Volt discharge buff?

[(XBOX)Bing me first]

Hey I'm new please don't kill me just saying his 4 doesn't do as much damage as it should either that or I have bad mods. But it does do some good cc so that's a plus.

Edited August 2, 2016 by Letter13
Removed profanity

[NinjaZeku]

If I understood the wiki

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Volt/Abilities

correctly, then without any Mods, you get (after 4 seconds)
450 damage per second over 8 seconds, i.e. 3600 damage
(or up to 4000 if there are other enemies in zapping range).

That is not a small number. That is a big number!

[(XBOX)Bing me first]

O OK thanks I guess it mostly feels like that in the void

[SylvenStar]

13 hours ago, NinjaZeku said:

If I understood the wiki

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Volt/Abilities

correctly, then without any Mods, you get (after 4 seconds)
450 damage per second over 8 seconds, i.e. 3600 damage
(or up to 4000 if there are other enemies in zapping range).

That is not a small number. That is a big number!

Depends on what level enemies you're taking on and what faction. At  what I consider "Beginner" and "Low" levels (1-15 and 15-20 respectively) Yes, 4,000 damage is a large number. However, at higher levels, there's something to consider here: That 4,000 damage is a limit on what can be done. Not because it's a flat number, but because all affected enemies share that number. Sure, it sounds nice to take this to corpus because of the damage multiplier electric damage has against shields and robotics, but when more than a small handful of enemies are present, suddenly that CC that should last for 12 seconds barely lasts for 3, if that. Why? It's not because the enemies are each taking so much damage. It's because there are so many enemies adding 225 to the total damage each half second. So assuming you are fighting corpus using only base stats, you activate discharge and hit 10 enemies at once, because why else would you activate Volt's ultimate ability? All ten of those enemies add 225 damage to the damage limit. The total of that is 2250, which is more than halfway to the limit. After the next half second, another 2250 will get added, hitting 4500, which is over the health cap. I do not know whether the ability distrubutes the actual remaining 1750 damage between all of the affected enemies or if some enemies simply don't take that tick of damage and one of them takes partial damage, I haven't been lucky enough to tell which, or if something else is happening, and this doesn't even account for the other chunks of damage that the "tesla coiled" enemies do to each other. But either way, that means that when you hit Discharge, after four seconds when the stun actually starts, the stun and damage only lasts for a second (if that) and each enemy takes no more than 450 damage each. Only when significant damage reduction is applied (high level grineer armor) or when only a tiny handful of enemies are affected do you see the ability stun enemies for anything close to the full 12 second duration. 
Ultimate disappointment if you ask me. I was under the impression that the health cap was supposed to be an enemy-by-enemy basis, but I have yet to see any evidence for that aside from the sheer disappointment I feel whenever I hit 4 as the Volt.

[Zachatoo]

Discharge (imo) isn't meant to be a damage ability, rather it's use is primarily for CC, which it's pretty decent at against Grineer due to armor mitigating some of the damage to allow the CC to last longer. The damage cap on Discharge is..interesting, and difficult to mod for. I just mod for everything else and Discharge still seems to work out all right for me.

[Navhkrin]

They should really remove damage cap on this ability, let it deal as much as it can, it still wont deal half the damage excals ulti deals with single wave. (This is not an actual fact, so dont quote me)

My point is, even without damage cap ability doesnt deal big damage to be anywhere near being OP. And without damage cap we could really see some interesting builds.

[(XBOX)Bing me first]

Thank you all for your wonderful inputs they all made good points and not calling me stupid :)

[Ohmlink]

Discharge deals ok damage out to 50 or so then it really falls off and CC becomes the whole reason to use it. Be aware that tightly packed unarmored enemies will likely not be held very long by the skill, they will either die because they are low level or if they are high level and they kill you.

[CobaltC3D]

4 hours ago, Navhkrin said:

They should really remove damage cap on this ability, let it deal as much as it can, it still wont deal half the damage excals ulti deals with single wave. (This is not an actual fact, so dont quote me)

My point is, even without damage cap ability doesnt deal big damage to be anywhere near being OP. And without damage cap we could really see some interesting builds.

Highly agree with removing the damage Cap, it would fix just about everyone's complaint with it as far as damage dealing and CC.

[SylvenStar]

13 hours ago, rydercd said:

Highly agree with removing the damage Cap, it would fix just about everyone's complaint with it as far as damage dealing and CC.

We can dream, friend. But I find it hard to believe that DE will remove the cap when the overwhelming complaints about Discharge are somehow drowned out by the complaints of Riot Shield, which, for some reason, got a ragdoll mechanic as an answer to "holy crap this sucks up so much energy, I can't even use the damn thing!"

Discharge, I fear, will never get a fix that it needs until Volt's next rework.

[RealPandemonium]

You have S#&$ty mods (:p) or are are trying to kill Alloy Grineer.

Re: the damage cap; every power has a damage cap; Discharge's is just presented a little differently.  4000 is the best radial nuke damage you can get right now, outside of fully status-boosted Miasma (4200 or 8400 if you consider the Viral proc.)

[SylvenStar]

51 minutes ago, RealPandemonium said:

You have S#&$ty mods (:p) or are are trying to kill Alloy Grineer.

Re: the damage cap; every power has a damage cap; Discharge's is just presented a little differently.  4000 is the best radial nuke damage you can get right now, outside of fully status-boosted Miasma (4200 or 8400 if you consider the Viral proc.)

You're not grasping how Discharge works. Miasma applies that 4200 damage to every enemy. Discharge's 4000 damage is divided between the affected enemies. Whether that's intended or not is debatable, but that's how it works.

[RealPandemonium]

5 hours ago, SylvenStar said:

You're not grasping how Discharge works. Miasma applies that 4200 damage to every enemy. Discharge's 4000 damage is divided between the affected enemies. Whether that's intended or not is debatable, but that's how it works.

It's not, though.  The cap is per coil, not per all enemies. Go to the simulacrum and see how many Discharges are needed to kill varying numbers of the same enemy.  

[Letter13]

Moved to Players Helping Players subforum.

[13QZXXTTX]

Your best bet is going for range, and efficiency, though I rather go for duration build for speed run.

Yes as long you have Super Duper Trinity Booster along, you can spam 4 to crowd control.

Yes, DE didn't fix the summary on Volt's description. Rather the description apply when you start off, think Volt as a starting frame. 

[SylvenStar]

9 hours ago, RealPandemonium said:

It's not, though.  The cap is per coil, not per all enemies. Go to the simulacrum and see how many Discharges are needed to kill varying numbers of the same enemy.  

If that were true, then Discharge wouldn't have zero duration when used against large numbers of high level corpus, such as in sortie missions, or high level mobile defense. 

Perhaps this was a recent stealth fix that I haven't gotten around to checking out, so maybe you are right. I will need to check when I get the chance, hopefully soon this morning. But at the very least, when the rework was first done, it wasn't a by-enemy basis.

[ragingdeamon]

32 minutes ago, SylvenStar said:

If that were true, then Discharge wouldn't have zero duration when used against large numbers of high level corpus, such as in sortie missions, or high level mobile defense. 

Perhaps this was a recent stealth fix that I haven't gotten around to checking out, so maybe you are right. I will need to check when I get the chance, hopefully soon this morning. But at the very least, when the rework was first done, it wasn't a by-enemy basis.

no, the damage cap is per enemy, but in high level missions the mob spawns are very dense, which means more enemies clustered, which means that the coils damage other coils. the damage cap refers to all damage, not just damage from being a coil. 

seems like an oversight to me, but at this point I would settle for keeping the CC on when you reach the damage cap, just don't do damage anymore. 

[(PSN)ghinellil]

I stopped the stalker with it. But in end a tried to finish him in close range. Bad decision!

Anyway Volt is a great frame with amazing abilities. 

[SylvenStar]

1 hour ago, ragingdeamon said:

no, the damage cap is per enemy, but in high level missions the mob spawns are very dense, which means more enemies clustered, which means that the coils damage other coils. the damage cap refers to all damage, not just damage from being a coil. 

seems like an oversight to me, but at this point I would settle for keeping the CC on when you reach the damage cap, just don't do damage anymore. 

It didn't before. Even on low level missions when enemies weren't clustered together, chaining coils between each other, I would still see only tiny bits of damage done before enemies would break out. I finally managed to reach level 40 enemies in a survival mission vs Corpus a few minutes ago where I could see this happening, so clearly it has been fixed/updated since I last used the Volt. As you said, this is still a problem where at a high enough level, the effects of the ultimate become negligible.
@RealPandemonium  You sir, I owe an apology.

However, I still stand by my original argument: Volt still needs tweaks to get him to stand with other frames as having the ability to handle late game, at the very least in a fun manner.

Edited August 2, 2016 by SylvenStar

[RealPandemonium]

3 hours ago, SylvenStar said:

It didn't before. Even on low level missions when enemies weren't clustered together, chaining coils between each other, I would still see only tiny bits of damage done before enemies would break out. I finally managed to reach level 40 enemies in a survival mission vs Corpus a few minutes ago where I could see this happening, so clearly it has been fixed/updated since I last used the Volt. As you said, this is still a problem where at a high enough level, the effects of the ultimate become negligible.
@RealPandemonium  You sir, I owe an apology.

However, I still stand by my original argument: Volt still needs tweaks to get him to stand with other frames as having the ability to handle late game, at the very least in a fun manner.

Heh, I think that those "other frames" need a nerf so that the community at large can finally realize that our current "late game" is a freaking joke.  

[SylvenStar]

1 hour ago, RealPandemonium said:

Heh, I think that those "other frames" need a nerf so that the community at large can finally realize that our current "late game" is a freaking joke.  

Actually, I get the impression we're not at the endgame yet. The focus system was called endgame content, but we got it at the beginning of the cinematic quest system. I think something bigger is coming our way. And naturally as we get more abilities, we'll have to get bigger enemies with more mechanics and out-of-the-way methods to beat them.

Also, if there is one thing you should know about me, it's that I adore unique mechanics and gameplay gimmicks above all else. Hence why favorite frames of mine are those like Ivara, Limbo, Atlas, Nekros, Hydroind and Chroma to an extent. Volt I enjoy mostly because of his theme of electricity, but he still feels... underwhelming. He certainly has the tools to do what he needs get the job done, but it doesn't feel powerful. And I feel the same way about Frost and Ember, too. Yeah, sure, they're super strong and are more than able to get the job done, but... the three of them don't have the fun mechanics that they could. Ember has an ult that follows her, Frost has the bubble, and Volt has a speed boost, and now a riot shield. Useful, but not... impressive, though that's not quite the word I'm looking for.

[Singularity001]

As someone modding for speed and shield duration... X3 I call this skill the "suicide" button in high level stuff.