marked. (Different browser may have different alignment.) Type Ice effect% Test target Freeze damage Ice Wave damage Avalanche damage Infested 100% expected result 350 700 1500 Test result: Charger 349 699 1497 Leaper 349 699 1497 I.Flesh 50% expected result 175 350 750 Test result: Crawler 175 349 749 Volatile Runner 175 349 749 Fossilized 75% expected result 262.5 525 1125 Test result: Boiler 262 524 1123 Brood Mother 262 524 1123 Swarm-Mutalist MOA 262 *1572 *3369 Tar-Mutalist MOA 262 *1572 *3369 Ancient Healer 262 *262 *562 Toxic Ancient 262 *262 *562 Corrupted Ancient 262 *262 *562 Ancient Disruptor 262 *26 *56 __________________________________________________________________________________________ If the table is not well aligned for your browser, check this picture: _________________________________________________________________________________________ P.S. Unlike Ancient Healer, Ancient Disruptor's aura can cover itself and other ancients. Also I tested Saryn's Miasma and Excal's Javelin, they both deal correct damage at 100% power strength against Ancient Disruptor. EDIT: MORE Warframe SKILL TEST: Tested some other skills against Ancient Healer and Disruptor: (All skills were aimed for torso, headshots were avoided.) Excalibur Slash Dash: deals about 50% of expected damage against Ancient Healer, and deals about 5% of expected damage against Disruptor. Javelin: deals about 100% of expected damage against both Ancients. E.Blade: deals about 100% of expected damage against both Ancients. (without melee weapon or mod equipped, 100% power strength) Ember Fireball: deals about 50% of expected damage against both Ancients. World on Fire: deals about 50% of expected damage against Ancient Healer. And deals 5% of expected damage against Disruptor (direct damage is 5, heat proc is 200 per tick, weird enough). Saryn Venom: deals about 100% of expected damage against Ancient Healer, but deals "ZERO" damage against Disruptor. Miasma: deals about 100% of expected damage for both Ancients. (100% power strength and 100% duration) Rhino Stomp: deals about 100% of expected damage against Ancient Healer, and deals about 10% of expected damage against Disruptor. Loki Disarm: deals about 100% of expected damage against Ancient Healer, but deals about 10% of expected damage against Disruptor. There is no rule at all. Ash Shuriken: This is a tricky one since you can not aim it freely... most of the time it treats like you hit ancient's helm gear behind its head and deals 50% of expected damage for all ancients. But if the Shuriken does hit the body, it deals about 100% correct damage for all ancients. And headshot got 2x damage correctly but it's a bit hard since the helm gear seems to have large hit box, it even covers the FRONT side. Blade Storm: deals about 50% of expected damage against Ancient Healer, and deals about 5% of expected damage against Disruptor. Welp, even FinishHer Finisher damage is not reliable. Blade Storm hit Ancient healer. It is supposed to deal 2000 damage, but deals 998 damage instead. It can not take proc damage in this picture because level 1 ancient is killed by 998 damage directly. I have to test blade storm on low level enemies otherwise the chain effect and the camera is way too hard to handle. Blade Storm hit Ancient Disruptor. It is supposed to deal 2000 damage, but deals only 100 damage. But its proc deals 350 damage per tick (supposed to be 700). Atlas Landslide deals 50% of expected damage against both ancient healer and disruptor. Oberon Smite deals 50% of expected damage against ancient healer, and deals 5% of expected damage against disruptor. However, projectiles after this initial smite deal 100% of expected damage against disruptor, sometimes even 200%. Reckoning deals 50% of expected damage against ancient healer, and deals 5% of expected damage against disruptor. All Ancients takes half expected damage from certain skills. It has something to do with its helm gear behind its head. Disruptor's aura reduces certain skills' damage by 90% further. But some skills are not effected. Other fossilized enemies (Boiler and Brood mother) have no such issues. Conclusions 1. Body part damage multiplier is completely messed up for a lot of warframe ability. Especially non-Humanoid I guess. Ancient's helm gear behind its head seems to take 0.5x damage. And it is bugged for some warframe ability that takes that 0.5x multiplier no matter it's a radial effect or direct damage type. But there are some victims as well... Moa type enemies (except Anti MOA) seem to take 3x damage from certain radial skills. Anti MOA has sightly different figure and it takes correct damage. I think AoE/Radial ability should hit torso and use 1.0x damage multiplier on all enemies. 2. Ancient Disruptor's aura effectiveness is very weird. It reduces CERTAIN (but not all) abilities damage by 90%. (did the reduction use to be so high?) And it DOES cover itself and other ancients. Ancient's aura should NOT cover itself or other ancients. 3.Anyways, CC abilities are not effected by both aura, CC for the win. Epic Work mate. Really, no Joke. We need more "technical players" like you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealPandemonium Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 (edited) Epic Work mate. Really, no Joke. We need more "technical players" like you! This thread is mostly alarmist. He is only really pointing out that Ancients have a .5x body part on their back that is hit by many radial effects. Everything else is business as usual, but he makes it out to be something crazy when it's really not. Edited November 20, 2015 by RealPandemonium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-cS-dalonico Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 the mechanics behind their aura are broken. i remember being able to solo akkad till wave 25 with only my thorid with no problem at all some moths ago; but now since round 5 its impossible because the damage reduction to AoE the disruptors aura gives makes that even at round 6 nothing will die from that very same thorid. absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealPandemonium Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 the mechanics behind their aura are broken. i remember being able to solo akkad till wave 25 with only my thorid with no problem at all some moths ago; but now since round 5 its impossible because the damage reduction to AoE the disruptors aura gives makes that even at round 6 nothing will die from that very same thorid. absurd. Did you have Radiation damage on your Torid before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taiiat Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 I think AoE/Radial ability should hit torso and use 1.0x damage multiplier on all enemies. i don't agree it should be considered a Binary situation. Abilities which automatically target things, use Body, yes. but ones that you control where to attack from or have Projectiles or Et Cetera - should check Body Part Multipliers for whichever one is 'closest' or so. being able to deliberately aim most of your Abilities is better than not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted November 23, 2015 Author Share Posted November 23, 2015 i don't agree it should be considered a Binary situation. Abilities which automatically target things, use Body, yes. but ones that you control where to attack from or have Projectiles or Et Cetera - should check Body Part Multipliers for whichever one is 'closest' or so. being able to deliberately aim most of your Abilities is better than not. That's what i mean... "AoE/Radial" skills. (Abilities which automatically target things) not including projectile or physical hits. Because radial skills and mostly AoE and automatically target things. Anyway, your point is exactly what I wanted to say. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted December 12, 2015 Author Share Posted December 12, 2015 (edited) This thread is mostly alarmist. He is only really pointing out that Ancients have a .5x body part on their back that is hit by many radial effects. Everything else is business as usual, but he makes it out to be something crazy when it's really not. U18: When disruptor auras stack, it seems very buggy. The energy drain effect is multiplied, but the ability damage reduction effect is quite... random. I have 185% power strength. Sometimes I deal 104 damage, sometimes I deal 1039 damage from Avalanche. 104 and 1039 damage even appear at the same time... Edited December 21, 2015 by aerosoul1337 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAZANATOR Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 Try to go client with frost and iim sure you will get right numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 I know this is different but... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealPandemonium Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) I know this is different but... That's just because of their 50% bonus resistances. Fire, Corrosive, and Puncture damage are already resisted by 50% by Techs, so Guardian Eximus Techs get 100% resistance and become immune. It used to cap at 75%, but something changed (maybe the bonus resist increased from 25% -> 50%? Ember getting neutered by overlapping Eximus damage resist auras is nothing new, though. You pretty much need a Radiation proc source to keep those stacking auras from becoming a problem in late post-game content. Edited December 21, 2015 by RealPandemonium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 That's just because of their 50% bonus resistances. Fire, Corrosive, and Puncture damage are already resisted by 50% by Techs, so Guardian Eximus Techs get 100% resistance and become immune. It used to cap at 75%, but something changed (maybe the bonus resist increased from 25% -> 50%? Ember getting neutered by overlapping Eximus damage resist auras is nothing new, though. You pretty much need a Radiation proc source to keep those stacking auras from becoming a problem in late post-game content. What you said is much more like Toxic ancient's aura stack, 2 auras can provide aoe gas/toxin damage immunity. This may not be new. But 1 single Guardian unit with photo shield is immune to puncture, corrosive and heat damage since U18. Because I used to solo tons of missions with pure corrosive + heat build Atomos, and never encountered such a 100% resistance thing before U18. But, even other eximus that gives 50% resistance does not have this bug after U18. Guardian + photo shield seems buggy. Only Guardian + Photo Shield has no resistance cap so far as I know. Charger's Infested health has 50% resistance against radiation and viral. Parasitic Charger has 50% more resistance against all types of damage. But I still can kill them with Radiation + Viral weapon. (cap about 75% according to Parasitic Charge's Codex entry) Guardian Eximus' Proto Shield has 100% damage resistance against 3 damage types, and I am sure this happened right after U18. And these 3 types of damage are kinda important for void missions, Guardian Nullifiers are immune to those and I had to abort some missions. This is not listed from any update note, it is probably an accidental bug imo. Specifically, no health type should be completely immune to any type of damage directly. Grineer's cloned flesh has innate 50% gas resistance, but none of any grineer eximus has 100% gas resistance even now. (cap at 75%) Anyway this seems to be another issue. For more discussion: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/570556-u18-game-breaking-bug-invulnerable-eximus/ By the way, you got any idea of the pictures that avalanche deals inconsistent damage against disruptors (U18 simulacrum screen shots)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealPandemonium Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 By the way, you got any idea of the pictures that avalanche deals inconsistent damage against disruptors (U18 simulacrum screen shots)? Not sure yet, ill test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealPandemonium Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Looks like sometimes the aura is on ans sometimes off. Freezing seems to have an effect on it? After the ancients had all been frozen for a while, it seems that all their auras had deactivated, allowing me to deal full damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted December 23, 2015 Author Share Posted December 23, 2015 (edited) Looks like sometimes the aura is on ans sometimes off. Freezing seems to have an effect on it? After the ancients had all been frozen for a while, it seems that all their auras had deactivated, allowing me to deal full damage. Hmmm... You see this picture? Those disruptors are pretty close enough to cover each other. But 1 takes 1039 damage while another takes 104 damage only. Seems not simply "on or off" because the aura aoe radius is about 10m. Edited December 23, 2015 by aerosoul1337 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgarhighman Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 A variety of eximus are "currently" ignoring "random variety" of damage types at the moment... Good luck hoping DE will sort this out proper >.> ick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealPandemonium Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Hmmm... You see this picture? Those disruptors are pretty close enough to cover each other. But 1 takes 1039 damage while another takes 104 damage only. Seems not simply "on or off" because the aura aoe radius is about 10m. That's what I'm saying; sometimes the aura is inactive for some reason, and I noticed that the aura had totally deactivated for all of them after they had stayed frozen for a sustained period of 10+ seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerosoul1337 Posted December 24, 2015 Author Share Posted December 24, 2015 (edited) That's what I'm saying; sometimes the aura is inactive for some reason, and I noticed that the aura had totally deactivated for all of them after they had stayed frozen for a sustained period of 10+ seconds. I don't think so, aura is AoE. And they are all frozen in that screen shot. If an aura is "OFF", then everyone will take the same damage. So does "ON"... Edited December 24, 2015 by aerosoul1337 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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