Vitality And Redirection Option Or Must Have?

[(PSN)B0XMAN517]

A.

I like having to sacrifice my vitality for some extra power or utility. 

[-N7-Leonhart]

Damage mods like Serration are not optional, they are there 100% of the time, that is why there is a talk about removing them.

 

Vitality and Redirection are indeed optional, a lot of people throw them away to put some other stuff. So Vitality and Redirection should ofc stay as they are.

 

/thread

[AandOE]

The different Focus trees could apply their vision of a mandatory mod (togglable in Options) to the Warframe being worn. If a tree exudes lots of... armor aspects, for example... it could auto-apply Steel Fiber without equipping it. (not stackable, or selectable in the mod screen when applied) Going this route, it could simply be a node in the Focus Tree, with no additive cooldown (i.e. completely negated), and active as soon as clicked, instead of being togglable in the options screen.

[AutoPhox]

I sometimes use 1, but never both. I would be against having them built in though, on some frames I like having low shields so that Rage gets converting faster.

^

[Aquasurge]

perhaps having similar mods like vigor could solve some problems e.g. one mod increases armour and health and another may increase shields and shield recharge rate

[Loswaith]

While I almost always use both (obviously some frames get away without them), it serves me well and given I drop much less than most that I group with they seem to be doing the trick.

 

Not sure I would consider them mandatory however as plenty of builds handle them and I tend to be more of an attrition style player so not going down works well for the way I play, while other ways may work better for the way others play.

 

At the end of the day I'm not going to complain if it needs to be done to make the game easier to get a good balance for

[AzureTerra]

Option B.

Gives scope for more Corrupted mods that Boost one at the expense of the other.

 

Some of my frames i use both on, some only one of the pair. Others have One and Vigor. See a lot of frames that run min/min and often have to pick them up again

[Grobbus]

Some frames can actually go without them like Rhino/Valkyr while others need one of those in order to protect themselves from being one-shot.
If DE do make them scale with frame level, it'll just open more room mostly for CC/Utility frames(but all other will benefit from it as well) and actually use more than one exilus mod.

[Kripion]

I never use redirection on my Ash P, and I dont use Vitality on Frost P. So the pair arent mandatory for me BUT. Using one  however is mandatory for me...

 

 

To build up some more diversity we need new mods. Here are mine ideas:

- energy drain resistance mod

- blocking dmg mitigation mod

- warframes ability nullifying resistance : gives 0,25 sec/rank (up to 10 rank) of delay before your ability get nullified after you get into nullifier bubble, if nullifier get killed your ability will be canceled anyway

- corrupted mod: increase efficiency/ decrease power strenght

- corrupted mod: increase duration/ decrease power strenght

- corrupted mod: increase def/ decrease all movement speed

- and one for by favorite warframe (ash): teleport augment:) - ash performs finisher automatically after teleporting to an enemy:)

 

And the most important thing: MANY SYNDICATE MODS are outdated and can be replaced by regular MUCH better ones. For example why someone would use Rising Storm if we have Body count

Edited February 13, 2016 by Kripion

[RadioLarity]

Of course not. What a broken idea.

 

This is nothing but straight-up power creep. "Add them automatically to every frame" will lead to "hey Frames are tankier and also their abilities/additional stats are better" will lead to "raise the silly numbers of the enemies! Make them stronger! Make them tankier!"

 

It would only lead to stupid power creep.

 

So, no.

 

No no no no no no no no no.

 

A modding system exists for you to find a compromise. You have to choose how to mod and how to play. Having both Vitality and Redirection is a choice that has a cost (not being able to use another mod).

This is practically the same solution as getting rid of those mods and adding hp/shield scaling with levels.

So I don't understand why ppl go mad about splashing the mandatory mods regardless of everything.

Edited February 14, 2016 by RadioLarity

[Necrius]

I replaced Redirection with Vigor and now got lots of health. shield-restoring sentinel helps a lot.

[felixsylvaris]

Some frames relay more on armour, health, shields or power based immunity. So there is some versality.

 

Some frames care about: power duration, power strenght, power range.

 

On some mission i would put on rush or even thief wit or that thing for hacking.

 

But almost always i would take power efficiency.

 

There need to be some tradeoff betwean survivalibility and buffing power level.

 

Maybe if in the future there will be more mods doing fancy stuff with specific frame there will be time for changes but not now.

 

Removing survivalibility mods will make more place for mods increasing ability power, which is opposite to increasing builds variety.

[(PSN)martin576]

I feel Armor and Health and shields mods are overrated.

I Run all my frames without any Health and shields mods and they all do well.

The reason I think there overrated is because there is a point where you get one shotted no matter what Frame or How much Survival mods you have on.

Even on Banshee who is squishy af, I've never ran a Health shield, or armor mod.

Also Zephyr who has really high health and shields, I never run Survival mods.

There a waste imo

How do you deal with oneshotting then?

[fatpig84]

If you use Loki, you don't even fit either one of them.

555 health points + 555 shield points for a 12 +14 mod energy investment is stupid.

[Bachuuu]

Option, at high level you get one shotted no matter how much hp you have.

[(PSN)martin576]

If you use Loki, you don't even fit either one of them.

555 health points + 555 shield points for a 12 +14 mod energy investment is stupid.

What do you use then on Loki?

[(PSN)martin576]

Option, at high level you get one shotted no matter how much hp you have.

How ppl deal with this? I was in T4 Surv yesterday with random players and we dropped like flies at 15 min already. Vor was a nightmare alone, which was a new experience.

[Airyllish]

How ppl deal with this? I was in T4 Surv yesterday with random players and we dropped like flies at 15 min already. Vor was a nightmare alone, which was a new experience.

 

If you all dropped like flies at 15 minutes in T4 survival, it sounds more like your cell was ill-prepared and didn't work well together. Which isn't an insult, for the record, but just me saying that all the frames you were running clearly didn't sync well. 

 

So that has nothing to do with these two mods specifically and is instead an isolated incident.

 

As for Vitality and Redirection; when I was a babby player I was using both of them because they looked like they were necessary. Now after 21 days of playing the game and using multiple frames, I can confidently say that it depends on the frame you're using and what mission you're doing. For example, why would you ever use Redirection at any level on Valkyr? By the same token, if you're a fully modded Blessing Trin, you don't need either of them. And by the same token if you're running a tank Frost, you don't need to bother with Vitality but you'd be daft not to use Redirection.

 

Vitality, Redirection and Steel Fibre all have their places, but that's the trick. They have their places and that means they are for specific frames or for specific mission types. They are not necessary on all and every frame for all and every mission and, in some cases, are actually downright bad choices to use.

[(PSN)martin576]

If you all dropped like flies at 15 minutes in T4 survival, it sounds more like your cell was ill-prepared and didn't work well together. Which isn't an insult, for the record, but just me saying that all the frames you were running clearly didn't sync well. 

 

So that has nothing to do with these two mods specifically and is instead an isolated incident.

 

As for Vitality and Redirection; when I was a babby player I was using both of them because they looked like they were necessary. Now after 21 days of playing the game and using multiple frames, I can confidently say that it depends on the frame you're using and what mission you're doing. For example, why would you ever use Redirection at any level on Valkyr? By the same token, if you're a fully modded Blessing Trin, you don't need either of them. And by the same token if you're running a tank Frost, you don't need to bother with Vitality but you'd be daft not to use Redirection.

 

Vitality, Redirection and Steel Fibre all have their places, but that's the trick. They have their places and that means they are for specific frames or for specific mission types. They are not necessary on all and every frame for all and every mission and, in some cases, are actually downright bad choices to use.

Yes, maybe you're right, we were noobs, bad, lame amateurs. But the insane and idiotic oneshotting there was something I never saw in this game before, and I play since 2013 spring.

[Airyllish]

Yes, maybe you're right, we were noobs, bad, lame amateurs. But the insane and idiotic oneshotting there was something I never saw in this game before, and I play since 2013 spring.

 

You, sir, are taking what I said way out of context.

 

What I said was that if you all died within 15 minutes on a T4 exterminate, something went wrong with your squad set up. Which happens sometimes on PUG missions, so it isn't anybody's fault and it isn't an indication of anybody's level of skill. It just means that something, somewhere, went awry.

 

I never called anybody anything. I just said that whatever happened to you has nothing to do with the topic of vitality or redirection mods - none of which would have made any difference to your scenario of dying in 15 minutes on T4 - and that it was an isolated incident most likely.

 

Do you want fries with that amount of salt or what?

[(PSN)martin576]

You, sir, are taking what I said way out of context.

 

What I said was that if you all died within 15 minutes on a T4 exterminate, something went wrong with your squad set up. Which happens sometimes on PUG missions, so it isn't anybody's fault and it isn't an indication of anybody's level of skill. It just means that something, somewhere, went awry.

 

I never called anybody anything. I just said that whatever happened to you has nothing to do with the topic of vitality or redirection mods - none of which would have made any difference to your scenario of dying in 15 minutes on T4 - and that it was an isolated incident most likely.

 

Do you want fries with that amount of salt or what?

No,  no. We really were extremely bad. I wasn't sarcastic. But man, it was a sad masscare and it usually not happening at 15m in T4S. I bought a nicely modded PeaceMaker Mesa with Vitality, and I was going down 10 sec later as I was rezzed. Same for the others. This is why I ask advice how ppl play high level battles without Redirection and Vitality.

[Airyllish]

No,  no. We really were extremely bad. I wasn't sarcastic. But man, it was a sad masscare and it usually not happening at 15m in T4S. I bought a nicely modded PeaceMaker Mesa with Vitality, and I was going down 10 sec later as I was rezzed. Same for the others. This is why I ask advice how ppl play high level battles without Redirection and Vitality.

 

Ah.

 

I apologise then, I thought you were being sarcastic. 

 

I still don't think the answer is a simple one if only because, if you're running T4 survival with a group, what you can bring depends on who you're playing with and how confident you are in their ability to pick you up if you need it or otherwise help keep you going. Ran a few the other day with my clan and was happy to take along my unforma'd Saryn because she worked well in conjunction with the Valkyr, Rhino P and Frost P of my clanmates. Everything blew up deliciously quickly, and as a result I didn't need to bother taking Redirction. (But I took Vitality so that, in the rare event my shield did disappear, I had a health pool large enough to let me use Molt and get out of the sticky situation.) So, still, it all depends on who you play with and what you play as to whether or not you take a mod like Vitality or Redirection.