No Need For Bleed-out Timer In Warframe

[(PSN)AmjadZohair]

When you become downed there is always a chance to be revived as long as there are other players in your squad are still alive unless all of them become downed then you have to use one of your (4) revives available every mission.

And as soon as you become downed you will have the option to use one of your (4) revives as well. this is too important if you was using Frost and your bubble was gone in high level mission and you want to back on your feet as soon as possible to save the objectives.

I think this is another reason to encourage you to play with other players and not solo.

What you think about that?

Edited November 20, 2016 by (PS4)AmjadZohair

[AdunSaveMe]

Being downed is like a respawn timer. You're supposed to be vulnerable. It's supposed to be a temporary loss.

[Blakrana]

12 minutes ago, (PS4)AmjadZohair said:

I think this is another reason to encourage you to play with other players and not solo

Fail to see any incentive. It's just Solo revival methodology but in a group setting. Bleed out is a group perk. Toss that out...why are we using a group again?

[Beggining]

1 minute ago, Blakrana said:

Fail to see any incentive. It's just Solo revival methodology but in a group setting. Bleed out is a group perk. Toss that out...why are we using a group again?

From OP's example, it's probably a suggestion for an option, to be able to 'give up' so they can revive faster and CC or defend objective.

[light_ryuzaki]

yeah , it's kinda odd when you're not in the suit , not having "blood ", as there is just a suit made of metal..or something like that

[AdunSaveMe]

2 minutes ago, light_ryuzaki said:

yeah , it's kinda odd when you're not in the suit , not having "blood ", as there is just a suit made of metal..or something like that

You can't control an RC car if it doesn't have any wheels. You can't control a Warframe if it's similarly incapacitated. 

[light_ryuzaki]

1 minute ago, AdunSaveMe said:

You can't control an RC car if it doesn't have any wheels. You can't control a Warframe if it's similarly incapacitated. 

basically you can , you don't loose the signal , just that it won't move [ as with he frame , you can use your secondary and move a bit ]  :) I meant the animation and having to bleed being odd

[Blakrana]

Just now, Beggining said:

From OP's example, it's probably a suggestion for an option, to be able to 'give up' so they can revive faster and CC or defend objective.

Yeah, I see that. Suicide in TF2 sort of deal.

But it doesn't actually add any incentive to group play over solo. Group play having the bleedout is in itself a reason for partying up over due to Solo being 'mess up four times and you're done'. Whilst grouping isn't meant to encourage recklessness...it's safer to be an idiot with friends, as it were.

4 minutes ago, light_ryuzaki said:

yeah , it's kinda odd when you're not in the suit , not having "blood ", as there is just a suit made of metal..or something like that

Warframes are Techno-organic constructs. They have both organic and mechanical components.

They need to breathe (Life support, will exhale visibly on cold tiles). They bleed.

That and for the record, bleeding isn't necessarily the loss of haemoglobin. It can also refer to the" escape of fluid or gas from a closed system through a valve".

Both definitions can apply to a Waframe, per their Techno-organic nature.

[Beggining]

Just now, Blakrana said:

Yeah, I see that. Suicide in TF2 sort of deal.

But it doesn't actually add any incentive to group play over solo. Group play having the bleedout is in itself a reason for partying up over due to Solo being 'mess up four times and you're done'. Whilst grouping isn't meant to encourage recklessness...it's safer to be an idiot with friends, as it were.

I can see this being abused by someone who loves their sentinel so much when it died more than an emergency quick revive, to be honest.

[light_ryuzaki]

1 minute ago, Blakrana said:

Yeah, I see that. Suicide in TF2 sort of deal.

But it doesn't actually add any incentive to group play over solo. Group play having the bleedout is in itself a reason for partying up over due to Solo being 'mess up four times and you're done'. Whilst grouping isn't meant to encourage recklessness...it's safer to be an idiot with friends, as it were.

Warframes are Techno-organic constructs. They have both organic and mechanical components.

They need to breathe (Life support, will exhale visibly on cold tiles). They bleed.

That and for the record, bleeding isn't necessarily the loss of haemoglobin. It can also refer to the" escape of fluid or gas from a closed system through a valve".

Both definitions can apply to a Waframe, per their Techno-organic nature.

you use a link , of energy , like a  wave with a specific frequency to  control it , it may have be true that they need to breed and stuff, but those times are no more , the story line is progressing and changes are being made

[Katinka]

The warframes do have living organic (infested) parts and can bleed thus they can bleed out.  The option to spend a Revive before the timer runs down could be handy but I suspect people would rage-use them when unnecessary then not have them when they need them and it would discourage other players from going to revive either a) because you can do it yourself, or b) because you shouldn't have wasted them, depending on the other player's perspective.

Edited November 20, 2016 by Katinka

[Beggining]

1 minute ago, light_ryuzaki said:

you use a link , of energy , like a  wave with a specific frequency to  control it , it may have be true that they need to breed and stuff, but those times are no more , the story line is progressing and changes are being made

Didn't the Operator say that the transference made them feel everything a warframe is feeling? I can see them being immune to transference pain as the story goes on, but for now it seem that the pain is too great for them to actually do parkour and stuff. We have a health indicator, after all.

Also, one of the Operator's line is 'Get up, Warframe.' suggesting that it's not just the Operator's effort that controls the frame (?)

[AlphaPHENIX]

25 minutes ago, light_ryuzaki said:

yeah , it's kinda odd when you're not in the suit , not having "blood ", as there is just a suit made of metal..or something like that

If you have been paying attention to lore you would know that Warframes are more then just ''metal pupets''

[CGs_Knackie]

No bleed-out timer means invincible, it doesn't make sense dude.

[Blakrana]

Just now, light_ryuzaki said:

it may have be true that they need to breed and stuff, but those times are no more , the story line is progressing and changes are being made

It's still true Warframes need to breathe. Still true that they're Techno-organic constructs with a few important biological necessities to function. They bleed, they breathe. 

Nothing has changed these facts.

How they're employed has simply been clarified, but what they need remains the same. Indeed, we've had it finally confirmed that yes, Warframes are derivative of the Infested in some form...what we now need is the specifications to this. But there are certainly organics to the Warframe construct.

2 minutes ago, Beggining said:

Didn't the Operator say that the transference made them feel everything a warframe is feeling? I can see them being immune to transference pain as the story goes on, but for now it seem that the pain is too great for them to actually do parkour and stuff. We have a health indicator, after all.

"Transference makes this hurt" when low on health. Certainly makes me wonder how badly it smarts when a frame is downed, honestly. Even if you can get up again, got to sting...Haptic feedback has its downsides, in any case.

Spoiler

Hell...War Within basically showed how dangerous Transference actually is when your enemy knows what it is and how to abuse it...Long range Psionic attacks? Brr. The thought of an Infested doing the same sort of attack is terrifying, honestly...

As for Parkour, might be more down to lack of experience in a body that isn't designed to have both exceptional strength and likely supportive cybernetic augmentations. Flip side, they do have the ability to teleport a reasonably modest distance.

3 minutes ago, Beggining said:

I can see this being abused by someone who loves their sentinel so much when it died more than an emergency quick revive, to be honest.

Potentially. As is, my quibble is the 'incentivises group play' claim more than anything else.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

wish our seintinal could revive us a set number of times, they can revive themselves..just saying 

[light_ryuzaki]

1 minute ago, Blakrana said:

It's still true Warframes need to breathe. Still true that they're Techno-organic constructs with a few important biological necessities to function. They bleed, they breathe. 

Nothing has changed these facts.

How they're employed has simply been clarified, but what they need remains the same. Indeed, we've had it finally confirmed that yes, Warframes are derivative of the Infested in some form...what we now need is the specifications to this. But there are certainly organics to the Warframe construct.

"Transference makes this hurt" when low on health. Certainly makes me wonder how badly it smarts when a frame is downed, honestly. Even if you can get up again, got to sting...Haptic feedback has its downsides, in any case.

  Reveal hidden contents

Hell...War Within basically showed how dangerous Transference actually is when your enemy knows what it is and how to abuse it...Long range Psionic attacks? Brr. The thought of an Infested doing the same sort of attack is terrifying, honestly...

As for Parkour, might be more down to lack of experience in a body that isn't designed to have both exceptional strength and likely supportive cybernetic augmentations. Flip side, they do have the ability to teleport a reasonably modest distance.

Potentially. As is, my quibble is the 'incentivises group play' claim more than anything else.

It's a mess,why would you need to breath with the wf when you are  using transference to project just your mind there , then  why they don't get destroyed when you leave the warframe and go out as an operator ? don't they need to breath , don't they bleed if no one controls them ? In  my opinion they bleed because the operator is somehow  , in it (body), I couldn't see how you would teleport your body as the operator in a mission from the liset, that's why they can be defined as a "techno organic " construct , if not , it's just a exoskeletal suit, an empty shell. Possibly there will be many more lore changes on the road etc.

[Blakrana]

3 minutes ago, light_ryuzaki said:

It's a mess,why would you need to breath with the wf when you are  using transference to project just your mind there , then  why they don't get destroyed when you leave the warframe and go out as an operator ? don't they need to breath , don't they bleed if no one controls them ?

The Warframe needs to breathe for itself, not the Operator. The Operator is more than capable of attending to their own biological functions and Transference has no bearing on that. Maybe they even have their breathing synchronised, Warframe and Operator, but that's a different vein of conjecture.

Further, breathing is an autonomous biological function. It's more than plausible that a Techno-organic construct such as the Warframes are capable of that basic, necessary function. Bleeding being a result of damage and injury...kind of irrelevant, seeing as the prevention of blood loss is part of the autonomous role of scabbing or whatever the Warframe parallel is. We sure as hell don't think to ourselves 'I should stop bleeding now' when injured.

Warframes being able to deal with their own need to breathe is a logical necessity. Else you're wasting extremely valuable conscious attention on just making sure lungs work, or whatever the parallels are. And that's without considering they've some form of inbuilt suspension hardware, to heavily curb their biological functions when not in use, a trait not alien to nature either.

9 minutes ago, light_ryuzaki said:

In  my opinion they bleed because the operator is somehow  , in it (body), I couldn't see how you would teleport your body as the operator in a mission from the liset, that's why they can be defined as a "techno organic " construct , if not , it's just a exoskeletal suit, an empty shell.

Warframes have been capable of bleeding long before any Operator gained the capability to possess them directly. So it's not because the Operator is 'there' that they bleed whatsoever. Transference has, before TWW, only been mental inhabitation/projection, and minds don't bleed outside some weird story settings. So it's not because of events that bleeding is now suddenly relevant...Bleeding was always relevant, because Warframes are both biological and mechanical constructs.

Far too much evidence exists to dispute this fact.

As for 'empty shell' all references to the Warframes being 'empty' largely refers to the lack of an apparent mind, personality...anything we could recognise as a 'self'. The Warframe is however only metaphorically hollow due to still being comprised of flesh and metal. And even that is open for debate as it stands.

For sake of argument, consider the Continuity ritual; an Orokin must essentially destroy the mind and personality of the offered Yuvan, make them 'empty' in order to claim their body for their own. Warframes are 'empty' in the same sense supposedly...yet there's enough hints to there being more going on that it leaves it inconclusive just how accurate it is to consider them 'empty shells'.

What is very important for discussing Warframe is to recognise the metaphors and their difference to literal statements. "Empty shell" is one such metaphorical statement.