Why did Valkyr get nerfed?

[Vyra]

Valkyr was almost destroyed... the energy drain is WAY to strong...especially if you think about nullifiers and leeches....

[DxAdder]

Well Mesa and Sayrn were nerfed already and they were making no progress on Ash so the came to the boards in mass telling everyone how Valkyr ruined there lives.. Pretty much the usual Propaganda that gets used everytime they want a nerf,

 

 

[Vyra]

Well valkyr was so hard nerfed that many people ask me if i am a noob or why i use valkyr ... then they leave my team...
i on the other hand still manage to get scores and tasks done with her in sorties etc...because i dont want to just give up... there is no other cat frame...


i demand my Valkyr being Un-nerfed...
nerfing a cat is just cruel...

[(PSN)Mazda_07_]

I'm OK with the changes 

[Dreddeth]

Everyone's talking about the energy drain, so I can only assume you all lack any Fleeting Expertise, or you just have a problem letting go of Blind Rage.

[Heckzu]

2 minutes ago, Vyra said:

Valkyr was almost destroyed... the energy drain is WAY to strong...especially if you think about nullifiers and leeches....

How was Valkyr almost destroyed? Why does the energy drain on a crutch skill matter when she has another absurdly strong ability: Warcry? With Eternal War, it doesn't matter if there an energy leech, once you've activated warcry, it's essentially up forever until you run into a nullifier. Not to mention it gives a huge armor buff on top of her already highest base armor in the game and slows enemies so their likelihood of killing you is even further reduced.

Seriously, the hysteria nerf was much needed and she's still perfectly viable. If you think Valkyr was solely a hysteria bot, then I honestly can't see you as anything other than a trash player who needs an overpowered crutch to be able to do anything.

[ograzzt]

1 hour ago, Venom-Snake said:

Then dont get hit or kill them first.

Ancients are quiet noticeable and priority targets anyways.

There are other enemies covered in their auras around, you know. One - two hits are enough for draining all your energy if enemies have high enough level. And don't tell me you can avoid all the hits from all the enemies with disruptor's aura. It's just suicide to use hysteria against high level infested now. Unless you using naramon focus of course.

[Vyra]

2 minutes ago, Dreddeth said:

Everyone's talking about the energy drain, so I can only assume you all lack any Fleeting Expertise, or you just have a problem letting go of Blind Rage.

Well Hysteria is affected by power duration... if you apply fleeting expertise you will get MORE drain...

Hysteria consumes 2.5 energy per second and the cost will increase over time, up to 15 energy per second, while active. It will remain active until either Valkyr's energy is depleted, or the ability is deactivated by casting it again (default 4).

Activation energy cost is affected by Power Efficiency, and the energy drain is affected by Power Efficiency and Power Duration.

So why would i put a minus on duration?

[Vyra]

7 minutes ago, Heckzu said:

How was Valkyr almost destroyed? Why does the energy drain on a crutch skill matter when she has another absurdly strong ability: Warcry? With Eternal War, it doesn't matter if there an energy leech, once you've activated warcry, it's essentially up forever until you run into a nullifier. Not to mention it gives a huge armor buff on top of her already highest base armor in the game and slows enemies so their likelihood of killing you is even further reduced.

Seriously, the hysteria nerf was much needed and she's still perfectly viable. If you think Valkyr was solely a hysteria bot, then I honestly can't see you as anything other than a trash player who needs an overpowered crutch to be able to do anything.

play valkyr on lvl 120+ Corpus/void maps .. then tell me all of your statements again...

Also.. armor in this game is useless against grineer... i go wit maxed armor to even a lvl 50-80 grineer map and can literally get 1 shot...

not even speaking if those motherfkn OP Scorches...

Edited July 27, 2016 by Vyra

[Heckzu]

3 minutes ago, Vyra said:

Well Hysteria is affected by power duration... if you apply fleeting expertise you will get MORE drain...

Hysteria consumes 2.5 energy per second and the cost will increase over time, up to 15 energy per second, while active. It will remain active until either Valkyr's energy is depleted, or the ability is deactivated by casting it again (default 4).

Activation energy cost is affected by Power Efficiency, and the energy drain is affected by Power Efficiency and Power Duration.

So why would i put a minus on duration?

If your duration is at 100% (the default amount), any additional power efficiency has a greater affect than adding duration. If you use fleeting expertise in a build and get 175% efficiency with 100% duration, you'll burn less energy than, say, 130% efficiency and 150% duration.

[Dreddeth]

10 minutes ago, Vyra said:

Well Hysteria is affected by power duration... if you apply fleeting expertise you will get MORE drain...

Hysteria consumes 2.5 energy per second and the cost will increase over time, up to 15 energy per second, while active. It will remain active until either Valkyr's energy is depleted, or the ability is deactivated by casting it again (default 4).

Activation energy cost is affected by Power Efficiency, and the energy drain is affected by Power Efficiency and Power Duration.

So why would i put a minus on duration?

Primed Continuity overcompensates for Fleeting Expertise to the point that it's still cheaper. at 175% efficiency and 80% duration (More than that if you, unlike me, have the resources to actually max your P. Continuity), you're looking at a maximum cost of about 3.25 energy per second tick, and a pretty much unchanged number of ticks per second.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Dreddeth
replaced "second" with "tick"

[Vyra]

Just now, Dreddeth said:

Primed Continuity overcompensates for Fleeting Expertise to the point that it's still cheaper. at 175% efficiency and 80% duration (More than that if you, unlike me, have the resources to actually max your P. Continuity), you're looking at a maximum cost of about 3.25 energy per second and a pretty much unchanged number of ticks per second.

because everyone has nothing else to do and plays every single day in the year just to wait for primed mods to arrive at that shop...

or has luck....

Look you guys can say what you want but compared to NOVA or ASH or LOKI Valkyr was destroyed... why?
Because you can play Nova without having this and that prime and STILL be the bOSS of the map...
while to play Valkyr "how she was" you need every single secret/uberRARE item of the game ) ...

You can run in stealth with loki for ever...

you can infintely cast that banshee ability that can go on the entire map....

you can use ash and kill the entire map without getting hit...
you can infinitely have ironskin on with no problems...

now tell me again why was valkyr nerfed SO HARD ?

 

[Kaotyke]

20 minutes ago, ograzzt said:

There are other enemies covered in their auras around, you know. One - two hits are enough for draining all your energy if enemies have high enough level. And don't tell me you can avoid all the hits from all the enemies with disruptor's aura. It's just suicide to use hysteria against high level infested now. Unless you using naramon focus of course.

Yes I can, because I against infested... no, any enemy, I dont stand in one place for long.

Its called:

 

[Knight_Ex]

6 hours ago, BlazerEraser said:

eeeh...Inaros is just as easy for me to use...but w/e.

@LegionCynex

I didn't say "Nerf Inaros now, he's broken" now did i? I was just curious since he's just as OP as Valkyr was :3.

Huuuuge difference between pressing 4 to become invunerable to all damage while dealing tons of your own damage with Valk, in comparison to holding 4 to stack armor & watch your health/energy & cast 1 on an enemy to refill your health back up with Inaros, you always have to be mobile and you can't stand there like an idiot with him and take repeated hits, and as the levels go up eventually your health starts taking serious damage, don't believe me? Go to the simulator room and spawn 3 corrupted gunners at level 120 and let them fire on you for more than 3 seconds, then do the same with Valk, results speak for themselves.  Don't get me wrong, inaros is amazing when you pump the time and mods into him, however Valk was godlike without any forma and relying on her 4.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Knight_Ex

[Vol4ica_]

7 hours ago, BlazerEraser said:

 

Edit: I got my answers at least, can a Moderator close this please? Thank you.

 

You want people to stop making post in this thread because you got an answer. For this you call moderator...
If you were a bit more attentive you would have started your thread here https://forums.warframe.com/forum/38-players-helping-players/

In this case anybody who got the same questions as yours would use search and find this thread. And then he wouldn't need to scroll through pages to find the answer you got - in that forum section you can choose the best answer.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Vol4ica_

[Rioma]

meanwhile Wukong has true god mode and can still use any weapon of choice

[Grumpy]

Don't spend too much time learning your class and putting time and Forma's into it, just enjoy the game for what it is.  Someone will cry OP, and the nerf bat will swing.  It's just the way it is.......

And I've seen plenty of Valks die on missions, she wasn't OP, but our community of experts felt she was...

[.Dracula.]

2 minutes ago, Grumpy said:

Don't spend too much time learning your class and putting time and Forma's into it, just enjoy the game for what it is.  Someone will cry OP, and the nerf bat will swing.  It's just the way it is.......

And I've seen plenty of Valks die on missions, she wasn't OP, but our community of experts felt she was...

Sure thing. Smh

[maxedpotato]

39 minutes ago, Heckzu said:

How was Valkyr almost destroyed? Why does the energy drain on a crutch skill matter when she has another absurdly strong ability: Warcry? With Eternal War, it doesn't matter if there an energy leech, once you've activated warcry, it's essentially up forever until you run into a nullifier. Not to mention it gives a huge armor buff on top of her already highest base armor in the game and slows enemies so their likelihood of killing you is even further reduced.

Seriously, the hysteria nerf was much needed and she's still perfectly viable. If you think Valkyr was solely a hysteria bot, then I honestly can't see you as anything other than a trash player who needs an overpowered crutch to be able to do anything.

 the problem is that all of her other abilities are kinda S#&$.
i can see why they'd nerf hysteria but 2 of valk's abilities are terrible lol.
her 3 tickles the enemy for 2 seconds and her 1 is just a travelling gimmick that wont be all that usefull at all.
that leaves us with a speed/armour buff and..well..that's it lol. valkyr is a discount excalibur at this point.
not saying she's useless, but lackluster rather.

[Heckzu]

39 minutes ago, Vyra said:

because everyone has nothing else to do and plays every single day in the year just to wait for primed mods to arrive at that shop...

or has luck....

Look you guys can say what you want but compared to NOVA or ASH or LOKI Valkyr was destroyed... why?
Because you can play Nova without having this and that prime and STILL be the bOSS of the map...
while to play Valkyr "how she was" you need every single secret/uberRARE item of the game ) ...

You can run in stealth with loki for ever...

you can infintely cast that banshee ability that can go on the entire map....

you can use ash and kill the entire map without getting hit...
you can infinitely have ironskin on with no problems...

now tell me again why was valkyr nerfed SO HARD ?

 

You can use Narrow minded since it gives more duration than primed continuity and you probably don't use her 1st and 3rd ability often so there's not much lost from the negative range.

 

Loki dies to anything, and I mean ANYTHING, in one hit by around level 80 because he's the squishiest frame. His invisibility cannot be recast so he has to constantly exit invisibility, which makes him extremely vulnerable since he can get 1 shotted in the timespan that he's visible, on top of being able of dying to stay bullets and rockets while invisible. The current Valkyr can't keep hysteria up forever and it needs to be deactivated and reactivated to make manageable, but isn't that the same as Loki in a sense, except Valkyr won't die from a single bullet?

 

Why compare Nova? She has no crutch survivability skill like Valkyr.

 

Banshee is immobile and can't so anything during quake, and can't receive energy from EV, so your argument is invalid regarding being able to infinitely cast it. And with Resonating Quake, it's energy cost makes Hysteria look like a 1st ability in comparison.

 

Ash's bladestorm is broken and getting reworked eventually, so there's no point bringing him up because you ask why they didn't nerf him when he is getting one.

 

And Iron Skin isn't recastable, and you forget that it acts as an HP increase buff, but Rhino only has 190 base armor so even with iron skin, Valkyr has more effective HP.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Heckzu
Bad autocorrect

[Dreddeth]

35 minutes ago, Vyra said:

because everyone has nothing else to do and plays every single day in the year just to wait for primed mods to arrive at that shop...

or has luck....

Look you guys can say what you want but compared to NOVA or ASH or LOKI Valkyr was destroyed... why?
Because you can play Nova without having this and that prime and STILL be the bOSS of the map...
while to play Valkyr "how she was" you need every single secret/uberRARE item of the game ) ...

You can run in stealth with loki for ever...

you can infintely cast that banshee ability that can go on the entire map....

you can use ash and kill the entire map without getting hit...
you can infinitely have ironskin on with no problems...

now tell me again why was valkyr nerfed SO HARD ?

 

Virtually unconditional invulnerability is obnoxious and a mark of poor design.

To address your other point, no warframe is going to be all it can be without Primed mods, so the argument here is moot. More so because Constitution is, or at least was, fairly common. If you only have normal Continuity in spite of how often Baro brings the Primed version, you can swap out your fairly useless Power Strength mods with Constitution, and the sum will actually be greater than if you'd just used Primed Continuity alone.

The sheer hyperbole of your comparisons to other warframes is so utterly ridiculous that it demands dismissal. Do you really think the people being "bOSS of the map" didn't spend hours tweaking their builds, and days, or even weeks, of cumulative hours just farming and leveling the requisite mods? Baro brought either Primed Flow or Primed Continuity (I forget which) twice around before I could find a single Rage mod, and that's not counting the time before I started looking.

In conclusion, firstly, every build has its fair share of grinding involved, secondly, the acquisition rate for the mods you need at any given time is atrocious no matter which way you slice it, and thirdly, every optimized, maximized, or min-maxed build ever requires not only Primed Mods, but also Corrupt Mods, and you can hardly be expected to be taken seriously when you evidently expect a Hysteria build to work just fine and dandy with sub-par mods.

10 minutes ago, xXRiomaXx said:

meanwhile Wukong has true god mode and can still use any weapon of choice

Defy is a conditional auto-revive with diminishing returns built into the ability, not "true god mode." Even with Rage, high-level attrition kills him quickly enough, whereas Valkyr is guaranteed unkillable for however long you can keep Hysteria up. Even accounting for anti-power units like Disruptors or Nullifiers, she's still in a better place, because Hysteria's innate life-strike heals her to full in a couple of swings, and Wukong is still taking damage while Defy is active, so Valkyr is much, much less likely to die suddenly if her buff is forced off compared to Wukong.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Dreddeth

[Vyra]

11 minutes ago, Heckzu said:

Why compare Nova?

Because at some point i can surive longer with nova than valkyr .. which is pretty sad fact for valkyr...

also i am not saying to nerf any frame... i just say that other frames are living longer than valkyr... 

valkyr has to be strong...i don't get why they nerf her...
valkyr is more or less a melee frame... so hysteria should be used for long time .. or else you can do nohthing but dodge and die all the time...


what i don't understand is why they nerf a frame only because anti-valkyr people hated on her?

by that logic we would need to destroy anything on earth just because some people want to see the world in flames...

Edited July 27, 2016 by Vyra

[(PSN)Deception_Pharo]

7 hours ago, venon23 said:

sorry mate but inaros is not unkillable evry warframe reach a point that is insta kill except too the way valkyr was

Technically he is kill able in higher levels.

[zombielore]

16 minutes ago, Vyra said:

Because at some point i can surive longer with nova than valkyr .. which is pretty sad fact for valkyr...

I'm sorry, what in the world are you talking about?

I don't think the problem is Valkyr. Her only noticable change was an increase in energy drain to an acceptable level and if that ruined the frame for you then there's no more point for this thread. Seriously pre nerf Valkyr was 0.75 e/s and you get one of if not the highest DPS weapons in the game along with invunerability, that sound fair to you? If so don't even bother responding.

Ha survive longer with Nova then Valkyr, I wonder if people on the forum play the same game as me.

[Heckzu]

24 minutes ago, Vyra said:

valkyr has to be strong...i don't get why they nerf her...
valkyr is more or less a melee frame... so hysteria should be used for long time .. or else you can do nohthing but dodge and die all the time...

She's already plenty strong, what are you taking about? You can effectively keep hysteria up forever, even now, you just need to know how to play in order to do so instead of being a mindless 'hit 4 and E spam for 2 hours straight' frame.

Her old hysteria was unhealthy for the game which is why it was nerfed. Other frames have had this happen, i.e. Trinity's Blessing. All other invincibilities are worse than hysteria: wukong isn't actually tanky and has diminishing returns, iron skin's invincibility only lasts for 4 seconds iirc and can't be recast, and Atlas's first ability doesn't prevent shield damage and is incredibly brief, lasting for only 1 second, if not less, and requires you to be up in someone's face to use so its invincibility has too many gaps in between.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Heckzu
Autocorrect, stahhhpppp