make it viable de a community consensus

[(PSN)Tpaetznick]

the power creep is real

this is a buff thread in response to that

feel free to say what you believe needs to be buffed some things that come to mind are

snipers

daggers

dual daggers

fu***** gorgons

glaives (just a smidge)

 

body count should be built in (3 seconds is absurd we need a change not a band aid)

melee in general excluding shadow debt mods

I'm not saying massive buffs just something to make sad weapons or classes endgame viAble whether it be adding weapons , stances or buffing a stat or 2

 

 

oh yeah I almost forgot the venka and tonfas the claw weapons need crit or something useful besides looking badass maybe venka prime

[TheLexiConArtist]

21 minutes ago, (PS4)Tpaetznick said:

the power creep is real

this is a buff thread in response to that

--

fu***** gorgons

--

As someone who put a Catalyst in his regular Gorgon before the Soma ruined all hopes of LMG parity forever (and then got primed into the bargain)...

Yes. Pls. Supra got a buff, Soma+Prime is still way out ahead, but the whole Gorgonfamily is left in the dust. That's criminal.

_{I know my potato in the original is still wasted because the Prisma-G and G-Wraith exist now, but such is life.. at least I'd get to upgrade to bigger brothers, not its Timmy, Power Gamer cousin.}

[hawttdawgg]

Remember the forgotten weapons that became overshadowed by new powercreeps

-RIP Ogris, killed by Tonkor

-RIP Supra, Gorgon family, Karak (wraith is still pretty viable), most other assault rifles, killed by Soma P

-RIP Skana, Cronus, Pangolin, Jaw Sword, Plasma Sword, etc, killed by Broken War

-RIP Fragor and Magistar, killed by War and Jat Kittag

-RIP snipers almost across the board, killed by Lex P

-RIP bows (Rakta Cernos is almost not a bow with its speed), killed by Dread with Argon Scope and Bladed Rounds

-RIP Kunai and Despair, killed by Spira, counting hikou in a slightly different category due to concealed explosive build

The list goes on, and im aware that some of the things I mentioned above are still perfectly viable in some situations, but in general they're beaten.

Most weapons above would be nice if they were brought up to speed a little, not all obviously. Early on weapons like the skana will forever be mediocre, but thats kinda their place. Also melee weapons depend on stances more than stats sometimes, due to stances having multipliers and some just feeling better than others based on personal taste.

[Herosupport]

Every weapon DE nerfed because "it was overpowered" should be returned to its former glory seeing has just about every time DE releases a new weapon new post on the forum come up crying for nerfs some of the reasons for the nerfs are no longer valid such has the Brakk all 3 changes can be reveres'd the distribution of its damage among the 3 types the spread and the damage falloff. its a pointless cycle for the nerfing to continue because we all should know by now in 2 or 4 weeks there is going to be another great weapon that's going to to come along and by making a bunch of weapons good again the new weapons will get there Fad time and if some of the players find it to their liking then they will keep using it even after the new fad arives.

the nerfs back in the day were called for for the time but now the options to pick from are Significantly better. By continuously nefing new weapons players time is waisted and on top of that some of the Nerfs done have been atrocious such has the ones done to the Acrid, Synoid Gammacor and Others I'm not aware of.

[KnightCole]

Id love if they buffed up the LMG class of weapons.

Supra: 100% more base velocity, 18 base accuracy, Higher base RoF

Gorgons: 16/18/20 accuracy, 120/150/200 Mag cap, 720/840/1080 ammo cap

Small QoL buffs that would make them all alot more useful.  Supra is so aggravating to use due to it's insane spread, high recoil, and strange burst fire mechanic.  It starts off firing like a musket's RoF, then it moves to bolt action RoF, then it suddenly takes off an becomes a minigun....

 

Gorgons are so inaccurate they spend more time recoiling and missing then they do hitting anything.  Not terrible weapons if they had an accuracy and ammo buff, but right now, just annoying to use.  I always end up using my Soma P over anything else.  Buff the other LMGs, dont nerf the Soma.

[(PSN)Crimson_Judgment]

Now just saying Before they buff the Gorgon... just think for a moment about the Heavy gunners

Think of what happened to Corpus Techs and Scorches upon their Respective weapon buffs now just think about the Heavy gunners

Regardless i do hope they get buffed but i can't help but wonder what will the Heavy gunners turn into

[TheLexiConArtist]

7 hours ago, (PS4)Crimson_Judgment said:

Now just saying Before they buff the Gorgon... just think for a moment about the Heavy gunners

Think of what happened to Corpus Techs and Scorches upon their Respective weapon buffs now just think about the Heavy gunners

Regardless i do hope they get buffed but i can't help but wonder what will the Heavy gunners turn into

There's no real reason for the enemies to get buffed 'accidentally' with the weapon buffs. It's a conscious decision on DE's part.

 

They already have freely customisable properties.

A regular Viper fires naturally faster than the Shield Lancer's does. Levels give enemies increases in damage. Bombards aren't susceptible to their own blast radius (and have homing rockets, which our Ogris doesn't). Enemies use RNG to decide when they have to reload, rather than actual clips.

Enemy weapons only share properties of our weapons. They are not the same. Nightwatch Grineer Lancers used "enhanced weapons like the Karak Wraith", but really it's only a change to the model to justify stat tweaks that made the enemies stronger.

 

You can still find some old relics of the past using outdated mechanics and weapons on certain tiles. Corpus Crewmen with impervious helmets portaling into Grineer 'dormitories'/barracks tiles in invasions, bootleg Grineer Troopers using their old weapon/stats showing up on some Spy vaults if triggered. No reason the enemies can't stay as they are independantly of our guns being altered.

[tnccs215]

On ‎25‎/‎02‎/‎2016 at 2:35 AM, Herosupport said:

Every weapon DE nerfed because "it was overpowered" should be returned to its former glory seeing has just about every time DE releases a new weapon new post on the forum come up crying for nerfs some of the reasons for the nerfs are no longer valid such has the Brakk all 3 changes can be reveres'd the distribution of its damage among the 3 types the spread and the damage falloff. its a pointless cycle for the nerfing to continue because we all should know by now in 2 or 4 weeks there is going to be another great weapon that's going to to come along and by making a bunch of weapons good again the new weapons will get there Fad time and if some of the players find it to their liking then they will keep using it even after the new fad arives.

the nerfs back in the day were called for for the time but now the options to pick from are Significantly better. By continuously nefing new weapons players time is waisted and on top of that some of the Nerfs done have been atrocious such has the ones done to the Acrid, Synoid Gammacor and Others I'm not aware of.

are you copy pasting yourself? Its the third time I read those exact same words on different threads.

[phoenix1992]

Now are couple of things they think while doing an rebalance :

Is the weapon obtainable  : Dakra prime, Skana Prime and Skana prisma (arguable) will not reiceive an buff soon because of this. 
Is the weapon easy to obtain : This is why 2/4 of the Stalker armory is weak. 
Is the weapon gated : The rise of Tonkor and Sonicor, are due to this - they are not gated - not clan tech, not drop able and do not require nitain/telerium/shaneningans.
Is the weapon easy to aquire, use and are people interested in it : Again Tonkor is here. Redeemer too. Sure we may love "high tier" gear, but majority of the player base in any given time will not use special guns. They don't need/want/have the power, to get them

[RealPandemonium]

Nerf the powercreeps, keep the old weapons IMO.  The game is too easy as-is; we don't need to keep making it easier and easier across the board.  

Edited February 27, 2016 by RealPandemonium

[KnightCole]

13 hours ago, RealPandemonium said:

Nerf the powercreeps, keep the old weapons IMO.  The game is too easy as-is; we don't need to keep making it easier and easier across the board.  

Easy?  Or is it just follow the meta or else?  Seems that in high tier stuff like T2-3 sorties, if you dont bring w/e magical frame and 1 click entire rooms, you do nothing but get raped.  I did some Corpus sortie and 1 moa 3x damage grey box took my entire Supra mag.....that is just beyond stupid honestly.  Even headshotting the crewmen took entire mags of my Supra....

Then the mobs were just running around S#&$ting those pulsing circles of death all over the place, 1 shotting everything....

 

Yeah, that is not "easy' or fun or even 'difficult', that is just stupid S#&$....

 

I remember once when DE had an alert where the Grineer were fairly tough, but not overly so, they were black colored grineer with some bad &#!, tough melee guys running with them...I dont recall the alert or their names, but that is about how I envision this game being.  Where the mobs are tough and do decent damage, but not overly so like higher lvl stuff is now.  Even running a Rhino with 185% power str Iron skin doesnt last 2 1/2 seconds, and a single mob takes 216+ rounds.

[Sonicbullitt]

On 24/02/2016 at 10:44 PM, (PS4)Tpaetznick said:

the power creep is real

this is a buff thread in response to that

feel free to say what you believe needs to be buffed some things that come to mind are

snipers

daggers

dual daggers

fu***** gorgons

glaives (just a smidge)

 

body count should be built in (3 seconds is absurd we need a change not a band aid)

melee in general excluding shadow debt mods

I'm not saying massive buffs just something to make sad weapons or classes endgame viAble whether it be adding weapons , stances or buffing a stat or 2

 

 

oh yeah I almost forgot the venka and tonfas the claw weapons need crit or something useful besides looking badass maybe venka prime

since I already ,have quite a popular thread about the braton prime I might as well leave a link to my post, as I think that weapon definitely needs its ammo pool buffed. I feel DE needs a dedicated pve balance team for weapons just like pvp has, as scott is but one man and has other higher priority projects right now. I think we also need a playtest server for pre release items to stop too big power creep before said item releases. Power creep is fine if it is incremental but not if is in huge bursts like DE's way of implementing stuff. Link to the thread  down below btw.

 

Edited February 27, 2016 by Sonicbullitt

[RealPandemonium]

1 hour ago, KnightCole said:

Easy?  Or is it just follow the meta or else?  Seems that in high tier stuff like T2-3 sorties, if you dont bring w/e magical frame and 1 click entire rooms, you do nothing but get raped.  I did some Corpus sortie and 1 moa 3x damage grey box took my entire Supra mag.....that is just beyond stupid honestly.  Even headshotting the crewmen took entire mags of my Supra....

Then the mobs were just running around S#&$ting those pulsing circles of death all over the place, 1 shotting everything....

 

Yeah, that is not "easy' or fun or even 'difficult', that is just stupid S#&$....

 

I remember once when DE had an alert where the Grineer were fairly tough, but not overly so, they were black colored grineer with some bad &#!, tough melee guys running with them...I dont recall the alert or their names, but that is about how I envision this game being.  Where the mobs are tough and do decent damage, but not overly so like higher lvl stuff is now.  Even running a Rhino with 185% power str Iron skin doesnt last 2 1/2 seconds, and a single mob takes 216+ rounds.

Half of that is Sorties being overtuned, and the other half is likely you using the wrong mods against Corpus.  Sorties are overtuned, though.  Sorties and raids are mostly "cheese or die."  That doesn't mean that we should elevate everything to the level of cheese, though.  DE should fix enemy scaling and re-tune Sorties and raids to a more reasonable level.

Btw, Rhino/Mirage and Ash can get you through any sortie regardless of weapons, no sweat.  Your choice of weapon is almost irrelevant in Sorties.  

[KnightCole]

47 minutes ago, RealPandemonium said:

Half of that is Sorties being overtuned, and the other half is likely you using the wrong mods against Corpus.  Sorties are overtuned, though.  Sorties and raids are mostly "cheese or die."  That doesn't mean that we should elevate everything to the level of cheese, though.  DE should fix enemy scaling and re-tune Sorties and raids to a more reasonable level.

Btw, Rhino/Mirage and Ash can get you through any sortie regardless of weapons, no sweat.  Your choice of weapon is almost irrelevant in Sorties.  

Yeah, granted, I was using a Supra, which is a high pen gun vs Corpus, I also didnt use my newly acquired -shield amount aura....but still.....all that aside, it really shouldnt be that insane.  If you bring all the right cheese, you should kill something, even a high tier mob in like maybe 20 shots.  If you bring the wrong stuff, 40-50.  Not 200-500....

 

This game's scaling is fubar higher up, it honestly makes it no fun past like Ceres and Neptune.  Its no fun past about 20 minutes in most missions that use rounds/timers. 

I actually dont like how the game is basically 1 shot them, or 1 shot you...DE needs to make it a good back and forth at all levels.  I honestly thought the game scaled the power of the mobs based on the avg power of you and your group.  If they did that right it would be fun....but right now...its pretty much 1 shot for them or 1 shot for you.  At best, some mobs take 4 shots from my Soma Prime.

 

 

EDIT: Also, some thing I dont understand in this game.  You get my Supra, it has like 1000+ damage a shot, between Fire, puncture, impact and slashing damage.  My Tiberon has like 1000+ dmg a shot, my Soma does like 300......yet I take my Supra into combat, it takes like 8-10 rounds to kill a single Grineer in Draco, I take my Tiberon, it takes like a single burst, then my Soma, it takes like 4 shots....

 

The TTK and BTK across different mobs seems low for some weapons, while it seems abnormally high for others.  I have my Sobek modded with some nutzo high amount of damage, over 5000, yet it sometimes 1 shots, sometimes it doesnt...

 

I know of the + - different damage types vs targets, but still....doesnt seem like it would change damage that greatly.

Edited February 27, 2016 by KnightCole

[RealPandemonium]

 

1 hour ago, KnightCole said:

Yeah, granted, I was using a Supra, which is a high pen gun vs Corpus, I also didnt use my newly acquired -shield amount aura....but still.....all that aside, it really shouldnt be that insane.  If you bring all the right cheese, you should kill something, even a high tier mob in like maybe 20 shots.  If you bring the wrong stuff, 40-50.  Not 200-500....

 

This game's scaling is fubar higher up, it honestly makes it no fun past like Ceres and Neptune.  Its no fun past about 20 minutes in most missions that use rounds/timers. 

I actually dont like how the game is basically 1 shot them, or 1 shot you...DE needs to make it a good back and forth at all levels.  I honestly thought the game scaled the power of the mobs based on the avg power of you and your group.  If they did that right it would be fun....but right now...its pretty much 1 shot for them or 1 shot for you.  At best, some mobs take 4 shots from my Soma Prime.

 

 

EDIT: Also, some thing I dont understand in this game.  You get my Supra, it has like 1000+ damage a shot, between Fire, puncture, impact and slashing damage.  My Tiberon has like 1000+ dmg a shot, my Soma does like 300......yet I take my Supra into combat, it takes like 8-10 rounds to kill a single Grineer in Draco, I take my Tiberon, it takes like a single burst, then my Soma, it takes like 4 shots....

 

The TTK and BTK across different mobs seems low for some weapons, while it seems abnormally high for others.  I have my Sobek modded with some nutzo high amount of damage, over 5000, yet it sometimes 1 shots, sometimes it doesnt...

 

I know of the + - different damage types vs targets, but still....doesnt seem like it would change damage that greatly.

Soma has criticals while the others don't, so its performance will be greater than its damage numbers indicate.  Also check out the Damage 2.0 page.  So much of the feedback on these forums is essentially noise because people don't understand the damage system.  They use extremely inefficient loadouts and then claim the weapon/frame is bad when in reality it is more than up to the task.  Not pointed at you, specifically, but this is a problem with the forum at large.  

[KnightCole]

4 hours ago, RealPandemonium said:

 

Soma has criticals while the others don't, so its performance will be greater than its damage numbers indicate.  Also check out the Damage 2.0 page.  So much of the feedback on these forums is essentially noise because people don't understand the damage system.  They use extremely inefficient loadouts and then claim the weapon/frame is bad when in reality it is more than up to the task.  Not pointed at you, specifically, but this is a problem with the forum at large.  

I pretty much run HEAT on all my guns, since it doesnt have that many negatives, so it pretty much gives me a nice damage boost.  I also do not mod for certain damage types, outside of sometimes putting gas on my guns for infested, I sometimes mod for radiation on grineer, but as a whole, I run all damage mods and HEAT>

[RealPandemonium]

5 hours ago, KnightCole said:

I pretty much run HEAT on all my guns, since it doesnt have that many negatives, so it pretty much gives me a nice damage boost.  I also do not mod for certain damage types, outside of sometimes putting gas on my guns for infested, I sometimes mod for radiation on grineer, but as a whole, I run all damage mods and HEAT>

Heat is alright overall (especially on Ember with Accelerant.)  However, once Grineer go over level 30 you'l want to bring a Radiation gun for Alloy and a Corrosive gun for Ferrite.  This is because those elements not only deal 75% bonus damage vs their respective armor types, but also ignore 75% of those kinds of armor, meaning that they do much more damage than other damage types.  This is also why Viral damage is mostly ineffective (aside from its procs) on high level Grineer, since even though it gets a 75% bonus, it doesn't ignore any armor so that 75% bonus doesn't mean much.