Is Punch Through Viable For Sweeper Prime Cc Build?

[Yazeth]

Hello. I have a Sweeper Prime, and I'm planning to use my event mods to help boost it's status and create an Blast/Elect Status build. I'm wondering if Punch Through mods will be useful on the Sweeper though. Although it is a shotgun. I do not know how common Punch Through will be useful for me. What do you guys think?

[Yazeth]

I guess I'll use Punch Through and max out on Firerate. Thanks guys.

[[DE]Grzegorz]

Multishot /1

3 event elementals /4

3 firerate /7

Punch Through /8

Total /8

 

If you don't need any killing potential, you are fine.

 

You can also try 2 firerate+2 punch through, I've been using Seeking Fury on pretty much all shotties I have.

Edited September 26, 2015 by Mofixil

[Archistopheles]

I can't remember if Sentinels benefit from reload speed. If they do, then Seeking Fury would be a good choice.

[stoybot]

It's very useful for a CC build.

 

EDIT:

This is what I run on mine:

 

 

Tends to knock down or stun small crowds very frequently.

Edited September 26, 2015 by stoybot

[LifeNine]

I can't remember if Sentinels benefit from reload speed. If they do, then Seeking Fury would be a good choice.

All sentinels weapons except the Burst Laser and Prisma Burst Laser has a reload speed greater than 0. At least that's what the in game stats say. The (Prisma) Burst Laser has a 0 second reload speed. I.e no reload.

[Yazeth]

Multishot /1

3 event elementals /4

3 firerate /7

Punch Through /8

Total /8

If you don't need any killing potential, you are fine.

You can also try 2 firerate+2 punch through, I've been using Seeking Fury on pretty much all shotties I have.

Thanks for the info, though it doesn't fully answer my question. Thou, I may be at at fault here for not making it clear.

Will there be enough situations that would warrant me using a Punch Through mod? Otherwise, I may just put more focua on reload speed, since I think it shortens the cooldown for Sweeper to fire again.

[Acos]

Yes. Sweeper fires in a cone pattern, meaning that the shots spread out. If enemies are tightly grouped together this will allow Sweeper to hit several targets at once, dramatically increasing the damage and crowd control potential. Do keep in mind, however, that the Sentinel is not smart like you; he won't necessarily prioritize groups of enemies to maximize his damage potential just because you put punch through on his weapon. 



 

Edited September 26, 2015 by Acos

[Katinka]

In my opinion Punch Through is viable on ANY sentinel weapon build since sentinels have a habit of shooting walls.  Way I see it, if it's going to shoot walls I might as well make it shoot through walls.

[taiiat]

i'd definitely go with yes.

Punch-Through is valuable. Seeking Fury is sufficient for it's targeting, and Reloading a tiny bit faster can't hurt.

 

 

Katinka has a similar mindset as i do, Sentinels at times try to shoot things that are behind a wall. Punch-Through can't hurt to actually hit what it's trying to shoot at.

 

- - - - - 

 

also, instead of going off the deep end with RoF Mods, replace one of them with Tactical Pump.

in the long term, it's going to be better. it won't spray in the short term as much, but in the long term it will be spending more of it's time shooting, and less down time where it's not protecting you. (until it's dead, but the only thing you can do about that, most won't do)

[stoybot]

also, instead of going off the deep end with RoF Mods, replace one of them with Tactical Pump.

in the long term, it's going to be better. it won't spray in the short term as much, but in the long term it will be spending more of it's time shooting, and less down time where it's not protecting you. (until it's dead, but the only thing you can do about that, most won't do)

 

And while it's shooting, it will be FAR less effective at protecting you, even though it will have 0.462 seconds less down time.

 

Magazine / Fire Rate + Reload Speed will give us the time it takes to empty a clip and reload - the shorter the better in terms of applying status.

 

Tactical Pump + Shotgun Spazz: 16.19

Shotgun Spaz + Frail Momentum: 9.14

 

That's a 77% difference, meaning the 180% RoF build is 77% more effective at applying status over time. If you think this is overkill, let me remind you that, even though you can push the status of Sweeper Prime up to 69.8%, it's still an IPS weapon, and the fact that you're only using 180% elemental damage means it will proc elemental status far less often than expected - only 31% of the times it procs a status effect. Furthermore, a fast rate of fire ensures that the most common proc - impact - is actually good enough to disable the enemy while the Sweeper is shooting.

 

TL;DR: I'll gladly jump off the deep end with RoF.

Edited September 26, 2015 by stoybot

[taiiat]

-snip-

wrong formula. because you're talking about something completely different.

 

(Mag/RoF) / ((Mag/RoF)+Reload)

 

without any RoF or Reload Mods, Sweeper has a ~90.9% uptime.

with +180% RoF, Sweeper has a ~78.125% uptime.

with +90% RoF and Tactical Pump, Sweeper has a ~88.5% uptime.

 

unfortunately, no matter what you do, there's going to be holes, but it's nice to... reduce the size of those holes.

 

 

so i suggest:

Edited September 27, 2015 by taiiat

[stoybot]

-snip-

 

Is this a joke? Do you not see that your equation is deliberately designed to produce lower numbers with slower reload speed regardless of the fire rate? Hell, remove that 90% RoF mod from the third loadout and your "uptime" - whatever that's supposed to be - becomes better than an unmodded Sweeper. If "uptime" is what matters, why run an RoF mod in the first place? Oh, right, because the Sweeper is not providing reliable CC without it. Oh wait, that means RoF is important in status application...

 

1 / (Magazine / (Magazine/RoF + Reload)) will give you the "sustained" gap between each shot, which is 0.8 seconds for 90% RoF + TP, and 0.457 for 180% RoF.

[DiosGX]

Just echoing what other people have said. Seeking Fury is an insanely good choice if you're using Gas or Elec procs on the Sweeper Prime. The AoE and procs pile up like mo'f*****.

[taiiat]

Is this a joke?

by your logic, your formula is deliberately designed to only make lots of RoF Mods better. which it is. calculating how much time can be spent firing only works one way, it doesn't favor stacking RoF Mods because then you spend more time Reloading.

the entire point of it is identifying what percentage of possible firing time you spend shooting rather than Reloading.

 

'sustained gap' isn't a thing.

[stoybot]

by your logic, your formula is deliberately designed to only make lots of RoF Mods better. which it is. calculating how much time can be spent firing only works one way, it doesn't favor stacking RoF Mods because then you spend more time Reloading.

the entire point of it is identifying what percentage of possible firing time you spend shooting rather than Reloading.

 

'sustained gap' isn't a thing.

 

All right, looks like this will be my last post here... But before I take my leave, I'll prove to you that according to your formula, a Sweeper with 0.01 fire rate (1 shot every 100 seconds) and reload speed of 1.5 seconds is a better status weapon than a Sweeper with a fire rate of 2 (2 shots every 1 second) and reload speed of 2 seconds. Ready?

 

(20/0.01)/(20/0.01 + 1.5) = 99.9% uptime

(20/2)/(20/2 + 2) = 83.3% uptime

 

I rest my case.

[taiiat]

hyperbole

but nothing would ever be used that way.

 

you're looking for a formula that will tell you what to do. math doesn't do that.

all the Formula tells you is how much of it's time is spent firing versus not firing, assuming you always want to be firing.

 

nothing more, nothing less.

your hyperbole can't make the formula into something it's not.

if a Weapon shot incredibly slow, yes, it's uptime would probably be good. ofcourse, such a Weapon would either have no Magazine, a small Magazine with a quick Reload, or a giant magazine with a fairly quick Reload.

your Formula also happens to be biased against low RoF so much, that Weapons which shoot slowly, like Charge Weapons, are immediately considered terrible no matter what you do.

 

 

so let's go the other way with ridiculous hyperbole, shall we?

 

1 / (20 / (20 / 20 + 2)) == 0.15

1 / (20 / (20 / 10,000 + 2)) == 0.1001

 

'i rest my case' indeed.

Edited September 27, 2015 by taiiat

[(PSN)TheYetiMan22]

Honestly, I would honestly avoid punch through (and vicious spread) if you want to procc consistently. As it has been said Sweeper shoots in a cone but bear in mind it also shoots downwards due to the height of the floating sentinel, meaning that accuracy is extremely poor. I've actually been using a rank 8/9 Tainted Shell and Sweeper procs so much more when I need it to. Just a thought, try it with Punch through and then with Tainted Shell